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Age Restrictions needed on ATS

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posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 08:32 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid
Yes, I have been reading what you are saying but as pointed out, we can't assure anyones age. Secondly, the ATS staff does enforce the T&C, which makes ATS a family friendly site. We do the best we can to maintain decorum. The membership helps out too. Personally, I'd rather have my kids here than anywhere else.
Well, I was actually interested in ideas. Not so much, me saying what must be done. I don't think I have suggested anything. Yet.

And, I can't say how important, or not important it has been to ATS to monitor the age rules.
But, I can say that noonsauce13 is NOT the first, second, third, fourth, fifth... underage person that has come right out and admitted it in a thread.
And, although this site has it's share of harmless threads and members, I equate these types of forums with allowing a child to dial into a party line with adults, and discussions about mostly adult topics.



Originally posted by greeneyedleo
Fact is, nobody on this site has any clue how old a member is. Just because they say they are 14 does not mean they are 14. Most certainly can not judge content or quality of post for age.

And you, nor I, can judge what another person's child should or should not be doing nor what sites they should visit. Its all opinion and personal parenting. Period.
As I said before. I'm not posing any answers at this time. I wanted to hear what kind of answers the brilliant minds of ATS might come up with.

And, unfortunately, yes, we can judge what another person's child is doing and what sites they are visiting. Especially since there are laws about it, site rules about it, etc.
You see, they way I view things, for the last 30 or 40 years, society has been involved in a voluntary experiment, where we have all been living in the gray areas, where boundaries of right and wrong have been so blurred, that we have forgotten a simple fact: There REALLY is such a thing as "Right" and "Wrong".
I mean, Hell, if you don't feel comfortable with concepts of right and wrong, how about:
Logical and Illogical
Smart and Stupid
Positive and Negative
Constructive and Destructive
Helpful and Harmful
In a pinch, if used honestly, any one of those combinations can help a person figure out most dilemmas or even moral quandaries.
There is a right or wrong involved in this topic.



Originally posted by tothetenthpower
I dunno, my kids don't get "protected" from things like that. I expose them to whatever I think they are mature enough to understand. I mean obviously there are some things which I just won't subjec them to.

But nothing is hidden from them. Education is key, always has been.

~Keeper
There are a lot of things that children are just not equipped for. Physically, emotionally and experience-wise. They are undeveloped, and do not have the tools to process certain information or situation correctly.



Originally posted by Quantum_Squirrel
It is not up to ATS to modify its content ..

It is up to the parents to monitor what there children (of any age) are up to on the internet.

I certainly would not let my kids read half this stuff it would scare them to death
More than half this stuff scares more than half of the adults that read it.




Originally posted by infinite
I agree with the premise of this thread.

Especially regarding media input, some content is rather too graphic and grotesque for our younger members. A simple "WARNING!!" in the title will not do.
I agree.




posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 08:57 PM
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Originally posted by triplescorpio
I am a dad and agree as an ATSER this site is so cool and as of late the cooks are leading the young and causing a complete lack of factual ideas threads and lots of really wacked unfounded statements. There really needs to be some kind of filter applied to keep the young and obviously disconnected ones from being led astray its one thing to have imagination its another to try and convince a 12 year old that there government is out to get them.
You touched on my point exactly.



Originally posted by influx.destruction
I am 16 and I know that my dad encourages me to research everything. He does not know I am so interested in conspiracies but I am sure he wouldn't object. the OP is right by saying that some parents might not want their children to visit these forums but if the children are intelligent enough to see through media lies then I think they are emotionally strong enough. I first learnt about the NWO when I was 14, it was a shock and I told many of my mates. I have convinced about 20 people that the World Governments are in fact pushing a different agenda so therefore I think that these forums are a form of alternative education.
You seem to understand that not all children are going to be intelligent or strong enough to handle this information safely, and that there are parents that wouldn't want their children on this site. I am sure this is from experience, or the experience of a friend.
And, I'm sorry, but even experienced, conspiracy-savvy adults have to sniff their way through the mazes of craziness, lies and disinformation of topics like NWO.
A 14 year old has no business getting brainwashed by either camp, whether it is the pro-NWO or con-NWO.
Your brain isn't even finished developing physically at 14 years old! It's a fact.
I'm sorry for you buddy.



