Persecutors of Christians in India Attacked by Elephants.

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posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 06:05 PM
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Well, Mohandas Gahndi would certainly say that it is karma. I tend to agree. Now, there is little difference between "punishment" by God and Karma. They both pretty much have a cause and effect feel to them.

Persecution of any people is wrong.However, as long as certain religions try to force their beliefs upon others, as the Muslims and a certain segment of "Christians" tend to do, there will be persecution.



[edit on 29-1-2010 by SpeakerofTruth]




posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 06:06 PM
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From what I recall, those attacks on the Christians were some sort of vengence from some perceived injustice that the Christians had levied on the Hindus TO START WITH.

None of it sounds very Christian to me.



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 06:18 PM
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Originally posted by hadriana
From what I recall, those attacks on the Christians were some sort of vengence from some perceived injustice that the Christians had levied on the Hindus TO START WITH.

None of it sounds very Christian to me.




"They were shouting, accusing them of effecting conversions," some of the witnesses reported.

In that same period, the parliament of another Indian state, Rajasthan, approved an anti-conversion law that inflicts a penalty of five years in prison and a fine of 50,000 rupees (about 1,250 dollars) on those who carry out conversions "by force, coercion, or fraud." With Rajasthan, there are now six Indian states where this kind of norm is in force, which is in fact aimed against the Christian missionaries.

Source


Oh yeah, convincing people to convert to Christianity, that's about as un-Christian as you can get.



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 06:18 PM
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Let me tell you this. If god caused people to be trampled to death because of what people around them did, then he is truly a dick.



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 06:21 PM
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That will learn them. Ganesha will freaking kill you if you rape or kill nuns with rampaging elephants.

He's the hindu god of obstacles. I guess a herd of elephants would qualify as a obstacle for sure.



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 06:22 PM
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reply to post by paranoiaFTW
 


Don't be hating man. Sometimes you have to discipline your children. And if some people are right. Death is just a transition to a better place.



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 06:39 PM
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Originally posted by maximiliian
reply to post by Nutter
 


oh yeah lets forgive the people who gang raped and murdered innocent nuns its ok hey maybe you can get together and have lunch sometime since they like to go around persecuting people for their religious beliefs. They needed to be punished and so thats exactly what happened such foul souls deserve it.
Im sorry you cant see the light.


Finally, someone being honest here and telling it like it really is...
justice is served and look what all the anti christians say.... unbelievable.

good answer Max



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 06:47 PM
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Originally posted by paranoiaFTW
Let me tell you this. If god caused people to be trampled to death because of what people around them did, then he is truly a dick.


Are you saying no one should ever have any accountability for their actions?
your statement doesn't make any sense at all.. in fact, it is the antithesis of stupidity



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 06:54 PM
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Originally posted by hadriana
From what I recall, those attacks on the Christians were some sort of vengence from some perceived injustice that the Christians had levied on the Hindus TO START WITH.

None of it sounds very Christian to me.


I spent several months in India traveling from town to town, and speaking to large groups there, mainly Christian. I also visited many Hindu homes, and found most of them to be very nice people, and such. There is a group of Hindus, however, that are very militant about preventing Christianity from having a foothold in India. I spoke in one church there that regularly has 60,000 to 100,000 people in attendance, all sitting on the huge concrete floor. India is unlike any other place on the planet when it comes to spiritual activity. By comparison, New Zealand is literally "dead" spiritually.

What I mean by dead is that nearly all Indians have some kind of spiritual belief, where here in New Zealand most people don't give spiritual things a second thought.

This group of militant Hindus is very determined to stamp out Christianity from the country. They are not doing this because the Christians have done anything to deserve it. They are doing it because they only want one religion in India... Hinduism.


NEW DELHI, INDIA (BosNewsLife) -- Hindu militants have threatened to burn to death an Indian evangelical pastor and his family if they don't close their Pentecostal church and leave a suburb of Bangalore, India's third largest city, Christian supporters said Monday, August 20.

Source

There is one man I met in India, called "Paulanna" who was the humblest man you'd ever run across, and filled with love for everyone. One day he was talking to some people in Hydrabad and a group of these militants came up, grabbed him, and took him to a place where they beat him and warned him to stop talking to people about the Christian God. He told the story so matter-of-factly, with very few words, and without a drop of animosity towards his persecutors. Paulanna did not in any way believe that what was done to him was God abandoning him, but rather he saw it as a means for others to be encouraged, and when people saw how he did not wish ill to come upon his persecutors, and that he prayed for them, that was an example to them of "loving your enemies."

Now, perhaps in this one place where truly terrible acts were done, such as rapping nuns, etc., there was a reason for a special "answer to prayer" by the people in the area. I'm sure that the people did not ask God to send elephants, but rather they just asked God to help them. So, God had to come up with a way to get the militant's attention, something that would really speak to them, and get them to stop acting in such a terrible manner. Hinduism understands the concept of Karma, and that divine justice CAN be dealt out towards those who are doing exceptional wrong.

