The physical world as a virtual reality

Originally posted by Matrix Rising
There's no evidence that an objective, material world exist. All of the evidence points to the contrary. The problem is many scientist believe in materialism so they will say one day we will find a theory that will explain how dead matter became aware of itself. This is wishful thinking.

Nobody has ever touched something called matter. When you touch a table top or lay your head on a soft pillow, it's the electrons from your hand that repel against the electrons from the pillow or table and you perceive a hard table or a soft pillow.

"Objective" is by definition a subjective category: it only refers to a given frame of reference within which a system operates and is gauged. And that framework is based on our senses - which are admittedly very limited - and the processing of sensory data by our brain/mind.

From that perspective it doesn't matter one bit even if we are all figments of each other's imagination: if I can perceive - or believe to perceive - that the sky is blue, and it can be empirically verified that others also perceive it as "blue", then the sky is "objectively" blue, even if it didn't exist outside our chosen framework of reference.

Also, how are the electrons that you mention as being the components of matter "nothing"? If they ARE electrons, then by definition they exist (again, within our frame of reference).

Eventually, it all boils down to the one essential question: whether "real" or not, how much influence do we have over our individual and collective perception of reality.
Because if we don't have any influence over it, the nature of this world an its reality is a moot point.


P.S. Just so you know, I understand - and basically agree - with the main point you're making. But in order to transcend the seeming limits of this world, if that is possible, semantic confusion is to be avoided at all costs, because its pitfalls can be deadly.







[edit on 30-1-2010 by Vanitas]

lol you discribe a reality without god, heaven, and freewill as dead.

sigh...... and everyone else is blind... when its YOU who desire these illusionary things... and will stop at nothing to delude yourself in the hope that they manifest.

Originally posted by Wertdagf
lol you discribe a reality without god, heaven, and freewill as dead.

sigh...... and everyone else is blind... when its YOU who desire these illusionary things... and will stop at nothing to delude yourself in the hope that they manifest.

Not sure who you are referring too without citing or quoting them. I've been a practitioner of lucid dreaming or mind awake / body asleep for over the last 22 years. In that time, these illusionist fantasies as you might call them clearly linked themselves to this reality in the most profound ways.

For example; consciously exploring precognitive reality in a non-physical dream state has allowed me to see this physical state from a non-physical perspective; and also has allowed me to see how highly organized thought in the form of dreams play a role in manufacturing and programing the VR so to speak.

This is a path down a well traveled road for me; no wishful thinking or bunk belief here. Been there done that, thanks.

I wanted to bump this thread rather then introducing a new thread although Brian Whitworth is certainly thread worthy on his own. He has published a follow up paper to his excellent theory: The Physical World as a Virtual Reality

The publication is called, "Simulating Space and Time" and is just another stunning example of genius at work.


Happy reading.

The universe is a virtual reality system running on a super computer. Evidence to this is quantum physics: reality is not "rendered" until there is an "observer", in exactly the same way a computer game's polygon graphics are not rendered if they are not visible by the gamer.

And since this is a game, I am sure the authors have left a backdoor so as that we can see behind the game and discover the computer that is running on. But so far no one has discovered it.



[edit on 26-5-2010 by masterp]

Originally posted by masterp
The universe is a virtual reality system running on a super computer. Evidence to this is quantum physics: reality is not "rendered" until there is an "observer", in exactly the same way a computer game's polygon graphics are not rendered if they are not visible by the gamer.

That's a fantastic way to describe it.

Originally posted by masterp
And since this is a game, I am sure the authors have left a backdoor so as that we can see behind the game and discover the computer that is running on. But so far no one has discovered it.

If there was a backdoor, it would be mind awake / body asleep or consciousness during sleep.


At least that's my opinion.

If it is why can't I "see" my reality as being back to the collective conciousness and just seperate from this crap illusion???? I mean you still gotta die and to do that you still gotta physically shoot yourself or hang yourself or jump from a very tall structure. To me, this proves the holographic or Virtual world theory is BUNK to the MAXIMO!!!!!!

[edit on 26-5-2010 by ldyserenity]

Originally posted by ldyserenity
If it is why can't I "see" my reality as being back to the collective conciousness and just seperate from this crap illusion????

Who said that your "reality" is separate from this crap illusion? If anything your "reality" is entangled with this crap illusion. You would be like a small mandlebrot set within the larger mandlebrot going WTF is this crap? Where is the collective of which I must come from?

Not saying it's a Mandlebrot set, rather just musing at the fractal like quality of "Physical Reality".

Originally posted by ldyserenity
I mean you still gotta die and to do that you still gotta physically shoot yourself or hang yourself or jump from a very tall structure. To me, this proves the holographic or Virtual world theory is BUNK to the MAXIMO!!!!!!