Originally posted by Remixtup

Now, my 7 year old has already experienced a ban on another site. It was for just 24 hours, and he understands what he did that was wrong (language) - and over all, was a great learning experience.



7 Years old and banned on a forum for "language"?
Seems like you ought to get off ats and get your kid off the computer and go play legos ffs
How can you people look at this exchange, and not understand just how bad things are?
Am I out of line?
It's not our responsibility?
Turn a blind eye?

Cowards and Imbeciles! Your disease it what is KILLING our lives.

There was a time when right and wrong was passed down, from parent to child, and on, and on. And, for the most part, it worked.

And, the people that understood right and wrong, would get involved when they needed to. And, if the concern was for children, the answers became easier.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 09:00 PM
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Originally posted by mamabeth

I was vegetating,mentally and physically,in front of my television.This
box would be on for hours with mindless shows entering my brain.

.
This describes lots of people.
I don't say much here, but I visit ATS almost daily, and have for several years.
We had no computer when my daughter was growing up. Now, with 2 grandkids, I would prefer that they were here ( At least the older 12 year old) instead of watching TV. They don't really get excited about anything unless they see it on Nickelodeon or the Disney Channel. If the choice is parking the kids in front of ATS or a TV, ATS would win hands down. So far neither of them wants to do much with a computer except play games, but things will change.
Yes, there are dangerous people and ideas online, (even here at ATS ) but they ( the ideas ) are the same ones that are around you daily and on almost all 298 TV channels most of us pay for via Cable or Satelite.
When I was learning to drive (1968) it never occured to me that I could ever write something that anyone on the other side of the world could read as soon as I wrote it. The technology I have seen in my 57 years is simply amazing! No, lets not censor ATS. Lets not put Age Limits on joining or reading either.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 09:08 PM
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Originally posted by moocowman
reply to post by mamabeth
So M after 50 years of being an (fill in blank) what possessed you to become an xtian ?
How did you go about critically evaluating the bibles for authenticity and truth ?

Have you met or spoken with jesus ? ( the one commonly referred to by most pastors and such)

Were you happy before you became an chrisitian ?

If not, why do you feel that you could not achieve happiness without xtianity ?

What type of xtian are you ?
I guess Jesus had you jump right into your usual compulsive anti-Christian dogma in the middle of this thread for a purpose.

Your obsession with debasing Christians and all things Christian is a perfect example of the type of exchange that I believe to be harmful, especially if a child is exposed to it.
I have read your words before, and let me tell you this: NOBODY needs to have their beliefs chipped away at, or end up questioning what, to some, is the only comfort they may have found in today's world.
Especially, a child.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 09:47 PM
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OK Folks. Let's not stray too far from the Topic.


And please address the post and Not the poster .



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 10:04 PM
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Are you reffering to me?


An age limit? For truth?


And if your reffering to spirituality, or quantum physics, and the new discovery that they are very much coupled, you should not be telling people what to believe. Growth is inevitable, and yes there are people that want to keep the mind set the same, but it always inevitbly changes.

No matter anyways, I would just make a new account and say I'm a year older. Reasons for me putting my age is so people get a better image of me. trust me, if i were to just keep talking and not describe who i was if it was a signifigate part of the thread, it might change the oppinion.

[edit on 6-1-2010 by gandhi]

[edit on 6-1-2010 by gandhi]



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 10:07 PM
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Originally posted by americandingbat
Understood. But it's worth considering how helpful to the rest of us it can be to be exposed to the thoughts and experiences of the younger members. Keeping younger members off the site would not only "protect" them from us, it would "protect" us from them. Not sure that that's a good idea -- as a parent, wouldn't you rather have the insight into what it's like to be a teenager today that you can get from their contributions, especially since ATS members tend by and large to be more self-aware and willing to face issues head-on than average?
I'm sorry, but I am not worried about taking the thoughts and experiences of children away from you adults. But, kudos on trying to make that sound normal and flowery.
Reading about a child's fear of being haunted, or new found belief that they have super powers, or wondering how many times they have been abducted by aliens, and then watching as an adult ATS member enables this, reinforces it and adds their own madness and views to the mix, is not my idea of gaining "insight" into anything that will help a teenager or anybody.
And, I AM facing an issue head on.



