Christian Missionaries Desperately Trying to Leave Haiti!

reply to post by ZyPHeR


though you make a good point it was drastically over shadowed on the promotion you have of yourself can you turn it down a notch btw i have the satanic book to good read! i myself have no religion no one or nothing should be above another no matter what or who and religion states that there is always someone or something that should be above

I promoted myself?? I was simply stating my religion for the sake of understanding my argument and where I stand as far as christianity goes. Wasnt trying to push anything in anyones face, so I apologise if thats how it came off.
-Z-

P.S. Yeah, the satanic bible is a great read and puts forth some valid points and was the only religion that made real sense to me.
Off topic though, i'll save it for another thread.

Originally posted by MOTT the HOOPLE
Nah I think if you don't have any special rescue skill or medical knowledge then being there is more a hindrance than a help. Not to mention using precious resources on people who are just marginally helpful.

So it's probably more beneficial if they go home and raise funds for the victims of the disaster and let the professionals do there jobs.

I thought the main reason for missionaries was to spread the word of God and to make sure that people understand that it might be crappy now, but when you die it all becomes clear as to God's plan.

Aside that I am convinced that the primary job of a missionary or priest is NOT to dig in the ruins but to comfort those who are in need of comforting.

The professionals can't dig frantically while tending to people's emotional need.

reply to post by factbeforefiction


Ummm when there's people starving and in need of serious medical care. Why should missionary's stay to use up more of the precious little resources left in the country? So they should stay so 150 more haitians should go without. Gods word will not feed them or get them stitches or antibiotics. Granted I'm sure spiritual guidance is needed greatly right now. And I belive gods word is great but ask anybody who is starving or in need of medical care, and they will say FEED ME, HEAL ME, preach to me later. I belive you are misguided. Whats the old saying do not point out splinters in others eyes, when you cant see the plank in your own. I wouldn't judge them until you were in their shoes, as well have you thought of the security aspect. Even the search and rescue teams have to call it quits after dark because of looters and bandits, Did you get that people that are pulling Haitians out of the rubble have to quit because of the security risk from other Haitians after night fall. So should these missionary's stay and waste precious needed resources and risk being assaulted or killed, to try and convert people over there right now? I seriously think you need to re-examine your stance on this. Maybe you should pray about it.

I hesitate to condemn the fleeing parties in question. Neither have I a firm knowledge of the entire situation in Haiti, nor do I know the position of these apparently christian people. It is entirely possible that the liberal news media has left out just enough information to make them seem less charitable or helpful in order to try and point out just how un-Christ like Christians can be. In the first place we all know that no one is perfect, and in the second place, it's not right to criticize circumstances or individuals about things of which we have no clear knowledge or understanding....those judgments, I'm told, are god's business.

People come in all sizes, shapes, and temperaments. Let them be.

Originally posted by watcher73

Originally posted by STFUPPERCUTTER
so the possiblity of helping others takes presedence over self preservation?

Isnt that what xtians say jesus did?

I swear the whole bible goes right over their heads.

Someone needs better aim.

hard to help more people in teh future when ur dead and stuff.

Originally posted by JcOg323
reply to post by factbeforefiction

 

Ummm when there's people starving and in need of serious medical care. Why should missionary's stay to use up more of the precious little resources left in the country? So they should stay so 150 more haitians should go without. Gods word will not feed them or get them stitches or antibiotics. Granted I'm sure spiritual guidance is needed greatly right now. And I belive gods word is great but ask anybody who is starving or in need of medical care, and they will say FEED ME, HEAL ME, preach to me later. I belive you are misguided. Whats the old saying do not point out splinters in others eyes, when you cant see the plank in your own. I wouldn't judge them until you were in their shoes, as well have you thought of the security aspect. Even the search and rescue teams have to call it quits after dark because of looters and bandits, Did you get that people that are pulling Haitians out of the rubble have to quit because of the security risk from other Haitians after night fall. So should these missionary's stay and waste precious needed resources and risk being assaulted or killed, to try and convert people over there right now? I seriously think you need to re-examine your stance on this. Maybe you should pray about it.

It's not about conversion deauch bag, it's not about anything other than comforting those in need to the best of your ability and if you can't do that then clear rocks out of the street so others who are more capable can.

