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Madeleine McCann 'Died In Holiday Apartment'

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posted on Jan, 15 2010 @ 08:48 PM
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reply to post by ArMaP
 


I think the Media coverage raised a lot of suspicions, Sky News were in overdrive long after Maddie went missing. I think people now know, anyone drilling information out like that is trying to cover up something.

Many people believed in the official story to begin with, they believed that because to them it meant Maddie could still be alive. The "Conspiracy" meant there was very little chance of her being alive. Most people go with what suits there beliefs, accepting the "Conspiracy" meant going against them. I think more and more people understand now, sometimes you have to drop ones beliefs to see the truth.

I think this has been a huge factor is winning public opinion, Gerry and Kate almost assure people that "Maddie is not dead" in reality they should accept the possibility, instead they focus on raising more money to continue the search. Even though when Maddie first went missing they didn't join that search until 48 hours after. Sorry but if my child went missing I would be the first one out looking, because I know my child better than anyone else. I would continue looking until I stopped berating.




posted on Jan, 15 2010 @ 10:37 PM
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If the sniffer dog indications are accurate, then the only questions are how did Madeleine die and what happened to her body?

If it could be proved that the McCanns disposed of the body, then very serious charges relating to the Find Madeleine fund would follow, in addition to the more obvious charges.

Personally, I think that there are witnesses to the events of that evening who have not been heard from. People who saw or heard things of which they may not realize the significance.

The sighting reported by the Smith family, of a man carrying a child just before 10 PM is very interesting. Does Gerry really have an alibi for that time period? Would a stranger go running through town with a kidnapped child on his shoulder? Can this person be the same person sighted by Jane Tanner shortly after 9 PM? That would add up to almost an hour of walking around carrying a kidnapped child. That's a hard scenario to swallow. This is a wierd case.

People are not telling the truth.



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 05:40 AM
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Originally posted by ipsedixit
The sighting reported by the Smith family, of a man carrying a child just before 10 PM is very interesting. Does Gerry really have an alibi for that time period? Would a stranger go running through town with a kidnapped child on his shoulder?
I just want to add that 10 PM is not considered late here in Portugal, many restaurants and bars are full of people at that time.

Night movie sessions, for example, usually end around midnight.

We are not "early to bed, early to rise" people.



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 05:56 AM
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reply to post by ipsedixit
 


I think this is a vital piece of evidence.


The transcripts show Mrs McCann told police about a conversation she had with Madeleine on the morning she vanished.

"While we were having breakfast, Madeleine said: 'Mum, why didn't you come when we were crying last night?'," she said.

She added: "Gerry and I talked about it for several minutes and decided to watch over the children more carefully at night."


Why talk about something if it didn't happen, why agree to watch over the children more carefully. They admit they were not careful enough.


Friends of the McCanns said the couple had been "puzzled" by Madeleine's remark as she had not apparently been crying when they called in for regular 20-minute checks from the restaurant across the pool where they dined each night during their holiday.


That's because this time they sedated her.


They said one of the McCanns' friends, Rachael Oldfield, had been in the adjoining flat - on the other side of Madeleine's wall - all evening and heard no crying.


One person who is a Friend of the McCann's said she heard no crying "That is not enough to go on"


The couple also insist Madeleine was not speaking angrily and they did not take it as a reproach.

Her reference to "we" is understood to have referred to Madeleine and her younger brother Sean.


Although Maddie didn't speak angry they don't deny leaving the children on their own.


Friends said they now believe the comment could even be a clue that an intruder was in the flat on the night of May 2 and briefly disturbed Madeleine and Sean before fleeing.


Bingo, this is proof "They were not in the Apartment the night before either


On the night Madeleine went missing, Mr McCann said he returned to the apartment by his usual route after his wife raised the alarm.

"I looked everywhere, I returned to the children's room and started to think about what could have happened," he said.


Why didn't he use this route when he was checking on Maddie, Did he use the short "Usual" route when he did check on Maddie, and claimed to have use the long route to cover up the time he had been covering up Maddies death.


"To my surprise, I realised that I could lift up the Persian blind without effort and almost without any noise."

Mr McCann also reported that the angle of the door had changed earlier on in the evening when he had checked on his children - who were all sleeping.


