Only one percent of the Holocaust claims can be proven - Says Holocaust Scholar and Expert

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posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 01:54 AM
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reply to post by Dark Ghost
 





There are a multitude of documents that suggest there were plans for the systematic murder of certain minorities in countries under Nazi rule.


No there are not. There is evidence for the existence of concentration camps and deportation, not for the so called death camps, gas chambers and number of deaths, that's a big difference.




posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 02:11 AM
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Originally posted by D377MC




6 million figure is pre ww2


Sort of. Lets have a look at where the figure of 6 million comes from.




then look at this article (?)

its one article , i think there is a notice aswell from a larger paper

an atrocity is an atrocity, im not arguing for or against that ,



posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 04:51 AM
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I think it`s pretty clear, from what many historical accounts teach us that the Jewish holocaust, (because there have been many, and saying THE holocaust somehow infers it`s a special one.) did happen... many died my guess would be about 2 million at most probably half or slightly more jewish, in labor camps.

However, was the original intent to commit genocide? I don`t think so, it`s pretty clear that "The final solution" was a program of deportation.
And the deportees were refused by many countries and ended up back in Germany.

Now let`s assume you have a class of people despised by a nation, whether justly or not for treason,(american entry into WW1 and the british guarantee of palestine to zionist jews.) that you try to get rid of through relocation and deportation but cannot. What do you do???

Probably, intern them and use them to further State goals.(Slave Labor)

Then you see you`re losing the war, would resources go to keep the slaves alive and productive, or be used to keep your army going?

Does imprisoning people as slaves dehumanize the master as much as the slave? leading to extreme brutality?

Would you, if walking into a labor camp where people are starving and dying assume it`s genocide? It would seem to be the obvious answer. Until you realize, that the captors had little, or no resources at the point the camps were liberated.

Now if you really want a class of people dead, is starvation, gassing(which is probably a myth) and shooting very efficient? Shooting yes, but enmasse before the war started in 1939, the nazis had 6 years to exterminate with 0 opposition if that was really the plan. And I`ve never heard of jews being killed untill well into the war. (Please tell me if I`m wrong on this point.)

It just seems to me, by asking yourself some basic questions with simple answers. The only conclusion is that the Jewish holocaust is partly fact, partly misinterpretation, and partly propaganda used to justify a war(and a future state) that the allies really had no buisness in whatsoever because it is pretty clear WW2 was provoked by poland.

In conclusion.. did it happen? Yes. Is it greatly exaggerated to enrich (not just money) a certain class of people? Most likely.

Just my 2 cents. By the way, Im fervently Anti-racist, so innately Anti-zionist. And American to boot. So before I`m called a nazi a german or Anti-semitie take that into consideration.

And please have enough sense to not use a grandparents` tatoo as proof of anything these facts are not in dispute. Internment/labor camps did happen.. intentional death camps is quite a stretch, and a majority of the deaths can be rightly blamed on the war against Germany.



posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 08:20 AM
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“Nothing printed on any piece of paper can alter what happened.”

Sublime! Now we’re talking. Although on second thoughts you were screaming ‘millions of documents everywhere’ in an attempt to make it seem you had something of importance to contribute and justify your six figure salary. Which is it? And where are they?

Such a delightful sentence Michael! So many angles... I’ll leave those of you who may meditate on that sentence for a few minutes; I don’t want to get too philosophical.
The rest is a stubborn repetition of the old litanies, central tenets of your fanatical fantasy, without even the appearance of engaging the theses or issues. Typical mainstream ’holocaustianity’.

And the world plays along, funding this and funding that. Germany is constantly demonstrating it’s eternal guilt and shame by periodically handing over rather large sums of money, they are on a ‘drip’ if you can picture that, a couple of dolphin class submarines quite recently if I remember correctly. Heard some whining about a couple of frigates just last fall, I daresay you’ll get them soon…

There exists in Israel an official organization, Amcha, which takes care of Holocaust survivors. According to this source, there were between 834,000 and 960,000 survivors world-wide in 1997. Amcha defines a Holocaust survivor as follows:

“A Holocaust survivor will be defined as any Jew who lived in a country at the time when it was: – under Nazi regime; – under Nazi occupation; – under regime of Nazi collaborators as well as any Jew who fled due to the above regime or occupation.”

That’s a rather generous definition. It automatically makes Jews who emigrated from Germany between 1933 and the beginning of the mass deportations in 1941, survivors, as it does all those who fled to the east before the advancing German army.

In that way, you maximize the number of survivors; that may be profitable if you claim compensation for them. It’s always interesting to see such creativity in all things financial.

In 1998, one year after these figures were published by Amcha, there was a statement by Rolf Bloch, the Jewish head of the Swiss Holocaust Fund.
This organization was negotiating compensation for Jewish Holocaust survivors to be paid by Swiss banks, and Bloch claimed that there were still more than 1,000,000 such survivors, and in 2000, the office of the Israeli Prime Minister again reported that there were still more than 1 million.

Well isn’t that surprising… even the survivors just keep growing in numbers...




[edit on 11-1-2010 by D377MC]

[edit on 11-1-2010 by D377MC]

[edit on 11-1-2010 by D377MC]



posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 11:07 AM
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Originally posted by Monts
I have often wondered how much is written and known about the holocaust was actually true. In my mind, I think it would be pretty easy to fake/grossly exaggerate the numbers of people who were killed.

