Conspiracy against Christians

Most people don't realize that the ones that control the media are the ones responsible for these prosperity preachers we see on tv today. Most don't know that Billy Graham, Benny Hinn, Kenneth Copeland etc. are all 33rd degree masons and were put into place to malign the blind christian further and to undermine the faith altogether. If people only knew that the media is being used to form their opinions whether they know it or not, believe it or not.

Originally posted by Raist
reply to post by BillfromCovina

 

But yes this is a bit off topic from the conspiracy of targeting and labeling all Christians as bad people.

Raist

Raist, your conspiracy is changing. I have never heard anyone say that all Christians are bad people. To point out hypocrisy among people who constantly judge others is not a conspiracy. I no longer understand what this widespread conspiracy against Christians is about.

reply to post by BillfromCovina


I have not wavered from my original thought. I spoke about people who see one Christian sinning/doing wrong and lumping all Christians into the same boat.

An example is to go to this thread.
www.abovetopsecret.com...
It is about missionaries involved in a Haiti kidnapping scandal. There is a post that says how all missionaries are not doing anything good without an agenda. That is not really the case though. Many missionaries offer help and get to know the people and also offer spiritual guidance if the people want it. They are not forcing anything on anyone.

But there are countless threads on this forum alone that puts all Christians in the same boat as those who conducted evil things many, many years ago. You can even read people referring to that on this thread. If you are not seeing that I cannot help make it any clearer.

That is a conspiracy that started years ago and has continued to grow. You can see numerous threads that attack the Christians and their beliefs. There are threads and posts that talk about Christians because they have made a mistake and sinned and the thread turns into calling Christians hypocrites because they sinned. Human nature is to sin. We are flesh creatures and still live in the world the world is filled with sin there is no escaping that until we die. Even you brought up the “leader” being caught in the hotel room smoking crack with a male prostitute. How many in Hollywood do this same thing but never are mentioned? Even if they are, are all actors/musicians/politicians labeled as hypocrites over one individual’s deeds?

Again most people label all Christians as hypocrites when one Christian fails and gets caught sinning. Not that I trust most televangelists, but I recall my own mother talking about how Jimmy Swaggart was a hypocrite and all when he admitted to having an affair. I do not know the man and his heart but I can say that if his heart is true and he was sorry then he is forgiven. The man got caught up in the flesh nature if he truly is what he says he is.

If he had murdered someone lock him up and make him pay. If he asks for forgiveness keep him locked up as the law mandates. The thing is though why does he or any other Christian have to be hypocrites because of one persons sins?

My point again is that when one person makes a mistake and sins/breaks the law all are lumped in with them. People fail there is no doubt about that. No one is perfect and any who claim to be are liars or fools.

Raist

Originally posted by Raist
reply to post by BillfromCovina

 

I have not wavered from my original thought. I spoke about people who see one Christian sinning/doing wrong and lumping all Christians into the same boat.

An example is to go to this thread.
www.abovetopsecret.com...
It is about missionaries involved in a Haiti kidnapping scandal. There is a post that says how all missionaries are not doing anything good without an agenda. That is not really the case though. Many missionaries offer help and get to know the people and also offer spiritual guidance if the people want it. They are not forcing anything on anyone.

But there are countless threads on this forum alone that puts all Christians in the same boat as those who conducted evil things many, many years ago. You can even read people referring to that on this thread. If you are not seeing that I cannot help make it any clearer.

That is a conspiracy that started years ago and has continued to grow. You can see numerous threads that attack the Christians and their beliefs. There are threads and posts that talk about Christians because they have made a mistake and sinned and the thread turns into calling Christians hypocrites because they sinned. Human nature is to sin. We are flesh creatures and still live in the world the world is filled with sin there is no escaping that until we die. Even you brought up the “leader” being caught in the hotel room smoking crack with a male prostitute. How many in Hollywood do this same thing but never are mentioned? Even if they are, are all actors/musicians/politicians labeled as hypocrites over one individual’s deeds?

You brought up Haiti as an example. Since Christians do not believe their good deeds will get them to heaven, there would be another agenda and that would be the spread of Christianity. The posters would be correct. This is not a conspiracy. You brought up Hollywood. Their failings would not be hypocrisy. They do not preach on TV about the sins of others, the eternal damnation for those sins, and make money doing it. No conspiracy to point out the hypocrisy of those that do.

reply to post by BillfromCovina


Christians cannot do good deeds just because they feel they are the right thing to do?

So any time I help someone I should be planning on handing them a bible from that ideology. No the poster was wrong and so are you. Christians help plenty of times without an agenda of spreading the Word.

As for the Hollywood thing you missed the point or you are ignoring it. Everyone jumps on the band wagon of dragging the person’s beliefs into their mistakes. Okay so they were Christian and they messed up. Simple facts are humans mess up. We are told in the bible we will mess up and to ask forgiveness when we do. No need to drag down all Christianity over one man’s sins and then claim all are hypocrites. Christians point out sin whether it be sin of themselves, other Christians and even nonbelievers. If you don’t point out that it is sin how is anyone to know?

