Avatar – Israel Defiled?

I saw Avatar twice, once on a 25 meter screen in 2D and then in 3D…
…I loved the movie…
…but I have had stuff running around in my head ever since…
…and thought I would share a couple for discussion.

What's in a name?

Jake Sully

Jake
Jake is short for Jacob.
Jacob was the second born twin of Esau and grandson of Abraham.
Jacob's name was later changed to Israel...
…he was the father of 12 sons who fathered the 12 tribes of Israel…
...it is from his name that the Children of Israel get their name.

Israel existed to reveal the Messiah the Seed of Abraham…
…Christians believe Jesus was that Seed. (see Galatians 3:16)

In Cameron's original scripting Jake Sully was named Josh Sully...
...Josh is short for Joshua (Yeshua) which some believe was Aramaic origin of the anglicized ‘Jesus’...
...perhaps it was changed to make the messianic connection less obvious.

Sully
Means to ‘make soiled’, to tarnish or to defile.

So Jake Sully could mean ‘Israel Defiled’.

Jake Sully became the 6th Toruk Makto (number six is also interesting)…
…and is an obvious alternative Messianic figure as a “prince of the power of the air" (Eph 2:2)

Jake first inhabits or possesses an alien human hybrid avatar (grown in a tank)...
...and later 'incarnates' as "Na'vi" (in a Docetist or Ebionite kind of way).


In case you think this is just an interpretive coincidence…
…or that I have lost touch with reality…
…consider the name of the person in charge of the Avatar program…
…her name is 'Grace Augustine'.

Augustine
St. Augustine was a Latin church father, one of the most important figures in the development of Western Christianity…
…many of his ideas were carried over into Protestantism by the Reformers.

Grace
St. Augustine believed that the grace of Christ was indispensable to human freedom.
…and wrote extensively on issues of the ‘spirit’ and the ‘soul'.

Grace was head of the Avatar program…
…and it is said of her early in the movie…
“she wrote the book on Avatars, she literally wrote the book”…

Grace had also run a mission school for the "Na'vi"…
…and later dies and is absorbed …
… and in death helps Jake to be victorious as the 6th Toruk Makto and to incarnate.


In conclusion…
… we have ‘Israel Defiled’, plus the demise of Christendom and the rise of an alternative Messiah…
…sound like any apocalyptic chronology that you know?

Ps and I won’t even get started on Pandora...
...the box from where all evil escaped and only hope remained…
…or blue Hindi gods.



[edit on 5/1/10 by troubleshooter]

I could drill a little further in the rabbit hole by adding that Jake, being a variation of Jacob, also means the "supplanter" in hebrew.

Or

Noun 1. supplanter - one who wrongfully or illegally seizes and holds the place of another usurper offender, wrongdoer - a person who transgresses moral or civil law claim jumper - one who illegally occupies property to which another has a legal claim

This view makes a lot of sense due to the fact that Avatar is about supplanting an indigenous population to farm valuable resources.

While I do think that Avatar is essentially an Anti-Imperialist movie, I don't think it was a direct reference to Israel. I think it expresses a generalized political sentiment.

Originally posted by Oscitate
I could drill a little further in the rabbit hole by adding that Jake, being a variation of Jacob, also means the "supplanter" in hebrew.
Or

Noun 1. supplanter - one who wrongfully or illegally seizes and holds the place of another usurper offender, wrongdoer - a person who transgresses moral or civil law claim jumper - one who illegally occupies property to which another has a legal claim

This view makes a lot of sense due to the fact that Avatar is about supplanting an indigenous population to farm valuable resources.

Yes good point...Ya`aqob [yah-ak-obe'] Meaning: Jacob = "heel holder" or "supplanter"

Jacob was holding the heal of Esau while he was born...
...and then he purchased Esau's birthright for bread and a bowl of lentils (and a little deception).

While I do think that Avatar is essentially an Anti-Imperialist movie, I don't think it was a direct reference to Israel. I think it expresses a generalized political sentiment.

Personally I think that this is proof that if a person has enough time on their hands, and nothing better to do, a conspiracy can be made out of anything.

[edit on 10-1-2010 by Majiq]

Originally posted by Majiq
Personally I think that this is proof that if a person has enough time on their hands, and nothing better to do, a conspiracy can be made out of anything.

Maybe some just can't see the trees for the forest.

The 'world of men' has been subjected to fifty years of the Alien Hypothesis in movies, series and animation...
...we have all been introduced to the concepts of alternate planetary beings traversing vast distances, bending time, swapping consciousnesses.

We have all been convinced that some are benevolent and some bent and evil.

This onslaught of ficticious ideas has become a part of our world view and influenced our philosophies and sciences.