Yeah, you still have to die. I don't see anywhere where VR theory states that the causality of life must now be ignored because you are looking closer at the pixels rather then the atoms.

When you see systems of information with the potential to be measured therefor rendered and realized, it's along that line of logic that you start to see the virtual nature of information processing.

Something that fits within the realm of cognition as the human brain is the best organic "Reality" rendering farm that I know of.

The worse thing I think we can do is try to approach this theory as if there is a physical computer churning out digital data and pumping out a virtual reality system.

Rather, I like to think of a singularity that has entangled itself with a profound expansion based on simple processes and rule-sets. A recursive feedback interface to observe and experience itself. [Not all of which is strictly human].

I didnt read anything, but I will just add

its very possible that we live in a virtual reality

but then, its very possible that in the next few years, everyone will be able to live in an alternate reality, using computers to do it

why? they are already working on an interface to our brain, so, you would receive senses from a computer, and you could interact with other people in a virtual world and not even notice the difference ....

thats the future, and when we achieve that, well, the rest is just bull, we become GOD

[edit on 26-5-2010 by Faiol]

reply to post by YouAreDreaming


Well that's what I am saying that why can't the reality experiencer just go back to the singularity and say I'm done playing, I am tired and I don't care no more? I mean if you want to use the analogy from the previous poster to me about a game, If I play WoW I get tired of playing or just want to rest, I shut off the game, go to bed etc, why can't I just say "hey I'm tired of playing" and log off? Why does it gotta be done through a grisly Act? I mean didn't Buddha just re-enter the singularity? Didn't He disappear after meditating and he did not die? Or am I wrong on this????

I have always been a fan of the VR theory, especially since I have had precognition,, lots and lots of times as well as deja vu lots of times and synchronicities, and too many things than I can even remember, But there has to be a way to go to the singularity as you put it (I called it the collective conciousness) or it could simply be called the source, but if this is indeed a VR than one should be at least in time eventually be able to just leave the physical world illusion and join again with the source and just be conciousness without physical experiences without having to die. Right?

[edit on 26-5-2010 by ldyserenity]

Originally posted by Faiol
I didnt read anything, but I will just add

its very possible that we live in a virtual reality

but then, its very possible that in the next few years, everyone will be able to live in an alternate reality, using computers to do it

why? they are already working on an interface to our brain, so, you would receive senses from a computer, and you could interact with other people in a virtual world and not even notice the difference ....

thats the future, and when we achieve that, well, the rest is just bull, we become GOD

[edit on 26-5-2010 by Faiol]

Goody goody another game that I can be crappy at playing :/ I guess I am not much of a good sport, I always lose and I am sick of playing and losing, I would not want to have this interface.

Originally posted by ldyserenity
Well that's what I am saying that why can't the reality experiencer just go back to the singularity and say I'm done playing, I am tired and I don't care no more? I mean if you want to use the analogy from the previous poster to me about a game, If I play WoW I get tired of playing or just want to rest, I shut off the game, go to bed etc, why can't I just say "hey I'm tired of playing" and log off? Why does it gotta be done through a grisly Act? I mean didn't Buddha just re-enter the singularity? Didn't He disappear after meditating and he did not die? Or am I wrong on this????

I am not about to make any wild assumptions because I don't know enough about re-integration with the singularity. I can only postulate that if it's fractal, then we are already part of the singularity, and are simply moving through nodes rendering data as we progress.

I'd like to log off too if we could, but apparently the log off is death. However, that said I can direct you to an interesting post that in a way shows a type of log-off. And although far greater then anything I have experienced, it fits well within divergent virtual reality experiences.

Originally posted by Ubasti
A couple of years ago I had a very strange dream. It was not precognitive as much as plain weird. From the time I started dreaming to the time I woke up, it seemed to me that the lifetime of four generations passed.

I was dreaming about four generations of people - birth, lifespan and death, and I was very disoriented when I woke up. It took me about two weeks to adjust to the fact that I found myself back in the "normal world" after being present in the "dream world" for about 2 centuries.

It was the most strange experience I ever had.

Source

Originally posted by ldyserenity
I have always been a fan of the VR theory, especially since I have had precognition,, lots and lots of times as well as deja vu lots of times and synchronicities, and too many things than I can even remember, But there has to be a way to go to the singularity as you put it (I called it the collective conciousness) or it could simply be called the source, but if this is indeed a VR than one should be at least in time eventually be able to just leave the physical world illusion and join again with the source and just be conciousness without physical experiences without having to die. Right?

This is still very gray for me, I am still struggling to adapt to many theories related to VR and Reality as a whole. So not really here to sell it, rather just learn with others on a like-minded topic.

Based on information coming from Robert A. Monroe and his journey back out of the VR so to speak, he said we need to achieve some type of escape velocity to stop being entrapped within many lifetimes of addiction to Human Experience.

