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Dreams are just dreams...Nothing else

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posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 10:07 PM
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A lot of people in this thread talk about how dreams are really an astral realm. While I do not rule out OBEs being real, dreams are entirely different. This thing that always bothered me was sleep walking. If the soul does exist, and leave our body when we dream, then we wouldn’t be able to sleep walk. Does any of this make sense to you guys?




posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 10:23 PM
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Dreams are much more than just dreams my friend. They can be used as a guide if listened to. But if you ignore them then they will have no meaning to you, just as with anything else on earth.



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 10:26 PM
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The souls does not always leave the body. The mind dreams to accomplish many tasks- We may work out problems, revisit our fears, have wish dreams, just for fun dreams, and people like myself have prophetic dreams-literal and symbolically. Many meet loved ones througha dream sequence-this can be done within astral though most meet them through dreams where they feel semi conscious and it's stilla bit wonky


But yah..you can sleep walk b.c we don't always leave.



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 10:49 PM
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I've been researching oobe's all day from a scientific standpoint. Basically, an oobe is a disintegration of various brain areas. It usually involves epilepsy or seizures in the temporal lobe, but can be triggered in different areas of the brain. It can be induced by various focusing techniques. This tricks the brain into believing that it's somewhere it's not, and the mind goes wild trying to pattern match. It seems to lock up to the subconscious in this attempt. This is the oobe. It's an integration of conscious awareness and dreamland.

I've had dreams that are meaningless, which are usually dull and I don't control. Lucid dreams where I'm in control and create the landscape. Lucid dreams where I'm not in control and are more of a vision like experience. Lucid dreams where I'm being taught by my experience or have a guide. Finally, I've had spontaneous oobe's that I don't interpret to actually be out of body. I think these are just funky vivid dream states caused by brain fits.

I don't buy into any supernatural explanation at all. It can be explained through reason, IMO.

The last oobe I had was after a stressful day. I fell onto my bed, clothed and all. Closed my eyes for less than ten seconds and seemed to be flung out into the street, flying around. The experience was quite intense. I could see, feel, & hear the pouring rain all around me. I mean savant style, aware of every single drop. I was not guiding my flight, was being flung. The thing which later made me realize this experience was fabricated was that I also seemed to have a holographic computer coming out my right wrist. I was manipulating this via my left.

When I woke up the experience seemed so vivid, so real that at first I was convinced I just jumped out my body. Then I remembered the holographic computer. Then I became extremely tired, shook it off as yet another wicked experience, and crashed.

It was something, but not real.

[edit on 13-1-2010 by unityemissions]



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 10:50 PM
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Sorry I must have sent out the wrong message. I know that dreaming is very important to our being, just nothing supernatural to dreams. While I do not rule out OBE's, which I believe in. It seems that dreams are not supernatural in any way. That’s just my opinion.



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 11:31 PM
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Dreams are your consciousness/unconsciousness in a new dimensional reality based on thought.

You have consciousness, and it's opposite, unconsciousness - a human being is 97% unconscious of the world/universe and multidimensional nature of their existence because they spend most of their time using the mind/intellect that evolved from animals and can not fathom this information. That is why enlightened beings chose to silence the mind, as it is an inferior tool to perceive reality and who you actually are, which is a multidimensional being of infinite potential - so they choose to listen to this being that resides in a higher dimension with no limitation of time etc, rather than the mind.

When you silence the mind, you realize you are not the rambling endless thoughts and emotions that arise from these thoughts and the mind, you detach from your mind and move closer to your source, this source is more conscious of the universe, of existence and has faculties of true peace and wisdom. You will become more conscious of your surroundings, you will have intuitive abilities and your dreams will become much clearer as you have now silenced the animal mind and increased your consciousness.

Your higher self/consciousness can now be emerge to clearly percieve the dream (or higher dimension where thoughts become reality) and you will find they make much more sense - you can receive teachings from yourself in a higher dimension or other beings residing in those dimensions as you are now conscious enough to perceive the teachings rather than projecting your own rambling subconscious imagery, or sometimes your mind is on overdrive with thought and your consciousness will not be able to perceive the dream at all. This explains the variability of lucidity of dreams.

