Robert Hastings has a message for UFO non-believers.

reply to post by James Carlson


What I don't know about the process, and what nobody else has mentioned to me, is whether or not the crews that were camping out at the launch facility needed to be authenticated to get access to LER-1, the upper level of the launch equipment room. When they were camping out, were they inside or outside the fence of the LF? As I understand it, if they were camping outside the fence, they need to be authenticated in order to be allowed access to the LER. Now if they need to be authenticated, this adds more time to the process, although in this case it could probably have been done almost immediately -- but I'm not certain, and that's why I mention it. Figel mentions authenticating security, but he doesn't mention authenticating maintenance, nor how long it took if it was done, and it might be significant. If the maintenance crew doesn't need to be authenticated, we're still looking at about 20-30 minutes average just to get down into LER-1 to check on the status of the missile, unless the access hatch was opened the night before and left open throughout the night. That doesn't seem very likely to me for security and weathering reasons, but if I'm wrong, someone please tell me -- I don't think I am wrong, because I know how the military usually works, and that's by checklist (which Figel also refers to), and I don't believe anybody would put "open the access hatch, and leave it open all night while you're sleeping" on a checklist. I also don't know whether or not the team member going below into the underground LER-1 still has to "safe" the site before checking the missile status -- and that's kind of important, since below ground in the silo is a "No-Lone-Zone", and whoever goes below can't be alone with the equipment, except for a very, very brief time, because by doing so, he's breaking visual contact with the security crew or other maintenance crew members above ground. If he's still required to safe the site, then he's got to click in a digital safety switch in order to disarm all of the explosive devices on site, at which point he has to reestablish immediately visual contact with another member of his maintenance team or security. I don't know whether it was done or not, but I can't think of any good reason why 2 men wouldn't have gone below, so this might be entirely irrelevant to the actual process. However this is done, though, the security team still remains on the surface with the 2-way radio.

Once the status has been checked underground, the only way that maintenance can report to the LCC is by using the SIN telephone that's underground with all the equipment, since the security personnel stay on the surface, and they're the only guys with the 2-way radios. This is also confirmed by Figel in his "interview" with Hastings. This whole process is the major reason why I don't believe that the mention of UFOs to anybody on the SIN telephone was a valid report. And that's why I remain convinced that they were just screwing around. Security wakes them up, they throw on their clothes unless they slept rugged, and then they take about 20 minutes plus to open up the access hatch, climb down into LER-1 and check the status of the missile. Maintenance then calls the LCC on the SIN telephone below ground, and says something to the effect of, "yeah, we've got indication of a channel 9 No-Go -- I guess the UFO that's up there must have shut down the missile."

reply to post by James Carlson


And he says this while the security crew is still on the surface with the 2-way radio on which they've already established comms with the LCC. And yet, the first mention of a UFO comes from maintenance on the SIN telephone underground, and not by the security team on the surface with the supposed UFO and communications already established and open via the 2-way. Once the guy underground has said this, it's overheard by the team leader of one of the other security teams who are with another maintenance group at another silo, because they're also required to monitor the 2-ways -- that means they can overhear everything that's being said at the LCC -- he pops in with "yeah, there's one out here too!" and all of a sudden it's a regular holiday crowd of UFOs on the comms side, but no actual UFOs on site. Had there been a real UFO present, security would have notified either the command post or the LCC immediately, to determine whether Figel still wants them to go below, wait for a strike team or what. However the event occurred, though, it would never have been reported first by the maintenance crew underground -- I believe Figel and my father would have heard about it immediately from security on the surface, because that's their job -- they aren't checking the status of the missile -- they're looking after the maintenance team. So during the 20 plus minutes it takes to open the access hatch, go into the LER to check the status, and call the LCC on the SIN telephone, either nobody else saw the UFO except the guy preparing and then opening the access hatch, descending into the LER, and then calling the LCC, or nobody on the security team thought a UFO on site was important enough to call in via already established comms with the LCC, or there was no UFO. Common sense should tell you that there was no UFO, only a half-assed attempt to be amusing by a guy who was still asleep at 0845 when the missiles actually went offline. This is not a difficult scenario to follow through, unless you're just so convinced that UFOs were involved that you no longer consider the most obvious explanations for anything in relation to the event.