All the animals are under God's control, and if he wants, he can send any animals he wishes to accomplish whatever he wishes. The elephants don't have to understand at all why they are doing what they are doing. They will just feel compelled to act in such-and-such a way.

Now, to those who want to accuse God of wrong doing, you really have no idea what you are suggesting. God tells US to love our enemies, and to not repay evil with evil. He tells us that because he says "Revenge is MINE, I will repay." He is the Judge, not us. He is the Creator, not us. As Bush liked to say "He's the DECIDER." God commands you to leave certain things to Him, and He is fully within His right to do so.

For those who think that God has to follow the same set of rules that you do, let me ask you something... did you have that same attitude towards your parents when you were a child? When your Mom and Dad told you to go to sleep at 8:00 P.M., did you refuse, claiming that if they could stay up, so could you? Did you insist on driving a car at the age of 10? Were you a rebellious child, insisting that the rules for children must be the same as the rules for adults?

If you did do that, then it is clear as a bell why you think that same thing regarding you and God.

If you did realize that not all living beings are required to follow the same principles and rules, then you should have little problem with the concept that God is the Supreme Court Judge of the Highest Supreme Court in the Universe.

Nowhere does God portray himself as just a "nice guy" who will allow anyone and everyone to slap him across the face repeatedly with no consequences. No place is he portrayed in that way, and yet that is what He requires from His followers. Those who trust in Him come to a place where they trust his judgment about a given situation. Death and suffering are not the end-all-be-all. This life is not the endgame... it's just the trials to see who is going to make it. For the faithful, death is just an exit from this lower state of existence to a higher-level of existence.

Many times, God allows his followers to be persecuted, and that is His right to do. Those who suffer that way will not fail to gain compensation in the next life. Those who truly understand faith will not find fault with God allowing people to suffer.

Sometimes, however, God will intervene in a situation, preventing evil from continuing to flourish. This he does as he determines. It may be in response to earnest prayer, or it may be just because he has determined to do it for some unknown reason. He is not at all obligated to tell you or me why he does certain things.

Perhaps this entire situation in India came about because God wanted to give a strong "atomic bomb" kind of event that would get the people's attention and cause them to take a step back and ask if what they are doing is the right thing to do.

I would also think that if the Christians who have been persecuted did not fight back, but did what the Bible says to do under such conditions, then perhaps that gave a strong power to their prayers for help.

If, on the other hand, they did wrongly by fighting back, it may not have gone that way. But, God is always free to be God, and that means, unlike mankind, He can do whatever He wants. If you have a problem with that, then that is just your human ego, pride, and lack of humility rearing up it's not-so-beautiful head. You probably have a problem with all authority in your life as well.


[edit on 29-1-2010 by downisreallyup]



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 07:08 PM
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reply to post by Lophe
 


First of all, learn how to spell. It's not SKUM. It's scum. Secondly, what right do you have to even say such a thing?



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 07:11 PM
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reply to post by antideceit
 


yes it was needed to be said ,alot of people are too misguided ,they think if theres a god he is going to come down and save you or hand you a million dollars just because things arent going your way or something horrible happens. it doesnt work like that all the time. Im not even religious but from my experience the way in which things unfold sometimes seem like the work of something indescribable.



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 08:24 PM
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reply to post by maximiliian
 


Well, in some regards you are correct. However, too many people want to cast human characteristics upon the Godhead. They never take into consideration that God is nothing like a human.

God doesn't have the same desire or focus that humans do, nor does he have the personality traits of a human. What I mean is that if you think God feels anger, hate, jealousy, et cetera, as humans do, then you are sadly mistaken.

The first thing one must understand about the Godhead is that God is a SPIRIT, not a man.


The truth was apparent from what had been revealed in the Old Testament, but it had never been put into plain words. “God is spirit,” He declared, “and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and in truth” (John 4:24).
God is a Spirit

What we see in today's culture is anthropomorphism at its worst. For those who don't know what that means:


Anthropomorphism is the attribution of human characteristics to non-human creatures and beings, phenomena, material states and objects or abstract concepts.
Anthropomorphism



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 08:56 PM
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reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
 


When I think of god I think of a universal conscious that has a network-web of some sort that exists on many if not one level.



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 10:34 PM
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Originally posted by paranoiaFTW
Let me tell you this. If god caused people to be trampled to death because of what people around them did, then he is truly a dick.


Don`t expect any stars for that reply. You see, when speaking of God, we refer to the all powerful maker of everything, it is not a term specific to one religion but God is specific to everyone (except for the small atheist group consisting of a very small 2% of the world who each have been burned bad enough at least once this lifetime to be so pissed as to deny a more supreme being then their self). But do not be misled, for we can never fully understand God but we must recognize He is above us and therefore He can never be wrong, to put it more politely then you would.

[edit on 1/29/2010 by csulli456]



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 10:59 PM
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This story sounds like silly propaganda, a case of people seeing what they want to believe.

everyone does it, they twist the perception of reality to justify their beleifs.