When you are extremely conscious and your mind is well trained, you can carry your consciousness into the higher dimensions without going unconscious during the sleep process and then having to "wake up" the consciousness in the middle of the dream (aka lucid dream) - a well trained person will keep focused on nothing or one thing and lose focus of the 3d environment (sleep to shut down physical body and no thoughts so that theres no focus on the mind which is also in this 3d environment) - your consciousness which is multidimensional will then begin to perceive your higher dimensional body (intense vibrations/astral body) and you will lose focus of your physical body and start using the 3rd eye from your astral body to see this new dimension)

Most people go unconscious into their minds when they go to sleep as opposed to shifting consciousness into higher dimensional realities, with very little amount of consciousness able to perceive, it's like when your lost in a daydream during the day and lose all focus of your surroundings, someone has to bang on the table next to you to tell you to "wake up" and then you leave your mind and increase your consciousness again.

You are not your thoughts or your emotions, move away from these towards your true nature. People who try to use their minds to fathom will never be able to absorb this information, and will not have experiences that re-enforce the accuracy of it as they are using an inferior tool to rationalize reality even though deep down their consciousness is waiting to be increased, barely able to manifest itself.


[edit on 13-1-2010 by raiden12]



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 12:09 AM
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reply to post by raiden12
 


I've experienced everything you talk about, but my interpretation is different. No higher dimensions, certainly no shutting down the mind. The notion is absurd. It's how the mind operates. If it's not working, we die.

I've experienced lucid dreaming. Use to have meditative techniques to be aware from sensory experience to dreamland. I did this naturally as a child. Would double from 1 - passed a million, then go backwards to 1, then recycle. After a couple of cycles, would begin to see fleeting stars with eyes open. Each star carried a sound, thought, color and number I was counting. Stars would begin to turn into brite white lite. Light would fill all I could see, as the counting was beyond most peoples comprehension. Then I would seem to jump out. It's just an illusion. Every bit of it. We're manipulating our brainwave state. That's all. I have visions, visit "other planets" , etc, etc. It's just experiencing the mind. It IS the subconscious. Nothing mystical about it, IMO.

Okay, let's just agree to disagree. You obviously have a deep seated belief in this. I'm not trying to sway you, just giving an additional opinion for other readers.

[edit on 14-1-2010 by unityemissions]



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 12:19 AM
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Originally posted by unityemissions
reply to post by raiden12
 


I've experienced everything you talk about, but my interpretation is different. No higher dimensions, certainly no shutting down the mind. The notion is absurd. It's how the mind operates. If it's not working, we die.



Unityemissions

I'm certainly not suggesting shutting off the mind physically and causing death, what i'm suggesting is that people who practice meditation will come to realize that they are not their thoughts, and the emotions that stem from those thoughts. Through hard work and discipline, one can stop the mind from constantly running off with our attention, blocking the consciousness from manifesting. It needs to be experienced to be understood, and once understood it re-enforces the student to continue with meditation which then leads onto many topics that are too large to discuss within this thread. If you spend two weeks watching your own thoughts 24x7, constantly, and casting them aside as soon as you have one and continuing to just "observe" reality inside AND outside of you, you will start observing reality through your consciousness and move away from your mind as the point of observation, you WILL realize your a being that is not your physical body or anything that comes from it (thoughts from the mind, emotions that stem from those thoughts.) Don't try to use your mind to understand reality, it just can't, and until you do this work you will be stuck trying to understand it - it's through personal experience that we begin to understand and re-enforce our concepts, so if you don't do it you will be funneling reality through a limited vehicle which is your physical body and the mind and will never awaken.

When you do this work, your dreams will be clearer, which will re-enforce the work your putting in, they will be clearer and the consciousness can now observe, or if it's strong enough, take control - this is called a lucid dream. An Out of body experience is simply consciousness manifesting in the higher dimensions so that it can take control, instead of just observing subconscious rambling of the mind. Like i said, if you can remain conscious during the sleep process and not go off into your mind with thoughts, you will have an OBE every time - but this is a skill that needs to be developed.


[edit on 14-1-2010 by raiden12]



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 12:20 AM
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Dreams come in a tremendous spectrum of experience and flavors. They range from sexual, instinctual experiences, random unconscious spurts, or there are those that are definitely full of depth. Some of my most vivid and really lucid colorful dreams where off an African shamanistic brew of Ubalawu. Next come the ones that are connected and follow sleep paralysis experiences if you are calm and you let it ride. Some are full of symbolism and exist to be discerned by the conscious self.



