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Mormon church wanted ‘plausible deniability’ on anti-gay effort

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posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 09:53 AM
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rawstory.com...




The Mormon church worked to hide its involvement in the 2008 effort to ban gay marriage in California, telling the Proposition 8 campaign that it wanted "plausible deniability" in its connections with the movement, documents revealed in a California courtroom Wednesday show.

In the seventh day of testimony in the landmark gay-marriage trial in San Francisco, lawyers for the gay-rights side presented emails showing "close links between the Proposition 8 campaign and leaders of the Catholic and Mormon churches," the Los Angeles Times reported.

One key email that got the attention of Julia Rosen at the Prop 8 Trial Tracker blog was one between officials of the Church of Latter-Day Saints and the Proposition 8 campaign, which read in part:

With respect to Prop. 8 campaign, key talking points will come from campaign, but cautious, strategic, not to take the lead so as to provide plausible deniability or respectable distance so as not to show that church is directly involved.

"Get that? The LDS Church intentionally worked to hide behind the scenes to disguise their involvement in the public realm," Rosen wrote. "The LDS Church is well aware that the general public does not have the most favorable opinion of them. Attention on their involvement could have hurt their cause, namely passing Prop 8."


So the Mormon Church is anti gay but dosen't have the guts to admit it. Then worked behind the scenes to influence votes. So much for seperation of Church and State. But we all knew that was BS anyway.




posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 10:44 AM
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reply to post by whaaa
 


I'm curious are, the the numbers of Mormons on the decrease like other christian churches ?

I'd also be very curious to find out how many of their wandering elders have needed treatment for the homosexuality or live so far back in the closet that they eat Turkish delight in the snow.



posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 01:56 PM
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I wouldn't be so quick to call mormons Christian.



posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 02:16 PM
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The Mormon Church should lose it's tax exemption.


To be tax-exempt under section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code, an organization must be organized and operated exclusively for exempt purposes set forth in section 501(c)(3), and none of its earnings may inure to any private shareholder or individual. In addition, it may not be an action organization, i.e., it may not attempt to influence legislation as a substantial part of its activities and it may not participate in any campaign activity for or against political candidates.


www.irs.gov...=96099,00.html


Last year, in response to some
of these concerns, the Lobbying Disclosure Act of 1995 was enacted, to become effective January
1, 1996. 2 U.S.C. 1601 et seq. In addition to requiring organizations that engage in lobbying
to register and report on their activities, the Act provides that IRC 501(c)(4) organizations that
engage in lobbying are not eligible to receive Federal funds as an award, grant, or loan.
1 Debate
concerning further, non-tax legislation continues.




www.irs.gov...

If they tried to hide their activities then they broke the tax exemption law and should lose their status IMO.



posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 02:20 PM
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I'm totally confused and thought this was old, well known news? Even at the time when Prop 8 was in preparation, all I remember reading about was the campaigns by the Mormons and all the funding they provided.

It didn't sound like they were trying to keep it secret because everyone knew. There was even a scandal because they were apparently coming from Utah with funds to advertise in California. There are also news articles about their involvement as far back as 2008 and admissions on their own websites.

[edit on 1/21/2010 by AshleyD]



posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 02:23 PM
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reply to post by Nutter
 


For anyone who wants to send an official complaint to the IRS, here is a link with all the useful information.

lds501c3.wordpress.com...



posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 02:26 PM
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There is more at stake than what is seen and on the surface. The one question I have is if it is proven in a court of law, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that they did indeed have an influence over the political process, and that the actions of such directly influenced the outcome of the election. A preacher can stand on a pulpit and state he is against gay marriage, but is not allowed to tell his congregation on how to vote, that is the essence of the seperation of churche and state on the part of the church. So if it is true, what should the consequences of their actions be. It reminds me of the Colorado Focus on the Family, which has been to court several times for attempting to influence the politcal process.



posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 02:41 PM
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Originally posted by sdcigarpig
A preacher can stand on a pulpit and state he is against gay marriage, but is not allowed to tell his congregation on how to vote, that is the essence of the seperation of churche and state on the part of the church.


Here is the letter sent to all Mormon church leaders to read aloud to their congregations.


