Last Neanderthals in Europe Died out 37,000 Years Ago

The paper, by Professor João Zilhão and colleagues, builds on his earlier research which proposed that, south of the Cantabro-Pyrenean mountain chain, Neanderthals survived for several millennia after being replaced or assimilated by anatomically modern humans everywhere else in Europe.

This is a pretty neat find! Mostly because if they only died out 37,000 years ago, then they not only lived along anatomically modern humans (180,000 years ago), but they also lived along side behaviorally modern humans (50,000 years ago). Since they did live alongside behaviorally modern humans, I wonder why the humans never kept any record of them, as they did with wooley mammoths, etc.

SOURCE: www.sciencedaily.com...

Well, I think it's possible that neanderthals bred with modern humans and assimilated into our gene pool. It could be that there are no records because they weren't seen as different enough to merit special mention. Keep in mind, the written word is only around six thousand years old, so any records from an earlier time (in the form of paintings) would be vague.

More random dates and unproven theories.....

Sure, I believe in God and it's an "unproven theory", but...
At least I admit mines faith.

Originally posted by CanadianDream420
More random dates and unproven theories.....

Sure, I believe in God and it's an "unproven theory", but...
At least I admit mines faith.

So your "faith" in a cosmic sugar daddy is more believable than a well thought out, scientific investigation?

Science, religion, and faith are in the same. It's all human, all are just other ways of dealing with the world we live in today.

Truly remarkable though! For me I consider the dating methods to be non existent. For I only found out about its existence at the time I interpreted it.

Who knows the world and time could have worked totally different back then. Another existence, that I wasn't apart of.

I sure wish I was apart of the Neanderthal times.

Heck, maybe I was.




[edit on 28-1-2010 by OpenYourHead]

Originally posted by OpenYourHead
Science and faith are in the same. It's all human.

Well, while it's true that someone can have faith in science, that's more of a faith based on facts and logical reasoning. This is as opposed to faith in God, which may involve some sort of reasoning from the believer, but is hardly based on facts.

I apologize, OP, it seems we've hijacked your thread and turned it into a science vs. religion debate. I'll cease and desist immediately.

Originally posted by Schmidt1989
Since they did live alongside behaviorally modern humans, I wonder why the humans never kept any record of them, as they did with wooley mammoths, etc.

Well we didn't hunt Neanderthal for food, so that's probably why we didn't produce cave drawings of them

But we do have very deep rooted myths of non human beings - trolls, goblins etc - which may be a racial memory of encounters with Neanderthals.

I once read that the study of middens from both human and Neanderthal sites showed that humans were much more diverse in their diet - taking advantage of alternate foods (e.g. shellfish, fish) rather than relying on hunting and gathering of 'traditional' sources. The diversity in the humans' diet allowed them to venture farther into unknown territories, while the Neanderthals were more likely to stay where they know their traditional diet was abundant. As climates and topography changed, the traditional foods became less abundant, and the Neanderthals were unable to diversify their diet to accommodate the changes.

Just a theory, but it makes sense.

Originally posted by Essan

Well we didn't hunt Neanderthal for food...

Are you sure about that?

One of science's most puzzling mysteries - the disappearance of the Neanderthals - may have been solved. Modern humans ate them, says a leading fossil expert.

The controversial suggestion follows publication of a study in the Journal of Anthropological Sciences about a Neanderthal jawbone apparently butchered by modern humans. Now the leader of the research team says he believes the flesh had been eaten by humans, while its teeth may have been used to make a necklace.

Fernando Rozzi, of Paris's Centre National de la Récherche Scientifique, said the jawbone had probably been cut into to remove flesh, including the tongue. Crucially, the butchery was similar to that used by humans to cut up deer carcass in the early Stone Age. "Neanderthals met a violent end at our hands and in some cases we ate them," Rozzi said.

Source:
www.guardian.co.uk...

I don't understand. I've always known that Neanderthals disappeared around 35000 BC. How is that news?

isnt there a gap of several thousand years in area's after the neanderthals vanish and modern humans appear?

Also before the neanderthals started vanishing they sort of coexisted with modern man. At least modern man didnt advance out of the near east into europe but instead went to central asia. Where they stayed for quite a while before moving into europe from there.

Originally posted by LiquidLight
Well, I think it's possible that neanderthals bred with modern humans and assimilated into our gene pool. It could be that there are no records because they weren't seen as different enough to merit special mention. Keep in mind, the written word is only around six thousand years old, so any records from an earlier time (in the form of paintings) would be vague.

I agree, im still trying to wonder how no one recognized the most famous neanderthal... bush.

They died out because of their natural mentality, where as 'man' was nomadic, the neanderthals would stay in one place and not hunt or gather too far from their homes.

They died from climatechange.

and it wasnt "MAN MADE"

it was a natural occurance and they all starved to death, then a metorite crashed into northern Europe wiping out the rest of them.

google it.

Reconstructions of Neanderthals don't have them looking all that much different than us.
It's possible they just assimilated in, but since they would have been different than us... it's as likely fights occurred, much like you would have between aboriginal tribes.
Might have also been trade as well, however.

@ Silent Thunder

That idea is based off of one find, and there's evidence that early man practiced cannibalism as well as neaderthal man.

It was climatechange...and the reason they aren't recorded is diversity. The global elitists of that time pushed acceptance of diversity in peoples, and pushed climatechange and global warming. See, we aren't so advance anyway...

Nice find.

What if you take this also into account?

greetings lunica

Originally posted by Apocolypto
They died out because of their natural mentality, where as 'man' was nomadic, the neanderthals would stay in one place and not hunt or gather too far from their homes.

They died from climatechange.

and it wasnt "MAN MADE"

it was a natural occurance and they all starved to death, then a metorite crashed into northern Europe wiping out the rest of them.

google it.

Well, there's very little evidence that Neanderthals did anything but hunt large mammals for sustenance, and they likely had no division of labor between male and female. On the other hand, homo sapien males likely hunted large mammals, while the women, children, and elderly fished and gathered plants.

As such, when the climate changed and their main source of food disappeared, it's possible that Neanderthals didn't have the ability to adapt as readily as homo sapiens, and this could be the reason for their disappearance.

edit to say that our ability to adapt to almost any circumstance is why modern humans have thrived on every continent except Antarctica.

[edit on 1/30/2010 by LiquidLight]

if i recall correctly neandrathal dna was found and compared with modern human. it was shown that modern humans had not intermingled with neandrathals at least not to the extant of having children, which might not have been possible. sorry but i have no clue where i read that and am not up for searching for it (particularily isnce im sure i didnt read it on line).

neanderthal dna has been found in modern humans.
"Traces of that ancient DNA live on in most human beings today, the researchers report in fridays edition of the journal Science" L.A.Times may 7, 2010.
hrmm guess i became wrong. lol! funny how often that happens thru time; but thats another thread entirely....