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Why do reborn Christians regard all "spirits" as demons?

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posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 08:13 AM
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reply to post by tinfoilman
 


I loved your post tinfoilman. You proved to me they can be the biggest jerks. I am a firm believer in ghosts and aliens but I have never seen one, thank goodness. I don't want one haunting me.

I have heard stories from close friends about their encounters. One was a demon and the other was a UFO. In both cases the beings had no intent for enlightenment. Sounds like a bunch of jerks to me.

I don't know why they are affraid of humans. Maybe there is some rule they are playing by. Maybe they have exposure time credits. If they use them up they can't play their phyiscal card.

Two small spirits got exposed when one old lady accidentally saw them Then the two beings freaked out and flew back into their portal. Sounds like wild animals to me.




posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 08:37 AM
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reply to post by halfoldman
 

S&F for your post.

I too have often wondered at this. I have seen spirits of the dead for most of my life, and as a small boy played with the spirits of 6 soldiers who I have fought with in a forgotten war. We played war every day, my and my men, and I never thought anything of this. One day, home late for supper, my Mother questioned me as to where I had been, so I told her, I have been playing war with my men on the woods. She just about lost it, she was a devout Christian. Further questioning me, she became convinced that these were demons from hell. The next few days were hell, she called out two church women and a preacher who who undertook to pray the demons out of me. I remember is was a hot July that year, and we had no air conditioning in those days...I will never forget the smells coming from those people. Long story short, there were no demons, what they are is former persons who were now dead and trapped here. I have seen them again, and I see other dead people too, it is a curse, or a blessing, I don't know which.

I have noticed that when a Christian "sees" Jesus, it is always accepted as truth, and is someone happens to see a spirit of a dead person, or any other spirit, it is always a demon. Why is this, mind control? I think it is mind control. The dead are not that far away, people, and they are not, for the most part, demons! Also, there are other formerly alive persons who walk the planet and try to advise people, some call them "Ascended Masters." These are not demons either.

Don't get me wrong now, demons exist, and so does their boss, Satan. Human beings create material things by thought-forms, so years of devout belief in demons has created a bunch of them, thank you, Christians. When we all cross over into the Spirit World, these demons will be there, but guess who they will be after? Their creators, and the ones who are scared to death of them! Enjoy the afterlife, everybody gets what they want there. You want to be tortured by demons? So be it. Want to go to hell? It's waiting for those who believe in it.



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 12:03 PM
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One of the best sources for understanding Devils, Demons and the Nephilim is a publication/book by John Klein and Adam Spears titled: "Devils and Demons and the Return of the Nephilim." In the book they explains that demons are the disembodied souls of Nephilim.

When these half human and half demon Nephilim children die, there soul has no where to go because they were not created by God. As such these dead Nephilim when they die become Demon spirits in another realm that look to find new human hosts to inhabit in order to fulfill the Nephilim desire to experience human emotions, fear and all the vibrations that these demons feed from humans similar to Vampires feeding on blood to survive.

Demons want to inhabit humans to feed off of the emotions and feelings while Devils want to possess your soul. One wants to feed and bring the human host down by corrupting and influencing the human to acts of violence, murder, lust, sex, anything that excites the human body. Devils are different from demons and the book I referenced earlier will explain the hierarchy and organization. It will lay out the structure and explains in very simple terms the difference in Devils, Demons and Nephilim.

One of the other interesting points brought out by the book is that Angels are all male. There are no female Angels. This is a myth. There are female spirits, but spirits are not Angels. Anyway its a good reference book to have on hand as it is a good source for understand all the differences and purposes of those that fell from heaven. It's a 207 page publication that in my opinion offers a good amount of information necessary to better understanding Demons, Devils and what is referenced to as Nephilim.



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 12:09 PM
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reply to post by halfoldman
 




somebody who believes this, where is the evidence in the Bible?


It's basically a patchwork quilt of evidence that leads us to that belief. Of course, the Saul episode that you mention. Then the fact we are told there is a gulf that separates the dead from the living and that they cannot come back to interact with the living. Then the NT story of Lazarus when the rich man seeks to return with a message to his family but is forbidden. Necromancy is forbidden in the OT laws because it is believed to be demonic spirits, Etc.

[edit on 1/4/2010 by AshleyD]



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 12:23 PM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 

Thanks for explaining, the patchwork explanation makes sense and this is probably why it is so hard to understand this contemporary interpretation.
With all these things to contact the deceased being banned (but yet not dismissed as ineffective), one could swear that religion has something to hide regarding the afterlife.



