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Thy Will be Done, On Earth as It is in Texas

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posted on May, 27 2004 @ 07:20 AM
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Not long ago I pulled my car up alongside a tiny wooden church in the woods, a stark white frame box my family built in 1840. And as always, an honest-to-god chill went through me, for the ancestral ghosts presumably hovering over the graves there. From the wide open front door the Pentecostal preacher's message echoed from within the plain wooden walls: "Thank you Gawd for giving us strawng leaders like President Bush during this crieeesis. Praise you Lord and guide him in this battle with Satan's Muslim armies." If I had chosen to go back down the road a mile or so to the sprawling new Bible Baptist church---complete with school facilities, professional sound system and in-house television production---I could have heard approximately the same exhortation. Usually offered at the end of a prayer for sons and daughters of members in the congregation serving in Iraq, it can be heard in any of the thousands upon thousands of praise temples across our republic.

After a lifetime of identity conflict, I have come to accept that, blood-wise, if not politically or spiritually, these are my people. And as a leftist it is very clear to me these days why urban liberals not only fail to understand these people, but do not even know they exist, other than as some general lump of ignorant, intolerant voters called "the religious right," or the "Christian Right," or "neocon Christians." But until progressives come to understand what these people read, hear, are told and deeply believe, we cannot understand American politics, much less be effective. Given fundamentalist Christianity's inherent cultural isolation, it is nearly impossible for most enlightened Americans to imagine, in honest human terms, what fundamentalist Americans believe, let alone understand why we should all care.

For liberals to examine the current fundamentalist phenomenon in America is accept some hard truths. For starters, we libs are even more embattled than most of us choose to believe. Any significant liberal and progressive support is limited to a few urban pockets on each coast and along the upper edge of the Midwestern tier states. Most of the rest of the nation, the much vaunted heartland, is the dominion of the conservative and charismatic Christian. Turf-wise, it's pretty much their country, which is to say it presently belongs to George W. Bush for some valid reasons. Remember: He did not have to steal the entire election, just a little piece of it in Florida. Evangelical born-again Christians of one stripe or another were then, and are now, 40% of the electorate, and they support Bush 3-1. And as long as their clergy and their worst instincts tell them to, they will keep on voting for him, or someone like him, regardless of what we view as his arrogant folly and sub-intelligence. Forget about changing their minds. These Christians do not read the same books we do, they do not get their information from anything remotely resembling reasonably balanced sources, and in fact, consider even CBS and NBC super-liberal networks of porn and the Devil's lies. Given how fundamentalists see the modern world, they may as well be living in Iraq or Syria, with whom they share approximately the same Bronze Age religious tenets. They believe in God, Rumsfeld's Holy War and their absolute duty as God's chosen nation to kick Muslim ass up one side and down the other. In other words, just because millions of Christians appear to be dangerously nuts does not mean they are marginal.

Having been born into a Southern Pentecostal/Baptist family of many generations, and living in this fundamentalist social landscape means that I gaze into the maw of neocon Christianity daily. Hell, sometimes hourly. My brother is a fundamentalist preacher, as are a couple of my nephews, as were many of my ancestors going back to god-knows-when. My entire family is born-again; their lives are completely focused inside their own religious community, and on the time when Jesus returns to earth---Armageddon and The Rapture.


By JOE BAGEANT

My grandmother was a Pentacostal, and though she didn't live in the states, I can see her in that mold. It's a good article that will help to give reason to those dumbfounded as to why this president's approval rating, if based solely on performance, would not be in the single digits. It's hard for some to fathom why, but church & state have zero seperation in many people's minds.




posted on May, 27 2004 @ 08:09 AM
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That's right, because all Christians are idiots and have no valid opinions whatsoever! Their "morals" and sense of what is "right" are nothing but rhetorical tripe!

Numbskull



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 08:28 AM
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And it's not an anti-Christian screed.
But given the fact that an alarming portion of the voting demographic, as in Iraq with Shiites & Sunnis, vote soley on their religous symmetry with a candidate irespective of that candidates foiables, it is a cause for concern & those fundamentalists are a problem. They are a problem, as in Afganistan/Iraq/Saudi Arabia/Chenchnya and all other hot spots around the globe, because they are extremely easy to manipulate & mobilize to a frothy blood lust by any charasmatic leader who wears the same mask of their fundamentalism.

