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A Satanic blessing on our powerful "Christians".

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posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 11:51 PM
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reply to post by FeralMonkeyMagic
 


Unfortunately, anyone can call themselves a "Satanist." This is much like how so many people call themselves "Christian" but completely disagree on such things as the Catholics and Lutherans do. There are all kinds of new "Satanists." Just do not mix them up and do not learn about them from anyone but them. I have yet to call a plumber about my electrical issues. I hope that helps a little. I know there are a few, or were, members on ATS that subscribe to some other type of "Satanism" or whatever. I can only speak for myself. There is only one real "Church of Satan" and I have my membership card.




posted on Jan, 21 2010 @ 11:53 PM
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Originally posted by Badgered1
What a rubbish post. You need to stop taking yourself so seriously and get a real hobby like birdwatching. Better for the 'soul'.


APPLAUSE




posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 12:11 AM
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reply to post by SmokeJaguar67
 


I saw your avatar with the name Enlil and I wanted to know what the other words mean? then I read the rest of your post and I was confused cus based on my knowledge of Enki and Enlil(Jesus) Enki is the good guy and Enlil is the bad guy.(which I dont believe, and this a whole topic on its self which as soon as I get 20 posts I want to dill into) like you its a campaign to dis inform people (but he is God, Jesus) So since I got less than 20 posts can you U2M the answer of what your Avatar says.
Thanks
Matthew



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 01:01 AM
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Originally posted by halfoldman
There is no literal devil or God: it's just atheistic psycho-drama


yet...


Hail to the New Age of Lucifer,


May Leviathan, Ashteroth, Belial and Satan bless you for that!


And now I feel I can live it without all the guilt of what happened in the past, or what's happening in other places, because I feel the spirit of Lucifer moving in me...."
And when I feel that peace and joy, I know Satanism, the demonic princes of hell are not just being silly, they are godly, and should be respected like every other faith...


To me personally Lucifer is like Prometheus of Greek myth.
He brought mankind fire in defiance of tyranical gods.
How can he not be our hero and champion?


Sure dont sound like an atheist to me...



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 04:27 AM
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reply to post by pixanomaly
 


Okay, I'm going to admit that I have no idea what you're saying to me.
So, let's not go in verbal circles.
Whatever point you're trying to convey, just spit it out.
I really have no patience for mincing words for the sake of sounding smart.
Are you agreeing with me?
Supporting my statement?
Disagreeing with me?
Opposing my statement?
Just cut to the heart of the matter.



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 05:47 AM
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Originally posted by FeralMonkeyMagic

Agreed, somewhat conveluted.

In the bible the "satan" is referring to the charcter Lucifer. Who, as you say, is definitely an adversary of sorts, in christian religion, the self proclaimed adversary and ultimate enemy of God.

But the christian god himself said that he created all things, including good and evil. He was responsible for the creation of the angels. If you want to take it a step further, he basically never even gave the angels the ability to choose their own paths, or make any real decisions for themselves. According to that very logic, Lucifer's rebellion was part of god's plan. Poor Lucifer was nothing more than the very first scapegoat, a patsy, so that god might make an example out of him. If anything, Lucifer is a sympathetic character, who was used by his creator to set a president for posterity. That is not something a benevolent god would do. Of course, that's if you believe in such a thing, which I can't say with any certainty that I do.



Im not fully informed about all the different kinds of satanists out there, but i watched a doco created by an apparent "satanist" who said that in the La Vey Satanism, rituals are for show and used to convey a converse message of what christianity preaches?

Y'see, that's the thing about Satanism. Lavey was extremely tongue-in-cheek, and you have to take the 'rituals' with a grain of salt. I believe that he believed that people need rituals, so he put some together, pieced from pagan rituals that pre-dated christianity and likely figured that, well, if you're going to engage in ritual, it might as well be for your benefit rather than expend that energy for the possibility of a spiritual payoff down the road.


Fascinating stuff to be honest,

Truly.


...however

I knew there was a catch...


...funny that they make fun of christians, by having their own rituals, with "reversed" meaning prayers and the such - slightly ironic. though - that is what this one particular satanist dude was saying. He's on Youtube somewhere. It doesnt necesarily mean his view is gospel in the eyes of ALL satanists, does it?