So what if these people on TV sin, that is their issue to deal with it does not make them a hypocrite as you keep saying. It makes them human and flesh as the bible speaks of. We will not be completely free of sin until we are dead. How many more times will I have to say this stuff over and over before someone understands? Really it is simple; humans will sin even if they are Christian. We all work through our own sins we use our examples to teach others. It might be a sin we once had or have done we tell others that is a sin and they should be careful.

Again no one is perfect all humans will fail none are sin free. Some are freer of sin than others but all sin even if it is only from time to time. It might be nothing more than a passing thought or a cross word but it would be a sin. Until you understand that while in the flesh sin is a nature we must battle and at times we lose that battle you cannot call out a person for being a hypocrite for their sins, even if they point to sins in life.

Raist

reply to post by BillfromCovina


Here is another example
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Not only is there typical Christian bashing going on you have people talking about it is only a matter of time before Christians start beheading people again. Really? Because some nutcase/s goes out and does something to show no tolerance then all Christians are going to start killing nonbelievers?

Jesus never said to go out and destroy or kill others for their beliefs. The only time he did anything close to being this radical was to trash the tables of the money changers who had taken the temple and turned it into a money making scheme. In fact Jesus was friendly and even out of His way kind to those who were against Him. The only ones He called out were those who lived lies and were truly impure while trying to say they were perfectly pure. Those who say they are sin free yet convict others of their sins. These people are hypocrites but do we cannot see the hearts of people the way Christ could either. I can watch someone live their life and judge their actions but not so much them. If their life is that of sleeping around, lying, stealing and yet they claim to be of God then yes it is obvious they are hypocrites.

But the main point is though you have people attacking all of Christianity over the actions or deeds of one or a few people. Because some are false Christians or some Christians are caught in their sins by the public does not make all Christians guilty of that sin or hypocrites. People are human and will fail, we will sin. I have only come across a few people claiming to be Christian that also claim they do not sin. Those people one could label a hypocrite, but why attack Christians in general over this one person?

But in a way you are right it is not a conspiracy at its root cause. The cause comes from satan. The conspiracy lies within humans though who promote the attack of Christians because of the actions of a few. The conspiracy is not about the individual who is sinning it is about the claiming Christians to be bad people or people who will all do bad things just like the one being observed. Most sins that Christians do are sins that most do not consider sins (at least those I talking about). Most of those sins are not against the law as property damage or human trafficking is or even murder. Most of us do not condone such actions but we are placed on the same level as those fanatics who do. None of us that I have ever met have been involved in the atrocities of the past that destroyed people and their cultures, nor do I know any who would be for that. Those actions were taken part in from the flesh side of things using God as an excuse. Believe it or not people do use God as an excuse to sin. The Word of God has been twisted by nutcases to fit their agenda from the start, which does not link Christians in general to those people.

Raist

reply to post by Raist

We are making progress. At least we can agree that there is no conspiracy. Two examples of major atrocities and involvement of Christians Is Pat Robertson (700 Club) and his mining operations from Liberia. George Bush and Iraq war. The list really is big if I kept at it. A simple solution would be for Christians to clean house and stop pointing fingers. More love and less judgement.

reply to post by BillfromCovina


I said there is no conspiracy at its root cause. Again the root cause would be satan. There is a conspiracy though on the human level. So I guess we are not getting anywhere because we are not really agreeing.

As for Bush I believe he is one of those who uses the name of the Lord for his own agenda, I don’t think he is truly a Christian. As for Pat Robertson I think he has some signs of mental issues brought on by age. But really why tie them to every Christian? That is my point.

As for judgment who is judging here? Aside from those who are linking all Christians to Bush and Robertson. Really like I said Christians point out sin be it their own, other Christians, or even nonbelievers, if it is not pointed out someone might not know.

Who is pointing fingers (really think about this one hard)? I can list sins I struggle with just as much as I can list sins of others. We were never told not to look at the actions of people, in fact we were told to look at the actions of people so that we might know them better for who they are. But we are also to look at our own actions. I am not sure why you are not understanding that, I have only said in multiple times throughout the thread.

As for love, I have no problem with that. I can love someone and not love what they do, because the actions are not the person. This is something so many get mixed up they are either judging another person or someone is saying they are being judged when it is only their actions. If your actions are being judged and found to be sinful you might be told so that you could be out of sin. If you take that as being judged then you are wrong.

Why is it I feel I am must explain the entire Christian teachings to you? That is how it seems anyway. I don’t want to have to explain the entire teachings to you, at least not in this thread. The thread is about people taking the actions of one person who calls themselves a Christian (Bush, Robertson, who ever) and linking all Christians to that person or people.

Raist

reply to post by Raist


It's not just in the past... There are many Christians who seek to oppress their non-christian neighbors even today... The difference is that in this day and age, their neighbors are going to just quiver in a corner and take it... Guess the old saying is true, "You reap what you sow." Well, it's harvest time...

reply to post by JaxonRoberts


Have you even read any of my posts?

I cannot think that you have. Even sadder how you support anyone who has done nothing to be mixed with those who have.