..... over 2,500 hundred people were affected, ... I dont think there were that many persecuters were there ???

... and for all the christian homes destroyed, they probably just said " well they probably werent good christians" ... just silly in this day and age, come on now.



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 11:06 PM
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Maybe the elephants werent sticking up for them because they were christians, maybe it was because the people were being victimized and abused, and calling for help. Elephants while not posessing morals are pretty smart creatures. If I were to become frightned and yell for my dogs, they will come. Maybe the elephants had been fed by humans at some point. A familiar smell maybe, but I seriously doubt it was because theyt were christian



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 11:08 PM
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Elephants are really underestimated. They have very good memories and they are family oriented. They can also communicate through the ground.



posted on Jan, 29 2010 @ 11:18 PM
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Originally posted by IntastellaBurst


This story sounds like silly propaganda, a case of people seeing what they want to believe.

everyone does it, they twist the perception of reality to justify their beleifs.

..... over 2,500 hundred people were affected, ... I dont think there were that many persecuters were there ???

... and for all the christian homes destroyed, they probably just said " well they probably werent good christians" ... just silly in this day and age, come on now.


Like you said "everyone does it" and that includes you. You also clearly twist your perceptions that everything is caused by physical explanations, just to fit your perception of reality and to justify your non-spiritual, non-extraordinary view of the world.

A truly enlightened individual would be open to the possibilities. That individual would seek to understand what has happened, and not assume that everyone is just lying, hallucinating, or exaggerating. That is trying to explain something by explaining it away, and that is something that the stupidest and shallowest people can easily do. Naysayers are just people who are too lazy to really look for truth. They are people who have never taken the time to investigate supernatural things, and then they erroneously assume that because they have not experienced something, it must not be true or real.

You can do better, I'm sure of it.


[edit on 29-1-2010 by downisreallyup]



posted on Jan, 30 2010 @ 12:06 AM
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Two things here:

Why is it bad for "militant" Hindu's to not want a foreign religion to take root on their soil "by coercion or fraud" as the law states, yet it is perfectly reasonable to be up in arms about the "Islamo-fascists" who are supposedly trying to instill their world view upon the American masses? In my opinion, they have a perfect right to privilege their own 4,000 year old religion against what they perceive as interlopers who are deliberately and openly trying to replace their religion.

Obviously rape, murder and mayhem is unacceptable against ANYBODY, regardless of what they may or may not believe. And the people who commited such acts are criminals who deserve exceedingly severe punishment.

2ndly, at least for now, I see no way to confirm that their truly was a bias in their actions or an ability to differentiate between Christian persecutors and others. I would suspect this is an example of selective reporting, or at best, coincidence that subsequent rampages may prove wrong. As another poster mentioned, this has affected a lot of people, and it strains credulity to think every last one of them was personally responsible for a hand full of crimes against the Christian populace. Additionally, the link below suggests that the violence had little to do w/ religion as much as it did w/ local gangs and tribal warfare. While it is possible that the story is 100% accurate, until there is independent verification of some of these more outlandish aspects, I will be deferring judgement.

I found a fascinating take on the supposed Christian persecutions and the historical background written by a Born Again Christin who lives in India and has personally investigated and interviewed some of the victims. It might change your mind on the elephants supposed divine inspiration. www.stephen-knapp.com...

What I personally find most intriguing is the organized scouting behavior these elephants are reported to be displaying, assuming this too is correct. It reminds me of the bizarre case of the African man-eating lions made into the move "The Ghost in the darkness". For those not aware, two tigers appeared to use advanced stalking and communal hunting tactics in order to kill over 32 of the workers over a year. It is another strange example of animals showing very unusual and complex tactics in order to hunt humans that has never been demonstrated before (and in the case of the lions, since).

I look forward to hearing more information on this topic, and what the investigation brings. Rampaging elephants for Jesus. Classic.....



posted on Jan, 30 2010 @ 03:03 AM
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reply to post by downisreallyup
 


Have you ever heard the expression, .... it's good to keep an open mind, .. but not so open that your brains fall out ??

I am open to all possiblities, but pay more attention to probabilities. I always view the world from a spiritual perspective, not a christian point of view, as the two are much different. I've seen and done things that some people wouldnt believe, and even as I believe all things to be possible, the more unlikely they are the more improbable, and the more energy they require to manifest.

hence I've adopted a simplistic world view, amongst a complex and chaotic universe. As the saying goes, the simplest answer is usualy the right one.

.... so I'm still going with, whatever these elephants did had nothing to do with christianity. Like was pointed out earlier, elephants are very smart, they remember every elephant they meet for their entire lifetime, and are very sympathetic..... so do we always have to seperate humans by religion, race, or belief's ??? Can't we just say some elephants helped out some fellow human beings ???

and even then, it may all just be coincidence, and have nothing to do with anything except for elephant nature.





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