The difference between the Christian God/religion and others

reply to post by moocowman


it is not arrogance but confidence..i can back up anything i say with scriptural evidence..i can also disprove any alternate translations with scriptural evidence..i wont say i have never been wrong on something..but i will quickly admit if i am..on all of this however i am not as it is basic stuff and easily found anywhere in the bible

reply to post by resonance

It is a fact that the bible is historically accurate,

Then please provide the evidence.

Here goes I'll give you a starter for 10, please provide corroborated factual evidence that over 2 million Hebrew slaves (600000 armed men) were held captive in Egypt escaped and spent 40 years wandering the desert.


And a nice easy one while were at it, please provide corroborated factual evidence that the earth is flat.

reply to post by resonance

i can also disprove any alternate translations with scriptural evidence..

Using bibles to validate themselves is not proving anything matey boy, your trying to prove batman is real because robin passed him in the mall.

reply to post by moocowman


the authors are not unknown in most all cases..the ideas that they are unknown is new and just an attempt to discredit the bible

i also did word that wrong..i didnt mean ONLY people who have matured in their walk with god (yes i said faith and i should have said walk, so excuse me)..

but for your facts you want..john 3:16 is one of the most famous verses...it clearly states that all you need is belief..also..the idea that the whole bible on the basic level is just about man's redemption is clear if you read it...it starts with our fall, we are saved by jesus, then in revelation the earth passes away a new heaven and new earth are formed and we spend eternity...its all about our souls and what happens to them..this is obvious in the bible so i guess i could use the whole thing as my reference?

but since you say i am mistaken please present your counter arguments as i have seen none but you telling me i am wrong and not backing it up at all..

reply to post by moocowman


read what i wrote..i said i can disprove alternate translations..which are matters of the bible..

reply to post by resonance

but since you say i am mistaken please present your counter arguments as i have seen none but you telling me i am wrong and not backing it up at all..

Please don't lie, I have not at any time told you you are wrong, I have clearly said that your interpretations of the bibles cannot be any more nor less valid than anyone else including me.

Again, in you're opening post you claim to present facts yet have still failed to provide any.

reply to post by moocowman


and again i did provide facts not sources...i encourage people to look at the things i said and go find out for themselves as that is the best way to learn as no one likes to listen to anyone or be told they are wrong..

[edit on 12-1-2010 by resonance]

reply to post by resonance

but for your facts you want..john 3:16 is one of the most famous verses...it clearly states that all you need is belief.

You have not provided factual corroborated evidence that this John even existed, so whatever a character in a book has to say is not proving anything.

Again, Robin telling Batman that DC comics are crap does not prove Batman to be a real fact or anything else contained in thes books.

.also..the idea that the whole bible on the basic level is just about man's redemption is clear if you read it.

That may or may not be a conclusion that I could reach, but again this would only be my opinion no more or less valid than anyone else, still no facts here my friend.

Originally posted by resonance
reply to post by moocowman

 

and again i did provide facts not sources...i encourage people to look at the things i said and go find out for themselves as that is the best way to learn as no one likes to listen to anyone or be told they are wrong..

[edit on 12-1-2010 by resonance]

No my friend, a fact without correlative evidence is merely an opinion.

Again, please provide the evidence that 2 million Hebrew people (600000 armed men) were held as captive slaves in Egypt, escaped and spent 40 years in the dessert.

what kind of god would make a "tree", place it in the garden of eden, and then tell humans to not eat from it?
That's pretty sadistic, "here is a "tree" that I know will kill you if you eat from it"

yhwh is a monster and blood thristy tyrant. What kind of god tells the old testament jews to wipe out civilizations, commanding them to kill every living thing in certain cities? Where's the love there?

[edit on 1/12/2010 by Dark Realms]

Originally posted by resonance
reply to post by moocowman

 

read what i wrote..i said i can disprove alternate translations..which are matters of the bible..

No ones asking you to disprove anything, I'm asking you to "prove" something ie the "facts" you claim to present to people that you don't try to force your belief upon.

Please provide these facts, I will still maintain you merely have opinions no more or less valid than my own but will extend you the courtesy of waiting till you present your facts.

reply to post by Dark Realms

what kind of god would make a "tree", place it in the garden of eden, and then tell humans to not eat from it?