I believe that he found irony that christian rituals were just mock ups of older pagan rituals from cultures slaughtered and assimilated into the christian culture. He by no means (that I can figure) meant that his words should be 'gospel', as you put it, but they were meant to stir up emotion in people in hopes that they would begin to question their current station in life, and rail against the oppressive nature of all organized religion.




Are there any Satanists out there in ATS world who believe something contrary to the La Vey way of Satanism?

I'm sure there are lots of people that consider themselves Satanists, however I can profess to speak on their behalf as to what they believe.




Im genuinly asking as i have met a few people in real life who say that La Vey satanism isn't satanism at all? This one particular person thinks he's "try hard" satanist or something?

Just curious people.

I'm not quite sure where you're going with that. You don't need to be a member of the CoS to consider yourself a Satanist. But, Satanism, in the officially recognized sense has a certain set of philosophies that, once adhered to, even if by accident, make one a Satanist, whether they like it or not. It has little to nothing to do with the christian philosophies, or the philosophies of any other organized religion. One simply has to be human, have human desires and strength of conviction.



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 05:51 AM
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reply to post by Lillydale
 


Well said, my darling.
I don't think many of us could have done justice as you had done.
And so simply at that.
Applause and Shemhamforash.



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 09:45 AM
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reply to post by Matthew Dark
 



But the christian god himself said that he created all things, including good and evil. He was responsible for the creation of the angels. If you want to take it a step further, he basically never even gave the angels the ability to choose their own paths, or make any real decisions for themselves. According to that very logic, Lucifer's rebellion was part of god's plan.


Let's say you had the ability to create such creatures as Angels. Would you make them mindless robots to do your bidding or would you create them with a free will to do what they wanted to? Would you let them have the ability to decide whether they wanted to follow you or would you create them to follow a predetermined course of action that only you knew of?

How would you be able to tell if they actually loved you or not? Would it be fair to create mindless robots that do your bidding? I for one believe God created them with free will. Did God know that evil would arise because of this? Probably, but then God could very well make himself oblivious to the repercussions to truly see if the Angels would love Him and His ways.

He could have wiped every one of them out after they rebelled, but He didn't. Now there are two forces at work, good and evil. At first there was only good. Now there was evil. At this point there is only the Angels and God. Who could judge what is right and what is wrong? Enter mankind. I believe we will give testimony as to what both forces brought to our existence.

Remember when Adam and Eve came upon the idea of evil. God told them that in the day you eat of the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil you will surely die. He didn't kill them. He killed an animal and made coverings for the both of them. This was the first sin offering made by God Himself for them in keeping with His later texts.



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 10:22 AM
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reply to post by Matthew Dark
 


"I'm not quite sure where you're going with that. You don't need to be a member of the CoS to consider yourself a Satanist. But, Satanism, in the officially recognized sense has a certain set of philosophies that, once adhered to, even if by accident, make one a Satanist, whether they like it or not. It has little to nothing to do with the christian philosophies, or the philosophies of any other organized religion. One simply has to be human, have human desires and strength of conviction. "

Howdy,

Where i was going with that was that this particular satanist liked to think of himself as above you La Vey satanists - considers you "try hards" who like to appear "cool" in the eyes of others as they like to appear to be a part of some fringe club or something [Im not saying i believe that, these are my recollections of the conversation with him], the idea i got was that a real satanist believes in the deity Satan - opposer to God in all facets, perhaps taken from the Christian ideology of what Satan is and what brought him about. - Maybe he wants to be "super hard core" or something.. i dont know.

La Vey's "satanism" did not come around until the 70's as far as i can recall. So what do you say to those "satanists" who do not conform to your ideas of what "satanism" truly i to yous. I mean the ones that existed hundreds of years before La Vey gave it a crack at being accepted by the mainstream peoples?

Not trying to hound you or anything, but i would like to know what you think on this matter? As there were historically speaking "satanists" before you, they clearly had different ideas and a different way of life to the modern day "satanists" - So, in summary, what the hell were those guys called?