Raist

Originally posted by endisnighe

Let the one without sin, cast the first stone.

I have always felt, the people that judge others, really need to look into their own soul first and foremost.

The sin of pride is very egregious.

Forgive those that trespass against us, lead us not into temptation.

A couple of thoughts along your line OP.

So how do you feel about Barack Obama your "brother in christ"? While you are at it tell us how you feel about Romans 13: 1-8?

1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:

4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.

6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.

7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.

8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

To the OP: Personally I don't think that pointing out an xian's blatant hypocrisy qualifies as much of a conspiracy, unless of course you are willing to put forward that xians conspire against their own best interests.



[edit on 5-2-2010 by Lilitu]

Originally posted by Raist
Often the Christian body as a whole seems to be judged on the actions of one or even a few.

This is done to all belief systems. Look at what people do to the Freemasons. I mean, just because there are a handful of Freemasons whoare involved in "shady" dealings, people assume the whole grop is an "evil" cabal. It's ridiculous, but true.

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


At least you get what I am saying. It matters not the group being labeled what matters is the whole group is not the same as the individual.

I use Christians though because obviously I am one and many act as if Christians are to never sin or make a mistake. When really Christians have to face the same struggles in life as anyone else and seeing as how we are in the flesh we do sin from time to time.

But the individual is not the same as the group.

Yes it is ridiculous.
Raist

Originally posted by Lilitu
To the OP: Personally I don't think that pointing out an xian's blatant hypocrisy qualifies as much of a conspiracy, unless of course you are willing to put forward that xians conspire against their own best interests.

[edit on 5-2-2010 by Lilitu]

Point missed. It is not about that at all.

Please read the postings again.

Raist

Blah, blah, blah, Johnny is picking on me, blah, blah, blah, Suzie is picking on me.

Which third world country do the Christian’s want to bomb this time to get people to stop saying bad things about them?

If you join a herd, and not everyone likes your herd, get over it already. Hang out with your herd, that’s why you joined them and leave the whining to Gray Hound!

Raist, kudos on the thread.

Not everyone that says, "Lord, Lord..."
The servant is not above the Master. If they persecuted me, they will persecute you.

I regularly receive a little publication called VOM (Voice Of the Martyrs). Most of the tragic tales mentioned in it are occurring in other countries but the attitude is spreading to this country. It's an insidious disdain that permeates every aspect of our lives.

Have you ever watched television and noticed that EVERY depiction of Christians is as whack-jobs? The only movie I've seen in YEARS depicting a Christian in a favorable light was The Book of Eli. (Great movie, btw.)

Americans are being conditioned by propaganda (and by nominal Christians) to despise Christians.

I say "nominal" Christians because they are Christian in name only, not in actions.

I know of a woman who was quite "heathen" in her youth and terrifically violent. As she got older she could no longer physically beat people up so she turned to religion. She was quite vocal about how everyone else was guilty of all the things she'd done her whole life and how they were going to "burn in hell".

I tried showing her verses explaining that there is no place of eternal punishment but that took all the fun of being a "Christian" away for her so she refused to look at the verses. There's a lot of those types running around and they give the rest of us a bad name.

The bible says that in the end days "They will kill you thinking they do God's service." That wouldn't be atheists. It'll be Christians because who else would be interested in doing God's service? Misguided or nominal Christians, to be sure, but killer Christians none the less. We just have to wait for the wheat to be separated from the chaff to find out which is which and keep filling your lamp, brother.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


If you understood what being a Christian was you would understand how asking about Christians bombing is oxymoronic.

As for whining I really was not. I was trying to point out that the actions of one do not equal the actions of all thus your question is oxymoronic.

If you really care to understand please read the posts though and we will discuss it logically.

Raist

reply to post by whitewave


Thanks it is always nice to see someone who understands what is being placed in front of them.

But I guess I should have expected that some one my pearls were being cast infront of swine. That is from the bible for those who do not know, it is not an insult just an explination.


Raist

Originally posted by Raist
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

If you understood what being a Christian was you would understand how asking about Christians bombing is oxymoronic.

As for whining I really was not. I was trying to point out that the actions of one do not equal the actions of all thus your question is oxymoronic.

If you really care to understand please read the posts though and we will discuss it logically.

Raist

Actually I have met some of THE ONLY TRUE CHRISTIANS they are called the Pensylvania Dutch Amish and they don't use electricity or the internet. Evidently these things are not part of the Christian G-d's natural world.

I respect the Amish they don't talk about their beliefs THEY PRACTICE THEIR BELIEFS nor do they ever complain because to them everything is G-d's will.

Hey don't worry I know how you feel I know a lot of musicians who are frustrated because they can't write songs like the Beetles.

Maybe you should convert to something obtainable a little more you know everyone's speed?

Methinks you are the one who doesn't have a clue what being a Christian is!



[edit on 5/2/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


I understand it well enough to know many miss the mark that they are aiming for. Of course I also understand how it should make one feel when they miss that mark.

This thread is not about me and my understanding of being a Christian though. I will again point out the actions of individuals do not speak for all Christians and leave you at that.

Raist