As a couple of the mods who have posted have said -- by all means use the alert button if you see something inappropriate. I know that I used it once, in a thread where a young-sounding member with some concerns about feeling dissociated received a reply recommending the use of hallucinogens. The issue was dealt with very promptly, with the result that the thread as a whole stood but the drug references were removed. As is often the case in such threads, a lot of the information that was posted was exactly the kind of thing that I would want a kid to see -- people posting their ability to identify with the issue. It's easy to focus on the relatively few "unsafe" posters, but most threads here provide a variety of reactions -- including responses from people who have had similar issues and found help online or through talking to parents, friends, spiritual advisors, therapists, or elsewhere.
I'm not sure how to respond to you without absolutely crushing you. But I will try. Regardless of how you claim to have handled a situation, and the wonderful results that ensued, the young-sounding user still aired their laundrey in a thread, and they still received an unhealthy answer. And, who knows what kind of U2U traffic went on.
Also, while you are sources this specific incident, I am still responding to the MANY incidents. And, if you haven't been in here long enough, or if you haven't viewed a wide-enough spectrum of threads to have seen more, there is nothing I can do about that. But, make no mistake, you can believe me and the other members that have agreed with me... it is happening all the time.
And, I'm sorry, but a page full of responses from 20 members, advising help from a range of sources from shamans, to somebody's mom that practices Reiki part-time, to psychiatrists, allowing alien-Gods into their minds, to priests, to frickin' comic books, is not what I consider "Helping a Child".
And, I have seen ALL of these in here.



So much of life has a component of fear. At least here you also get the "anti-fear" voices.
"anti-fear"? What are you talking about?! Are you really that disconnected?
First of all, most of this site RUNS ON FEAR. It is a self-professed "Conspiracy Forum". Conspiracy, being the operative term.
Let me help:
con·spir·a·cy (kn-spîr-s)
n. pl. con·spir·a·cies
1. An agreement to perform together an illegal, wrongful, or subversive act.
2. A group of conspirators.
3. Law An agreement between two or more persons to commit a crime or accomplish a legal purpose through illegal action.
4. A joining or acting together, as if by sinister design: a conspiracy of wind and tide that devastated coastal areas.
Hey! That sounds SCARY!

See? That doesn't sound like something that a child should be around.



So what would you suggest?
I am suggesting nothing yet. I am listening.



And, for the sake of conversation, let's all agree that, for the most part, an over 18 restriction isn't stopping anybody that has decided to come in here.
And, it will cost too much money to get rid of all the illegal aliens, and it is too difficult to prosecute wealthy criminals, and it is too much trouble to monitor all the hallways in crime-ridden schools.



But as you point out, isn't that a matter for the children and their parents to decide, not for hundreds of online babysitters?
Kudos for taking that out of context.
What I said was

The amount of doom and gloom and fear, that is present in the world today, to say nothing of the way a site like this can literally "funnel" all of it directly into a young mind, with no filters or guidance, has never, in the history of our planet, existed before.
There is no way to say that it is good for a kid.
Focusing on the potential for HARM in here.
THEN I said

And, if it is EVER decided to be so, that should be made by a parent. Not by hundreds of online forum "babysitters".
Meaning, that if it is ever decided that the potentially HARMFUL exposure a child can receive in here, is decided to be OK, THAT decision should be made by parents. In other words, maybe a release or waiver from parents for the kids to be members of the site.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 10:19 PM
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reply to post by LASTofTheV8s
 


My Mrs. Lovejoy ... you do take the "oh won't somebody think of the children" complex to the extreme ... combined with a rather intense and probably unhealthy "control" obsession, a preponderance for judgmental knowitallsm, superiority, and intransigence.