Like i said my knowledge of this is limited at best, so please let me know your opinion.

This is where my question ends, and i like to branch into my thoughts on what you have described to me as Satanism. Please don't get pissed at me, as i am only expressing views based on what you have told me about satanism. Btw - im not attacking you, so please don't read it like that. Just merely making my own suppositions. It is in no way meant to anger or rile you up.

- "Satanism, in the officially recognized sense has a certain set of philosophies that, once adhered to, even if by accident, make one a Satanist, whether they like it or not. It has little to nothing to do with the christian philosophies, or the philosophies of any other organized religion. One simply has to be human, have human desires and strength of conviction." -

on that note, i think you are trying to encapsulate humanity as a whole as being "satanists" by default - i think that is a bit rich.

I enjoy reading your statements as they are usually fairly even handed. But that last one was a cop out to all mankind (IMO). Christians and Jews and Muslims could also be defined as such, by your own definition of what it takes to be a satanist? Then again, maybe you are right.

Using Christian teachings, we are all "Born sinners" and we must ask for repentance. So perhaps you are right on us all being born "satanists" - though i don't agree with that, i thought id be objective and show you that as a Christian i will try and meet you half way on things.

Maybe we all, at first, let ourselves do what we want, in a carnal sense, until we learn that giving into yourself leads to creating bad patterns of behavior that are negative to ourselves and those around us.

For example: If i wanted to constantly feel good, i could bunt some Heroin... It would make me feel good, great apparently, but it would take hold of my life and destroy it. That's a simple way of describing my thoughts on carnal pleasures and constantly giving in to them. I am not saying you do that, but i am trying to get my point across to show you how i see "carnal delights".

Same with Sex, constantly focusing on sex is distracting and is not a basis for a solid relationship - however don't get me wrong, sex with my wife is fulfilling and tiring! hahaha - but going with the "carnal" delights thing, if i see a woman and i went and slept with her because my little man wanted some action, that would destroy my relationship with the woman i love and potentially scar her for life. So, i got some - but she is hurt and forever scared by my selfish actions of wanting to partake in carnal delights.

At the end of the day, unless your hurting some one, physically, mentally, monetarily - you're not wronging anyone.. And by the same token, a Christian need only act as a christian to be called such - which is following the teachings of Christ to have the most positive effect on those around them and themselves as possible.

If you do not lie, steal, cheat, harm others - then maybe you are filling the criteria to being a Christian. Im definitely not pushing my own religion on you my friend, but i thought id use the same criterion to support my statement, that you did yours - there seems to be a duality here. Christians have all the traits you described.

HAving human desires and human needs, is as God intended us to be - But to constantly submit to these things and indulge in the carnal pleasures constantly can lead to dire straits. I mean, i can sit at home all day and smoke pot and stuff my face full of food and jerk off to porn all day - but where does that get me?

I hope you don't find me being too vulgar or confronting, but i thought id make that supposition to try and describe how i see "carnal" delights and what happens when some one constantly submits to them.



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 11:28 AM
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reply to post by Matthew Dark
 


You lack a sense of divine irony to appreciate the comedy of your predicament- you have not only turned a parody into your own church, but mock yourself. FeralMagicMonkey addressed this in the post that followed mine.

The wind in this instance not only laughs but also rolls its eyes.
When you can laugh at yourself then reply :-)




posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 12:56 PM
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reply to post by FeralMonkeyMagic
 

You are here erroneously equating Satanism with compulsion and inaction.
How many people from other religions sit around praying for something to happen, or contemplating their navels? LaVey advices: go and do something about your wishes and so many prayer hours can be used productively. LaVey disscusses this at length in his chapter: "Indulgence...Not Compulsion". The true Satanist is not mastered by his desires, and he should be the master of, instead of being mastered by pleasure (Satanic Bible: p.85).
On the other hand, if one is rich enough or disabled to enjoy sloth, and that floats your boat, then enjoy it. It is not typical of Satanists as far as I know however.
During the late 1960s, when LaVey wrote, there were many movements who thought they could save the world through dropping-out and having pipe-dreams (no pun intended). His document is the only main "maniphesto" from that era that glorifies power through activity without guilt in normal society, and an indifference for "spiritual" bums and "psychic vampires".


