Marketing Doritos and increasing violence at the same time

reply to post by Ridhya


If you continually practice a simulation you will be more comfortable when it comes to the real thing.

I'm not trying to preach - the world we are creating has a market for games where people kill people. I have bigger things to worry about than discuss it in-depth for hours online.

Gotta say I'm surprised that nearly everyone who responded doesn't have any problem with physical violence...

On the other hand I'm a few months from a Master's degree in Psychology so I see far worse aspects of physical violence than some kid who grew up "alright" despite having been slapped around as a kid.

Originally posted by eight bits

So basically you are arguing there is no such thing as conditioning?

No.

So what exactly is "conditioning" then and how does it relate your beliefs about us all having the final say in our own actions?

[edit on 17-1-2010 by bsbray11]

Gotta say I'm surprised that nearly everyone who responded doesn't have any problem with physical violence...

I don't know what you saw. I saw one professional actor pretend to slap another professional actor. A foley artist worked the soundtrack to match the pretended action.

If you saw something other than a non-violent skit or a playlet, then that's on you. Because a skit or playlet is all that happened. There was no physical violence, except in your mind.

And BTW, obviously not in all viewers' minds. Maybe that has something to do with attending to the difference between make-believe and reality, which is also relevant to the discussion with

bsbray

So what exactly is "conditioning" then and how does it relate your beliefs about us all having the final say in our own actions?

I am not sure what beliefs you are talking about, and even less sure that they would be on-topic here.

If you don't see that you watched a stage magic act, then let me step aside, so you can talk directly with Thermo Klein. TK thinks the Dorito commercial violence was as real as you think Derren Brown's conditioning was.

You two will make beautiful music together. Enjoy.

[edit on 17-1-2010 by eight bits]

Originally posted by eight bits

So what exactly is "conditioning" then and how does it relate your beliefs about us all having the final say in our own actions?

I am not sure what beliefs you are talking about, and even less sure that they would be on-topic here.

If you don't see that you watched a stage magic act, then let me step aside, so you can talk directly with Thermo Klein. TK thinks the Dorito commercial violence was as real as you think Derren Brown's conditioning was.

You two will make beautiful music together. Enjoy.

Forget about Darren Brown.

"Conditioning" is a very real concept and very widely accepted amongst psychological professionals.

How do you think this general concept of being able to condition someone, relates to the idea that we all have final say in our own decisions?

reply to post by Thermo Klein


That easily offended? May as well leave your TV on childrens cartoon network forever, or even better, just throw your TV out. You don't need that violent imagery plaguing your mind! It is my personaly opinion that people who get so offended over such silly things are really holding back the world. It's the same kind of people who 60 years ago would want a painting burned for depicting a nude woman. You ALWAYS have the option of just not looking at or listening to something that offends you.

Also, to suggest that video games, especially shooters influence people to become violent is ridiculous. The majority of gamers are rather passive, because they are essentially geeks and are well aware that they're physically weak because they are mentally strong. The only people who play shooting games that I know who are aggressive only got into gaming with the current XBOX 360 generation, and were mindless and violent long before they ever played a violent video game. Some people are just violent. Playing a game where you shoot somebody isn't going to make what would normally be a passive person suddenly want to shoot people. I would recommend not letting little kids play these games, but not because of the violent influence (which is more plausible with little kids as they're unintelligent, but these games are not meant for them and are even rated so their parents know not to let them play) but because spending a significant amount of time with video games at a young age causes the child to develope weaker social skills, which gets hard to overcome as they get older.

reply to post by eight bits


Wow you really have a way with turning things to fit your agenda! Agaian, I never implied what you said, even the title of my thread doesn't imply what you said. Good luck having a normal relationship out there mate,

Wow you really have a way with turning things to fit your agenda!

Say what? It's called slapstick. It is a form of comedy. Has been since we ate mastodons.

Don't like the ad? Then don't distribute it on the internet. Problem solved.

Generally, I avoid double posts, but since my previous message, Thermo Klein has honored me as a respected foe.