In addition, Hastings never explains what the UFO was doing hovering over the silo a good half hour (at least) after the missiles were already taken offline. Are the pilots just hanging out to see what affect their little "screw up the American missiles" game has on the natives? There are so many obvious holes to his version of this supposed flying saucer interference event that it surprises me the damn thing doesn't just sink along with other obvious fictions from its own weight. I guess because people like Hastings and Salas keep it alive for no purpose, with no evidence, and in obvious contradiction to anything that looks even remotely like common sense.

Everything that Figel has said to Hastings in every interview he's done, including the one Hastings repeatedly discusses above, as if it's some holy recognition of demonic possession or something equally and controversially important, sounds EXACTLY like this to me -- just a couple of guys screwing around, which according to some guys I've met at different missileer websites, used to happen a lot. Just a week or so ago, I got an email from a guy who was somewhat familiar with a hoax story out of 490th SMS in 1970-71, and he was told (by a drunken team member at a local watering hole, so you decide how accurate the story is) about a hoax that even ended up being reported in a UFO magazine -- which were also extremely plentiful at the time, more so than now, because UFOs were a lot more culturally relevant then; you couldn't turn on the TV without hearing about UFOs, watching a show about UFOs, or listening to people talk about UFOs. Anything for a laugh, y'know?

reply to post by James Carlson


When I first asked my father about Echo Flight, he told me basically the same thing. He also told me that in the late 1960s he used to hear UFO "reports" all the time, at both Malmstrom AFB and in New Mexico, and this escalated the more that UFOs were in the news and discussed on television. He also said that to his knowledge not one UFO ever "reported" to him turned out to be anything to be concerned with, and that most of time it was just lights in the sky that the kids who were on watch would imagine to be more mysterious than they actually were. He said a point was reached when it happened so often that he was certain folks were reporting UFOs when there was nothing to report -- just to be funny or amusing -- and that a lot of this was due to television. I got interested in that portion of it, because like any other kid who grew up in the 60s and 70s, I spent a lot of time in front of the TV, so just for kicks I looked up what was on TV for March 1967, and was surprised to notice that there was a lot of mention of UFOs in the Sci-Fi shows like Star Trek, Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea, Lost in Space, and The Invaders, crime shows like the Green Hornet, and comedies like Green Acres -- and this was just between March 9 and March 15, 1967; all of them dealt with flying saucers, either as real Sci-Fi threats or as hoaxes. I was particularly amused to find out that on March 15, 1967, the day before the Echo Flight Incident, Green Acres aired an episode called "The Saucer Season" about a UFO hoax investigated by an Air Force Lt. played by Robert Hastings, who was also a regular at that time on McHale's Navy. Deja Vu? Coincidence? Synchronicity? Irony? Or just stupid-weird? You decide...

And so, in both the short and the long run, we end up with an Echo Flight Incident having more in common with a repeat of the Green Acres episode "The Saucer Season" just a few hours after it had originally aired the day before than with an actual report of a UFO. This isn't even rocket science anymore -- it's just a pathetic manipulation of already established facts by some guy with a tape recorder and a pen looking for anything at all that might show how Robert Salas' ridiculous little fiction about UFOs and missiles may have actually occurred. But anybody with an open mind who looks close enough can't help but notice that there is NOTHING there.