You must be a hoot at thanksgiving.


It seems to me that YOU are way more negatively affected by being on ATS than any young member I have ever observed ... perhaps this whole thing is you projecting.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 10:50 PM
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reply to post by americandingbat
 




The internet is an "Unnatural" ingredient in life today. And, to some extent, it invades all of our lives. But, it is also an Unnatural Ingredient in the raising of our children.


Am I hearing fear?
Yeah! You really touched on a sensitive spot!
I think you are just enjoying the opportunity to take up a "pie-in-the-sky", "everything's fine" position against, what you probably, and incorrectly perceive as a conservative, rule-creating opponent.
I'm not sure, but you may literally be the Living Embodiment of what is wrong with the world today. How cool.



I have trouble with the idea that the internet is "unnatural" -- it is a means for people to communicate. Nothing is more human (and natural) than communication. Like it or not, networks are a part of life today. Kids will be exposed to online communication -- including some difficult, scary, or misleading information. Isn't it better to have them exposed to the "crazies" here where there is a strong, diverse, and generally responsible community of contributors who will speak up if they see something going wrong?
I'm afraid you are losing credibility with every sentence. OK. So, now the internet is a natural extension of basic human communication. Sure. It's totally natural.
You continuously pump the responsibility and quality of this community that are continuously speaking up when they see wrongs being done.
At this point, you are just full of crap.
And, I will freely admit that YOU scare me. If I found out my child had been communicating with somebody like you, at a time where they were troubled, vulnerable and open to outside influences, I would be terrified.
You are the kind of person that enjoys being a "Champion of Light" or some such nonsense, in your mind. You are packed full of "agenda", and a serious need to see yourself stick up for, what you perceive as "freedoms" and all things good.
Even when you are wrong.





Having a child or young person, exposed to hundreds of different people and their views, is a terrifying prospect under the best of circumstances. There is nothing normal or healthy about it.


Here I totally disagree. Yes, I'm sure it's terrifying. But I don't see why it should be abnormal or unhealthy. Parents can (and should) help their kids puzzle through all the information they are exposed to. But much of what people (adults as well as kids) are exposed to here is actually the process of puzzling through. Being exposed to this may help kids develop the mental tools that they need to live in an information-overload world.
Again, you are just arguing to argue.
You write that "Parents can (and should) help their kids puzzle through all the information they are exposed to. But much of what people (adults as well as kids) are exposed to here is actually the process of puzzling through."
No Sh**!
How does that negate what I said? Again, you are just writing... "things".
If a kid comes into a thread and announces that they are constantly thinking about how cool it would be if they were dead, or how they are seeing things, obviously there isn't a parent around to help him see the "beauty" and "understanding" of the forum members.




Now, take those same hundreds of people, and consider that they are not taking into consideration that their are young members viewing their posts.


If they're not abiding by the terms and conditions of the website, then they should be reported. If they are, then the worst thing that happens is kids find out that people believe different things.
Did you really write this?: If they are, then the worst thing that happens is kids find out that people believe different things.
You have no idea what you are talking about, and I am not wasting anymore time with you. You really have no business involved in this thread. And, you should take your unrealistic views to a topic that does not involve children.

 
Mod Edit: Please Review the Following Link: Courtesy Is Mandatory



[edit on Wed Jan 6 2010 by Jbird]



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 10:51 PM
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reply to post by LASTofTheV8s
 



to say nothing of the way a site like this can literally "funnel" all of it directly into a young mind, with no filters or guidance, has never, in the history of our planet, existed before.


I'd contend that the first sentence chiseled into a stone tablet or painted on a cave wall was the original "funnel" and the reader , young or old from then on had to decide how much of that content to catch.

In my experience young adults/teens deserve more credit than you seem to be giving them in knowing
what is worthy (of investigation) and what is backwash.

You've even had first hand testimony attest to that right in this thread.