Do not even presume to know what I have done in my life. I was a Jesuit Priest by my late 20's, spent the years 18 - 22 evacuating refugees from Beirut in the Military while most of my friends were killed, got my Masters degree in between, and spent another ten years in hospitals every night with every type of person of all religions and holding their hands while they died, feeling the warmth of a person turn to icy cold because nobody in their family was there for them and watching the fear in their eyes embrace the comfort that you are able to give them when they most need it.

If all a person can do is just be there for someone so that they don't have to die alone, I guarantee it will be one of the most significant times in both of your lives. And if that's all you can do, that's enough.

I would say you make me sick but I believe you are naive and your heart may be in the right place though your head is clearly up your **S.

BTW: Yes, I did request to be released from my vows years ago and have taken full advantage of it, but don't for a second presume to know me.

Originally posted by watcher73

Jesus said to give up/sell everything.

Actually that is not true at all man.

Jesus clearly said to GIVE IT AWAY for FREE!

None of this sell it crap.

Give it Away!

reply to post by factbeforefiction


when 150 hysteric haitians run at you wielding machetes, screaming "food, water, orthapedic surgeons!" i'd bet you were on the first flight out also!
Not to mention they probably blame GOD for this anyway!!!

I would love to see how Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell (if he was still alive), Benny Hinn, Billy Graham, John Hagee, James Kennedy, and host of others, would have reacted had they been there. Their faces would have been priceless.

Originally posted by spearhead
reply to post by factbeforefiction

 

when 150 hysteric haitians run at you wielding machetes, screaming "food, water, orthapedic surgeons!" i'd bet you were on the first flight out also!
Not to mention they probably blame GOD for this anyway!!!

Well you'd lose that bet spearhead, people like me look at life as a stagecoach stop. I'm not going to flinch if I'm doing the right thing when I die. You don't get that because you are a coward.

Edit to include Deaf Alien.


[edit on 16-1-2010 by factbeforefiction]

Originally posted by anotherdad
reply to post by moocowman

 

Ya but that would be like finding a muslim and/or there money volunteering to help in a disaster zone. Not gunna happen!

What on Earth are you on about? I was so shocked by the above comment that I had to reply. Muslims give money all year round. It's called "Zakaat" and is compulsory on all Muslims whereby they have to give a minimum of 2.5% (You can give more if you like) of any kinds of capital or savings to the poor, including gold, precious stones and anything of value. And that excludes all the donations that are given when a disaster happens. Muslims do their own thing without requiring that their actions be publicly televised and seen. When something happens, they automatically do what needs to be done, for example, the immense amount of donations that were given for the Indonesian and Pakistan earthquakes a few years ago. It does not require a disaster to happen first before doing so.

And further, that even excludes voluntary donations that Muslims may do. For example, I give Zakaat and also give a sizeable amount to various charities every month, especially in Palestine, Iraq and Afghanistan. When the quakes happened, I gave a large amount of cash. Everyone I know also gave varying amounts of money, it's normal to. I also sponsor various kids around the world and intend to donate to a reputable charity for the Haiti quake.

I would appreciate it if you would research a little before saying such stupid things in the future. Thank you.

reply to post by JasonT


After reading your post, I researched. It appears that you are correct.

I came across this website: Islamic Relief Worldwide

Regardless of religions, beliefs, or lack thereof, we are all humans and want to help others.

reply to post by watcher73


hypocrites we may be. But perhaps you should check your sources before spreading false claims. When people put words into Jesus's mouth to construct an argument it shows their argument holds no water at all.

reply to post by OneManBand


when people dont realize jesus is just another story that was told by other religions before there even was a christianity your bible holds no water at all!

Originally posted by JasonT

Originally posted by anotherdad
reply to post by moocowman

 

Ya but that would be like finding a muslim and/or there money volunteering to help in a disaster zone. Not gunna happen!

What on Earth are you on about? I was so shocked by the above comment that I had to reply. Muslims give money all year round. It's called "Zakaat" and is compulsory on all Muslims whereby they have to give a minimum of 2.5% (You can give more if you like) of any kinds of capital or savings to the poor, including gold, precious stones and anything of value. And that excludes all the donations that are given when a disaster happens. Muslims do their own thing without requiring that their actions be publicly televised and seen. When something happens, they automatically do what needs to be done, for example, the immense amount of donations that were given for the Indonesian and Pakistan earthquakes a few years ago. It does not require a disaster to happen first before doing so.

