Boy killed by bullet 'fired three miles away'

reply to post by sotp


Those idiots with guns are the ones that ruin it for those who do not do stupid stuff with their firearms.

I think ignorance is to blame more than the 2nd amendment. Perhaps we should employ better gun safety education programs. Or perhaps we should force these people to provide character witnesses before they buy a gun..

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Again, 'somebody' may have taken his place. You speak of the Nanny State of the UK but we sure as hell aren't afraid, nor need to be coaxed into staying home on celebratory nights for fear of random bullets flying past our heads... so, by your own admission, which is the nanny state again? Doesn't sound like the UK anymore does it?

As for staying inside, he was, not necessarily inside his home, but inside of a building nonetheless, with friends and family - a fairly secure environment by most's standards.

As for any emotional response; the only emotion I've conveyed is sympathy for the grieving and abhorrence for your lack thereof.

reply to post by Pr0t0


Prudence and common sense to avoid potential mayhem is not a nanny state friend. The fact that it can be allowed to exist disproves that point. People are free to celebrate in the fashion that they so choose here in America. That's not always safe. Kind of like joining a motor cycle gang, loads of fun, but not always safe.

Some people opt for safe instead of fun.

Who didn't opt for safe? The boys parents, and there is no getting around the fact that they placed him in that jeapordy as the boy did not drive himself to church his family did.

I have stated time and time again its a tragedy one I hold all three parties responsible for.

The man who shot the gun, the parents and the church officials.

The child was a rightless minor who was hostage to the actions of all three.

All three parties are negligent and the fact that someone is greiving over the loss caused by their own negligence is not an excuse for not pointing out their own negligence.

Your arguments are all based on emotion, indignation and anger.

That is how your government would prefer you to react and ours too, that is why a more sensible Nanny is then needed.

To seperate all the crying and whining and frightened and angry children and to stop their bickering and tell them what they must do, what's right, what's safe.

I happen to know its not entirely safe to go out during certain occassions and make that decision without having to be told utilizing something called common sense.

I am still alive by the way.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


How are the church officials in any way responsible? How are the boys parents in any way accountable? Yes the shooter, but no one else can or should be held accountable for this.

Nice attempt to pursue the emotional response avenue, by the way, but I sing to my own tune, not yours, your governments, my governments or anyone else. Since you failed to read the last line of my previous post, which was a genuine assessment of emotional response in this thread, I will leave it to your own deduction as to which emotions I employ; you certainly don't seem to have the ability to assess a text based conversation correctly, but I'll allow you to continue, without recourse.

And remember, it is your government who tells the whiny children to stay home on New Years, not mine.

[edit on 4-1-2010 by Pr0t0]

reply to post by Pr0t0

How are the church officials in any way responsible? How are the boys parents in any way accountable? Yes the shooter, but no one else can or should be held accountable for this.

This should be fairly obvious to anyone not in denial. The church is responsible for the structures integrity. Obviously it is a substandard dwelling if it was so penetrated with lethal force. Believe me the attorneys will be looking at that!

Once again the parents dragged the child out into the cold late at night to place him into harms way. The child is dead through the parent’s actions. That’s just a fact. Had they stayed home the boy would be alive.

Unlike the United Kingdom which bans firearms and even arrests and imprisons people for defending themselves from home intruders…

The local government here urges people to exercise caution it doesn’t legislate it. Marshall Law is not declared New Years Eve; the responsible local governments simply remind people of the added risks and what they are.

They also suggest everyone have at least a bare minimum of supplies during hurricane season to take care of yourself in the case that weather or the damage it causes keeps rescue officials from getting to you right away.

They don’t force you to have three days supplies. It’s common sense and the tens of thousands of Americans standing in front of the Superdome 2 days after Katrina with no food or water had no common sense.

I keep a month’s worth of emergency supplies on hand. No one forces me to do that, I do so because it’s prudent.

I am sorry friend, they are just not rational arguments you are putting forth.

Perhaps I should just check with the Queen or Prime Minister Brown after all it’s only their opinions that matter over there.

Let’s see where did I leave her number at. I have met the Queen by the way, she complimented me on my remarkable common sense!


[edit on 4/1/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
What a tragedy, only the good die young though.

Proof positive religion will not save you! Did the gun kill the boy or his parents dragging a three year old to church?

Cause and effect.

Out of line, traveler.

Cause -- human stupidity.

Effect -- Faith-testing tragedy.

You watch yourself.

Originally posted by TarzanBeta

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
What a tragedy, only the good die young though.

Proof positive religion will not save you! Did the gun kill the boy or his parents dragging a three year old to church?