Surely you're not trying to police the interwebs single handedly?
Yikes



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 11:07 PM
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reply to post by LASTofTheV8s
 


It wouldn't be a problem if ATS members (the majority being adults) excercised restraint and practiced self examination before they pressed the reply button.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by Kailassa
Exactly, the decision about what your kid sees should be made by you, not by "forum babysitters".
Yet you seem to be looking for some change in this forum that would allow you to trust it to be more appropriate for children, rather than being prepared to monitor your children's involvement yourself.
This has nothing to do with my kid. You should read my posts before mumbling yourself into negation.



It is not "Censorship". I am talking about filtering what these kids are exposed to. If that outrages you, you are kind of proving my point, as to how bad we need to do it.
In some cases, parents and the kids may not know what is best for them.

Filtering, censorship ... exactly the same thing. Weasel words don't change facts.
Again, try the "reading thing" before you go ahead and insinuate that somebody is a weasel.
What I wrote was "I am talking about filtering what these kids are exposed to." I stated no specific plan, or angle. In a general way, I mentioned "filtering" as a way to control what the kids, people who aren't even supposed to be on the site, are exposed to.



Assuming that you know better than another parent what is best for THEIR child is fat-headed nonsense. Your ego is really bursting through here.
My kids, like Whaaa's have grown up free to access whatever information they want. Kids bought up with love, respect, good examples from their parents and able to talk to their parents about everything can usually handle freedom fine.
"grown up free to access whatever information they want. " Well, at this point, I'm pretty sure most of us agree that I know better than you do.



Well you did say that ATS was bad for children and that an over 18 agreement won't keep them out, so what is it you want?
If you want the type of censorship known of as filtering, just move to Australia or China, and the government will make your your precious little ones don't see anything nasty.
As I said, I am not worried about my children. I am worried about the children of people like you.



I would expect the parent to be the "mature adult" who is there to give your child advice and input.
But you have proved your immaturity by jumping to conclusions, so I'm starting to think it would be a "Holy Crap!" situation if your children only have you to guide them.
No wonder you want to shift off parental responsibilities by pushing for censorship of this forum.
I am holding back right now, as anybody who has ever read some of my posts can tell you.
You have been insinuating, over and over, that this is about my child, and you have brought my child into this over and over. For some reason you have tried to make this personal. And, the only reason there can be for this, is that you are feeling threatened, or that your failures and shortcomings are popping up in your mind.
So, you feel it is ok for you to bring my child into this.
You also have no business in this thread. Although, you also have helped to prove my point. I can't possibly see what you would have to offer any kid that is looking for sane, solid, healthy answers to a problem.
This thread was made hoping that some logical, decent, open-minded people with the ability to communicating without attacking, could actually throw some ideas around in a positive way.

Not for people to vent because they feel threatened.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 11:18 PM
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Originally posted by xynephadyn
I completely agree. We need to BAN all children from posting on our forums. I am beyond sick and tired of reading teenagers threads selling us a line of BS. Most dont take it seriously.

Make a Teenager Forum for goodness sakes. I think we all would be MUCH HAPPIER.
I think this is an awesome idea. It could, at least, be a start.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 11:22 PM
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Don't worry too much about crushing me


I'm not going to bother going through our whole exchange and continuing it, because I think it's pretty obvious that we just don't see things the same way.

For what it's worth (and I know I mentioned this, even if it got missed), I share your concern that some of the kids who post here with their concerns are doing so because they don't have adequate guidance and support at home. I just don't agree with you that this is such a bad place for that to happen.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 11:33 PM
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Originally posted by gandhi
And if your reffering to spirituality, or quantum physics, and the new discovery that they are very much coupled
If you were OLDER you would know that this is nothing NEW in the least!




You should not be telling people what to believe.
I am not telling anybody what to believe, but I am saying that there are dangers connected with believing things when they are being served to a person by anonymous sources they no nothing about. But, hey, if you feel better if you argue with that, you go right ahead.