And further, that even excludes voluntary donations that Muslims may do. For example, I give Zakaat and also give a sizeable amount to various charities every month, especially in Palestine, Iraq and Afghanistan. When the quakes happened, I gave a large amount of cash. Everyone I know also gave varying amounts of money, it's normal to. I also sponsor various kids around the world and intend to donate to a reputable charity for the Haiti quake.

I would appreciate it if you would research a little before saying such stupid things in the future. Thank you.

To me you sound like a good charitable person, as is the way of Islam. I think his suggestion was, have you ever contributed to a non Islamic charity.

I believe the topic of this conversation is more or less about human behaviour and psychology - not religion. As an atheist, I never miss the opportunity to kick organised religion in the nuts but I cannot blame them for leaving.

The Catholic Church and countless missionaries have loss hundreds of lives, the entire Catholic Church - including the Archbishop - have died during the quake. These missionaries, who are wanting to leave, are probably traumatised. An emotional attack, like this, is so strong that the remaining individuals probably want to be home with their families - and try to understand why their God has allowed this to happen.

Again, you cannot fault them.

Give them a break, and I say that as an atheist.

Originally posted by infinite
I believe the topic of this conversation is more or less about human behaviour and psychology - not religion. As an atheist, I never miss the opportunity to kick organised religion in the nuts but I cannot blame them for leaving.

The Catholic Church and countless missionaries have loss hundreds of lives, the entire Catholic Church - including the Archbishop - have died during the quake. These missionaries, who are wanting to leave, are probably traumatised. An emotional attack, like this, is so strong that the remaining individuals probably want to be home with their families - and try to understand why their God has allowed this to happen.

Again, you cannot fault them.

Give them a break, and I say that as an atheist.

That's the thing we always forget, some of us are stronger than others. Good for you for reminding us of that.

The first thing you do at a disaster is get rid of the useless people and use the people that are useful.

In most cases Christian Missionaries have no training in disasters so they should leave.

Bring in the disaster relief groups with training in handling problems.

Even groups like Mennonites or Mormons are of more use then many of these Christian Missionaries.
The Mennonites or Mormons will roll up there sleeves and go to work without questions.
www.mds.mennonite.net...
motherjones.com...

Many other Missionaries have no training at all and would not know what to do. And its best to get them out and let there churches send in there disaster relief teams.

I haven't read the whole thread yet, just the title. I will go back and read it. But I need to make a comment. You think they should be working to assist the poor because they are missionaries, right? But you have actually no idea what is happening there now. I'm not saying that I know anything about Haiti. I surely don't. But I'm saying that I know a little about the deviousness that has become the American government. What is really happening there?. I lived in a country where the Army was sent door to door to kill it's citizens at the advice imoh of our beloved CIA. Why are so many people dying from an earthquake? It doesn't make sense. Why is the US sending drones from Afganistan? To do what? To spy on people? Where is the press? Why aren't we getting stories of heroic rescue workers with their wonder dogs? Maybe we will. But don't condemn people till you get all the facts. At any rate, dependents and non essential people should be gotten out of danger. In 1971 in Dacca, Consul General Archer Blood was asked if the American dependents should evacuate. He at first said no, why would they have anything to fear from the indiginous people, not in those words, but the Bengalis had nothing against the Americans. But after realizing the that the army was going door to door killing people, he changed his mind and wanted everybody out of there. One American family for some reason went back to their flat before the evacuation and found their immediate neighbors in the flat downstairs massacred. But back to Haiti, we don'tknow what is happening there. We don't know if people blame the US for whatever it is. We don't know whether or not our beloved CIA is carrying out some sort of depopulation agenda. We don't know if the earthquake was created by HAARP or not. We don't know anything. I"m surprized this was even in the news, our bitter anti-Christian news media wants something mean to say against the Christians so bad that they will risk drawing attention to the weirdness of what is happening in Haiti for the joy of having something mean to say. Wish we had a real news media at a time like this. It is a real hindrance to not know what is going on.

[edit on 16-1-2010 by m khan]