Why would it be a Surprise the blinds made no noise when he lifted them, was this the first time he ever opened these blinds.

So the angel of the Door had changed, not sure if this happens to anyone else but when I open my outside door, any door in the house that is not shut properly "Moves" with the air that has just entered the house.


Reporting from the McCanns' home town of Rothley in Leicestershire, Sky correspondent David Crabtree said the McCanns were upset that the transcript leak had caused diversion in their campaign.


upset because "The Truth Hurts"

I think we need to have a petition to have a Madeleine Fund enquiry, The fund was set up in the hope of finding Madeleine alive and to support the family with expenses. With the evidence surrounding this case the finger is pointing at the McCanns, In my opinion Kate and Gerry knew Maddie was not alive, thus making the Maddie fund a complete fraud.



Source used





[edit on 16-1-2010 by IamNow]



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 06:26 AM
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Didn't they have strong links to a priest in Portugal?
I sometimes think he may be the one who holds the truth of what happened.
Unfortunately he will take any confession with him to his grave. What a burden, if this is the case.
What got me most at the time was they never, ever, admitted they were wrong to leave their kids alone like that. She said she wished she hadn't done it. That's not quite the same.
It was justified on the basis of how close the apartment was.
It was claimed this was just like dining in your garden.
It was said after the event, that you wouldn't expect a kidnapper to be roaming around. Well what of all the other things that could happen? Heck, what of Madeleine waking up in a strange place and needing her mum?
I'm wondering what the culture is, in Portugal, of taking your kids out with you? I've worked overseas where it was quite accepted to bring babies, kids in pushchairs etc out to restaurants. They would fall asleep while out. It was no big deal. Wasn't this supposed to be 'a family holiday'?
My theory is - M was by all accounts a bit of a hyper child and didn't like to be left. So she was sedated. As opposed to the twins (so tests on them prove nothing). But she struggled to get up and fell and hit her head maybe. You could almost understand a cover up. If the damage was done anyway, the immediate reaction might be to protect the family unit.
But what family unit?
I believe M is dead. Whatever, my thoughts now are with the remaining kids, even if their parents were not implicated. As someone posted, there is culpability regardless (in my opinion, she said, cautiously)..




[edit on 16-1-2010 by unicorn1]



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 07:45 AM
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Originally posted by unicorn1
I'm wondering what the culture is, in Portugal, of taking your kids out with you? I've worked overseas where it was quite accepted to bring babies, kids in pushchairs etc out to restaurants. They would fall asleep while out. It was no big deal. Wasn't this supposed to be 'a family holiday'?
We (not me, I don't have any children) usually take our children out to something like a simple family and friends dinner.

During the hotter summer days is common to see children playing near their parents' until midnight or even later, but I think (I haven't looked at it) that this is one of those places in which they make a "small UK", and act as if they are back home, sometimes nobody speaks Portuguese in places like that (and some places we are not looked at by the waiters if we speak Portuguese, we have to speak English
).



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 08:12 AM
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reply to post by ArMaP
 


Thanks for the info every little helps.

Just found another inconstancy.


Did anyone else in the Tapas 9 notice anything strange?

Matthew Oldfield said he had checked on the McCanns’ apartment at 9.30pm. A source close to the McCanns had said he did not look into the bedroom where Madeleine was sleeping with the two-year-old twins Sean and Amelie. But the Evening Standard report claimed he saw the twins but did not have a view of Madeleine’s bed. www.timesonline.co.uk...






@ 45 seconds into the video posted earlier, Kate clearly states she could see the twins in there cot and that Madeleine's bes was "Just here" pointing just beyond the door, so why didn't the source see the same thing.





posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 08:25 AM
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Lets not forget the bible passage from Kate's bible, this happened to be a page than was crumpled.

Samuel II, chapter 12, verses 15-19

15 And Nathan departed unto his house. And the LORD struck the child that Uriah's wife bare unto David, and it was very sick.

16 David therefore besought God for the child; and David fasted, and went in, and lay all night upon the earth.

17 And the elders of his house arose, and went to him, to raise him up from the earth: but he would not, neither did he eat bread with them.