Growth is inevitable, and yes there are people that want to keep the mind set the same, but it always inevitbly changes.
There is healthy, controlled growth as guided by experienced, trusted sources, and then there is hurried, irresponsible flooding of information and direction from bogus sources.


[quote[No matter anyways, I would just make a new account and say I'm a year older. Reasons for me putting my age is so people get a better image of me. trust me, if i were to just keep talking and not describe who i was if it was a signifigate part of the thread, it might change the oppinion. No. You can trust me. Nothing you can do would change my opinion of you. And, thank you for freely admitting your lack of respect for authority or the decisions of adults that definitely know better than you.
Unfortunately, you were never taught that what you just described is wrong.
It isn't cool.
It isn't smart.
It isn't honorable.
But, you don't understand what I'm saying.

[edit on 6-1-2010 by gandhi]

[edit on 6-1-2010 by gandhi]



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 11:37 PM
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Originally posted by schrodingers dog
reply to post by LASTofTheV8s
 


My Mrs. Lovejoy ... you do take the "oh won't somebody think of the children" complex to the extreme ... combined with a rather intense and probably unhealthy "control" obsession, a preponderance for judgmental knowitallsm, superiority, and intransigence.

You must be a hoot at thanksgiving.


It seems to me that YOU are way more negatively affected by being on ATS than any young member I have ever observed ... perhaps this whole thing is you projecting.
Perhaps you are an idiot with a dictionary in his lap, and I am an ATS member that is sick of seeing posts where kids are showing signs of SERIOUS problems, in a forum that they are not even supposed to be, and watching them get 3 pages of "crazy" in response.
Why don't you go "project" that.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 11:48 PM
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Originally posted by MirrorImage
reply to post by LASTofTheV8s
 



to say nothing of the way a site like this can literally "funnel" all of it directly into a young mind, with no filters or guidance, has never, in the history of our planet, existed before.


I'd contend that the first sentence chiseled into a stone tablet or painted on a cave wall was the original "funnel" and the reader , young or old from then on had to decide how much of that content to catch.

In my experience young adults/teens deserve more credit than you seem to be giving them in knowing
what is worthy (of investigation) and what is backwash.

You've even had first hand testimony attest to that right in this thread.


Surely you're not trying to police the interwebs single handedly?
Yikes
First hand testimony? Are you talking about the kids that are bragging about being here by breaking the rules, or the ones admitting that parents wouldn't want their kids here, or the one that admitted that a kid should only be here if they are strong and intelligent enough?
Hmmmm. Which of these very wise souls are we going to use to argue your point? Which of these individuals are going to be your proof that it is ok for a kid to have piles of adults teaching them to shape-shift, while their parents are getting divorced, or the kid that is building a little arsenal because he has been convinced that there will be an alien invasion within a few months?
Seriously? Do you people really want to do this with me?
Instead of offering some ideas?
Well, obviously the mods are ok with it, so feel free to continue. But, I'm not going to argue the same points over and over.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 11:49 PM
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Originally posted by LASTofTheV8s

Perhaps you are an idiot with a dictionary in his lap ...


lol, that's actually pretty funny, that's going in my signature.



and I am an ATS member that is sick of seeing posts where kids are showing signs of SERIOUS problems, in a forum that they are not even supposed to be, and watching them get 3 pages of "crazy" ...


Hey, how do you think we feel ... we've been watching you do that for 4 pages.



posted on Jan, 6 2010 @ 11:50 PM
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Originally posted by EMPIRE
reply to post by LASTofTheV8s
 


It wouldn't be a problem if ATS members (the majority being adults) excercised restraint and practiced self examination before they pressed the reply button.
Thank you.
You see, this was something I was thinking about also. But, I'm not sure all the members are ABLE to do that.



posted on Jan, 7 2010 @ 12:02 AM
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reply to post by LASTofTheV8s
 


Sadly they aren't.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

In that thread I clearly outlined the problem. The problem isn't censorship by the mods and admins, rather, it is tha lack of self imposed censorship by the user. People need to question their motivations as to why they are posting, and if they don't...well...you get what you get.



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