2010? The Mahdi/Maitreya/Antichrist-All in One?

reply to post by On the Edge


No you just implied it either way it dont matter because like i stated I AM THE ANTI-CHRIST

You just gotta love religious zelots

Well the best advice I can tell you right off the bat is to know the three main schools of Christian Eschatology: Futurism, Preterism, and Historicism. I used to be a Futurist, like it sounds you are, but not anymore. I was raised a protestant, Lutheran to be exact, and always knew that Futurism did not seem to jive with some of the things that Lutherans are taught, but I never knew why that was. As most of the Churches back then did not teach Prophecy, many Lutherans learned Futurism, who should not have, including myself.

Basic run down:
Futurism is a school that was brought about as part of the Counter Reformation in 1585, by Jesuit doctor of theology named Francisco Ribera. It teaches that the last week of the 70 weeks of Daniel is for some reason removed to a Future 7 year tribulation period. This is the school that teaches a rebuilt Jewish Temple, a Peace treaty, and an Antichrist.

Sound familiar?

Preterism was written also as part of the Counter Reformation by Spanish Jesuit Luis De Alcazar. This school teaches that everything in Revelations and Daniel has already occurred, minus the return of Christ. Most everything in Revelations is accountable to Nero. This is the currant school used by the Roman Catholic Church.

Now both of these schools came in response to the Protestant Reformation, by the militant arm of the Vatican, known as the Jesuit Order. The reason for them is because when Martin Luther translated the Bible into German, he gave the common man access to it, and they began to realize that much of what had been going on with Rome matched up very closely with the events of prophecy. At the time there was no name for this line of interpretation, though now its known as various schools of Historicism.

Basically Historicism teaches that the 70 weeks of Daniel ended when they ended, I think it was 3.5 years after the death of Christ or when he was born, I forget which. Much of the prophecies actually dealt with the end of the “Age of the Jews”, and the beginning of the “Age of the Church”. The end times then go on from 70ad, up until the return of Christ (which could be anytime, there is not timeline like in Futurism). Revelations is a roadmap of the age of the Church.

Let me give you an example: The two witnesses who have to teach in sackcloth are not Elijah and Enoch as Futurism teaches, but rather the Old and New Testament which had to be taught in secrecy under pain of the Inquisition while Rome had outlawed the ownership of the Bible. Your Whore of Babylon that you mention above is the mating of the Roman Empire (the beast, and city of seven hills), and the Roman Catholic Church (the woman with the Cup, or sibylline oracle) the symbol of the Vatican:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/211f1e635c64.jpg[/atsimg]

You know how I mentioned that the evil one can effect things over time, make false prophecies, then make them appear to come true? Well look up who the Vatican helped during WWII, and after the war look into how they helped make Israel a nation again after the Holocaust. Funny how Rome had its hands in both sides of that prophecy coming to pass in accordance with their interpretation, eh?

reply to post by KeeperOfGenisis


There is no one Antichrist, that is unbiblical:

2Jo 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

So if you reject Christ, then by definition the term Antichrist does in fact fit. Anyway, as this seems to be a topic on the subject of Christianity, did you have anything to add to the topic, or did you just show up to voice that you dislike Christianity? I have no issue with you showing up to voice descent if you have something you want to debate, but if you just showed up to disrupt that is trolling.

reply to post by defcon5


What translation are you using? Some translations don't say "an antichrist" in this verse.

ESV:

For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh. Such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist.

NIV:

Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist.

NASB:

For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh This is the deceiver and the antichrist.

At any rate, this verse alone can't prove or disprove an Antichrist being real. The Antichrist has many names in the Bible. Unfortunately, people have chosen the worst one to refer to him by.

reply to post by defcon5

It teaches that the last week of the seventy weeks of Daniel is for some reason removed to a Future 7 year tribulation period.

For some reason, eh? It's not as simple as that. It's not arbitrarily moved. Futurists see the 70 weeks being "put on hold" in Daniel 9:26, when the anointed one is cut off. The move the seventieth week to the future because of Daniel 9:27, where the "prince who is to come" makes a contract for one week.