reply to post by James Carlson


Look, go to the websites and talk to the missileers -- they've got lifetimes of experience with this very thing that neither I nor Hastings will ever possess. Talk to them ... please. Ask them if this sounds like a valid UFO event -- ask them what they think about Hastings little missile book and the stories he's written. I've told you what I believe, based on what I've read from every statement available, what my father has told me, what I've discussed with other missileers elsewhere, and what I've read and uncovered through my own research. I've detailed everything, given you the sources, and in most cases told you exactly where you can look up the documents yourselves on the internet, so you can judge the matter and its context for yourself at your leisure. In my opinion, it would seem overly hasty for anyone to judge that Figel's version of these events describes an actual UFO sighting, but these guys -- Salas, Klotz, Hastings, CUFON, et al -- are very used to doing exactly that; all of the confirmations Robert Salas has gathered to "prove" his story are, for the most part, nonsense. He claims confirmation by my father, which is bunk -- my father doesn't even believe in UFOs, and he's said this on numerous occassions. I communicated very shortly with Salas' watch commander -- Mr. Frederick Meiwald -- and although he didn't want to go into any details for personal reasons having nothing to do with the story itself (a health related issue), he did tell me that, like my father, he doesn't believe in UFOs either. What kind of confirmations are these?

Instead of the above litany of questions regarding my claims and my father's memories, Hastings should be asking questions like: how much time elapsed between Figel's instructions to check the status of the missile and when that status was actually reported? Did Figel at any time for however many years believe that a UFO had actually shut down the missiles at Echo Flight? Did Figel believe that what he heard on the 2-way and the SIN telephone correlated with an actual report of a UFO, and did he respond by doing anything different from what he would normally have done? Are there any errors in the scenario I've outlined above? Other than to clear UFOs as having anything at all to do with the missile failures, did the investigators or anybody else spend a lot of time discussing the mention of UFOs? Did the Malmstrom UFO officer, Lt. Col. Lewis D. Chase, question Figel or anybody else regarding UFOs, or did he investigate any UFOs at all in relation to Echo Flight? Did anybody at all seem concerned about a UFO having somehow caused a flight of missiles to drop into a No-Go state? When everybody concerned was debriefed later, did anybody tell them not to discuss the matter of UFOs, or just not to discuss anything having to do with the Echo Flight missiles going offline? Was anybody ever debriefed by anybody specifically regarding UFOs, or was everything focused on Echo Flight equipment and the electrical environment? Was there any serious response from anybody at all resulting from what seems to be an offhanded mention of UFOs?

reply to post by James Carlson


Please believe me, I have no intentions of disputing with anybody the existence of UFOs or even whether UFOs are overly fascinated with nuclear facilities. Frankly, I'm not much interested in UFOs, and what I know about them is almost entirely the result of research stemming from this one incident. I don't know whether Figel believes in UFOs, and I'm not even sure whether that's relevant. But I do believe that his past statements have been grievously misinterpreted by people who are more concerned with finding UFOs than they are with finding out what really happened. Because of this, I think they're blinded to what he's been telling them from day one -- of course, the same might be said of me, and if that's the case, I'll apologize -- I have no desire to win an argument by trying to hide actual facts and events, or by lying about something, and I'll concede the field entirely if I'm that far off. I would still believe what my father claims, but I would absolutely quit saying that Figel has been misinterpreted, and I would go out publically and state that my suppositions regarding his version of events was in error. And that would require an apology to Mr. Hastings that I would otherwise absolutely dread, because I detest the man -- but I would still aplogize and try to put things right. I'm not a dishonest person, and I don't intend to give others reason to make such a claim. I know words and phrases like "personal honor" aren't particularly popular these days, but some people do take character seriously, and I like to think that I'm one of those people, and that my actions show this. If I need to make amends, than I'll make amends -- I promise you that. But I don't believe it will ever come to that, because the "evidence" these guys have presented in full knowledge of the facts of this case is absolutely pathetic -- and the fact that they've continuously ignored or distorted the record of this very well-documented event suggests to me that their conclusions are studiously forced into a box with a UFO, making any examination without that UFO impossible.

