Only one percent of the Holocaust claims can be proven - Says Holocaust Scholar and Expert

Originally posted by ziggystrange

Originally posted by ancient_wisdom
not to go off topic, but what is also interesting, is that Hitler was supposedly the leader of the Blond Hair, blue eyed Aryan race, yet Hitler has brown hair. Although he has blue eyes, he clearly has brown hair and only medium height. There are also sources that say Hitler was half Jewish. (www.discussanything.com... www.straightdope.com...)

So, the leader of the Supreme Aryan Race is only half-Aryan and half-Jewish. Sounds like the German people got hijacked like every other political race. Any surprise?

I never knew that!!!!!!!!!!!!

Did you know he was an artist? Go find that one and come and break the news to us.

Nobody here knew he was half Jew, that must be why he killed himself.

I always though he was a blond guy, you are like an encyclopaedia, what was you IQ again?

What else do you know that's smart like secret stuff?

I know lots of smart, secret stuff. Pay attention and maybe you'll find out a thing or two.

And yes I did know he was an artist.

[edit on 6-1-2010 by ancient_wisdom]

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by Sharrow

 

But look around Sharrow. Everyone here you're talking to pretty much disagrees with you. When you make a point and fail to convince people, you've lost. when you've made points that lost, and continue to say those points, unable to respond to points your responders say, you've epically failed and lost. This is the law of the internet. You may respond, or take your leave.

actually, I am on Sharrow's side.

reply to post by Sharrow


But it's not annoying me at all. It's amusing to me to watch you squirm and not answer me. I'm here playing left 4 dead 2 and drawing. The hell do I care what you say to try and evade me? I'll just keep saying the same thing. respond to my points or lea.... oh, you already did leave. Well then, you've shown your answer. You have run rather then answer my points. clap clap clap.

reply to post by ancient_wisdom


Then do him the favor of answering my points way back a few pages.


Also, saying you know secret stuff and not saying what it is is pretty lame.
[edit on 6-1-2010 by Gorman91]

[edit on 6-1-2010 by Gorman91]

reply to post by Gorman91


what prompted me to say I have secrets is even more lame (Originally posted by ziggystrange
What else do you know that's smart like secret stuff?)

What was the question you wanted me to answer?

[edit on 6-1-2010 by ancient_wisdom]

[edit on 6-1-2010 by ancient_wisdom]

reply to post by Sharrow


At the current German birthrate in 50 years or less Germany will be a Muslim Arab country. In a hundred years there would hardly be any native Germans left.

At 1.37, Germany's birth rate, or the average number of children a woman bears, remains one of the lowest in the European Union and compares with 1.7 in Finland and 1.9 in France, said sociologist Hans Bertram, at the news conference.

[edit on 6-1-2010 by RRokkyy]

reply to post by ancient_wisdom


meh, anything really. What makes you think the holocaust did not happen?

POLITE MOD REQUEST

Hi People,

Well - seems this thread has descended into a few pages which could effectively be reduced to:
"Na-ah, you are!"
"Na-ah, YOU are!"
"No...YOU are!"
"No...YOU are!"


...sticking to the topic at hand would be great.

I do appreciate that calling for responses is certainly part of the essence of discussion...but when it becomes the SOLE discussion, well, its pretty much flogging the proverbial deceased Equine...


Cheers,
ALIEN

reply to post by Gorman91


check out these videos:

www.holocaustdenialvideos.com...

There is a lot of evidence that original Holocaust stories are now admitted hoaxes. There were storied that Jews were electrified, shrunken heads, Jewish skin used to make soap. All of these have been proven to be not part of the official holocaust story.

And yet they call skeptics the holocaust revisionists. Take this into consideration and ask yourself who is the real revisionist. Auschwitz changed their death toll number from 4 million to 1 million died.

erichunt.net...

This is not about how many people died, this is about the type of science being employed and the use of oppressive force against anyone who questions this historic event, even though the holocaust scholars themselves question the event, which is what I think this thread is all about. This is the exact same kind of thing they are doing with Global Warming, calling you a "denier" if you deny it. This is really no different than 9/11 or any other conspiracy. It is just a harder barrier to cross over because we know that the Holocaust did happen in the sense that governments are dictatorial. But guess what, Hitler is not the only dictatorial government. That is a fact that the holocaust story tries to cover up, that only Hitler is the supreme evil of the world (the half-Aryan leader of the Aryan Race).

I could go on. For instance, in certain European countries, Holocaust denial is a crime. Doesn't this sort of set off red flags for the scientific minded amongst us? Imagine if you could go to jail for denying that Christopher Columbus discovered America, even though we have evidence to the contrary?