In my eyes, the schools of eschatology, except for futurism, have a problem here with Daniel's 70 weeks. They all teach that they're over, but that simply can't be when we look what will be accomplished by the time the 70 weeks are over; Daniel 9:24:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

Yes, Jesus did accomplish some of these things; but not all of them. So, if the 70 weeks are over, we have a problem.

reply to post by defcon5


For your information its discrimination by you to label me an ism I AM OF NO RELIGION whether that be FUTURISM I dont know but i do know i dislike all religion including your ridiculous FUTURISM so please dont just label me a hater of christans i hate nobody but I have a right to speak my mind and so i did if im of any religion I BELIEVE IN ALIENS thats as far as my religion go's.

reply to post by octotom

Its not the only verse to state that:

1Jo 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

1Jo 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

1Jo 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

And I am using the standard KJV that comes with Esword, since it makes cutting and pasting a snap.
If you don’t have it I highly recommend it:
Esword
You can download any bible you want into it, commentaries, etc…

I highly recommend Wesleys notes…

Originally posted by octotom
At any rate, this verse alone can't prove or disprove an Antichrist being real. The Antichrist has many names in the Bible. Unfortunately, people have chosen the worst one to refer to him by.

Well if you are referring to beasts, they are not Antichrists, they are World Empires:
(specifically: Babylon, Media/Persia, Greece, Rome, and the last World Empire possibly the USA)

The ‘Little Horn” is possibly an Antichrist, but he is a very specific person in history:
The Pontifex Maximus, a position that was held by Roman Emperors (gods on earth).
The job of the Pontifex Maximus was as follows:

1) As Ceaser he could speak as God on Earth.
2) He set jus divinum, including punishments for heretics or religious crimes.
3) He set both the Religious and real Calander.
4) Again he set jus divinum.

Later this station was refused by a Christian Emperor, Gratian, in 382AD, as unbefitting a Christian:

In 382, the Emperor Gratian, at the urging of St. Ambrose, removed the Altar of Victory from the Forum, withdrew the state subsidies that funded many pagan activities and formally renounced the title of Pontifex Maximus.

At which time the title was happily taken over by the Bishop of Rome:

It is said that Pope Damasus I was the first Bishop of Rome to assume the title.

( Please excuse that I am using Wiki, and that the Catholic Apologists keep changing this article. It seems like each time I write about this on ATS it gets padded more and more to soften the Catholic side of what occurred in History.)

Who has used it to do the following under the Title of Holy Pontiff:
1) Speak as the voice of God on Earth.
2) Run the Inquisitions and Crusades.
3) Set both the Religious and Real Calendar. (including our currant calendar)
4) Set jus divinum.

Now lets compare that tooooo:

Dan 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

So Daniel says that this man was supposed to:
1) shall speak great words against the most High
2) wear out the saints of the most High
3) think to change times
4) think to change laws

Hm…

The “Man of Sin” is also a reference to the Pontifex Maximus…


Does that cover it, or is there another title that you are referring to?

Originally posted by defcon5
As most of the Churches back then did not teach Prophecy, many Lutherans learned Futurism, who should not have, including myself.

"What I say to you,I say to everyone:Watch!" Matt.13:37

"I tell you the truth,this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened." Matt.13:30

God said He would be with us to the very end. Revelation,Daniel,Matthew,...all tell us what to look for. And to definetly be watching.

I have had a running theme of "New-Agism" lately,and pointing to their "return of the Christ" is very significant in the big scheme of things.

I've seen lectures that touch on alot of what you have said,and found them to be very informative.(However,I also believe "History repeats itself" and that the time of the end is really The End!)

Hopefully,we agree on what's most important..."Jesus is Lord!"

Originally posted by ChemBreather

Originally posted by Moonman1111
reply to post by On the Edge

 

Very good post, this is the same entity Peggy Kane has been promoting as the 'One'. Who new agers promote as 'the coming world teacher', and who others promote as 'good benevolent aliens here to enlighten us'. It's all part of the grand deception.

And Peggy have alot of intresting reversed Speach audio too, from alot of Celebs and Reptiles and dead people speaking of 'the Net that we will all see' etc..

I heard the 'a small step for man' backwards, it became ' Man will spacewalk',

To OP:
So if this Bluebeam AntiDude comes and the muslims think it is for real, they will be set on a crusade to kill the christians to make the world a muslim only world..Convert or die scenario wich we have seen a few incidents on last year.
The british sailbout crew that was kidnaped and the Norwegian journalist who all came back with this muslim skarf and had turned to the quaran.

Some of the other reverse speech websites are interesting, but Peggy is a Luciferian and all her EVP's and other audio is fabricated. She even talked about how her 'One' would shock people if he showed up and said his name was Lucifer, and that he 'needs to change his name'. Plus her website along with GLP have a hidden hand pulling the strings on them if you know what I mean.

reply to post by octotom

Originally posted by octotom
For some reason, eh? It's not as simple as that.

It's not arbitrarily moved.

No, your right, they moved it intentionally to deflect the Historicists version of Eschatology, which was very clearly showing that the Prophecies were pointing to the Holy Pontiff as being the “Little Horn”.