[edit on 4-1-2010 by halfoldman]



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 02:34 PM
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reply to post by sphinx551
 
Sorry, Mod, this is actually a reply to the OP.

Only the people who believe that can answer it.

By the teaching of the New Testament and many OT prophecies, the Holy Spirit is obviously not a demon or evil.

So if one believes in the Holy Spirit, by definition, one does not believe all spirits are evil or demons.

Angels (not fallen) = not evil spirits. If they were all evil, we would not need to test them.

And btw, there is significant fossil evidence for the nephilim.

One need only search for it. Chuck Missler has some videos on YouTube, but there are many archival newspaper stories of discoveries during the 19th century, right here in the US.

[edit on 4-1-2010 by Copperflower]



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 03:26 PM
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Because they're afraid of realizing the truth that not all elements of Christianity are true. They're afraid that god isn't a white-bearded man who keeps heaven off-limits, as if it were some exclusive club. But most importantly, because they fail to open their minds.



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 04:09 PM
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Originally posted by halfoldman
In the accepted Old Testament Saul encounters the dead via the "Witch of Endor". Some verses are more specific: Job 4:15, "Then a spirit passed my face; and the hair of my flesh stood up".
How, why or where does anyone get the message in the Bible that all spirits are "demons"?
Somebody please explain why significant amounts of people believe in aliens and spirits, but only as "demons"?

[edit on 3-1-2010 by halfoldman]


Hi halfoldman,

I'm a Christian, though not a fundamentalist, but I've spoken with a lot of 'born again' Christians (as well as other denominations). My impression is that the more fundamentalist/literally bible-based faction of Christianity sees spirits as EITHER human deceased, or demonic in orgin, or angelic beings in the service of God. (And as said in this discussion before, God too is Spirit of course!)

The taboo on dealing directly with spirits comes from our relative inability to distinguish between goodies and nasties. A spirit being could pretend to be a human, passed-on, family-member, yet in reality be a demon masquerading as a beloved human we grieve over. This could expose the person 'contacted' to great spiritual danger, and insidious deceptions.

So my answer would be there's a slight misconception in your starting post. The fear shown by Christians toward forms of Spiritualism/contacting the dead, stems not from the idea that all spirits are evil demons, but from the potential of demons infiltrating themselves in such interactions.

Personally, I am open minded toward aliens existing, and some species hopefully being 'good guys'. Also I appreciate and respect Spiritualists and Psychics as people of another (version of) faith, on one more road toward discovery.


smilodon

[edit on 4/1/10 by smilodon]

[edit on 4/1/10 by smilodon]



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 04:16 PM
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We don't. But alot of us believe that so-called ghosts and spirits stuck here are demonic, because after death the soul goes either to Heaven or Hell. therefore alot of us think ghosts are demonic but i do like a good ghost story or movie.


[edit on 10-04-08 by Beach Bum]



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 04:33 PM
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Originally posted by halfoldman

Originally posted by thisnamenotinuse
Evidence is a study in itself, but you can start by reading Genesis 6:4.


I cannot agree - the hybrids in Genesis were physical beings. Demons are non-material and cannot interbreed with us.
I believe in many spirits, but only a few are demons or the "Jinn" that was never embodied. But maybe Im wrong?


Then how did they eat and kill men as stated in the good book? They were very real and they were the muscle behind the Megaliths we see today IE Pyramids and others. Why do you think they called them Gods and their offspring the Giants? Let alone that would explain all the Bigfoot sightings, Man hunted and killed the Giants who survived the Flood. I don't think we got them all and they multiplied. I have had an encounter with one of these Giants, so they are real very real.



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 05:09 PM
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reply to post by MaxBlack
 


The Watchers are the fathers of the Nephilm- (GIANTS). The Watchers IE so called fallen angels were sons of God and Gods themselves. The parents of the Nephilm are the Watchers IE sons of God and human woman daughters of God.

God made them, The Giants Demons just because they are not Divine spirits.

www.thedivinecouncil.com... Mike is the foremost expert on this subject, Check him out. The best reading I have done in along time.



posted on Jan, 4 2010 @ 06:30 PM
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reply to post by lostinspace
 


lol. I'm glad you enjoyed my post. I guess I'm just getting frustrated with them after ghost hunting for so long.