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 12:28 AM
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reply to post by raiden12
 


Thanks for the reply, but I'd rather not ever adapt something that I think a delusion. I've been there, and it's not a healthy state. I consider it to be borderline psychopathic. You mention being able to be more aware of your surroundings. I've already got this. I process all streams simultaneously. I can have headphones blaring, and still here everything around me. I can seem to be off into la-la land, actually internally visualizing various things, thinking in multiple streams, while still being entirely aware of my surroundings visually, and auditory. I have used different meditative techniques throughout my lifetime, but don't think there's anything supernatural to it, whatsoever. I am my thoughts. Not just the voice, but the imagination as well.



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 12:49 AM
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Originally posted by unityemissions
reply to post by raiden12
 


Thanks for the reply, but I'd rather not ever adapt something that I think a delusion. I've been there, and it's not a healthy state. I consider it to be borderline psychopathic. You mention being able to be more aware of your surroundings. I've already got this. I process all streams simultaneously. I can have headphones blaring, and still here everything around me. I can seem to be off into la-la land, actually internally visualizing various things, thinking in multiple streams, while still being entirely aware of my surroundings visually, and auditory. I have used different meditative techniques throughout my lifetime, but don't think there's anything supernatural to it, whatsoever. I am my thoughts. Not just the voice, but the imagination as well.


Thank you for your comment,

I would not consider meditating to achieve inner silence to be unhealthy or borderline psychotic - in fact, i would consider not doing so to be absurd. If you don't have a stable silence and can keep that silent base without having anything interrupt it, how could you possibly have control over your reality? You are being influenced, and until you realise it's the mind that's doing the influencing with it's thoughts/emotions you will be lost in it.

People don't dedicate their lives to the pursuit of this knowledge because they are stupid or psychotic, they were masters, they were incredibly wise and they knew this information for many thousands of years, it's not new, we just lost it over time. If you are skilled enough, you will experience what it's like to observe reality from a level you never even dreamed of, you can leave this place through consciousness, observing reality at such a high level that time is non existent and the point of observation is eternal in nature and is not susceptible to the growth/decay/death cycle of the 3d environment.

Do you have any idea what the chances of your existence are right now? How could you not consider life to be more complex than this? Considering what's at stake, which is your soul, don't you think it's worth looking into, for the sake of two weeks of experimentation?

How long can you have no thoughts interrupting you AT ALL? Most peoples average is only a few seconds long, imagine how influenced they are most of their day without realizing it? Again, i use the analogy of getting lost in a daydream to describe losing consciousness of your surroundings - you need to do the opposite and strengthen the consciousness - then you will experience life and it will start to make sense.

Something to ponder:

deoxy.org...

[edit on 14-1-2010 by raiden12]



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 12:56 AM
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Originally posted by Maddogkull
A lot of people in this thread talk about how dreams are really an astral realm. While I do not rule out OBEs being real, dreams are entirely different. This thing that always bothered me was sleep walking. If the soul does exist, and leave our body when we dream, then we wouldn’t be able to sleep walk. Does any of this make sense to you guys?


Dreams are organized thoughts which form a virtual reality we have come to call a dream.

They reside within a cognitive reality as opposed to physical reality and have subjective properties to them.

Dreams are also a form of language and is in fact a way we are communicating to ourselves in a very organized dipole of thought.


Anything that exists in cognitive reality, also exists in non-physical reality so if you believe that is higher realms or what ever... it is still reduced to consciousness space.

When dreams come true, we have a dream/reality dualism that reveals dreams are more then just random information and have as they always have had, potential for reality.

Something I doubt many of you can even begin to fathom intellectually.



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 01:07 AM
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Originally posted by raiden12

Originally posted by unityemissions
reply to post by raiden12
 


Thanks for the reply, but I'd rather not ever adapt something that I think a delusion. I've been there, and it's not a healthy state. I consider it to be borderline psychopathic. You mention being able to be more aware of your surroundings. I've already got this. I process all streams simultaneously. I can have headphones blaring, and still here everything around me. I can seem to be off into la-la land, actually internally visualizing various things, thinking in multiple streams, while still being entirely aware of my surroundings visually, and auditory. I have used different meditative techniques throughout my lifetime, but don't think there's anything supernatural to it, whatsoever. I am my thoughts. Not just the voice, but the imagination as well.