I had written what follows yesterday, anticipating a reply in the thread itself. Since we have established that no real violence occurs in the subject video, it is proper to explore what is actually depicted there.

You said what you got out of the film. Here's what I get.

We see that this boy is growing up without a father. That is a touchy subject in the never-relaxed American dialog between races. But it is faced squarely here, neither sensationalized nor denied.

While his mother can request that the boy "play nicely," it is likely that a father would better be able to instruct the boy about the proper expression of his masculinity. While this man is obviously not ideal, he is a genuine candidate to function as the father whom the boy lacks.

First, however, the man needs to lose his self-absorbed and on-the-prowl persona. For that to happen, spiritual growth needs to occur. The sooner, the better.

The mother exits, to attend to nurturing life (to place the flowers she has received in water), female generativeness, leaving man and boy to enact the male mysteries. Immediately, the child drops his toy, putting away childish things, thereby announcing that he will be the initiator and hierophant in what is to come.

And hierophant he is. The slap, of course, is immediately recognized as an archetypal symbol of sudden enlightenment, of epiphany. And its use here is as a contrasting example for that proper expression of masculinity which the boy needs to learn, and which the man, if enlightened, can teach him.

The boy states plainly what the man must learn: to respect the person of the boy's mother and the good order of their household. In doing so, the boy exemplifies and personifies what the man must become: the "man of the house."

However, we do not know whether the man's enlightenment will take hold. It is a good sign that the man does not react to his initiation. We can thus be sure that his mask is gone, but the question is whether it is gone permanently.

The final moments are given over to the return of the mother, as a disembodied voice. Thus, at least for now, the man must confront her not in her carnal aspect, but as the mother complement to his father candidacy.

She has the last word, and uses it to ask the vital question, has her son "played nicely," that is, succeeded in precipitating the expansion of consciousness by which this man can assume his proper role in the eternal drama of life.

She receives no answer. Only time will tell.

I believe that we need more, not less, sociologically valid and psychologically well-founded self-examination in American public life. I am surprised that someone about to receive a master's in psychology would either disagree, or else have had only a surface reaction to what is portrayed in the film.

Pass those Doritos, please.

You say that 1st person shooter games are bad?
Let me explain something, from my point of view.
I played/play videos games (FPS mainly) since I'm 10, and video games since I'm 8.
It never affected me nor my friends to be "more" violent/ violent. It acts like a "therapy". It always stays a game.

BUT

Some people, are, yes, affected by thoses games having trouble making the difference. But for someone to do this, he needs other prerequistes :
- Sometimes he lives in a violent world (child abuse, intimidation at school,etc.)
- Sometimes the person has no attention from anyone,etc

It's very rare to see someone kill some people in a school because he played Call of Duty yesterday, without having troubles in the past..


Well that's my opinion

reply to post by Thermo Klein


You don't need to sit around spending time critically analyzing things to see your values being trodden on.

isnt that what your doing?

reply to post by Thermo Klein


the world we are creating has a market for games where people kill people. I have bigger things to worry about than discuss it in-depth for hours online.

didnt you bring it up?

reply to post by Thermo Klein


I dont find the commercial to offensive or to violent. FPS, yes they can seem a bit violent.

On the other hand I dont believe it to be to brainwashing in any way. I play them all the time, in fact im getting bored of it being so to the point, i want more tactics and more team play. Anyway Ive been playing fps and violent video games ever since i got a hold of 007 Golden eye, actually you can date it back to nintendos duck hunt. I would also like to point out that I have never been in a fight, I have never shot a gun, well a 22 rifle in Mexico when we went hunting, but thats it. I dont have nightmares and I dont have shooting fantasies. I think its really up to the person that plays it, wether or not he/she allows it to influence them.

Peace!

reply to post by Thermo Klein


You're seriously stressing about that benign (and imo cute/funny) commercial?

I think people like you (i.e. those who make mountains out of molehills) are more worrisome than that commercial.

Furthermore, how is this remotely conspiracy related? Are you proposing that Frito Lays is in cahoots with the NWO to spread violence to the masses via snack food ads?