Some of you can probably guess, by reading the title of this thread, what I'm going to talk about in this post, and you're probably one of these "crazy people". What I've noticed happening lately, is whenever a person tries to express a complex or deeply thought out idea, if people can't relate to it, or read it in a science book somewhere, it's immediately crazy talk. I see this happening everywhere I look...obviously it doesn't happen much on ATS...but it does happen more than you'd expect...

For example, I was on yahoo answers recently where a person asked if Christians were really following Satan and they didn't know it. He stated that Christians often seem to be very insensitive, and unconsciously heartless, the way the speak holier than thou condemning others and telling them where they're gonna go. He continued, meanwhile they act like they are the compassionate ones...and what he is getting at here is often very true about Christians...they act as though they're better than everyone else...such good people they are...on the path to Heaven, whether consciously, or subconsciously, they act as though they are above other people, the scum of the world who will rot in hell...it's like a snotty exclusive club he states. He goes onto explain how much bloodshed and corruption exists because of religion, when it supposedly works towards the opposite of death and destruction. The bible states we must be unthinking robots and never even begin to question the LORDS position "Lean not unto your own understanding" it states. IDK about you, but that sounds like the request of an evil and manipulative overlord who's scared he'll loose power if people start exerting some independent thought.

Anyway, on with my point...here are some of his actual replies:

are u dumb? Christians go completely against that u idiot get some counseling u sound like one of those crazy homeless people

I think you need to hit the pipe again, buddy.

Huh? I think it's pretty apparent when you worship Satan. It's kinda hard NOT to notice.

god your an idiot

I bet ALL those replies were made by Christians...but seriously...some of those replies are so pathetically ignorant I feel like killing myself just so I can escape this moronic planet which constantly corrodes away at my soul...this guy is obviously trying to discuss a perfectly rational idea, produced by utilizing logical analysis, and with an open mind. He also doesn't actually believe in religion, and tries THINKING FOR HIMSELF...thus enabling him to see religion for what it is...people are just so attached to the idea that God must be the "good guy" because it's been etched into their minds since birth, and they couldn't possibly try to exert some independent thought because they'd rather believe what everyone else tells them...this guy was simply making unbiased analysis with open mind and without including any false, and irrational preconceptions, and he gets flamed hard.

One person says he sounds like a bum? Did they ever stop think a bum might actually be onto something? Sure, some bums are insane...but the fact that they sit around for years, observing the world, and the rat race, instead of mindlessly partaking in it, might give them a deep and complex understanding of the world, it might enable them to develop a clearer picture, free from the materialistic perceptions that get forced into our head through TV and all forms of media. The bum gets to sit back and watch the world flow...they have a lot of time to think and ponder...they know better than anyone else what's going on...especially in metaphysical and philosophical senses...and that's why people think they are crazy...because they are so simple minded and couldn't possibly begin to understand the rantings of bum who may be expressing very deep and complex points of view...and since he looks and smells like crap it's easier to just assume he's insane, and they are the smarter, and more sane ones.

This also happens with scientists, since they are often very smart people, they start going and researching and writing papers involving areas of science which are considered "pseudo-science"...I'm sure if Nickola Tesla were born a few hundred years ago...and he started rambling on about this thing called electricity...and alternating motors...and laser beams...and rockets which would travel to the moon...he'd be called crazy...imagine if he made a field of light bulbs placed only in the dirt, light up, as he once demonstrated? He'd probably be accused of practicing witchery and be burned to death, because nothing like that could ever be real...because it was simply beyond their intellectual capacity and their ability to understand...today we just call these people who speak of such complex ideas as fantasizing crack-pots...because we know "know" there is no such thing as magic...

Sorry to turn a large portion of this post into a religious debate, but I found it an effective way of making the point I'm trying to get across here. And to sum up, that point is - we think we are so smart, that science has all the answers and there is nothing more to be learnt...when the real truth is...science has 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% of the answers...and merely explains and examines the surface of reality...and anyone who sees this, and tries to expand their thinking, is immediately a crazy person because we "know" they must be wrong because what they say doesn't make sense...or sounds just a tad to wondrous to possibly be accepted by science...because we can't go letting any theories like that into science can we? We have to make sure it's all perfectly materialistic and easy for our primitive brains to grasp...it has to be a certian and predictable system...which is why a lot of scientists don't like quantum physics...and string theory etc...because it's starting to examine the real nature of reality...and the chaotic and unpredictable structure of reality which becomes almost to much for our brains to handle...

EDIT: Another thing I forgot to mention...is that we at ATS, are often considered as paranoid crazy folk...when you and me both know that isn't at all true. I'll admit some of us can go over the top, but we are often interested in these sorts of topics because we can expand our thinking, and we realize that not everything is as it seems, that not every word our Government says is true, and that they do operate in the shadows and conceal highly important information from the public...but explaining this to anyone else would just make you a crack-pot...if you want to fit in, you have to be a mindless robot and talk about the things they want you to talk about...

[edit on 21/1/10 by CHA0S]

Since being dumb has been celebrated? Since propaganda has taken hold of the world?

I don't know the exact date, but I would put it between Edward Bernays ``invention`` of mass media propaganda using radio and television... So early 20th century.

[edit on 21-1-2010 by Vitchilo]

I could not agree with you anymore on this. I have been thinking about this quite a bit lately as well and I have come to the conclusion that the world thrives off of ignorance and any individual who has half a brain that attempts to sift through the lies of this earth and try to find the truth is immediately looked down upon by their peers. Just in my own experience nearly every one of my friends and most of my family now think I'm crazy and completely disregard everything I say because I "have no idea what I'm talking about." Also not to mention that almost all the people that we are talking about here have never even spent more than 1 day researching ANY topic that they were not forced to do because of school or something of the sort. I also find it rather funny that the majority of the population thinks their common sense is all knowing. I'm just going to stop because I could go on all day about this.