Read, think, post. You're as responsible for the quality of dialouge, like every other poster who does take a minute. If I can wade through the utter fascist waist high shiite of Free Republic threads, I can't see the hardship in you reading & thinking about ATS content before you default into name calling.



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 08:58 AM
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I know a *few* people that will continue to support Bush because of his religious demonstrations. These people also named their dog after Bush, and they have a pre-printed "autographed" picture of George & Laura hanging on the wall of their home. I could go on but I won't.



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 09:38 AM
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I asked my parents if they were going to vote for Bush. Their reply was "of course, he's a Christian." I asked why with all the crap that his administration has pulled and that was the only reason why they are voting for him....because he's a "Christian". I love my parents but sometimes I just want to say "WAKE UP". So, for now, I'm keeping my vote in PA just so I can counter at least one of theirs.



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 02:03 PM
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MacMerdin

Serious question for you, because I don't recognize your name,
("crap that his administration has pulled")

What are you referring to?

Seriously, don't get uptight or anything I really want to know your facts.

Thank you.



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 02:14 PM
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SuperKyle,

Well, firstly I am gay. My parents know this and love and support me. So, why would they vote for someone who wants to deny me the choice of marriage? Also, how about the whole war in Iraq? Not that it wasn't a good thing, because I do feel that we are basically doing the right thing. But, the way in which we got there to begin with....meaning the lies to get us there. How about the dwindling of our economy? I could go on but you'd be better off reading other threads about the Bush admins faults. So, with all that said, why vote for someone just because he is suppossed to be of your religion? Just because Kerry isn't a fundamentalist (read EXTREMIST) Christian doesn't mean that he's not Christian. I don't know what his religious views are and really don't care because my vote is going to whom I feel will be a better president not a better religious leader. Did I answer your question?



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 02:16 PM
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[Edited on 1-6-2004 by Faisca]



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 03:29 PM
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Bush is a Christian ?

Would a Christian put 152 people to death while Governor of Texas ?

Would a Christian mock a person on death row as Bush did to Karla Faye Tucker ?

Would a Christian begin an unjust war which has resulted in the deaths of thousands ?

Would a Christian put money and power before humanity ?

Bush a Christian ? - my arse. And if he says he's a Christian that just makes him a hypocrite too.

George Bush - The Texecutioner


[Edited on 27-5-2004 by Pisky]



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 03:40 PM
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Pisky that's my view 100% But some people don't care to look at the "bad things" I guess. Why would Bush do the things he's dnoe if he's Christian? Some people choose not to look deeper into issues and just go with what they hear on TV, and it makes me sooo frustrated.



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 03:49 PM
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Maybe the people who blindly follow him because he's a Christian should reconsider their own ideas as to exactly what Christianity is.

That made me consider the questions I posed earlier ...

Would Jesus put 152 people to death while Governor of Texas ?

Would Jesus mock a person on death row as Bush did to Karla Faye Tucker ?

Would Jesus begin an unjust war which has resulted in the deaths of thousands ?

Would Jesus put money and power before humanity ?


And I got a resounding NO ! as a reply to all of the questions. So why did Bush do them, if he follows Jesus ?

Maybe he doesn't follow Jesus at all - Maybe its just lip service.



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 06:20 PM
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LOL Pisky.....that reminds me of the commercial....."What would Jesus drive?" Sorry to be off topic.

I also know a few Christians who have said the same thing about Bush though Pisky. They feel that Bush is far from at least acting Christian. Not Christian bashing here.



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 06:28 PM
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this thread is full of pure conjecture and BULL#.

i also see people becoming more and more delusional the longer they stay here...pity! i actually had respect for them...HAD being the keyword.



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 06:45 PM
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Think of it though. Me, a pagan, defending Christians from being tarred with the same brush as 'phony-Christians'. I just think its unfair for the reputations of true followers of Christ to be blackened by people who say one thing and do another.
I'd do the same for Muslims or Jews if it came to it.



posted on May, 27 2004 @ 07:51 PM
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Thank you, Pisky. I admire your ability to do that =) To look at something from a differing point of view and defending that different view is something that not many people can do (especially around here).

Seriously though, I get so frustrated with the difficulty inherent in getting close minded or thick skulled people (Christians or otherwise) to even look at opinions that might be different than their own. Has anyone found a good way to combat this problem? I'm still searching...

[Edited on 1-6-2004 by Faisca]




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