[edit on 22-1-2010 by halfoldman]



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 08:34 PM
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Originally posted by halfoldman
reply to post by FeralMonkeyMagic
 

You are here erroneously equating Satanism with compulsion and inaction.
How many people from other religions sit around praying for something to happen, or contemplating their navels? LaVey advices: go and do something about your wishes and so many prayer hours can be used productively. LaVey disscusses this at length in his chapter: "Indulgence...Not Compulsion". The true Satanist is not mastered by his desires, and he should be the master of, instead of being mastered by pleasure (Satanic Bible: p.85).
On the other hand, if one is rich enough or disabled to enjoy sloth, and that floats your boat, then enjoy it. It is not typical of Satanists as far as I know however.
During the late 1960s, when LaVey wrote, there were many movements who thought they could save the world through dropping-out and having pipe-dreams (no pun intended). His document is the only main "maniphesto" from that era that glorifies power through activity without guilt in normal society, and an indifference for "spiritual" bums and "psychic vampires".


[edit on 22-1-2010 by halfoldman]


You miss the point. I only use one avenue to describe MY OPINION on what it would be to indulge in carnal pleasures, from my own perspective.

What you say about prayer, is again your opinion. However, should you attempt to understand those who are praying, you should attempt to understand why they pray. Asking God to do something for you is not why you pray - When i pray, it's almost meditative. I reflect on certain things and ask God that i might be able to act better or see a different point of view etc - However, prayers have definitely been answered, so i certainly don't think that this is a waste of time or can be considered "unproductive". Like i say, cool that you have your own opinion on prayer, but i have my own perception of it also.

Like i said, that's how i would see it. Im not saying that is how it is, but i am saying that is how i see it. Just like you see it differently, i see it differently to you.

No 2 people will read the same essay and come away with the exact same conclusion.



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 09:17 PM
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reply to post by FeralMonkeyMagic
 

I have nothing against prayer. I just thought your last paragraph was somehow a notion that carnal pleasure was preached in Satanism to the point of mindless inertia. And some prayer (like going through a four hour Praise-a-thon) is to me a mixture between mind-control and self-delusion. Prayer can be a great guiding mechanism.
Thanks for the clarification.



posted on Jan, 22 2010 @ 09:56 PM
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Originally posted by halfoldman
reply to post by FeralMonkeyMagic
 

I have nothing against prayer. I just thought your last paragraph was somehow a notion that carnal pleasure was preached in Satanism to the point of mindless inertia. And some prayer (like going through a four hour Praise-a-thon) is to me a mixture between mind-control and self-delusion. Prayer can be a great guiding mechanism.
Thanks for the clarification.



Aww shucks!


Glad i was able to better describe my views. Sorry for the mix up mate.

I have to say though, seeing people go through a huge addiction to things like heroin is definitely a sad and mournful thing to see. Lack of self control in that case. Very sad.



posted on Jan, 24 2010 @ 10:22 AM
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Originally posted by jackflap


Let's say you had the ability to create such creatures as Angels. Would you make them mindless robots to do your bidding or would you create them with a free will to do what they wanted to? Would you let them have the ability to decide whether they wanted to follow you or would you create them to follow a predetermined course of action that only you knew of?

Had I such power, the actions of my creations would hold little consequence to me. If they lived harmoniously, I'd applaud their compassion. If they rebelled, I'd applaud their fervor. I'd care not if they worshiped me as I would be all-powerful and above such petty nuances.



How would you be able to tell if they actually loved you or not? Would it be fair to create mindless robots that do your bidding? I for one believe God created them with free will. Did God know that evil would arise because of this? Probably, but then God could very well make himself oblivious to the repercussions to truly see if the Angels would love Him and His ways.

That's assuming that rebelling would be considered 'evil'. And, by your standards, 'god' planted the seed of what you consider 'evil' in the 'angels' in the first place or rebellion wouldn't have even been a consideration.



He could have wiped every one of them out after they rebelled, but He didn't. Now there are two forces at work, good and evil. At first there was only good. Now there was evil. At this point there is only the Angels and God. Who could judge what is right and what is wrong? Enter mankind. I believe we will give testimony as to what both forces brought to our existence.