The reason Holocaust denial is a crime in Europe, is because they are afraid it will revive the Nazi party, but if anything, the Holocaust story keeps the Hitler fear alive, which is then used to wage continuous war such as: Iran wants to kill all Jews, meaning he is equal to Hitler, even though he never said that, and actually speaks eloquently when it comes to the Holocaust. But the believers make demons out of their enemies. How many times have we heard someone call someone else "Hitler" it has become like the N-word, where if you do not like someone, they are Hitlerian or Fascist. The truth is that the government, all governments, to a certain extent are fascist, yet again the Holocaust story hides this by making it seem like Hitler was the only one, he was defeated, and so now the world is safe. We like to think that society advanced after world war 2, but there are more wars now then before. World war 1 was supposed to be the war to end all wars, but it was actually just the first in a long line of banker wars.

Wars always involve the international bankers, not Hitler, and this is apparent when you see that they fund Hitler through the Bush family, IG Farben, and Eugenics. These are all tied into the Rockefeller/Rothschild family.

[edit on 6-1-2010 by ancient_wisdom]

[edit on 6-1-2010 by ancient_wisdom]

reply to post by Sharrow


Lovely, I can't wait till you are an old man and your grandchildren tell you 9/11 never happened because "Grandpa keeps changing the story". You keep wanting to twist the authors meaning to support your worldview and when many posters in the thread call you out for twisting the authors words you claim its Jews working against you!

Classic.

reply to post by buddhasystem


Have you actually traveled to Auschwitz? To see what is still there? Until you do so, I would suggest you think harder before you post.

I think we need a little perspective here.
Please take note that I am neither denying any holocaust nor defending any Nazis. I just hate it when only one side of an event gets all the attention. You do think it fair to look at all facets of any case don't you?

Just a few point here.

Some history leading up to Kristallnacht and WW 2
judicial-inc.biz...

a little bit of Neuremberg info:
Do you believe coreced confessions are OK?

www.codoh.com...
www.radioislam.org...

False Confessions. The US has been doing some of this recently and I believe it has been held that it is legal and admissable in court. Do any of you know exactly what goes on during a simple "questioning" session? (i.e.without torture)

www.innocenceproject.org...

www.vho.org...

And yet another Holocasut that doesn't get any press.
www.srpska-mreza.com...

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN WE HAVE BEEN LIED TO BY THE GERMANS ABOUT THE DRESDEN BOMBINGS


(**note** this article is not my original work, if you wish to see the original it is Here)

> February 13, 1999
> Good Morning from the Zundelsite:
> Today is "Dresden Day."

Apparently Mr. Zundel is unaware that recent research conducted by the courageous and politically incorrect truth-seekers of THE MAD REVISIONIST has revealed startling evidence that the bombing of Dresden and other German cities during the conflict known as World War II is in fact an elaborate German propaganda hoax.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that a few buildings might not have burned down, and that maybe a few people weren't singed or even killed as a result. But revisionists are scorned, and even laughed at, when we ask difficult questions about what really caused the tragedy, and how many people were really killed. Meanwhile, so many establishment lies about this alleged event have been exposed by revisionist research that its hard to take the normatively accepted version seriously.

Take the fact that there are numerous memorial sites in Germany that supposedly mark "mass graves" of civilians alleged to have been killed in these so-called "bombings". Yet not one of these sites have ever been excavated and subjected to impartial forensic examination to confirm that they contain what they are alleged to contain. Appalling, is it not? These Dresden hoaxers obviously have something to hide.

> Fifty-four years ago today, the city of Dresden, which had no strategic
> military significance at all and which had become a huge refugee city for
> civilians fleeing the Red Terror, became a huge fireball in the fiercest
> Allied terror bombing ever.

Indeed, the city of Dresden had no military or strategic significance. Is it therefore not the least bit fishy that the Dresden hoaxers expect you to believe the ridiculous notion that the Allies, while fighting a war that they intended to win, would waste valuable military resources on it?

> David Irving has written about the Dresden Holocaust, and it is a book well
> worth reading - and one you will never forget.
>
> It is estimated by some that as many as 350,000 - 600,000 victims were
> incinerated beyond being identifiable or even recognizable as human remains
> in that Holocaust. Only 35,000 could be identified.

Ah, so only 35,000 victims could be identified, and yet Zundel expects us to believe that another 350,000-600,000 people (why does the number vary so widely, hmmm?) were killed as well, simply because they are unaccounted for. How gullible does he think we are? Does he offer any proof to support this absurd number?

> Many of the pictures that people were served up as "pyres of gassed Jews"
> from Auschwitz and elsewhere in early Allied "atrocity flicks" are, in
> fact, photographs the Wehrmacht took of German victims of the Allied war
> crime of Dresden.