Thank you for your comment,

I would not consider meditating to achieve inner silence to be unhealthy or borderline psychotic - in fact, i would consider not doing so to be absurd. If you don't have a stable silence and can keep that silent base without having anything interrupt it, how could you possibly have control over your reality? You are being influenced, and until you realise it's the mind that's doing the influencing with it's thoughts/emotions you will be lost in it.


Actually, I said psychopathic, and I stand by that. Enlightened beings are just as dangerous as religious loons, as they're both fanatical. They both are after control, whether being aware of this or not. They both think that their interpretation of reality is absolute. Reality is not what we perceive. It exists independent of any one of us.



People don't dedicate their lives to the pursuit of this knowledge because they are stupid or psychotic, they were masters, they were incredibly wise and they knew this information for many thousands of years, it's not new, we just lost it over time. If you are skilled enough, you will experience what it's like to observe reality from a level you never even dreamed of, you can leave this place through consciousness, observing reality at such a high level that time is non existent and the point of observation is eternal in nature and is not susceptible to the growth/decay/death cycle of the 3d environment.


They dedicate their lives probably because they're bored of the mundane, and get lured in by others who are already brainwashed. I don't think they're stupid, just that they lack insight. As for reaching nirvana, no thanks. I'm quite comfortable with the fact that this body will decay, and my personal sense of self will wither away. Life goes on (overall) .



Do you have any idea what the chances of your existence are right now? How could you not consider life to be more complex than this? Considering what's at stake, which is the progression of your evolution, don't you think it's worth looking into, for the sake of two weeks of experimentation?

Something to ponder:

deoxy.org...


Do you have any clue how vast the universe is? I have considered the complexity of life, time and time again. What I've concluded is that life is a subjective term. It's only narcissism, which leads us to say, this is alive, this is not alive. We relate things which are living in ways we easily understand with our feeble minds. Everything is absorbing and reflecting energy. Everything is in constant motion. Everything exists. The difference between us (it seems) is that I identify with my personal sense of self. We're all one, that's undeniable, but still here I am, there you are. It's all true. It's all a lie. Which would you prefer to focus on? I choose to believe what I experience is nothing more than my subconscious teaching me based on eons of experiences from past generations. No, not my memories, but ancestral memories.

May I ask you a question? Why would you limit your subconscious, so that what we describe as an oobe must be something that happens outside of our body? The mind is incredibly powerful. It seems we wish to tell each other the same thing. Don't limit yourself!



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 01:20 AM
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Originally posted by YouAreDreaming
When dreams come true, we have a dream/reality dualism that reveals dreams are more then just random information and have as they always have had, potential for reality.

Something I doubt many of you can even begin to fathom intellectually.



I can fathom that. It just shows the incredibly accurate predictive powers of the subconscious mind. I'm left handed right-brained. My folks think I'm slightly autistic (aspergers or HFA) . It seems my left temporal lobe may have been damaged early in life. Through neuroplasticity, I've developed what many people would consider savant skills. This includes lightning quick arithmetics, and intuitive capabilities. One of these is predictions. I can look at someone and answer them before they speak, or know in a flash the best route to take in complex situations, etc..It just seems normal to me, but others say this is really out the norm.

Nothing that can't be explained rationally. I've developed a means of tapping into my subconscious more than the average person. Surely this would pop up in some people through their dreams, as that's when most "normal" people experience their subconscious.

[edit on 14-1-2010 by unityemissions]



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 03:45 AM
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Actually, I said psychopathic, and I stand by that. Enlightened beings are just as dangerous as religious loons, as they're both fanatical. They both are after control, whether being aware of this or not. They both think that their interpretation of reality is absolute. Reality is not what we perceive. It exists independent of any one of us.