The research that I've done all points to exactly one cause of the missile failures -- an electronic noise pulse that was probably generated internally either in the microcircuitry adjacent to the logic coupler or in the logic coupler itself. But it could have happened anywhere -- and if Kaminsky was an actual electrical engineer in 1967, he should have known this -- it was, after all, a very common problem in the early use of integrated circuitry. I have also documented and detailed all of this in my narrative, and it is a well-known character of technological history that Kaminsky either ignores or refuses to consider. The fact that documents from 1967-1969 all assert very plainly and in a very detailed manner EXACTLY what transpired makes it very unlikely that Kaminsky was giving a factual record of the events. I'll give Salas the benefit of the doubt here that the letter was genuinely written by Kaminsky, but there are a number of points to that letter that are quite simply WRONG, and cannot be supported by anything. For instance, he states that "Meanwhile I was contacted by our representative at OOAMA (Don Peterson) and told by him that the incident was reported as being a UFO event--That a UFO was seen by some Airmen over the LCF at the time E-Flight went down."

reply to post by James Carlson


We know for a fact that didn't happen, because if it had, Lt. Col. Lewis D. Chase would have investigated it per standing orders that went into effect in 1966; he continuously affirmed before his death that Echo Flight had nothing to do with UFOs, and he did not investigate any UFO sightings at all by anybody until March 24-25, 1967. I also show in my narrative that while there were rumors of UFOs in relation to Echo Flight, these rumors were very likely the result of discussions between Raymond Fowler, a NICAP investigator employed by Sylvania Corporation, and Roy Craig, an investigator with the Condon committe tasked by the Air Force with studying UFO phenomena, such rumors stemming from the fact that Raymond Fowler didn't know half as much about Echo Flight as he thought he knew, including the date on which it occurred. All of this has been documented since 1995, as I discuss in my narrative, and can be examined by anybody at any time; in most cases my sources can be downloaded or otherwise accessed on the internet. I didn't make up anything, my conclusions are valid and far more likely than the one espoused by Hastings and Salas, and my sources are very well regarded by both scholars and historians.

All of the logic couplers used by Autonetics throughout both the Minuteman I and the Minuteman II systems were highly susceptible to noise pulse, and when such an EMP was injected into the logic coupler, 7 out of 10 times the result was the same series of errors noted at Echo Flight, and then everything goes offline. A transformer had apparently blown around the time as the actual incident, so a lot of testing was conducted in an attempt to determine whether or not the transformer voltage could have coupled with the shielding in use on the LF cabling, but all the testing was negative. This indicated that the transient voltage spike affecting the logic coupler had to have originated somewhere adjacent to the LCC. Since no such testing could really be done to prove where the noise came from without taking down an LCC -- and even then it was doubtful that they'd find anything positive for the money they'd have to spend -- it was decided to correct the problem at the logic coupler by removing it's susceptibility to EMP noise -- a fix which, thankfully, was already scheduled system wide as part of the Minuteman II Force Modernization; the Air Force had been testing EMP affects on the electrical grid and LCC to LF cable systems at Hill AFB, Warren AFB, and contractor facilities since 1965 as part of their plans to upgrade the EMP defenses, and had made suggestions that would shield the logic couplers from electromagnetic interference of all kinds. They were also certain this would prevent electromagnetic noise from entering the logic couplers of the Minuteman I systems. So the Air Force simply ordered the fix to Minuteman I as well, as part of the new Force Mods. By July 1968, all the changes had been made, and the problem never occurred again. All of the command histories indicate that this is what happened, and the Top Secret Noforn ICBM Histories that the Air Force declassified a couple of years ago all say the same thing. The ICBM histories don't even mention UFOs in relation to any equipment problems at Malmstrom AFB (they might mention them elsewhere, but I only looked at the late 1960s at Malmstrom AFB -- but they're all online now at Georgetown University, so maybe I'll check someday, just for fun).