SALT LAKE CITY 30 June 2008

The following letter was sent from the First Presidency of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to Church leaders in California to be read to all congregations on 29 June 2008:

Preserving Traditional Marriage and Strengthening Families
In March 2000 California voters overwhelmingly approved a state law providing that “Only marriage between a man and a
woman is valid or recognized in California.” The California Supreme Court recently reversed this vote of the people. On
November 4, 2 008, Californians will vote on a proposed amendment to the California state constitution that will now restore
the March 2000 definition of marriage approved by the voters.
The Church’s teachings and position on this moral issue are unequivocal. Marriage between a man and a woman is
ordained of God, and the formation of families is central to the Creator’s plan for His children. Children are entitled to be
born within this bond of marriage.
A broad-based coalition of churches and other organizations placed the proposed amendment on the ballot. The Church
will participate with this coalition in seeking its passage.
Local Church leaders will provide information about how you may
become involved in this important cause.

We ask that you do all you can to support the proposed constitutional amendment by donating of your means and time to
assure that marriage in California is legally defined as being between a man and a woman.
Our best efforts are required to
preserve the sacred institution of marriage.
Style guide note: When reporting about The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, please use the complete name of
the Church in the first reference. For more information on the use of the name of the Church, go to our online style guide.


lds501c3.files.wordpress.com...

I would say that defines telling people how to vote.


So if it is true, what should the consequences of their actions be.


They should lose their tax exempt status.


[edit on 21-1-2010 by Nutter]



posted on Jan, 25 2010 @ 11:01 PM
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I am once again reminded of Ralph Reeds "stealth candidates", those Christians who ran for public office without acknowledging their religion .... until they were elected. I couldn't figure out even back then why a Christian would "hide their light under a basket".

Well, if this is any indication of how easy it is to throw money around a candidate/issue, then whoa to the country now, when corporations throw their money, excuse me, voice, around.



posted on Jan, 25 2010 @ 11:20 PM
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reply to post by Nutter
 

Now I am not going to pass judgement, however, if this a valid document and can be proven to come from headquarters of the LDS church, then they could be fined, if not lose their tax expempt status and have to pay taxes.
As it was sent as an email address, then those presenting it in court, would have to show to the court the IP address, show that it did come from the church, was not fabricated by someone with a grudge against the LDS church. Most of that would have to come out during the process of discovery. The question that I would have, is if it was proven in court that the different churchs did have a hand in preventing its passing, would it open the way up for individual court cases, or a class action law suit by gay couples who are denied the right to wed.



posted on Jan, 25 2010 @ 11:27 PM
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reply to post by whaaa
 


I know for a fact how the mormon church treats gays and lesbians. They ex communicate you for life. There is no seperation of church and state anywhere really. Oh sure you cant pray in school etc ...but by God anybody who doesnt like your choices will jump up and say "OH its against God" !!

what a joke on religion and its so called do gooders who claim to know whats on Gods mind.



posted on Jan, 26 2010 @ 07:31 PM
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It was well known before this document because there were whistle blowers within the LDS that warned the gay community what was coming down. It was well known what funds were being sent and what ways it was being used. People were reporting such to the IRS before, during, after the decision and nothing was done.


Magantice-There is no such thing as "no prayer in school". That is a flat out lie. People prayed when I was in school in the 80's and early 90's. My neighbor's grandchild (whom is christian) told me last year she prayed before her test.

The only restrictions are assembly led prayer and disrupting others while doing it (pray to yourself in silence instead of screaming).



posted on Jan, 30 2010 @ 02:16 PM
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reply to post by whaaa
 





So the Mormon Church is anti gay but dosen't have the guts to admit it. Then worked behind the scenes to influence votes. So much for seperation of Church and State. But we all knew that was BS anyway.


OK, Lets not be bias here. They did admit it, Its on their site as well as in their doctrine. Secondly, Considering the bible contradicts itself on the gay matters(its wrong to be gay but your not allowed to judge etc..) Its one way this church has decided to deal with it, By taking an anti-gay stance. Remember, Not all religions have accepted gays, Not just the Mormons.



posted on Jan, 30 2010 @ 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by Bilw85
I wouldn't be so quick to call mormons Christian.


They believe Christ is the only way back to heaven. What else would you call them?



posted on Jan, 30 2010 @ 04:35 PM
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reply to post by whaaa
 


The Mormons don't come close to being enlightend beings by any stretch of the imagination. They are anti-gay because their religion is both bigoted and primitive. These are not what one would call enlightend people. Fundamentalist religions of all ilks, have a tendancy to attract people of lower then average intelligence. The kind of person who can be led around if you lead them on a leash pulled by a ring in their nose. All fundamentalist religions, Christians, Muslim, and others fall in to one catagory. Their stupid and gross dullards. Trust me. You don't want your daughter to marry one of these walking idiots. So what does one do? If you train your daughter to ask the right questions, she won't be misledd. She will figure out on her own, that some information is better then none. It's said a little information is dangerous. It can be dangerous to the status quo. But a little information is the first part of changing the future.




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