I do not believe in the New Age nor any religious leaders or movements, i believe in the experiences that i have and do my best to find my own answers based on personal experiences and hard work, this is the only way to come to truly logical conclusions once you have experienced things for yourself. You say they think their interpretation of reality is absolute, but reading over your comments you are doing exactly the same thing, coming to absolute conclusions based on your personal experience. I practiced hard, learned that the consciousness resided in another dimension, meditated to control my thoughts and emotions, practiced staying conscious every night during sleep to observe the higher dimensional bodies and how they function in the astral/mental planes, started feeling true peace which is a faculty of the consciousness and can't be felt in the subconscious states of the mind, like when your a child. Have you had these experiences? If you haven't, then how can you possibly tell me that it's not real, or a delusion? You said it yourself, reality is not what we perceive and is subjective, well i changed the way i perceived it, stopped using the mind because i could, stopped listening to thoughts and getting lost in emotions because i could, it led me to a new point of observation and a completely new way of perceiving reality, i won't say it's absolute, but it's a hell of a lot better than the way i was perceiving it.




They dedicate their lives probably because they're bored of the mundane, and get lured in by others who are already brainwashed. I don't think they're stupid, just that they lack insight. As for reaching nirvana, no thanks.



Probably? Brainwashed? Obviously this statement is not based on any personal experience or facts, if you spent any time with these people you would realize they are incredibly wise and experience an inner peace that you can't fathom as you can only experience peace as a faculty of higher states of consciousness. It's funny, you've just described what i would classify as humanity in a subconscious state, lured in by others who are already brainwashed.




Do you have any clue how vast the universe is? I have considered the complexity of life, time and time again. What I've concluded is that life is a subjective term. It's only narcissism, which leads us to say, this is alive, this is not alive. We relate things which are living in ways we easily understand with our feeble minds.



Exactly, life is subjective, we do relate to things in ways we easily understand with our feeble minds because from life we've believed we only had our five senses and this physical body, it's more comfortable and easier to believe this - the part your missing is that if you use the faculties of consciousness, you have a new perspective with which to view reality, something different to gauge reality with and can compare this view with the view you had using your mind, this new way opens up many more doors and you learn more about life. You can now compare reality between the use of the mind and the use of consciousness, what you find is that when you use consciousness which is a part of a being residing in a higher dimension, you can perceive more of reality - most people never get this far, as they never realize they have a choice of what to listen to!

You will never be able to understand this without personal experience of it.



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 04:30 AM
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well, i insist that not all people do dream astral dreams.
but some do.

i can tell you for sure that i do.
i have had dreams with other people...

when i would ask them about it, of course, for science's sake i refrained from telling my experience first and to my surprise they had had the same dream with me. same experience of flying through space.
this is just one of many experiences.



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 05:01 AM
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I agree OP. I always Lucid Dream, For some reason I always do and it's a exciting and strange experience.



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 05:08 AM
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I have LOTS of predictive dreams which I document... a LOT come true.. even 'silly' ones like people getting pregnant.
I dreamed about one woman I had just met, I told her the next day that she was pregnant and her reply was "I have been trying for 5 years, even the DR's cant work out why I cant conceive!"
I told her to go buy a test as I was 100% sure of my dream.
She telephoned me in hysterics 2 hours later because she had tested and it was possitive!
This has happened many times....
Other dreams include one about 9/11 two weeks before it happened that had the whole family in shock when it came true..

Dreams may just be dreams to you but for me they require a notepad and pen by my bed



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 05:28 AM
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Originally posted by Maddogkull
A lot of people in this thread talk about how dreams are really an astral realm. While I do not rule out OBEs being real, dreams are entirely different.

Different, but very similar in a lot of ways.


This thing that always bothered me was sleep walking. If the soul does exist, and leave our body when we dream, then we wouldn’t be able to sleep walk.
You can exist in multiple spaces at once . . .


Does any of this make sense to you guys?
Yes it does make a lot of sense to me . . . but i wouldn't want you to take my word on it.

Keep a dream diary, practice lucid dreaming, try astral projection . . .

You can learn about this stuff on your own, don't listen to what people tell you, experience it for yourself and come to your own conclusion.



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 08:01 AM
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Originally posted by Maddogkull
A lot of people in this thread talk about how dreams are really an astral realm. While I do not rule out OBEs being real, dreams are entirely different. This thing that always bothered me was sleep walking. If the soul does exist, and leave our body when we dream, then we wouldn’t be able to sleep walk. Does any of this make sense to you guys?


Dreams may be the random firing of neurons. This may be why they often seem so cartoonish when we wake up. At least for me, the more intense the event we had while awake, the more logical and cogent the dream.



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