reply to post by James Carlson


Now from the outside, that's what it looks like to me. Maybe I got some minor details wrong, but I don't see the USAF spending so much money to conduct all of those tests if they knew a UFO had actually shut down the missiles, particularly since they were in the middle of a very well-documented budget crisis at the time. And from what I see, Walt Figel's version of these events is pretty much the same. I believe Mr. Hastings is neglecting a more common sense explanation in favor of something he desperately wants to believe in, but can't possibly prove. If I'm wrong, please tell me -- I'll apologize for the things I've said to Robert Hastings and to Robert Salas for my insistence that they have misinterpreted what Figel told them. I have no wish for my argument to prevail on the basis of my own stubborn adherence to an explanation that can't be otherwise supported -- that position on the field has already been co-opted by others. So if I'm wrong, tell me. Show me how I'm wrong -- explain to me in a sensible fashion that doesn't rely on Hastings' and Salas' insistence that "everybody else lied about it" except the witness -- oh, wait -- they don't have any real witnesses. I keep forgetting that bit. Okay, then, explain why you think I'm wrong, and make some sense, y'know? Because nonsense like Hastings regularly comes up with is always the last resort of idiots, and I don't think the readers of this forum are that stupid. You might as well just believe the first guy you meet on the street tomorrow, for all the good you'll get out of it.

But if you think I'm right ... please tell everybody else.

Most sincerely,
James Carlson

RH: BTW, there is a James T. Carlson living in Albuquerque (as you do) who uses the cyber name "acid_head" and lists one of his interests as "acid." Would that be you, James?

James Carlson: Yeah, that's about the response I expected -- we've played this little game of yours before.

RH: You didn't answer the question, James, as everyone reading this thread must have noticed. Given the comments made to me by your own father, regarding your psychological "problems" (amply demonstrated here and elsewhere, IMHO) my question is relevant. Either you are the James T. Carlson who uses the cyber-name "acid_head" or you're not. Which is it?

James Carlson: Figel doesn't confirm anything that Hastings claims, and certainly doesn't indicate that anything very strange occurred.

RH: As for Col. Walt Figel not confirming what I've written, how would you know, given that you have been too cowardly to call him, to hear what he told me directly, despite my pleas that you do so? His comments posted on this thread are verbatim excerpts from my taped conversation with him. As others posting here have previously noted, you are the *only* one who thinks that Figel agrees with your position. Talk about deep denial. (Drew Clueless doesn't count here, given his 100/1 inaccuracy-to-accuracy ratio when attempting to interpret anything anyone else has posted here.)

Now, how about my question regarding your interest or non-interest in '___'? Are you "acid_head" or not?

[edit on 28-2-2010 by Robert Hastings]

reply to post by gortex


Great post. A couple of possibilities. Maybe the ET's are concerned about our use of nuclear weapons just because it is a function of theirs to monitor dangerous elements in the universe.

Then again perhaps they are especially interested because they are responsible for us having the information in the first place and with that they are obligated (by some other universal law or entity perhaps?) to make sure it goes no farther than earth or that we do not use it to cause irreversible damage.

Click here for more information.

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The personal insults and attacks will stop now - or the thread will close.

Disagree, debate and challenge - but it must be done in a mature and respectable manner.

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reply to post by Robert Hastings


Hi Mr Hastings -I just wondered if you'd ever come across any further info regarding the Minot AFB incident from 1968 - its seems its quite a popular Air Force base as there were also unexplained UFO incidents in 1967 and 1966 but there does exist some pretty strange claims made about the 1968 case - heres one intriguing statement from Bill McNeff:

“There were incidents during the Minot episode that did not make it into the Blue Book files,” said McNeff, who added the official record doesn’t reflect that two airmen passed out after a close approach from the UFO.

He said a report that the lid of a missile silo was tampered with was also left out.

“What I learned later is that the lid was completely off the silo and lying on the grass,” McNeff said.

The Minot AFB B-52 UFO Incident.

Cheers.

Hi Karl,

Regarding the story of the two airmen passing out, I offer this, from my book UFOs and Nukes:

Although this bizarre report is strikingly similar to a scene in Steven Spielberg’s 1977 movie, Close Encounters of the Third Kind, researchers Jim Klotz and Tom Tulien have heard an account involving two USAF missile guards who were stationed at Minot AFB, in North Dakota, in 1968. Tulien told me, “This ‘second-hand’ story was apparently provided to a B-52 crew [we interviewed] by the commander of the 810th Strategic Aerospace Division, during a debriefing following a UFO event at Minot on 24 October 1968...The navigator recalled being informed that a large brightly-lit UFO was hovering close above a SAT team vehicle at one of the missile sites, frightening the occupants...when their B-52 appeared over the base flight line the UFO went dark and lifted up in the direction of the B-52. [Similarly,] the co-pilot recalled being informed that a large UFO was hovering close over a SAT vehicle at one of the missile sites, which frightened the SAT team who exited their vehicle running away. Since the team did not report-in, a second SAT team was dispatched and found the first team on the ground unconscious with the paint burned off the top of the vehicle.”