But every revisionist knows that it is physically impossible to burn bodies in open pits. That's why the photos and eyewitness testimonies of Jews being burned outside the kremas at Auschwitz must be fakes, right? So it serves as proof, as well, that the Dresden bombing is a hoax.

> The War Department, describing another city, Hamburg, described how people
> died in such a firestorm:
>
> "Literally hundreds of people were seen leaving shelters after the heat
> became intense. They ran across the street and were seen to collapse very
> slowly like people who were utterly exhausted. They could not get up."
>
> A reporter, Melitta Maschman, wrote of what happened in the City of Darmstadt:

Well, I suppose it is accurate to refer to Melita Maschmann (correct spelling) as a reporter at the time of the bombing. Though it would, perhaps, be more accurate to say that she was a reporter for the Bund Deutscher Madel. In fact, it would be more accurate still to say that she was the head of the BDM Press and Propaganda division in Berlin from 1943 until the end of the war. Interesting how Mr. Zundel is willing to, er, prune information that might cast doubt on the reliability and objectivity of his sources. Particulary when the source in question, in her memoir (Account Rendered: a Dossier on my Former Self) written after the war, was quite open in describing how the Nazis used to brainwash German youth.

> "There was not a house anywhere in the street which had not turned into a
> blazing firebrand. Above the sea of flames, a glowing cyclone raged over
> the town, and whenever it caught the bodies of people in flight, it
> shriveled them in a second to the size of a child, and the next day they
> lay all over the streets, hardly burnt, but like mummified children."

HBO should have saved this lie for its "Tales from the Crypt" program. Preposterous nonsense! So called "eyewitness" testimonies of these alleged bombings of German cities contain so many impossibilities and discrepancies as to make the whole story unbelievable. Sure, all of the survivors pretty much agree on the point that the city was bombed by the Allies, but how reliable are survivors who also testify to "puddles of melted human flesh" and people "glowing blue (or orange) and disintegrating" - and this, in sealed bunkers which were protected from the fire. There have been so many lies told by so-called "Dresden survivors" that all of these testimonies are wide open to reasonable doubt. After all, how much can you trust people testifying against their hated enemies?

And is there a single witness who actually saw a bomb dropped from an American plane land on the city and explode? No. Not one such witness. Who could have survived to have described such a thing? All we have are rumors. I don't want to hear what people thought they heard from inside the bomb shelter, or what they figured might be going on above. I want to know what they saw.

No, the Dresden myth relies almost entirely on hostile eyewitness testimony and questionable "confessions" by those alleged to have done the dirty deed. There is not a single survivor account of the Dresden bombing that has ever stood up to hostile cross-examination, and I challenge you to find one.

reply to post by DeathShield


> These German victims' wartimes stories are not known. They left no diaries.
>
> They perished in the flames of the devastating inferno of March 16, 1945 -
> among the thousands of victims of this Allied atrocity the following women
> and children named "Anna":



> I would like you to honor and remember these German victims of a deliberate
> Allied policy with genocidal overtones in a few moments' worth of silence.

While I'm sure that Mr. Zundel considers it good history to tug at the heart strings in the hopes of disabling our ability to think rationally and critically, this tactic will not work any better than the diary of Anne Frank. It stands that he has yet to show us one proof... one single proof... that any one of these persons died as a result of Allied bombs.

In light of the fact that I have shown that the Dresden story has no non-biased eyewitnesses and no conclusive physical evidence, it appears that alternative explanations for the destruction are entirely plausible. It could have been caused by someone smoking in bed (smoking is more common in continental Europe than it is in, say, North America). Also, it is entirely plausible that the German Air Force bombed the city themselves by accident (as they did to Freiburg), and then tried to cover up their heinous error by blaming the disaster on their hated enemies.

Its not looking good for the Dresden hoaxers now. Where is the proof that this city was bombed by the Allies? Considering the gravity of the charges, is it really so much to ask?

reply to post by ancient_wisdom


Well I'm kind of busy so please raise some actual points, not link them. Shrinking heads? Probably not. Electrified? Germans were toying with nerve-electrical interfaces. They probably did some things, but this was quickly ended because, well, you can't do that without computers. Skin as soap? Maybe, but they did make skin lamps.




Here's the thing. German scientists were encourages to be creative in any respect. In a nation that developed the first helicopters, jet engines, missiles, jet packs, night vision, etc etc, I see no reason why human slaves would not be used for some form of biological experimentation. To take this into a conspiracy, virtually all modern warfare utilities are rooted from designs found from the nazis. The military has always been interested in biological alteration (even radioactive contamination of pregnant women to see the effects, without the women's knowledge.

The thing is, governments in these days were very bad. I'm sure you know of the power of the eugenics movement in these days. The fact is that lots of unpleasant things occurred purely in the name of science. While the US and allies are just as guilty, this does not make the Nazis innocent.

