It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.


Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.


Bush's War

page: 1

log in


posted on May, 24 2004 @ 10:49 PM
Zinni argues, and I agree, a war on terrorism is wrongheaded and sure looser.

We can not win a war of ideas and cultures by killing people. Unless one is committed to killing every one of those we perceive as enemy. And that is called genocide. Who here is for genocide? Shall we now then call Mr. Bush Hitler II?

Some others have quipped wed have never won any non-war war; and those we have undertaken are complete flops and turn out to be profit areas for one’s political supporters. Remember the “War on Poverty”, “The War on Drugs” and the less publicized “War on Spam”, to name but a few that come to mind.

The terrorists are murderers and deserve the status of and treatment as such - Criminals.

Calling them “terrorists” and elevating them to the status on nation-state is unseemly and counterproductive.

Hunt them like dogs; give them no quarter; but do nothing that sets them apart, makes them seem special from any of the other low-life scum of the earth.

Yes. We are stuck with a mess in Iraq that needs to be completed. There’s no way out of that one. If we pull out now the entire Middle East will go to flames. But I know of no one in leadership who proposes such a course.

We are stuck with cleaning up the Bush mess.

posted on May, 24 2004 @ 11:08 PM
The moment Bush stole office, I knew that there would be an attack. Simply because the world of Arabs hate Bush's father, Cheney and Powell. To them, it was as if it would be if Germany's new president was Adolph's son. So , just his being in the White House renders us at the red level. And , the most troubling thing about that is, apparently they are right.
Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld and Powell have only one talent, they know how to provoke terrorism. And each day becomes more and more dangerous. The best thing we can do to at least lower the terrorist threat, is to get rid of the Bush oil regime. They are nothing but LIARS.

posted on May, 24 2004 @ 11:42 PM
Genocide is what the Islamist extremists want and have been aiming for, are we going to let them do it?

This is almost the same that happened in Germany, Hitler said that the Jewish people were the cause for every problem in the world and he wanted to kill them all (go figure now neo-commies say the same of the United States government, that it is the cause of all problems in the world and the world would be better without us...yeah right.)

But this time Islamic extremists have to use other tactics since they don't openly have the rest of the Islamic world using violence against infidels.

Are we to let another genocide like what happened with the Jewish people and all other people that are non-Muslim? What did Hitler do after most Jewish people were either killed or subjugated? He wanted to control the world and set forth to do this.

This is the same thing Islamic extremists want, and there seems to be some Islamic moderates that want the same. Not too long ago we had a Muslim member with an avatar of a few Muslims is some kind of protest and one of them was holding a board that said "Islam will DOMINATE the world."

This coming from someone who proclaimed to be a moderate Muslim. How many others like him agree, even if its not directly, with the view of the extremists? Is it just a problem with extremism or is there something else that is feeding this hatred? Is this hatred rooted in islam itself?

I will not post those parts of the Kuran that condone and asks Muslims to commit atrocities, but if you want to read the Kuran here is a link to it.

[Edited on 24-5-2004 by Muaddib]

posted on May, 24 2004 @ 11:45 PM
war on drugs....every year we have enough money to burn down every drug producing plant in the world, but yet we dont do cops can have narcotic unit and washington have another glorious front to fight.

how ironic to say they are terroists when we kill back their innocent civilians...sure MAYBE they have started, but we are all the same, fight evil with evil. this chain of hatred will never end until everyone of us is dead...

posted on May, 24 2004 @ 11:54 PM
I had a link but I can't seem to find it now but....
In a speach he gave, Dubya referred to the war on terror as a crusade. The original Crusades were to take back the "Holy Land" from the muslems. Maybe that's what he's trying to do. He keeps saying that we're a christian nation.

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 01:27 PM
Well if he says that we are a christian nation then he needs to go take a few classes on American History

We are not a christian nation and we better not be a christian nation in my lifetime. I dont have anything against Christians personally, Im just not a believer myself ( I used to be though)

We are a nation of diversity..We are free. This is what makes up America but sure, most of America are christians, alot arent. We have no business messing with other beliefs on the other side of the world.

My opinion. Had to get it out because I'm sick of this nonsense.

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 01:35 PM
Here is the sick thing about! The war is against Terrorists, right? Well, say they do kill a large group of terrorists. All this is going to acomplish is for non-terrorists (of the same religious/political/cultural group as the terrorists) to feel threatened and become terrorists in order to defend their way of life from the American death machine.

It is like that old Buster Keaten skit where he keeps going to pick his hat off the ground, but anytime he gets close enough to grab it, he kicks it just a little further out of arm's reach.

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 01:44 PM
This is exactly why a free Iraq is so important to the war on terror.

A free Iraq will not be producing terrorists. Iran will see the Free Iraq and say exactly what they are saying now anyway, "We want to be free!".