Cause and effect.

Out of line, traveler.

Cause -- human stupidity.

Effect -- Faith-testing tragedy.

You watch yourself.

Well if this thread proves one thing it is that you really have to watch yourself.

G-d sure won't not even when you are three, not even when you are in church!

Tell the doc on the next checkup no need to test the knees the reactions are fine!

Thanks.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Remarkably you're the only person here who cannot see past your single mindedness.

What do the Prime Minister (who none of us voted in) or the Queen (ditto) have to do with this? I simply have to refuse to continue to debate with you on this matter, not for any emotive reason, simply that my common sense outweighs my desire to confront nonsense this evening.

Originally posted by bsbray11
I don't know about blaming religion, but a toddler being killed at church by a stray bullet from 3 miles away should just beg critical thinking from a lot of church-going Christians.

It's obviously a tragedy either way.

Yeah... CRITICAL thinking will arrive you at THIS understanding:

Evil of this world has NO LIMITS. IMAGINE THE ODDS!!

Jerk fires bullet into air at precisely the right EVERYTHING so that the bullet literally makes its way up... and then comes back down... interestingly enough!! -- THROUGH A CHURCH ROOF -- THROUGH A CHILD'S HEAD.

The odds, if calculated, would be ASTOUNDING according to you... godless people.

Do you think for a second that the parents are questioning their faith over this? First of all, we are assuming they have faith. But, because this happened to their kid, I'm guessing they had faith to begin with because Evil rarely screws with its own kind unless it's for deceptive purposes.

Before I continue... where's your heart?! Christians are people, too, you know?! Heart for the kid! Heart for the parents! What ARE you? I may be a jerk, but I'm nothing like you.

Don't you think it's insanely ironic that you want to be anti-God but then you want to claim that there is a REASON this happened? Building a church RIGHT in the path of that place MUST be the reason that happened! The start of Christianity caused this event to happen! Of course!! Wow, you know better than your own logic, I'm sure. It's foolish and it's not logic.

Firstly, how do you know that the person who shot the bullet wasn't somehow conceived by people who met by going to that church? Of course, without Christianity, America simply wouldn't exist even CLOSE to the way it is today, if at all.

But, most importantly, you oh-so mentally near-sighted friend of ours... tell me...

WOULD YOU HAVE EVER BEEN BORN IF IT WEREN'T FOR THE CREATION OF CHRISTIANITY?

If you were a God-fearin' person, you might say it's possible that your spirit would turn up elsewhere...

But, being the godless one that you are, it's scientifically impossible for you to exist if your entire family history is completely beside the fact the Christianity exists. Your entire history must be COMPLETELY unaffected by the mere existence of Christianity. Let me tell you, my near-sighted friend; you wouldn't stand a chance without it.

Enjoy yourself.

Edit to add that this reply is a general reply and not all of it is specifically directed at bsbray11. Sorry for any confusion.

[edit on 1/4/2010 by TarzanBeta]

reply to post by Pr0t0


It’s called presence of mind friend. You see some people actually say what they mean and mean what they say.

I have asked you to explain how the boy could have died if he stayed at home, you had no answer.

I have asked you how he could have died had the church been better built, you have no answer.

It’s a tragedy that could have been avoided through the parents using common sense and the church being properly built.

The world is full of drunken fools especially on New Years Eve, they aren’t going to stop being drunken fools so it’s up to those of us who value our own safety to see properly too it.

My argument is a simple one, when you make that a priority you don’t end up falling victim to such needless tragedy.

Sorry you can’t see that. My other point is that it’s the lack of people using common sense that allows the rise of Nanny States to impose it’s will on them for better or worse.

I would rather me be responsible for me than the state, I can rely on me and tax a whole lot less!

The Queen says hi by the way!

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Originally posted by TarzanBeta

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
What a tragedy, only the good die young though.

Proof positive religion will not save you! Did the gun kill the boy or his parents dragging a three year old to church?

Cause and effect.

Out of line, traveler.

Cause -- human stupidity.

Effect -- Faith-testing tragedy.

You watch yourself.

Well if this thread proves one thing it is that you really have to watch yourself.

G-d sure won't not even when you are three, not even when you are in church!

Tell the doc on the next checkup no need to test the knees the reactions are fine!

Thanks.

Read my post before this one. The majority of it was meant for you.

Good luck with that attitude of yours.

Originally posted by fmcanarney
reply to post by john124

 

John, 40 m/s is 120 feet per second, about a third as fast as a slingshot projectile. 120 feet per second will not kill anyone, bruise yes, kill no.