However, ask any WW2 vet who liberated any of those death camps, and they will tell you that they were definitely death camps.


It was the soviet army that liberated Austwitz and by all accounts their treatment of the survivors wasn't exactly heroic.
In fact the gas/murder vans were first used in the 1930s by stalins mob of maniacs on their victims.



posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 12:18 PM
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Hey all,

In short, here's why everyone questions the Holocaust.

World: Hey Israel, why the war crimes?

Israel: The Holocaust!



posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 12:25 PM
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reply to post by ProWrestler_Joe
 


And it continues like this....

World: "Holocaust?"
Israel: "You're a Nazi!!!"

[edit on 11-1-2010 by Regenstorm]



posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 01:03 PM
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Gentile: You know, I've been reading extensively on the Holocaust, and I have a few questions. Some things just aren't adding up according to my logic and common sense.

Jew: You RACIST ANTI-SEMITIC SCUM why how DARE you, you HITLER loving NAZI LOW-LIFE CRIMINAL genociding FILTH.





[edit on 11-1-2010 by ProWrestler_Joe]



posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 04:58 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Jan, 11 2010 @ 05:10 PM
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post removed because the user has no concept of manners

Click here for more information.



posted on Jan, 12 2010 @ 11:24 AM
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excellent dramatization, ProWrestler_Joe and Regenstorm!

but, in fact, it is more like a documentary than a made-for-TV-drama miniseries!

if anyone feels that it's not an accurate representation of what REALLY goes on...just read this entire thread!
take notes of WHO says WHAT and also HOW it is said!




posted on Jan, 12 2010 @ 12:27 PM
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A star for ProWestler and Regenstorm. Excellent presentation. This is how it is used to go all over the world, or even here at ATS.



posted on Jan, 12 2010 @ 04:30 PM
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I always here all this talk about the halocoust. Now i dont deny it happened but i think it was blown way out of proportion for sympathy towards the zionist jews. How come nobody talks about the 100 million native americans thats were killed by white men



posted on Jan, 12 2010 @ 09:55 PM
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Originally posted by truthseeker1445How come nobody talks about the 100 million native americans thats were killed by white men


or the Jew responsible for over 10 million murders in the former Soviet Union.



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 02:01 AM
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So what are people who acually had family members executed in a death camps supposed to think of all this?

their family members are secretly alive, hiding somewhere to protect a POINTLESS secret?



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 05:08 AM
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Originally posted by Mikeyy
So what are people who acually had family members executed in a death camps supposed to think of all this?

their family members are secretly alive, hiding somewhere to protect a POINTLESS secret?


I don`t think anyone has SERIOUSLY suggested, that absolutely ZERO people were executed, If you just pulled a rough number out of the air...

400,000 executed, multipled by the average number of relatives surviving to tell the story equals a fairly large pool of horrible stories to tell.

And that`s the largest problem when people bring it up someone`s feelings get hurt, but it`s getting to the point in history where we need to look at it and wonder if it isn`t being used, exaggeterated, or "spun" to serve ruling interest, as most things are, to mostly enrich a certain group of people, wherever all these german payments go to....who knows?

Alot of people die in wars, that is usually the point. Alot of soldiers died on everyones` side. Should the families or special interest race/class blocs get payed for them too?

How many generations should germany`s children pay taxes, for the sins of their parents?



[edit on 13-1-2010 by Mykey420]



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 06:11 AM
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reply to post by Mikeyy
 


their family members are secretly alive, hiding somewhere to protect a POINTLESS secret?


Most of the Jewish changed their names under WW2. This is their secret. Many of them never died, but they've changed their family names from Jewish to something native of that country. This is how they "disappeared" in Hungary for example. This is how they "disappeared" in my home country.

[edit on 13-1-2010 by Sharrow]



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 08:42 AM
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The sad part is that people are willing to entertain the notion of a small group of people controlling the vast majority being so called, Illuminati; however, when presented with undeniable truth that those small group of people are Zionists, people are instantly repelled. It's safe to say Zionism has done a fine job in cloaking behind equality; it is perfectly acceptable to entertain the notion of a small minority controlling the vast majority just as long as that small minority is not of any particular race. The irony of it all is that, in the face equality, the slaves defend the captors. And thus, Zionism has proven to be untouchable. In the world, one can question government, leadership, and God, but dare not question Zionism.



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 09:38 AM
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reply to post by ProWrestler_Joe
 


Even if you claim that the secret rulers are lizards you're an anti-Semite.

Google Video Link



posted on Jan, 13 2010 @ 09:43 AM
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Originally posted by ProWrestler_Joe
In the world, one can question government, leadership, and God, but dare not question Zionism.


Seriously? I don't think you have to do a whole lot of digging to find not only questioning, but some serious criticism. And some of that criticism will be from Israelis, and Jews in general.

Criticize almost anything, Christianity, atheism, Islam, conservatives, liberals, Australians, the Chicago Bears... there'll be pushback. So if your point is, it's not possible to question or criticize anything and have everyone agree, then yes I agree with that.

There are honest questions. There are questions with no intent to find an answer, but to push an agenda (push-polling, as it were). There's honest criticism meant to stimulate a discussion and seek the truth. And whenever and wherever a discussion occurs, there'll be someone on the other side of it.

So if you're looking to question or criticize anything, especially where there's a significant emotional attachment, then yes you'll get pushback. Anyone afraid of the pushback, I guess, shouldn't "dare" to question.





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