Death tolls being changed doesn't matter, because they're always changing. People exaggerate numbers, but when lots of people say the same thing, then it happened. If we cannot trust mass testimonies, then so many of our conspiracies are wrong, even though they continue to be proven right.

[edit on 6-1-2010 by Gorman91]

Originally posted by OhZone
I think we need a little perspective here.
Please take note that I am neither denying any holocaust nor defending any Nazis. I just hate it when only one side of an event gets all the attention. You do think it fair to look at all facets of any case don't you?

Just a few point here.

Some history leading up to Kristallnacht and WW 2
judicial-inc.biz...

a little bit of Neuremberg info:
Do you believe coreced confessions are OK?

www.codoh.com...
www.radioislam.org...

False Confessions. The US has been doing some of this recently and I believe it has been held that it is legal and admissable in court. Do any of you know exactly what goes on during a simple "questioning" session? (i.e.without torture)

www.innocenceproject.org...

www.vho.org...

And yet another Holocasut that doesn't get any press.
www.srpska-mreza.com...

Thank God for Google.

Posting a bunch of supporting material for a fantasy, sourced from news outlets whose agenda is to promulgate lies, under the guise of being fair and even handed only further indicts the OP and you.

What should compel anyone to refute things long debunked and known to be revisionist poison?

reply to post by ancient_wisdom

I generally agree with your position.
Benjamin Freedman gave a very informative history lesson some years back. A copy of the speech is here:
www.sweetliberty.org...

I believe economic warfare is being waged on the US people as we speak.
By whom?
Read the speech. Come to your own conclusions.

reply to post by Sharrow


The fact you are all here even having this discussion is the point. They are fearful people will forget.

I have sat down face to face with two survivors and spoken with a German who was there. I know its all true and so does anyone other than very young people.

It is sad that each generation seems to reject the lessons learned by previous generations. Now that all the WW2 Soldiers and the Survivors are nearly gone, the evil people can start to rewrite history. The modern Nazi's are determined to rewrite history so they can repeat it.

It is sick beyond belief that people would even be suggesting it was faked since up until recently the victims were here to give first hand accounts.

I have no tolerance for Holocaust Deniers. I don't understand people that sick in the head. They are just Bigots trying to justify their irrational hatred. They are the same people who join the The Aryan Nation and the modern Nazi's who believe that the Holocaust was justified and want to continue it. They know it was real but they want to convince young people it was not so they can recruit them or brainwash them into joining their evil ranks.

It is horrible that less than a hundred years after this atrocity people are actually theorizing the whole thing was made up. I think its hatred of Jews or Blacks that is driving it. These haters don't dare admit their real beliefs so they spread these lies.

I'd post lots of pictures from mass graves and those taken of the victims while still barely alive but the T&C here won't allow it. I tried once when some sick Holocaust Denier had a thread going and they were taken down. On this issue, ATS is wrong and the photo's should all be posted in plain site to "Deny Ignorance" and in this case deny the haters a forum for their evil.

I had a neighbor for a few years in the early 80's who was a German Girl who refused to join the Nazi's during the war. She was taken hostage by an SSS Officer and held in his home. She was made to do all the cleaning and cooking between rapes by the SSS Officers. She was not a Jew but a German. They even brutalized their own people if they did not join in the slaughter or join the Party. Her name was Anna and she has died of old age. I miss her, she was a wonderful person. Boy did she love her glass of Beer with dinner.

She told me all about how the German People held parades to welcome the Americans to end the brutal Nazi Regime and the SSS atrocities committed against the German people. Her eyes would tear up and she would often drift off thinking but she thought it very important she relate her stories to as many as she could. She wanted the world to know that the German people were as appalled as the rest of the world. A couple of times she broke down into sobs and tears while recounting the beatings and rapes handed out to her by the SSS. Her own Father gave her to them because she refused to be a Nazi.

I could post about the accounts from the two Jewish survivors but this is tearing me up thinking about Anna and I've got to collect my thoughts. Sorry, maybe another time.

For now, please people realize those who suggest the stories are not true, know they are true and have an evil ulterior and very racists,bigoted motive.

reply to post by Blaine91555
Do you know what the best is, I never denied anything at all. Some guys are tried to create that impression that I'm denying anything here, because I opened this thread. Since that time they're trying to twist the words of everyone, trying to make false impressions. But they've failed.

And now you get 8 stars for your post. 8, almost the same number whose were against me. This is sooooooo transparent.

[edit on 6-1-2010 by Sharrow]

reply to post by Stewie


If that's about the Jews in the money business in ww2 Germany screwing ober the German government, I'll ask this. Why does the actions of the few justify the extermination of an entire race?