Fully agree with this part

Plus a bullet travels 1.5 miles per second and will likely travel up to 20 miles into the air before it reaches the apex and falls.

Not sure how you came up with this distance but research shows that a 30-06 will travel roughly 5500 yards maximum range. (roughly 3.125 miles)
This assumes holding the rifle at a 45 degree angle above level.
But,,, It depends on the bullet weight and propellant load.
The above figure is for the standard military M-2 cartidge, caliber .30

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


In that case you sleep safe in your bomb shelter for the rest of the year won't you.

If you need answers to your 'what if' questions, if they aren't glaringly obvious then I can't help.

And finally, in your attempt to be witty you have completely alienated yourself from future rational discussion with myself, and I'm sure several sincere posters on this board, so congratulations if this was your intended outcome.

As previously mentioned I am not willing to continue this discussion, this post is not to have the last word, simply to once again alleviate you of any necessity to retort. So please, let's agree to disagree, and leave it at that. Good night.

reply to post by TarzanBeta


All I know my friend is that if this boys parents had exercised some common sense the child would still be alive.

Christianity like all religions have so much blood on their hands it is not funny.

Inquisitions, pogroms, witch trials that fun burning people at the stake, religious wars waged all over the world today under the thinly veiled disguise of the war on terror.

Religion sure did not save this child's life.

You might want to let G-d make his own arguments instead of being so brash and to bold as to assume what those might be.

That is in large part what is wrong with religion, people taking liberty and license to interpret things in a manner that suits them just fine and then to cloak it in G-ds name and pretend it's G-d's will and G-d talking instead of their own will, and them talking.

At least I take ownership for my words and actions friend.

Responsibility for them too, this child’s parents needlessly endangered his life by taking him out on arguably the least safe evening of the year, now he is dead for that and to spare them their feelings you want to avoid that?

Sadly religions and those who imagine themselves to be religious are full of circular arguments that excuse personal responsibility to lay it some where else.

No wonder the world is in such a mess and sorry state.

I remember the movie Oh God with George Burns and Bob Denver, in it God really didn't like all the hypocrites and religious types who tried speaking for him.

He didn't think it was fair and I think he was right.

If you have a human argument or debate of your own feel free to share it.

Thanks!

[edit on 4/1/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

reply to post by Pr0t0


You have a nice evening friend, thanks for sharing.

Remember your promise the next time I am on a Mason's thread!

The boys death is a tragedy that deserves a hard and thorough examination.

In case you don't get it my friend, I am advocating that parents protect their children at any and all costs.

If you want to fault me for that fine.

Thanks, good evening to you, I will tell the Queen you said hi back, I wouldn't want her to think you were purposefully neglectful of her.

Tally ho!

Traveler...

That -was- the human argument.

You wouldn't last against a greater intelligence.

Enjoy.

Edit to remove the previous quotes and fix spelling.

P.S. - Remember on your death bed what you could have done to save yourself.

[edit on 1/4/2010 by TarzanBeta]

[edit on 1/4/2010 by TarzanBeta]

reply to post by TarzanBeta


I hold myself quite well in the Universe thank you very much!

There are many things out there by the way.

It's why I really think this child's parents should have stayed home.

Be well!

I found an image of the inside of the Covington Drive Church of God of Prophecy , where the unfortunate incident took place .


The style/structure of roof is visible.


Large image .
Covington Drive, Church of God of Prohecy.

I don`t know if you can deduce what the structural integrity of the roof is- just from this photo .

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


I sometimes agree with you, and almost always at least recognize your logic, though I may not agree. However, in this particular instance I feel you are rather off the mark and frankly am surprised by your position on this subject.

You point I am replying to states that the parents are at fault because they had no business taking a young child out of the house late at night when people are known to be drinking and shooting guns off.

Huh? So let me get this straight -- I should remain in my house at any and all times when people may be drinking heavily and/or shooting guns? Well, damn it's hunting season here. My horses have been shot twice because of stray bullets. So according to your logic, it would not be wise to leave my house during hunting season period.

Whatever happened to actually prosecuting the guilty and allowing the innocent to enjoy our freedoms?

And your comment regarding the fact that they should have simply prayed at home shows you have no knowledge or interest in religion -- which is fine and is your right -- but then you have no place telling those that do believe HOW they should believe and/or worship.

Do you know how many people died in a car wreck in the US in the last month? Do you still drive or are driven? Well you shouldn't -- it's a very potentially dangerous road out there so follow your own advice to others and in order to remain safe -- don't ever get in a car again.

You know if Geometry didn't exist that church would never had existed. I say it is geometry's fault that the boy died.