This is a verifiable historical fact that can be checked using currant resources. The commentary written by Ribera is called: “In Sacrum Beati Ioannis Apostoli, & Evangelistiae Apocalypsin Commentarij”. Look it up, here is a picture of the cover:
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3e099e02cf8a.gif[/atsimg]

Originally posted by octotom
In my eyes, the schools of eschatology, except for futurism, have a problem here with Daniel's 70 weeks. They all teach that they're over, but that simply can't be when we look what will be accomplished by the time the 70 weeks are over; Daniel 9:24:

Seventy weeks are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.

This is what I have on a translation of that verse:

Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.-KJV

Christ did in fact do all those things, he made the ultimate sacrifice for which none other would ever be a substitute for. This is the reasoning as to why the curtain of the Temple was rent in twain after the Crucifixion:

Luk 23:45 And the sun was darkened, and the veil of the temple was rent in the midst.

Sin has no meaning, and neither does death from that point onward. The enemy was defeated, and salvation assured for those who believe. Christ fulfilled the Prophecies and visions of those who saw his coming. The most holy which was anointed was Christ himself.

I must say that its nice to see someone who actually knows what I am talking about for a change on here though…

Originally posted by KeeperOfGenisis
For your information its discrimination by you to label me an ism I AM OF NO RELIGION whether that be FUTURISM.

First off, Futurism is a School or Prophetic Interpretation, its not a religion. Secondly, I never said anything about you being a futurist, you need to go back and re-read the thread.

Originally posted by KeeperOfGenisis
I dont know but i do know i dislike all religion including your ridiculous FUTURISM so please dont just label me a hater of christans i hate nobody but I have a right to speak my mind and so i did if im of any religion I BELIEVE IN ALIENS thats as far as my religion go's.

And my point was, do you have a point other then to come in here and pick on those who do believe in religion?

May I recommend:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Enjoy…

Originally posted by On the Edge
"I tell you the truth,this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened." Matt.13:30

I think you have the wrong verse. Download that Esword I linked above, its an excellent free program.

Anyway, the verse comes from here:

Mat 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

Now to understand what that means you have to go back to the beginning of the Chapter:

Mat 24:1-3 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

Notice the difference here:

Mat 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
Mar 13:4 Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when all these things shall be fulfilled?
Luk 21:7 And they asked him, saying, Master, but when shall these things be? and what sign will there be when these things shall come to pass?

Two of the three verses do not match the version from Matthew, so they are most likely the correct way that the question was stated. The question is actually two questions, the first being when will the Temple be destroyed:

shew him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

This did in fact happen within a generation of the Death of Christ. In 70 ad, the Romans crushed a rebellion among the Jewish people and literally decimated the city and its inhabitants. Many of the events that Christ talks about in the verses that follow Matthew 24:1 in fact relate to the “End of the Age of the Jews” and the destruction of Jerusalem. If you are interested I recommend reading: Wars of the Jews by Flavius Josephus

Originally posted by On the Edge
God said He would be with us to the very end. Revelation,Daniel,Matthew,...all tell us what to look for. And to definetly be watching.

There are still signs, but they are not necessarily the ones that Futurists look for, which worries me. I see Futurism as possibly being the ‘Great Deception”, I’ll explain that further later on if you would like.

Originally posted by On the Edge
I have had a running theme of "New-Agism" lately,and pointing to their "return of the Christ" is very significant in the big scheme of things.

Almost all religions are pointing at this period of history as being the End Times. I have spent a little time with the American Indians and even they have End Time prophecies that are coming to pass during this period.

Originally posted by On the Edge
I've seen lectures that touch on alot of what you have said,and found them to be very informative.(However,I also believe "History repeats itself" and that the time of the end is really The End!)

I believe that this world has been ended before, which is a unique viewpoint from most Christians. I do find support for this belief in the Bible itself though, and it is a recurrent theme in many other religions. I believe that this is the last repetition however, and this will be the final end.

Originally posted by On the Edge
Hopefully,we agree on what's most important..."Jesus is Lord!"

Absolutely.

reply to post by ChemBreather


lol- you make me laff. and then sigh sadly.

as for OP's excessively long post- why post ALLLLLL that? why not links with brief excepts? do toy not trusty us to be able to click links and judge for ourselves?

as for the denouncement of all muslims based on twisted theology of less than ten percent, and actions of even fewer... again i sigh sadly. not even going to explain here the errors, for it would only cornfuzzle you, since you seem to be so firmly convinced bt disinformation...
not visiting back to a thread i mistakenly thought might have been interesting, but merely saddening, so dun't 1- worry about replying or 2 - confuse silence for contriteness or acquiescence...

ps- most sane muslims know the maitreya nonsense for the bs it is. the antichrist will be much more believable to all 3 camps of children of abraham

Originally posted by ExParrot
reply to post by ChemBreather

 

ps- most sane muslims know the maitreya nonsense for the bs it is. the antichrist will be much more believable to all 3 camps of children of abraham

Whoa.