The cheating death bit is also not known to me, from my perspective with what I know thus far... we must die to exit the VR. If there is an alternative, I can only imagine but that doesn't make it real.

The bottom line, you already have personal experiences with Precognition, and that for me is a good starting point to see one part of the VR theory that some propose which is the recursive feedback interface.

I look at precognitive dreams as a type of pre-reality programming process that then goes through some kind of integration based on some unknown rule-set of approval. Once given the green light it's programmed into the mainframe and rendered into reality.

I think the precognitive angle is probably the most self-evident of some type of feedback interface. All I can do at this time is gather intel and figure out more of the real mechanics.

I would like to hear more about the precognitive expeirences you have and what you think they represent and how it is possible to have such expeirences. What theories do you subscribe to?

I probably thought we were living in VR before most of you since I'm probably older than most of you. But some of you seem to think that if we are in a VR, we must have an existence outside this VR, like in the Matrix movies. Why do you think that? You might just be a computer program that is programmed to think that it is alive. Someone said that why can't we break out. Where would you go? You might well be like the characters in a holo deck. If they leave the holodeck, they cease to exist. Moriarty and the countess had free will, but they couldn't leave the holodeck and still exist. Why must we be any different?

If you believe in Jehovah, then this might be his VR, and there are lots of others of his kind sitting at their computers playing with their own VR games. It might even be a game where two can play and the other player's nick is "Lucifer".
For that matter, there might just be a few thousand characters in this VR that think that they are alive, and the others don't have consciousness, again like in a holodeck with for instance said Moriarty and the countess, and Nick Fontaine.

And if the Matrix is true, and in the last Matrix movie it said that anybody who wanted could leave the matrix, maybe the Matrix novels and movies were the Matrix'es way of letting us know that we were living in a matrix. Those who have eyes, who were open to the concept, would see.
In that case, for gods sake leave me here. I do not want to live at the center of the earth and eat only that nasty snotty stuff. I prefer to experience sunny days, the wind on my cheeks, banana chocolate malts, and bacon. Even if it's only an illusion.

Interesting thread, I believe we live within a multiverse. Perhaps this document I produced will be of interest to others.

members.iinet.net.au...

or

docs.google.com...

[edit on 27-5-2010 by usernamehere]

Not read all posts but basicly you are saying we´re in the Matrix.
If so can i PLEASE PLEASE get my code redone...Cause i must be
Jinxed.

reply to post by masterp


There's a possible cheat code, try holding down D-M-T.

I agree with the body asleep/mind awake method as being considered a "backdoor" in that analogy. I believe it works on a similar mechanism.

All this door talk reminds me of this passage...

The man who comes back through the Door in the Wall will never be quite the same as the man who went out. He will be wiser but less sure, happier but less self-satisfied, humbler in acknowledging his ignorance yet better equipped to understand the relationship of words to things, of systematic reasoning to the unfathomable mystery which it tries, forever vainly, to comprehend.

- Aldous Huxley

reply to post by usernamehere


Hi [usernamehere],

I read Dimmack's article on time, which in turn made me question what is the resolution of the human eye, one theoretical megapixal amount I found on google was: 576 megapixels of available image data.

Giving any consideration to that amount: 576 x 1,000,000 pixels is a lot of pixels. Half a billion pixels of information that just the eyes take in which then have to be processed and rendered nearly instantly into a visual three-dimensional rendering.

Just try to imagine what process is involved to take this visual data through a sensory interface like the eye.

Convert the data into electrical signals, further convert the data into coherent photons [Hammerof/penrose], stimulate alpha/beta tublin within many neurons which start the information processing.

Calculate all the spacial distances and project a 3D composite with a high-resolution bitmap over a virtual spacial mesh just so we can sit and observe this mind-rendered hologram inside a little tiny grey matter brain.

These are some very substantial and astronomical numbers for the brain to be crunching, yet it does so effortlessly. How powerful is the human mind?

It renders "Reality"... enough said.

I would like to hear more about the precognitive expeirences you have and what you think they represent and how it is possible to have such expeirences. What theories do you subscribe to?

reply to post by YouAreDreaming


I do beleive in the VR theory, like I said I was just ticked off because I hate this reality, but hey maybe 2012 is going to be a reprogramming upgrade and it'll be better then.

My percognitive experiences: I had dreams (many) as a young teenager that became deja reve, sometimes even deja vu and my mom would tell me when I told her about the deja vu she would say because I told her I dreamt it months ago, and had forgotten, but that's why I started telling her my dreams(because of the deje reve). I even changed the future path I was meant to take; unfortunately I know I did, but can't remember why, for some reason this one person I was meant to have a relationship with didn't happen because of me, I made sure it didn't, because I was scared to death of being involved with them. I must've either had very bad precognitive dreams about him, or I was just afraid of the precognition itself like do I really have freewill, etc, and apparently yes... you really can incite freewill at will. Apparently if I had very bad dreams about that person, it was either already forgotten by awakening or I decided not to tell my mother, but it stayed subconciously somehow; I am guessing, if I just wasn't being pigheaded and proving to myself fate can be averted. To late to know now as it's been about 20 years.