Recently this hypothesis has taken a disturbing twist...
...while most previous science fiction has had man fighting from the moral high ground...
...movies like Avatar and District 9 portray humans negatively...
...violent, stupid insensitive destroyers of their planet and environment...
...and worthy of death and replacement.

My reflections don't come from 'too much time'...
...but a lifetime of knowledge from a the study of History, Theology and Medical Science.

Although bent, most humans are better than the charactertures portrayed in these theatrical works...
...and I am convinced there is an agenda alive in the forest.

reply to post by troubleshooter


My opinion, and it is just that, seeing as I don't know James Cameron, is that he has an interest in the history of the Native Americans, and told it with a sci-fi flare along with a happier ending for the Indians. Of course that may just be the slant that I put on it.

The story is strikingly similar to Pocahontas, Watch a movie called The New World, not the Dysney animation to get some history on this.
and you can then presume that Jake Sully or J S is in parallel to John Smith

reply to post by troubleshooter
On Dr. Deagle's Nutrimedical report, he had a guest on name Freeman who was discussing the meanings from the movie, Avatar.
The podcast from the show can be downloaded from Genesis Broadcasting.
It is the first hour of 01-06-10
gcnlive.com...
download 0106101
According to Freeman and Deagle on this hour:
It is the story of the animated movie, Fern Gully, The Last Rain-forest of 1992. Fairies trying to save the forest from loggers.
"Na'vi" is the name of a blue fairy in the video game, Legend of Zelda.
To understand Na vi using Kabbala, you go to the major archana of Taroh, based on Hebrew letters, N means Death and V is Lovers. So you end up with the name meaning, death lovers.
This is similar to The Blue Kachina, a Hopi Indian tale of the blue star that appears before the end of the age.
"Avatar" means, god incarnated.
Deagle's opinion is that the movie promotes false belief in animism where everything has consciousness, and the idea of migration of soul or consciousness, which is wrong because you can not deposit your consciousness into a computerized chip-set or another biological system or another cloned version of you.

[edit on 11-1-2010 by jmdewey60]

Originally posted by Pan7her
The story is strikingly similar to Pocahontas, Watch a movie called The New World, not the Dysney animation to get some history on this.
and you can then presume that Jake Sully or J S is in parallel to John Smith

Yes, I have heard Avatar compared to Pocahontas and The New World...
...I can also see parallels with Dances with Wolves and even Samuri.

Maybe that's the power of Avatar, it tells all our stories.

Originally posted by troubleshooter
Ps and I won’t even get started on Pandora...
...the box from where all evil escaped and only hope remained…
…or blue Hindi gods.

By all means get started. I haven't seen the movie, but have heard from many who have issue with the underlying themes/elements. Personally I find these discussions more entertaining than any movie. My reason for not considering seeing it is actually quite plain: It's cold outside and I don't want to leave the house unless I have to. The biggest surprise for me so far is the number of people who have gone to see the movie without knowing what the word "avatar" means.



[edit on 11-1-2010 by saint4God]

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by troubleshooter

 

On Dr. Deagle's Nutrimedical report, he had a guest on name Freeman who was discussing the meanings from the movie, Avatar.
The podcast from the show can be downloaded from Genesis Broadcasting.
It is the first hour of 01-06-10
gcnlive.com...
download 0106101
According to Freeman and Deagle on this hour:
It is the story of the animated movie, Fern Gully, The Last Rain-forest of 1992. Fairies trying to save the forest from loggers.
"Na'vi" is the name of a blue fairy in the video game, Legend of Zelda.
To understand Na vi using Kabbala, you go to the major archana of Taroh, based on Hebrew letters, N means Death and V is Lovers. So you end up with the name meaning, death lovers.
This is similar to The Blue Kachina, a Hopi Indian tale of the blue star that appears before the end of the age.
"Avatar" means, god incarnated.
Deagle's opinion is that the movie promotes false belief in animism where everything has consciousness, and the idea of migration of soul or consciousness, which is wrong because you can not deposit your consciousness into a computerized chip-set or another biological system or another cloned version of you.

[edit on 11-1-2010 by jmdewey60]

Deagle must hate all sci-fi movies then, since you can't fly space ships through interstellar distances, nor shoot lasers.

reply to post by jmdewey60

It is the story of the animated movie, Fern Gully, The Last Rain-forest of 1992. Fairies trying to save the forest from loggers.

Yep can see that...watch it with my girls years back.

"Na'vi" is the name of a blue fairy in the video game, Legend of Zelda.
To understand Na vi using Kabbala, you go to the major archana of Taroh, based on Hebrew letters, N means Death and V is Lovers. So you end up with the name meaning, death lovers.

I had not seen that but it fits too...

"Avatar" means, god incarnated.