[edit on 1-3-2010 by Robert Hastings]

reply to post by Robert Hastings


Hi Mr Hastings, thanks for the reply -thats certainly a very intriguing report and I'd never heard about the paint being burned off the top of the vehicle before. With all the witness testimony and radar evidence from the Minot case you'd think it would be more widely publicized (and discussed) but, as usual with these incidents, they're either forgotten about or wilfully ignored (so good job on the book ).

There was also another very strange aspect to this case involving claims of a missing combination lock on the inner door but I don't know how reliable the information is.

Missing lock.

Now comes one of the most interesting parts, and one that seemed to have slipped by the Air Force investigators at Blue Book. "Fourteen other people in separate locations also reported sighting a similar object. Also, at this approximate time, security alarm for one of the sites was activated. This was an alarm for both the outer and inner ring. When guards arrived at the scene they found that the outer door was open and the combination lock on the inner door had been removed."

Link

Cheers.

reply to post by Robert Hastings


Gentlemen, and Ladies,

Robert Hastings has made much of the fact that I have refused to interview his witness, Col. (Ret.) Walter Figel, Jr., regarding his recollections of the Echo Flight Incident on March 16, 1967. To be precise, he has written "I note first that James Carlson still refuses to call retired Col. Walt Figel, to hear from his own lips, as I did in October 2008, that while on alert as the DMCCC at Malmstrom's Echo Flight, in March 1967, he spoke with two individuals via the phone in the capsule--a missile maintenance team member and an arriving SAT team member--about a "large round object" that was hovering over one of the flight's LFs. James' father, Eric Carlson, lied to him some time ago--telling him that no UFOs were present when all 10 missiles dropped-off alert status--and so James has been slandering and libeling everyone who disputes that version of events ever since, Including one former MIMS tech whom I interviewed a few years ago." He stated as well: "So, James Carlson, rant on. If you ever find the courage to call Col. Figel please let me know. I will provide his phone number, as I first offered to do a year-and-a-half ago."

Frankly, I've never needed his assitance to contact Col. Figel -- I've managed to do so quite easily on my own. The fact that I have been reticent to discuss the matter in more detail has very little to do with cowardice. I have, in fact, contacted Col. Figel, but didn't feel that it would be very ethical to discuss in detail the event he recalls without securing first his complete cooperation, authority, and permission to do so. Having secured that this very evening, I am now prepared to discuss the matter in full. I can also add, very strongly, that my father never lied to me about anything, as Hastings claims, and that his recollections match exactly those of Col. Figel's. I've "slandered and libeled" nobody, and I can say with complete confidence today that both Robert Hastings and Robert Salas have knowingly mislead their entire audience into believing a lie they were well aware of in order to sell their books.

To begin with, Col. Figel does not believe in UFOs and does not believe that they were even remotely associated with the Echo Flight Incident, or any other equipment failures at Malmstrom AFB in 1967 (or any other year, for that matter). In one of his emails to me, he stated conclusively that "I am not a fan of Salas, Hastings, or the whole UFO crowd. I have never seen one and flatly don't believe they exist at all. I just want you to be clear of my position on UFOs. They make good science fiction - nothing more." In a discussion of Robert Salas and James Klotz's book "Faded Giant" and Robert Hastings' book "UFOs and Nukes", Col. Figel states unequivocably that "I have read both of their books. There are many inaccurate statements and events in the books. I have told them both that." Apparently, both authors ignored what Figel told them. In addition, he states that "Oscar Flight NEVER had any problems and Salas was NEVER involved in any of them at all." Now that's a pretty definitive statement to make in light of the categorical importance both authors have previously invested the testimony of Col. Figel with.