I don't have any explanation as set in stone, except that future memory is and has something to do with it. Like if you go by the VR theory, say when unconcious or partially like lucid, you can access the prgramming code and go forward to see whats ahead in the program, it's one of my theories anyway, but then it really isn't future memory, is it? No it's more like reading the end of the book or the middle of the book before you get to it, and when you invoke your freewill, it's like editing the pages in the book that are ahead, before you bother with the section you're in now... I hope you understand what I am trying to explain.

The reason I do think it's a hologram, is because metatron actually translates to beyond and matrix, that was thousands of years ago they picked that name out. Plus the metatron cube looks like something computerish, if you think of geometric computer systems which would be way beyond our 1's and 0's, but eventually we may be able to run a program just like this.
Typing too fast lol.
[edit on 27-5-2010 by ldyserenity]

[edit on 27-5-2010 by ldyserenity]

[edit on 27-5-2010 by ldyserenity]

reply to post by YouAreDreaming


I posted a thread awhile ago on the same subject, yet I tried to explain how time is meaningless. Somebody wanted to derail my thread, so I'm glad to see this one didn't get derailed in comparison.

If we consider quantum mechanics at its extreme, then it leaves out, or goes beyond, quantum physics. Physics has its limitations, and so the concept of virtual reality has been misunderstood.

Infinite is virtual reality.
Finite is reality.

Originally posted by ldyserenity
I do beleive in the VR theory, like I said I was just ticked off because I hate this reality, but hey maybe 2012 is going to be a reprogramming upgrade and it'll be better then.

I think a large majority of us are not thrilled with what goes on in this world.

Originally posted by ldyserenity
My percognitive experiences: I had dreams (many) as a young teenager that became deja reve, sometimes even deja vu and my mom would tell me when I told her about the deja vu she would say because I told her I dreamt it months ago, and had forgotten, but that's why I started telling her my dreams(because of the deje reve). I even changed the future path I was meant to take; unfortunately I know I did, but can't remember why, for some reason this one person I was meant to have a relationship with didn't happen because of me, I made sure it didn't, because I was scared to death of being involved with them. I must've either had very bad precognitive dreams about him, or I was just afraid of the precognition itself like do I really have freewill, etc, and apparently yes... you really can incite freewill at will. Apparently if I had very bad dreams about that person, it was either already forgotten by awakening or I decided not to tell my mother, but it stayed subconciously somehow; I am guessing, if I just wasn't being pigheaded and proving to myself fate can be averted. To late to know now as it's been about 20 years.

There is no question that having had precognitive dreams one would try to advert certain "fates" one sees. Many people are waking up to the hard-cold reality that some "Dreams" do come true. Largely because this is affecting more then one person on the planet and thanks to instant-information like the internet, people are more capable of sharing the nature of having such an experience.

Because it's glumped into a paranormal science, it's very likely we will never see critical research and acceptance from main stream science until such a point that more brilliant skeptics are won over by having first-hand experience enough to actually start the proper questioning and investigation.

Originally posted by ldyserenity
I don't have any explanation as set in stone, except that future memory is and has something to do with it. Like if you go by the VR theory, say when unconcious or partially like lucid, you can access the prgramming code and go forward to see whats ahead in the program, it's one of my theories anyway, but then it really isn't future memory, is it? No it's more like reading the end of the book or the middle of the book before you get to it, and when you invoke your freewill, it's like editing the pages in the book that are ahead, before you bother with the section you're in now... I hope you understand what I am trying to explain.

I can relate, and we may have a system of reality that was designed over a span of 13.6 billion years with every single probability already pre-calculated and stored within some database where by the "self" can then pick a subjective node (life form) and experience what that means.

This is just a speculation but if we can accept the possibility that prophets could see a probable future thousands of years forward, then perhaps the story was already written.

There may be no such thing as time/space, only data in certain states of probability waiting for actualization through the act of conscious observation. I can only speculate.

Originally posted by ldyserenity
The reason I do think it's a hologram, is because metatron actually translates to beyond and matrix, that was thousands of years ago they picked that name out. Plus the metatron cube looks like something computerish, if you think of geometric computer systems which would be way beyond our 1's and 0's, but eventually we may be able to run a program just like this.
Typing too fast lol.

Physical Reality may not be a hologram, but how our mind processes and renders sensory information into a holographic virtual reality is certainly like a hologram, like a holodeck.

At least in the cognitive model of perception, our interpretation of reality is "like" a hologram, or a virtual reality rendering.