Your concept of cosmology is both narrow and skewed in favor of humanity. And no, there was not only just 'good' at first because it says in your very bible that 'god' created 'good' and 'evil'. If anything, it was only for his amusement, which would tilt the scales in favor of 'god' being slightly more 'evil' than 'good'. Was there really 'gods' in that sense, I'd imagine that they'd care little for the struggles of lesser beings because it doesn't directly affect them. Unless, of course, the lesser beings fail to worship properly, then 'gods' or 'god' or whatever have a tendency to become petty, pouty, and spiteful. Any omni-powerful entity displaying that kind of behavior to me, shows insecurity and a shameful disregard for the very creatures they 'created'. That being said, they are not worthy of such praise and elevation as they act like spoiled children when they do not get their way. That alone is cause for rebellion.



Remember when Adam and Eve came upon the idea of evil. God told them that in the day you eat of the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil you will surely die. He didn't kill them. He killed an animal and made coverings for the both of them. This was the first sin offering made by God Himself for them in keeping with His later texts.


That's if you believe in such a thing, which I don't. That entire story is rife with inconsistencies that shows that 'god' was so unconcerned with his creations, and that he had either not been watching them adequately, or had set them up at patsies. How could such an omni-powerful being not know what had been transpiring in his own back yard? Why put such a powerful tool such as knowledge in such close proximity to beings that couldn't tell 'right' from 'wrong'? How could the serpent (whomever you wish to believe that may happen to be) enter unhampered, hold such pertinent conversations with these beings that went unheard, and get away without any reprisal whatsoever? Does that even make sense? Again, the entire bible is nothing more than a tool used to control the dullard populace, as any intelligent person would be able to point out the illogical holes in most, if not all of these stories. The concept of 'original sin' is a very powerful tool to create a virtual no-win situation. By these standards, the best any normal person can hope for is to basically just break even. These are some of the concepts I rebel against. And I will continue to do so even with my last breath.


[note: edited because I screwed up the quote function...again]



[edit on 1/24/10 by Matthew Dark]



posted on Jan, 24 2010 @ 10:26 AM
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Originally posted by pixanomaly
You lack a sense of divine irony to appreciate the comedy of your predicament- you have not only turned a parody into your own church, but mock yourself. FeralMagicMonkey addressed this in the post that followed mine.


I don't see how you're in any position to dictate my predicament to me.
You point out irony where there is none.



posted on Jan, 24 2010 @ 05:09 PM
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reply to post by Matthew Dark
 


Good stuff Matthew Dark. I just don't see God as being limited to anything. I mean, if you believe in Him and what the Bible teaches about Him. I just know there is a much grander plan that I for one cannot get my head around.


Isaiah 55:8-9 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. 9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.


I for one trust Him to do what He says He will do with my best interest in His plans. I enjoy your stuff though and am glad to have discussed it with you. Peace my friend.



posted on Jan, 24 2010 @ 05:35 PM
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An opinion for those who want to battle the Luciferians:
An old saying in the south is "Don't wrestle with the pigs, 'cause they love it and you just get dirty."
In biblical terms:


[6] Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

Matthew 7:6
Why else would they banter the unholiness around these days, very unlike they used to do in times of old (i.e. hide and keep it secret)? The corrupter and deceiver of the Word is the problem, not the Word itself.



posted on Jan, 24 2010 @ 09:43 PM
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reply to post by 1SawSomeThings
 


Sound advice 1SawSomeThings. I don't wish to battle anyone. I am merely trying to understand the self destructive nature of it all. There is a reason for it. As far as battling, I let the Word do Its work. It's really out of my hands. The Word is every ounce of power in the universe as far as I am concerned. It will accomplish Its goals and prosper.


Isaiah 55:11 so shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.



posted on Jan, 24 2010 @ 10:09 PM
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reply to post by jackflap
 


I appreciate that you took the time to read my posts and think about what I'd been saying, instead of just mindlessly arguing.
At least, on this topic, we can agree to disagree in a civil manner, which I believe is a step in the right direction.



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