reply to post by James Carlson


More specifically, Col. Walt Figel has definitively agreed with the scenario of events that I have outlined on numerous internet forums, including this one, a scenario that shows exactly how laughable it is to believe that the "report" of a UFO received by Figel and my father could be anything other than a badly wrought joke made by junior enlisted military members in the course of establishing the status of the missiles at the silos they were encamped at. He states that NOBODY ever believed that UFOs were involved in this incident until Robert Salas came forward with his ridiculous and silly science fiction tale of interference from beyond the stars, and that he has told in no uncertain terms this very assessment to both Hastings and Salas. He is also as disgusted as I am and as every other citizen of this country should be at the systematic trashing of reputations these men have engaged in to no purpose whatsoever except to increase the sales of their inaccurate and fictional books -- destroying the reputations and decent memories of men like my father, MAJ (Ret.) Eric D. Carlson, the UFO Officer at Malmstrom AFB -- Lt. Col. Lewis D. Chase -- the Condon Committee UFO investigator Roy Craig, and everybody who was ever involved with the investigation of this singular event in USAF history.

Let me be very clear, especially as Robert Hastings in particular has been saying the most sickening things -- things that cannot be supported in any way whatsoever by anybody: the Echo Flight Incident did not involve UFOs. It was a comparatively mediocre electronic incident that Robert Hastings and Robert Salas have manufactured in order to sell books. Col. Walt Figel concurs in this estimation, and admits as well that he has told both individuals that their versions of this incident are not only inaccurate, but are simply works of fiction. In light of these revelations from Col. Figel, and as well as in anticipation of future contacts with ex-missileers more involved in the actual investigation of the Echo Flight Incident that he has very kindly given me, I will be updating the book that I have written "Americans, Credulous - or - The Arrogance of Congenital Liars & Other Character Defects - Establishing the Truth Behind the Echo Flight UFO Incident of March 16, 1967". As always, it can be read or downloaded for free at www.scribd.com... -- please tell your friends. Investigating the unknown is always an appreciated undertaking and always should be, but lying about your findings, destroying the reputations of those who can no longer defend themselves, and proposing as fact easily provable fictions and deceits for no other reason than the sale of your books is and ought to continue to be looked upon as unethical, dishonest, and criminally stupid, regardless of the source.

reply to post by James Carlson


Since I am very much aware of the strategies undertaken by Robert Hastings in particular regarding matters like this that question his veracity, honesty, motivations and ethics, I would like to assure the members of this forum that I have no intentions whatsoever of conducting any sort of debate regarding these matters on this forum. Robert Hastings is welcome to respond to me privately at any time, but if he wishes to conduct a campaign of disinformation and deceit, he must do so within the confines of another forum entirely. Frankly, most people are absolutely sick of his dishonest arguments and intellect, as well as his habit of countering facts with a continuous helter-skelter of nonsense and trivia. I will not respond to Hastings at all on any forum that is not willing to put up with his crap, but I did think that these revelations were substantive enough to interest many members of this community. The fact of the matter is, every member of the crew that was on duty when the Echo Flight missiles were taken offline by an electronic noise pulse on March 16, 1967 are adamant that no UFOs were involved, no actual UFOs were ever reported to them, and they have repeatedly said the same to both Robert Hastings and Robert Salas. A poor joke was made at the time, as I've delineated recently in this forum, and Col. Figel confirms that it was understood by everyone at the time as just a joke. Nobody reported UFOs. There was no investigation of UFOs at Echo Flight. The only instructions they received from anybody at anytime was a reminder not to discuss the event or the ongoing investigation; they were never told not to discuss the UFOs, because the subject of UFOs never came up except during a very short interview in which the "joke" was offhandedly mentioned; NOBODY ever mentioned UFOs in relation to Echo Flight or any other equipment failures again, and Col. Figel has in the past explained all of this to both Hastings and Salas.