Mohammed, after having been rejected by the Jews and Christians living in the Arabian Peninsula, goes off and devises a vicious form of social control based on death. The Allah deity was usurped from the many gods of the Kaba and has nothing to do with God. Along with a black rock from space, Mohammed devises The Islamic System and starts the biggest lie in the last 1,400 years. That Allah is God.

Islam is not related at all to Judaism or Christianity. It was developed fully within historical times and its rise and development and spread recorded by those it consumed.

Islam is the antichrist.

[edit on 6-1-2010 by mike_trivisonno]

Originally posted by ChemBreather

I heard the 'a small step for man' backwards, it became ' Man will spacewalk',

Really?!? I am so going to have to dowload that and reverse it. I'm calling you out if it doesn't work though, lol

To OP:
So if this Bluebeam AntiDude comes and the muslims think it is for real, they will be set on a crusade to kill the christians to make the world a muslim only world..Convert or die scenario wich we have seen a few incidents on last year.

Bluebeam AntiDude! That's so gonna be my new secret super hero name!

Back on topic:

So, as you never mentioned athiests, I guess I'm safe then...

It was an interesting rant (honest, not being sarcastic) I read the whole thing. I might be an athiest/agnostic, but religion absolutely enthrals me as one one hell of a great story (pun intended).

reply to post by defcon5

Its not the only verse to state that: ...

I never denied that they weren't the only verses. I knew that that wasn't the case. In the 2 John verse, it was just strange to me for it to read "an antichrist" as I've only read "the antichrist" in my studies. But yeah, John's general epistles are loaded with references to "antichrist(s)". That is my I say that "Antichrist" is the worst possible name for him out of the lot.

If you don’t have it I highly recommend it: ...

I love e-Sword! Sadly, I use Linux and e-Sword doesn't quite work as it should. Luckily though, there are native Linux programs that are comparable. At the moment, I use one called Xiphos. I do believe I have Wesley's notes installed into it as well.

Well if you are referring to beasts, they are not Antichrists, they are World Empires:

No, I wasn't so much thinking of the beasts. Except maybe "the Beast" that is mentioned in Revelation; which I don't see it being possible, based on some of the actions that he's said to do, can be a nation.

Some of the other titles I was thinking of were the Assyrian and "Lawless one".

Thanks for the info though, I'll think it over. I always try to keep an open mind about things because, being human, it's possible that I've gotten things wrong! No need to apologize for using Wiki either. I actually don't mind quotes from it, as long as those quotes are cross referenced.

reply to post by On the Edge


This information certainly fits in with the Geo Spiritual Matrix's plan. I've always been a very secular individual and have real trouble understanding the need for a religion. While I've always been intrigued by the occult..For what its worth I think the work of Rik Clay and his ideas about the London 2012 Olympics being a key part of the Miatreya code well worth investigating.

reply to post by crowkey


Just watched all nine parts of the Youtube videos.

Makes ya wonder if that guy was ever able to sleep at night! His mind must have been jumping so fast from one thing to another.

There may well be something "in the cards" for the 2012 Olympics.

"Illuminati Playing Cards"
prophecyandpredictions.blogspot.com...

Thanks for the interesting referral. (So sad that he committed suicide at such a young age. Some say he was murdered?)

I stopped reading after you called Islam a cult. You're a tool mate, go home and try again.

reply to post by defcon5


I'm glad we see "eye to eye" on what matters most!

You sound like way more of a scholar on these subjects than I am,and I certainly appreciate your contributing here.

Please remember the word I began my thread with was "If..."

I did get awfully excited,it's true! I think this Maitreya is bad news all around,and I think that was all I was getting at. It will be big news when it comes to the front stage.

As long as we draw nearer to God in prayer,I know He will see us through.

I believe what we are seeing in the world today is unrestrained evil and that it will get worse.

Anyway,your insights were most welcome. I will have to go over them again in more detail,but feel free anytime to share what you believe about God,here and everywhere! Every voice counts!

(Looking back,I am a little embarrassed about the length of my "rant",as some call it! Hope it's understandable and forgiven,under the circumstances!)

Peace to all!