An imaginary one

reply to post by moocowman


well..first history was not really recorded back then so evidence at all is hard to come by, also as they had their own gods they would not want to record an event like the jewish god demolishing their army..prophecy is used to show the validity of the bible and it is very accurate, for me this is all i need to believe what it says..but i will do some digging on the topic and get back to you as i havent worried with that one much..i promise i will answer this though so do not think i am dodging

While some religions main purpose is to explain the unexplainable

Lol, that's just some woo that atheists peddle to explain why almost everybody disagrees with them. Their other story is that belief in god comes from addiction to your own brain chemistry, which, in an amazing display of awesomeness, they have heroically overcome. If both of those fail, then there's always child abuse, for example, some adult mentions God in the earshot of a child.

That, I think, is one of the defining features of religion: if one story doesn't work out, then there's always another story, never an admission of fallibility. Handy attitude if you aspire to be a lawyer.

The Bible also claims to predict the future, which it does with startling accuracy. No other book or prophet on Earth has come close to the track record the Bible has for very specific accurate predictions.

Unfortunately, that's counter-woo. And, it doesn't distinguish Christianity. Check out Islamic claims about the anticipation of modern science in the Koran. Actually, what they say sounds a lot like your

The Bible also comments on many facts of life that were rediscovered in modern times as new, yet were written thousands of years ago. Examples being crop rotation, the Earth is not flat, bathe in running water, atoms, and the water cycle just to name a few.

Ancient people weren't morons. On many things, the chief difference between us and them is that we don't kill a goat before we plant our crops. Many of us don't, anyway.

You were on much firmer ground here:

The TRUE purpose of Christianity as the Bible teaches it is the redemption of mankind and helping to lead others to accept God's free gift of salvation.

That is hardly self-proving. Personally, I wouldn't concede that human beings have a "fallen nature" from which to be redeemed. I wouldn't concede that Jesus taught that people did, either. Paul, sure. He corrected Jesus' oversights, errors and omissions all the time.

BUT, it is a place to stand, and would differentiate your religion from others. (It also differentiates your religion from the majority of Nicene Christians, such as Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox, who teach that "God's free gift" is necessary, but not sufficient, for salvation. If that is what you intend, fine.)

because none of us do as he says and none of us deserve anything.

Yes, that's pretty much pure Paul.

Personally, I think Jesus founded the first "tenant's rights movement." If somebody builds a building, then it's theirs and theirs alone. They can do anything they want inside.

But, if they ever decide to rent out the building, then the leaseholders acquire rights, too. The owner can't just do whatever he likes in his building anymore. He has willingly taken on the obligation to respect his tenants, so long as they are his tenants.

Nobody denies whose building it is, and what a swell job the owner did in building it. But owning and building rental property does not imply that the tenants have no rights.

The building is the Universe, and Jesus' Dad is the landlord. Jesus is the tenant organizer. I think Jesus has a point. Paul is somebody who wandered in from the desert and turned the movement. Kind of a Jimmy Hoffa figure.

But, I see you and moocowman are engaged, so I'll just post this up and wait my turn.

reply to post by moocowman


you are choosing to not accept what im telling you...

first you wanted to know about why id claim that the bible states only belief is needed and that this is obvious..i give you john 3:16 which is really all you need but there are more verses..

now you want to question john's existence..ill address that too...while i do not know for certain that it was john the evangelist who was an apostle of jesus someone wrote this book..and since it was written within a lifetime of jesus' death and never questioned until modern times on who wrote it i will assume it was in fact john as there is no evidence to the valid evidence to the contrary..also since this book has been accepted for over 1000 years as being legit, and people lived much closer to the times it describes it is logical to assume they had good reason to believe this

and my main post was about the bible and what it says and the difference between its purpose and other religions purposes..

if you want to know about the bible's scientific statements here you go
rr-bb.com...
this provides scriptural reference

to explain that the bible is not a law book as lets say the quran with sharia law you have to read it...no where does it say you must live a certain way to spend eternity in heaven..

the book is different in that it predicts the future accurately...in the 70 weeks prophecy of daniel 9, jesus predicts the destruction of the temple in mark 13..

reply to post by eight bits

Unfortunately, that's counter-woo. And, it doesn't distinguish Christianity. Check out Islamic claims about the anticipation of modern science in the Koran. Actually, what they say sounds a lot like your

the quran was written much later than the bible and while i dont know of exactly what it says i will look in to it...however, the quran contradicts itself in many places..for instance they claim to believe in an all powerful god (since they say the believe in the god of the bible) yet that he cannot become human..they also say jesus was a great prophet, but he claimed to be god, and would therefore be a false prophet..i could name many more

Ancient people weren't morons. On many things, the chief difference between us and them is that we don't kill a goat before we plant our crops. Many of us don't, anyway.