Only "rumors" of UFOs were ever discussed by anybody, just as the command histories all assert, and these -- as I've repeatedly affirmed -- were caused by a combination of this single, poorly executed joke, and the already confirmed fact that Raymond Fowler, a NICAP investigator who worked with Sylvania Corporation, was made aware -- due to his employment -- that the Echo Flight Incident had occurred. He didn't know any details regarding this event, because Sylvania wasn't involved even remotely with the investigation, so the information he had was based entirely on rumors -- he wasn't cleared for any details whatsoever. Unfortunately, Fowler told what little he knew to Roy Craig, an investigator with the Condon committee tasked by the Air Force with studying UFO phenomena, and told Craig as well that he suspected UFOs may have been involved. They weren't. The fact of the matter is that Fowler did not know the exact date of the incident, and told Craig that he suspected it had occurred coincident to a UFO reported on March 24-25, and subsequently investigated by Lt. Col. Lewis D. Chase for Project Blue Book and Malmstrom AFB. These "rumors" referred to in the command histories, therefore, stemmed from the fact that Raymond Fowler didn't know as much about Echo Flight as he thought, including the date on which it occurred. All of this has been documented since 1995, as I have also discussed in my narrative, and can be examined or downloaded by anybody at any time at www.scribd.com... completely without charge.

reply to post by James Carlson


Thank you, and please feel free to contact me at any time at [email protected] if you have any comments regarding this matter. Please note as well that I have no intention of responding to Hastings on this forum -- although I'm equally sure he'll respond to this with more layered objections that are essentially meaningless. If he wishes to respond in any way, he can do so under the concerned but honest moderation at Reality Uncovered. They won't put up with his nonsense.

Most sincerely,
James Carlson

Originally posted by James Carlson
Please believe me, I have no intentions of disputing with anybody the existence of UFOs or even whether UFOs are overly fascinated with nuclear facilities.

Frankly, I'm not much interested in UFOs, and what I know about them is almost entirely the result of research stemming from this one incident.

Hi James - according to government documentation, there have been quite a few incidents where unknown objects have been witnessed (and confirmed on radar) in the vicinity of nuclear-weapons storage areas.

Can I ask you what you think the nature of these objects are (or why it is of no interest to you)?

Documents

* DOD, USAF, and CIA document reveal that during October, November, and December of 1975, reliable military personnel repeatedly sighted unconventional aerial objects in the vicinity of nuclear-weapons storage areas, aircraft alert areas and nuclear-missile control facilities at Loring Air Force Base, Maine; Wurtsmith AFB Michigan; Malstrom AFB, Montana; Minot AFB, North Dakota; and Canadian Air Forces Station, Ontario. Many of the sightings were confirmed by radar. At Loring AFB, the interloper "demonstrated a clear intent on the weapons storage areas."


* The incidents drew the attention of the CIA, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and the Secretary of Defense. Though the Air Force informed the public and the press that individual sightings were isolated incidents, an Air Force document says that "Security Option III was implemented and that security measures were coordinated with fifteen (15) Air Force bases from Guam to Newfoundland. Another AF document reveals that the Air Force conducted an investigation into the incidents but found no explanation for their occurrence.


* It appears Air Force "security measures" provided no protection against the "invasion." One month later, on January 21, 1976, UFOs "25 yards in diameter, gold or silver in color with blue light on top, hole in middle, and red light on bottom" were observed "near the flight line of Cannon AFB, N.M." Ten days later, on January 31, a UFO was observed "over the ammo storage area" at Fort Richie, Maryland.


* From 1948 through 1950, an FBI document reveals, UFOs were sighted by "persons whose reliability is not questioned, "near highly sensitive military and government installations, including nuclear weapons design, construction, testing and stockpiling sites. Security officials were greatly alarmed by these incidents."


* A CIA document reveals that in 1952 "sighting of unexplained objects at great altitudes and traveling at high speeds" were reported in the vicinity of major U.S. defense installations and posed a threat to national security.

Link

Government documents (pdf)

Cheers.

[edit on 02/10/08 by karl 12]