Incarnated in a Hindi sort of way...yes.

Thank for you contribution.

reply to post by troubleshooter


Cameron
Means... One who makes movies that make hundreds of Millions if not a Billion dollars off of pop culture knowledge he put's into them.

reply to post by hippomchippo

Deagle must hate all sci-fi movies then, since you can't fly space ships through interstellar distances, nor shoot lasers.

He thinks a lot of movies are brain washing propaganda to change the way people think and to allow them to accept ideas like; people are a virus on the planet and we need to be exterminated.
I suppose the worse case, based on the philosophy of this movie, would be someone stupid enough to be talked into having their memories and consciousness transferred into a robot or something in order to be more environmentally friendly. Your body would die in the process, but don't worry, whatever it is that makes you, you will be migrated, and you will continue on like nothing happened. They could show them the results of earlier transfers that convincingly seem to be the persons they knew. The scientists will laugh behind your back for being a sucker, with another voluntary suicide, because God alone can save your soul.



[edit on 11-1-2010 by jmdewey60]

Originally posted by troubleshooter


Recently this hypothesis has taken a disturbing twist...
...while most previous science fiction has had man fighting from the moral high ground...
...movies like Avatar and District 9 portray humans negatively...
...violent, stupid insensitive destroyers of their planet and environment...
...and worthy of death and replacement.

That about sums us humans up nicely, at leas that sums up the agenda of the Elite. Most average people advocate taking care of our blue-green dot, but the Elite and the wealthy (which includes the company depicted in Avatar and its workers) don't care about this planet or its people, they know that in the event of a resource shortage they would be safe. So the pillaging of the planet continues.

I don't think there's a conspiracy here. I watched the film and I didn't once think of Israel in any of it. It's pretty straight forward in its message about us greedy humans going into places we don't belong to get resources we don't own *cough* middle east *cough* but I fail to see how any of that has to do with "defiling" Israel or an anti-christ type scenario...

But maybe I'm not quite paranoid enough to connect the dots

Merry Brandybuck means "Happy alcohol male deer."
Peregrine Took means "Hawk stole"
Frodo Baggins means "African-American hairdo female deer sack within"
Samwise Gamgee means "Samual (from the Bible!) smart legs golly."

Also "The Dark Lord" could mean devil!

Word games don't mean anything. Even if it was deliberate, what does Avatar have to do with Israel?

reply to post by troubleshooter


Don't forget that the word "Navi" is derivative of the Hebrew word "Prophet". I don't speak Hebrew but it caught my eye cause the Arabic word "Nabi" means prophet. Because they are sister languages, I checked and its true that Navi means prophet.

Throw that into the mix.



[edit on 12-1-2010 by seattletruth]

The Col. Quaritch's name - it means "Rotten" or "Corrupt" in Serbian language, it's written "Kvarić", that's also how it's officially translated (in Serbia we translate names) in the subtitles. I actually thought the translation was a pun but it's not, the guy translated it correctly.

I think the movie is full of many references, about 95% of all material in it is from *somewhere*, as in - it's not original. I've seen enough to really recognize about 95% of all the stuff. I believe 100% of material, from visuals, sounds to actual dialogs - have a hidden meaning.

That's one of the things making it an epic, a true piece of art.

reply to post by seattletruth


Don't forget that the word "Navi" is derivative of the Hebrew word "Prophet". I don't speak Hebrew but it caught my eye cause the Arabic word "Nabi" means prophet. Because they are sister languages, I checked and its true that Navi means prophet.

Throw that into the mix.
Good find...
...you are correct, the word that is traditionally translated 'prophet' is נְבִיא = navi

The meaning of navi is described in Deuteronomy 18:18, where God is recorded to have said,

"I will put my words in his mouth and he will speak to them all that I command him."

Thus, the navi (prophet) was thought to be the "mouth" of God.

The root nun-vet-alef ("navi") is based on the two-letter root nun-vet which denotes openness...
...the prophet's mouth must be available to speak God's words.

Navi - prophecy people eh?



[edit on 12/1/10 by troubleshooter]

Originally posted by SassyCat
The Col. Quaritch's name - it means "Rotten" or "Corrupt" in Serbian language, it's written "Kvarić", that's also how it's officially translated (in Serbia we translate names) in the subtitles. I actually thought the translation was a pun but it's not, the guy translated it correctly.

I think the movie is full of many references, about 95% of all material in it is from *somewhere*, as in - it's not original. I've seen enough to really recognize about 95% of all the stuff. I believe 100% of material, from visuals, sounds to actual dialogs - have a hidden meaning.

That's one of the things making it an epic, a true piece of art.

Nice one...

Thanks for that insight...
...Quaritch was one name I could find no meaning for.