You were on much firmer ground here:

in no way do i think they were morons...but its strange to me that the bible talks about many scientific things that were not known to be certain until much more modern times..like that circumcision should be on the 8th day..this happens to be when a clotting agent ( prothrombin ) is elevated to an abnormal height and is the only time this happens..

on your other statements...we needed a savior..in the law god handed man, debt had to be paid even after death..this was done by the son or another related person called the kinsman redeemer...no person was born without sin as sin was carried in the seed of men..we therefore could not pay our debt of death to god..that is why we needed the virgin birth, so a man could be born without sin, he would also have to not sin his entire life so as to be sinless and redeem us..this is what jesus did..this is why all you need is to accept that he paid your debt..no where in scripture does it say works are a necessity..

and man dont get me on roman catholics haha..they are idolatrous the way i see it..i mean i could interpret idolatry wrong but it looks that way to me..not saying im perfect i dont live right at all..

so you feel because of your admittance of being "christian" that the "debt" has been paid for you?

reply to post by Dark Realms


firstly read my other post about free will and why there would even be a tree that was forbidden..

yhwh is a monster and blood thristy tyrant. What kind of god tells the old testament jews to wipe out civilizations, commanding them to kill every living thing in certain cities? Where's the love there?

now i will address this..have you ever wondered why he told them to wipe out civilizations..i have and im glad you phrased it the way you did..yes they had to kill EVERY SINGLE BEING

now ill explain the nephilim..which are a huge part of really understanding the bible..

in genesis 6 it talks about the sons of god (Which are always angels, we are sons of men) having children with the daughters of men...this hybrid created a giant (also there are many giant skeletons found so go look it up) it also says these things were around after the flood but not in so great a number..for example goliath and his brothers..og of bashan..and other kings..

the whole reason for the flood was because of the mix breeding...the bloodline of the human race was being corrupted by lucifer and the fallen angels in an attempt to stop the messiah from being born..because if his blood was not purely human it would have redeemed the fallen angels and lucifer as well or just not redeemed humanity..the world was much smaller and the only family left with no tainted blood was noah's..as it says in the bible he was perfect in his generations..no was not a holy man he was a drunk, but the only pure blood left so he had to carry on the human race..

so why did god destroy those cities? they were cities of nephilim..in numbers 13 they even send scouts and it tells you that they saw giants and did not want to fight but were told the lord was with them so they did and conquered them..

so god was not merciless in doing this as they were not humans..you can do a study on the tribes and their names..the rephaim were a race of giants..some believe the tribes with IM endings were all nephilim descendants

reply to post by Ausar


no i believe that because i admit that i am a sinner and that i do need a savior..and that jesus' death paid the debt for my sins that i am saved because that is all god asks of you

this is another example of why christanity is different..it requires no religious ritual, church is not necessary, neither is works, although God does asks that you do them it does not get you in to heaven..yes in the old testament they did have to do sacrifices because they had no messiah yet so they had to wash their sins in the blood of lambs every year

and as i have said before..the bible is amazing in many aspects, and this makes it easy for me to believe things that have less proof than others..the prophecy, equidistant letter sequences that cannot be recreated even with computers, all 66 books work harmoniously with no contradictions, the fact that the god of the jews and christians has been around longer than any other, the science facts in the bible..all these things make it an amazing book..and since the lord says he will preserve his word i believe him, because most of these "books" were not written to be books, they were written as documents or letters and combined because they were the ones that were the most accepted and accurate as judged by people who lived back then..

if you want info on anything i just said tell me ill give it to you

many biblical facts are corroborated in some of the apocryphal books which while not considered divinely inspired are historically accurate..