Ignorance is bliss to the weak minded individual who cannot accept the truth.

Ive came accross a lot of militant christians who condemn me to hell because i dont follow the word of the bible. Here in lies the problem. They dont feel as if they can live there lives without guidance. So when they turn to the bible it becomes like a father or mother figure telling them everything will be fine if they do as it says.

When someone trys to claim they are actually following a demanding control freak as with the example above. You may aswell have just slapped there mother. They dont need much free or deep thought to read a book and do as it says.

I know enough christians to know that they are'nt at all like that. Websites just seem to attract those for some reason.

A lot of the time people dont even think about what you say. they just read the words and then go off on a rant. There impossible to talk to because all they really want is an argument at the end of the day.

Some people are lemmings. They're born that way and don't know any better.

BTW just ignore the christians in the internet, they're probably just 16 yo boys with no knowledge of how the world works. Yes it's frustrating, but there are those who know the truth, so don't give up hope just yet.

Also, revolutionaries are usually made to look crazy by the MSM, they are silenced and laughed at because TPTB know they are dangerous.

there cant be any more ignorant sheep, than 'religious fanatics',

second place goes to 'patriots', the third err mabe football fans i dunno

[edit on 21-1-2010 by angelx666]

The relgious question in the OP does make a good example. However, I do not think what the OP is talking about is limited to religion. Instead, it could apply to most any in-depth topic.

To me it is more of a societal issue. So much communication these days is boiled down and shoved into sound bites, bullet points, text messages and tweets that more lengthy expression can seem odd to some.

Good topic OP. I have found that, at least within my own family, it started out, they thought I was crazy and I realized I was focusing on subjects that rely on a wide basis of circumstantial evidence and cover far too many areas of society. I stopped trying to talk to them about the world in a broad sense and instead would pose a question.

For example:

When the climate emails came out and we learned that they didn't keep the raw data for vetting I asked my mom (who was a school teacher) how she would feel reading an essay that provided no sources for its thesis or if it did provide sources, upon checking you found they were no longer available. Would you trust it?

She immediately replied that know she could not trust it as there was way to verify the thesis. I then presented the news article ( I forget the publication it appeared but it was ironically enough an AP source) that stated the Raw data was gone due to space concerns.

In this way she, an adamant supporter of MMGW was speechless. It also opened her up to listening to my oppinion more on topics such as banking and globalization and hedgemony.

Some people will never listen while others just need to have ideas presented to them from an angle they can relate too. Throwing a whole new paradigm of the world at someone will cause defensive responses because it can sound like an attack on their view of reality. If you show them the contradicitions piece by piece and little by little, they start to come around. My father even listens to things I have to say and reads sources I give him because I started to debate him on his terms.

Anyways great thread.

Cheers

People today crave simplicity. We can't know everything so we give our trust to the media. Anything that falls outside of the box they must reject lest their entire worldview collapses. It;s a scary world when the old boundaries have been thrown away. Public education doesn't help in this regard either as they don't teach critical thinking or logic.
Our challenge is how to open people up to new ideas without them feeling threatened. And yes, christians are about the worst when it comes to being close-minded. We have our work cut out for us.

True statement.
Since ones social status became more important for his credibility than ones actual wisdom. A fool can become scientist and gets heard, respected while a wise and knowledgeable bum gets laughed at.
Since we were all learned to believe that shallowness is the norm.
Since our western definition of 'knowledge' was reduced to 'scientific approved knowledge'.
Since we stopped thinking for ourselves.

As Vichilo stated:

Originally posted by Vitchilo
I don't know the exact date, but I would put it between Edward Bernays ``invention`` of mass media propaganda using radio and television... So early 20th century.

Also, most mainstream education systems don't really encourage much creative thinking or critical questioning - 'ah, learn the biased history books we gave you and you'll be allright... just make sure you fit in society well..'

It's part of the Zeitgeist I guess.

Most people aren't very bright, and have an inate aversion to questioning the pillars of their internal world even when they are.

You can get around this by not questioning them directly by associating them with what you are questioning. Using a form of projection where you project something onto a project of a group - not necessarily of the person you are talking to - and discuss it in that manner.

This avoids pricking people's sense of offense, and allows you to sometimes get under their radar of meme-defense.

Agreed! I was just having this conversation the other night with a friend online. He is very close minded and thinks I am crazy. I dont like when people just dismiss something as crazy without even reading about it. I have read things on here that I thought were out there UNTIL I read about it. People dont want to look into things, they want it told to them and then when it is they think you are crazy for telling them. I have a few friends who say I read too much and I laugh, there is no such thing!!
S&F

Unfortunately this is the world we live in. The thinking man is now a minority while the rest just go about their mundane everyday lives completely unaware of anything that isn't being preached to them.

Just recently I tried to bring up the topic of the possibility of extraterrestrial life with a friend and I swear he looked at me like I was a mad man. Different topic but the same principle.

Most people have never thought much about anything but their daily lives. This isn't a new phenomena. Quite the opposite. Thinking about things is the new phenomena.

This is a great post. I think that there are a lot of people that are deep thinkers. But do to society they believe they can do nothing about the topics they are thinking about. So they take the stand point why worry about it if I cannot change it. And that is were the problem lies.

Crash