This is the plan to win the war. Create freedom. When people can go to a job and then come home to a television, or Gamecube or whatever else their good hearts desire, they will not have the desire to enter a terrorist organization.

There will still be recruits for a time after Iraq is completely free, but recruiting will die down beginning with a Free Iraq.

If you notice this, America, besides a little event the other day, is not going out of our way to kill. When we are attacked we fight back. Right now the main mission is just the freedom of Iraq.

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 01:48 PM
We have stirred up a hornets nest in iraq.. Iraq is technically free right now right? Saddam is gone, people are going to school, etc... But the terrorists still thrive. They will continue to hate america and everything we stand for. No bomb on earth can convince them to change their views and their passions. Bombs only make their hate grow. Evil begets Evil.

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 01:50 PM

Originally posted by Muaddib
Genocide is what the Islamist extremists want and have been aiming for, are we going to let them do it?

So we can assume your vote is for genocide?

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 01:56 PM

Originally posted by NotTooHappy
No link required for me. I heard it first hand and read the reply by Osama as it reverberated thru the moslem press for week - page 1 news item.

Bothe these damn guys are dangerous to the health and well being of the world.

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 01:58 PM
I think that the muslin world see us a much a terrorist as we are to believe they are and I don't blame them, we are off our own territory over the sea and into their land and killing them, now will anybody argue that this is no view as terrorism.

Yes I will no argue that we had a reason to fight terrorist beacuse of what happend on 9/11 but that does not include the entire islamic nation.

I am so tired of everything that I had not seen the news in 3 days I can not take anymore I feel drain and sick. I am sorry is this sound like a cry baby.

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 02:07 PM

Originally posted by Thatoneguy
Well if he says that we are a christian nation then he needs to go take a few classes on American History

We are not a christian nation and we better not be a christian nation...


Interesting fact: US affirmed that USA was NOT a christian nation in Treaty of 1804.

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 02:27 PM
The way you get someone to change their behavior is you make it too expensive for them to continue in their old ways.

Every person you meet gets SOMETHING from the way they behave, or they would change it. I'm not refering here to outside forces, but their internal motivations.

An alcoholic gets something from each drink, or they wouldn't do it. Bullies and spousal abusers get something from their own behavior as well.

My toddler gets something out of willfully disobeying me.

So how do you get someone to change? You make their choices so expensive for them that they decide BY THEMSELVES to do something different.

Like it or not, this is the path that Israel is using in the Gaza. Bombings within Israel are in steep decline; there are even weeks without a single bombing. Why? Because they have made it so expensive for the neighbors of terrorists, and the families of terrorists, that on many blocks, bomb factories are just not welcome. Parents don't encourage their children to waste their lives on terrorism, only to bring violence from the occupiers into their neighborhood.

Of course, Israel would get a lot further by giving people jobs and credit cards. But then, jobs are fairly scarce in Israel for everybody.

The U.S. is using the same program, with similar results. Fewer attempts are made in the U.S., because Al Quaida as taught us how to be more vigilant. So they are shifting to softer targets, in Europe or even in the 'Arab street' of the Middle East.

The lesson we are teaching is not aimed at Al Quaida, but at their NEIGHBORS, their subjects, the Middle of the road types. The message we are sending is that we CAN tell the difference between an Iraqi or Afghan that has declared war on the West, and one that has not.

If you don't want American violence in your town, then distance yourselves from our enemies.

I know a lot of people hate Reagan, but he gave a speech once where he said something like this (not a direct quote):

We have no right to expect other countries to love us. No one has a right to expect someone else's love. So we shouldn't try to buy other nations' loyalty. We cannot make them love us. But we are entitled to their respect. And it is proper to require their respect. We ought to be prepared to respect them in return, and reward them for doing so.


posted on May, 25 2004 @ 03:04 PM

We have no right to expect other countries to love us. No one has a right to expect someone else's love. So we shouldn't try to buy other nations' loyalty. We cannot make them love us. But we are entitled to their respect. And it is proper to require their respect. We ought to be prepared to respect them in return, and reward them for doing so.

posted on May, 25 2004 @ 08:11 PM
I take issue with your major premise suggesting your method of behavioral change presented as the single effective method. As a matter of experience the method you suggest most often does not affect change at all but only acts as a deterrent to the underlying attitude/behavior.


The method being used by Israel (Eye for an Eye) has been in use since 1948. I would call 50 +years of killing and distruction with little effect a FAILED POLICY..... but then I might have your patience.

Much research has been done on this subject. “Change” methodology has been at the heart of the management/business reinvention phenomenon currently sweeping the corporate world.

I suggest you do a Google search on “methods of changing behaviors/attitudes” if you wish to broaden your perspective. I have listed a few cites below as starters in no particular order or importance but as a sampling:

I also recommend you check Kohlberg's stages of moral development for a better understanding of just what one might be teaching as a person behaviors change/ or ar changed.

[Edited on 25-5-2004 by gmcnulty]

top topics


log in