18 And it came to pass on the seventh day, that the child died. And the servants of David feared to tell him that the child was dead: for they said, Behold, while the child was yet alive, we spake unto him, and he would not hearken unto our voice: how will he then vex himself, if we tell him that the child is dead?

19 But when David saw that his servants whispered, David perceived that the child was dead: therefore David said unto his servants, Is the child dead? And they said, He is dead.


_______________


I think this is a huge huge clue,.



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 08:38 AM
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The McCann children being left alone at night in an unfamiliar, foreign apartment (locked or unlocked...take your pick) is outrageous and totally irresponsible in itself. However, add to this an early interview with a relative (Kate's mother from memory) where it was revealed that, apparently, Madeleine was a sleep walker and often required sedation...

I believe there is also reference in the police files to a 'chart' which was stuck to the fridge at the Rothley residence where Maddie was rewarded with a star for staying in her own bed. Mind boggling stuff.

As for the Madeleine fund and the entrepreneurial way in which it was conceived and launched within days of Madeleine's disappearance, well, who could forget Gerry's religious like 'vision' and his great 'marketing ploy' in using Maddie's distinctive eye pattern as an advertising tool for said campaign? I remember seeing cunning and misleading interviews in which the fund was portrayed as a charity which it certainly is not. Shameless, despicable and wanton deception.

There's lots more that will come to me (and others), I'm sure.



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 08:42 AM
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This is my theory as to why this has been covered up so well




Scottish Knights Templar

Oh and look what's in Rothley where Kate and Gerry live.

Link



[edit on 16-1-2010 by IamNow]



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 09:31 AM
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Originally posted by IamNow
This is my theory as to why this has been covered up so well




Scottish Knights Templar

Oh and look what's in Rothley where Kate and Gerry live.

Link



[edit on 16-1-2010 by IamNow]


That is interesting though I think it would have been more interesting if the chapel was not situated so close. I think this more likely just a normal sign of respect and a red hering.

Though without a doubt there has been some high level intervention, a safety net caught the Mccans, a net that should have been used to capture them.

Peace out,

Korg.



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 09:44 AM
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reply to post by Korg Trinity
 


Yes very true this could just be a token of respect, however it did seem to fit in with the Andrew Brown/Gordon Brown interest.

What do you think about getting a petition going to look into the Maddie fund, all it would take is somebody who has donated money to ask where than money had gone and why it's justifiable based on the evidence to have a Maddie fund.

The sniffer dogs picked up on the scent of Death both in the apartment and in the family hire car, DNA samples were 99% a match to that of Maddie from that car. To me this investigation is now "Murder or Manslaughter"

The Site "FindMadeleine " states


Why do we continue?

* There is absolutely nothing to suggest that Madeleine has been harmed.
* Madeleine is still missing and someone needs to be looking for her.
* She is very young and vulnerable and needs our help.
* We love her dearly and miss her beyond words.

Fund Objectives

The full objects of the Fund are:

* To secure the safe return to her family of Madeleine McCann who was abducted in Praia da Luz, Portugal on Thursday 3rd May 2007;

* To procure that Madeleine's abduction is thoroughly investigated and that her abductors, as well as those who played or play any part in assisting them, are identified and brought to justice; and

* To provide support, including financial assistance, to Madeleine's family.

This is all based on the fact she was abducted and is still alive, there is no evidence to support this.



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 10:26 AM
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Originally posted by KANDINSKI
Im so glad to see this subject on here.He will go to his death bed trying to get the Mcanns convicted,and so he should.Its the little things in this case that are the most telling.

Like who drives miles and dumps a fridge on holiday?

Also leaving the car doors open for 24 hours to dry out spilt meat?
I defy anyone to watch the documentary and still say she was taken.

From what I hear most people in their village cross the road to avoid them.

[edit on 15-1-2010 by KANDINSKI]


Interesting what you say about the attitude of local people. I think most people now consider them guilty. Presuming they did find Madeline dead and hatched a plan to hide the body, how could either of them go through that? I can't even imagine the trauma involved in transporting your dead child to some remote place and then burying her in a crude grave. Maybe Gerry convinced Kate that it was the only way that they would be able to 'keep' the twins.

