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Originally posted by GoodOlDave
Originally posted by Thermo Klein
I made my case: pictures of an explosion with no airplane.
...and the case *I* made trumps the case *YOU* made: eyewitnesses in the area specifically saw that it was an airplane that hit the Pentagon.
So I will ask again- what alternative scenario do you have that explains both the strange wall damage AND the eyewitnesses seeing an airplane hitting the Pentagon? Many of them were pretty explicit.
Eyewitness accounts of the Pentagon attack
Not being able to see people from a satelite or airplane means they don't exist and this somehow carries the same logic as if you're only 100 feet away.
He's saying that because we can't see a six foot person from a satellite, we should also not be able to see a 124 foot wide plane from 200 feet away!!
All this work, research, marking points on pictures, and I get only 4 flags... and this Hooper person gets a star for THIS!!? Guys - stop backing each other! You're just making it worse.
Hooper - keep in mind none of us can see your brain.
While we're at it - you do realize you're backing the idea that there is a huge Boeing airplane INSIDE a militarily sealed building... and it got there by flying through a wall!!
Originally posted by dereks
Originally posted by truthquest
But data released by the NTSB is not even close to being compatible with the damage path... it even lists the pilot cabin door as "closed" the entire flight.
Oh dear, you ignore the little fact that the cabin door was shown as closed on every previous flight - that sensor was not connected, as you would know if you visited other than silly conspiracy theory sites....
You and i both know what the nose of a 757 is made of and how thin the aluminum is.
Now we both should know there is no way as stated in the official story that the nose of the plane survived the imapct of the wall and the internal collumns.
Originally posted by thedman
Its not the nose of the aircraft - its whats behind it that did the damage
The keel beam the strongest part of an aircraft - main structural member provides support to cabin and cargo bay floors.
Landing gear - some of the heaviest components on an aircraft, designed to resist impact of 250,000 lbs at 180 mph during landing
Jet engines - built of exotic high strenght alloys to resist high temperaturs and stress of turbines spinning at 10,000 rpm Weigh 6 tons each
Wing spars - large sections of high strength aluminium alloy, provides main strength and support to wings, resists weight of fuel
Originally posted by Thermo Klein
I gave you commonly available, irrefutable pictures centered on the Pentagon explosion when the building hadn't even collapsed yet - there was no airplane, I gave you pictures after the building collapsed - there was no airplane. The evidence can't be any more clear, yet you stick to some old story - I don't get it.
Originally posted by Thermo Klein
If you honestly think that people's eye-witness accounts WITHOUT PICTURES, are better evidence than pictures of the explosion site then we have nothing more to talk about... [You may want to research that eye-witness accounts are often times not used in trials any longer because of the high propensity for error.]
Blast expert Allyn E. Kilsheimer was the first structural engineer to arrive at the Pentagon after the crash and helped coordinate the emergency response. "It was absolutely a plane, and I'll tell you why," says Kilsheimer, CEO of KCE Structural Engineers PC, Washington, D.C. "I saw the marks of the plane wing on the face of the building. I picked up parts of the plane with the airline markings on them. I held in my hand the tail section of the plane, and I found the black box." Kilsheimer's eyewitness account is backed up by photos of plane wreckage inside and outside the building. Kilsheimer adds: "I held parts of uniforms from crew members in my hands, including body parts.
Originally posted by Alfie1
The recovered DNA of passengers and crew places AA 77 at the Pentagon.
Scores of witnesses saw a large passenger jet approach and crash into the Pentagon. Some say it was a Boeing 757, some say it had AA logo.
Wreckage of a Boeing 757 has been recovered from the Pentagon. Some of it imbedded within concrete within the Pentagon. Not a bolt from a missile or a whiff of an explosive was detected at the site.
To contradict that, all we seem to have is your personal opinon of what a crash site should look like. It is not as though you even pretend to have any expertise in the field.
From the morning of 9/11 to today no-one has seen AA 77,its crew, or passengers. Where are they ?
Alright, so we have one guy, Kilsheimer, stating, "I held parts of uniforms from crew members in my hands, including body parts. Okay?"
Interesting that NOBODY took any pictures,
and also that this alleged airplane crashed at around 350 MPH
into cement and the airplane dissolved or turned into liquid,
while leaving the wall intact, AND...
it was hot enough and intense enough to melt an airplane,
but crew uniforms stayed unburnt.
Originally posted by Thermo Klein
Originally posted by Alfie1
The recovered DNA of passengers and crew places AA 77 at the Pentagon.
Scores of witnesses saw a large passenger jet approach and crash into the Pentagon. Some say it was a Boeing 757, some say it had AA logo.
Wreckage of a Boeing 757 has been recovered from the Pentagon. Some of it imbedded within concrete within the Pentagon. Not a bolt from a missile or a whiff of an explosive was detected at the site.
I'd be interested in some citations and pictures of these. DNA from 170 victims would be a solid clue depending on which company allegedly collected and tested it.
Why is it that with all these claims NO ONE can produce a single picture of a lot of wreckage?
To contradict that, all we seem to have is your personal opinon of what a crash site should look like. It is not as though you even pretend to have any expertise in the field.
I don't claim to be an expert, although, I am an ex-airline employee who has gone through several types of crash training and I'm eligible to work on the scene of airplane crashes (not just anyone off the street can do this). I've seen plenty of evidence and crash sites and one thing they ALL have in common, is airplane wreckage.
From the morning of 9/11 to today no-one has seen AA 77,its crew, or passengers. Where are they ?
If there NEVER WAS crew and passengers, evidenced by the fact there's no video of that plane taking off from anywhere and no pictures of the wreckage, they wouldn't be missed.
***
I'm very much willing to change my mind on this - in fact I'd be HAPPY to! I don't want a government and media that lie, I don't want to be part of a small minority that gets ridiculed for not being able to let it go. All I'm asking for is some pictures of a crash scene, which so far, no one has been able to show me.
[edit on 5-2-2010 by Thermo Klein]