My feeling is that Gerry was emotionally detached from Maddie. Some parents react in this way to 'problem children' (behavioural problems, autism, disabilities etc) they don't have the patience or empathy necessary to understand or help the child so they avoid bonding and even dislike or resent the child. Therefore it would be easier for Gerry to come up with such a plan.

I feel that if it was just Kate alone, she would not have been together enough to come up with something like that. I think there are three possibilities on how this will end:

1. Kate and Gerry keep up their pretence of innocence until they die.

2. New evidence comes to light that they are guilty

3. Kate Mccann cracks under the strain of trying to live with what she's done and gives the game away.

As I said earlier, I don't know how any 'normal' person could live with the guilt of killing and burying their own child.



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 11:13 AM
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There are over 40 questions which Kate Mcann refused to answer during interrogation by police(according to the daily mail).

I know if a kid of mine went missing,I would tell the cops everything that I could,to give them the best chance of finding the child.
Why Kate chose not to answer,I do not know.

www.dailymail.co.uk...

The previously mentioned fridge is something that I had not heard before,and to me is very suspicious.
All mention of the fridge was removed from Gerrys blog,when portugese police gave them "arguido"(suspect) status.

uk.answers.yahoo.com...

Did they ever go looking for the fridge?
they should IMO.
Watch Gerry's body language in this clip:

www.youtube.com...
[edit on 16/1/2010 by Silcone Synapse]

[edit on 16/1/2010 by Silcone Synapse]



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 01:48 PM
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reply to post by unicorn1
 


The priest is another strange part of the jigsaw,it was reported that he was a completley different peson before he met the Mcanns.


Father Jose Pacheco who comforted Gerry and Kate McCann in the days after Madeleine vanished later claimed that he had been the victim of some form of deception.
The priest even ordered every trace of the Madeleine appeal removed from his church of Our Lady of the Light.
Friends of Jose Pacheco said he could no longer bear to discuss the case. “Even when his friends broach the subject he immediately changes it,” said one.
“He says it is an extremely unpleasant situation and the McCann family only ever brought him problems. “He even told one friend they ruined his life. “There are two completely different Pachecos, the one before the McCanns and this shell of a man after the McCanns. He is a nervous wreck.” What were the problems that forced Father Pacheco to become “a shell of a man” after the McCanns?

madeleinemccann.org...

Heres a couple of other things I find odd and disturbing:

As the dogs were searching the apartment,police noted Gerry driving past:


At around 10pm, police officers see Gerry McCann, going past the apartment at the wheel of his hire car, a Renault Mégane Scenic, an impenetrable look on his face.At around 10pm, police officers see Gerry McCann, going past the apartment at the wheel of his hire car, a Renault Mégane Scenic, an impenetrable look on his face.

goncaloamaraltruthofthelie.blogspot.com...

Heres something even more disturbing-One of the Tapas 9 was seen to be acting in a very disturbing matter,while refering to Madeline,and his own 1year old daughter:


Two or three days passed in Mallorca where we relaxed (Page 3) with our children. Possibly around the fourth or fifth day abroad, I remember an incident that stayed with me. I tell this in this way, and afterwards I have thought many times about the incident that I am about to describe.
One night, on holidays, the adults—the couple aforementioned—were on a patio on the side of the house were we lodged. We had been eating and drinking. I was seated between David and Gerry who were both speaking about Madeleine. I don’t remember the conversation in its entirety, but id did appear they were discussing a possible scenario. I remember David telling Gerry something like “she” (referring to Madeleine) “would she do this”. Upon mentioning “this”, David was sucking on one of his fingers, pushing it inside and outside his mouth, and with the other hand encircled his breast in a gyrating fashion over his shirt.
This was done in a provocative manner and carried an explicit insinuation in relation to what he was doing.
I remember that I was shocked at this, and looked at Gerry, and also at Dave, to gauge their reactions. I looked around (page 4) as is saying “did someone else hear that, or was it just me”. Silence registered in all the conversations and after, we all began conversing again.
I never spoke to anyone about this, but always felt that it was very strange and not something that should be discussed or said.
Besides this, I remember that David once again did the same thing. When I refer to this, I want to clarify that it was during a conversation in which he was talking about an imaginary situation. I do not know of what. I believe that he was talking about his own daughter, Lily, although I cannot be certain. He put one of his fingers in his mouth and slide it in and out, and with the other hand, drew a circle around his breast in a sexually provocative way.
I believe that he was referring to what Lily would do. I believe that he did this later, during the holidays, but I cannot be sure. The last time, besides this, when I was with David and Fiona was several weeks after the holidays, when Savio and I were at a restaurant with Gerry, Kate, Dave and Fiona.


KATHERINA ZACHARIAS GASPAR, alleged witness staement.
themaddiecasefiles.com...

One of their friends was not a good person to say the least,one could deduce from the above statement.
So many questions...
Iam going to watch the truth of the lie film now if YT is working for me.

[edit on 16/1/2010 by Silcone Synapse]



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 01:52 PM
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reply to post by Silcone Synapse
 


Is there any evidence abt them dumping a fridge? Its weird because there is a quote saying:

"Gonçalo Amaral: "Yes. The bodily fluid in the car shows that. If the body had been buried there would have been mummification. The fact that there were fluids points to refrigeration."

Also not sure what to make of this?

gerrymccan-abuseofpower-humanrights.blogspot.com...

IMO they are guilty, they killed her either through an accident via medication or on purpose...and as other members have said the safety net was provided to them for some reason....?

edit to add: the 48 questions that Kate wouldn't answer...seriously wtf...

[edit on 16-1-2010 by slinkey10]



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 02:06 PM
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reply to post by slinkey10
 


It does appear that they were very well connected.
On the fridge,all I know is Gerry mentioned taking it to the dump on his blog,then removed all reference to it once they were made arguidos.
Not sure if that is accurate though,its only according to that link.

Something else.On this page:

gerrymccan-abuseofpower-humanrights.blogspot.com...

If you scroll down approx 10-15% there is a link to a story about "Sea Bass"


Sean and the Sea Bass. Sean and the Sea Bass Sean subsequently developed a taste for Sea Bass which can produce cadaverine under some circumstances ...


Now,this link is 404 not found,and the google caches are not taking me to the link,or are non existant,which I find a bit odd...

"Cadaverine" is a chemical which is present in certain fish and other things,which is noxious,and the article may have been refering to some way the sniffer dogs could give a false positive maybe?


Cadaverine is a foul-smelling molecule produced by protein hydrolysis during putrefaction of animal tissue. Cadaverine is a toxic[1] diamine with the formula NH2(CH2)5NH2, which is similar to putrescine.

en.wikipedia.org...

Not sure who the "Sean" guy is though,or even if the story is relevent,just found it odd that it seems to have been wiped from the web.

Edit:Sean maybe Madelines younger brother???

[edit on 16/1/2010 by Silcone Synapse]



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 02:50 PM
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reply to post by Silcone Synapse
 


I get that 404 as well. Is GM referring to Sean one of their two-year-old twins.? A two year old who likes sea bass???

Funny how the investigative journalist(sic) Donal MacIntyre sticks his beak in....gerrymccan-abuseofpower-humanrights.blogspot.com...



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 03:34 PM
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reply to post by IamNow
 


Thank you for starting your very interesting thread, IamNow.

I'd not looked into the McCann case in such detail, despite my vague suspicions about the parents role in the child's disappearance.

Having reviewed all the material in this thread & having watched the video "The Truth of the Lie", I am now highly suspicious of the parents role in this.

One hopes this case will be properly investigated & the truth "comes out".

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 03:57 PM
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Originally posted by slinkey10
reply to post by Silcone Synapse
 


I get that 404 as well. Is GM referring to Sean one of their two-year-old twins.? A two year old who likes sea bass???

Funny how the investigative journalist(sic) Donal MacIntyre sticks his beak in....gerrymccan-abuseofpower-humanrights.blogspot.com...


Damned strange if it was their son who "developed a taste for sea bass".
Does not make sense.
Like a lot of this whole case.The more I read about it,the more it seems that there is some kind of coverup,sadly.
It appears that very influential people have at the highest levels,sought to hide evidence from the investigation,or to cover up and disregard other pieces of evidence.
Add to that Gerrys often Bizzare body language,the priest,and the Irish witness and it becomes a very strange coverup/reworking of the facts.
It does not add up.



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