At first I was trying to catch something on film or on audio or understand it like everyone else is. After over ten years of amateur ghost hunting and my own paranormal experiences though, and hearing and seeing other people's experiences, the only conclusion I've come up with is these spirits certainly don't act like human beings and I'm starting to think they're actually something else entirely.

I could understand if there were one or two bad spirits or even if most of them were bad, but even if that was the case, then where's the good ones at?

People can easily get the wrong idea from Hollywood movies where the ghosts sometimes do actually communicate with people and even try to help them avoid some fate or help them in some way.

But that's Hollywood movies. In real life that never happens on a real ghost hunt. In real life you spend all of your time chasing shadow people or vanishing thermal images of a human outline only for it to run away.

Then in a few seconds it'll come back and start making sounds and knocking things over again until you find it again and then it's gone again. Also, that's at EVERY hunt. It's not like it's just one bad ghost. No matter where you go it's the same ghostly pattern all over the world. Where if they were really spirits of dead humans then you would expect the ghosts to have cultural differences and things like that depending on where they lived right? You don't see that in ghosts though.

That does not fit the description of the spirit of a deceased human. Humans behave differently and act differently. So, even if one was a jerk, not all of them would be. With ghosts, every single ghost has one single pattern and it seems tailor made to try to scare people or disturb them or harm them. Not communicate with them.

And most every psychic that claims they can communicate with the spirits usually ends up as being outed as a fraud before it's all said and done, so I have my doubts there that anyone is actually communicating with these things.

Also, they certaintly don't seem to really need any help because they won't communicate with you. They just seem like they're trying to scare you.

Obviously there should be at least one spirit of a human somewhere that would want to genuinely communicate with us about what the after life is like, but again, in real life that is never the case. Nowhere can you find a ghost that's willing to cooperate.

However, let's contrast that with actual human beings that have had near death experiences. Now, I'm not saying that NDEs are real, but everyone that has one seems to wake up and wants to do nothing more than tell every person in the world about their NDE experience and what the after life is like and say yes there is an AFTERLIFE!

Yet ghosts seem to not think it's important to tell us this? It's more important that they scare us or harm us? Definitely not the behavior you would expect from a human spirit.

I used to think also that maybe it's the case that they can only communicate with us for a short time. Maybe they can't just hang around and communicate like they would like too.

But that didn't make any sense to me either, because when they can affect our world, what do they waste their time doing? We would have to believe that even though they can only interact with us for very short time periods, that the ghost of a human spirit thinks the most important thing they can do with that limited time is annoy us, hurt us, or scare us? That doesn't make any sense. Why would they waste their time on such things if their time was in fact limited?

Also, many of the prophecies that have supposedly been give to us by spirits over many of thousands of years. They're really long sometimes. They go on and on and on. But all of a sudden when someone is like, well tell me about the afterlife we're to believe that every single spirit looks at its watch and then is like, oh yeah, about that. I'd love to tell you that, but I'm outta time. Sorry, gotta go! LOL?

I think it's time everyone consider that these things might not be human at all. They don't act anything like I would expect a human spirit to actually act. Not in my experiences anyway. Only in the movies, not in real life they don't.





[edit on 4-1-2010 by tinfoilman]



posted on Jan, 8 2010 @ 02:52 PM
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Christians can't even stub a toe without blaming it on the foul demon of foot ouchies.



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 07:27 PM
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Greetings Halfoldman,
I hope this answer is received into the heart it is written. I am a born again Christian, and wish only to give an answer I have experienced. I cannot go beyond what I know, that would be most unwise.
There is only God. Those who are born again are witness to the birth of Gods Son or Heart. When this is experienced there can be no aliens. There can be nothing that is alien. All becomes a spiritual manifestation of God solidified or compacted into the sense realm or the third principle, yet, it all remains spiritual after becoming spiritual to those born again.
Peace.



posted on Jan, 14 2010 @ 09:46 PM
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People tend to blame others for traits or things that they have themselves. You see people bashing on gays when in truth, they're a little queermosexual themselves. The same thing is happening with this. They're the ones harboring the negative spirits claiming to be loving and caring individuals who happen to think that if you don't believe in the awesome supernatural miraculous powers of Jesus you'll go hell while they smile guilt-free.

All truth.

[edit on 14-1-2010 by Jwest06]



posted on Jan, 16 2010 @ 05:12 PM
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reply to post by Jwest06
 


That's funny, I don't feel that way or act that way, and I don't know one Christian who does. I also live in the Bible belt, so the exposure is very great.

Also, I have to ask, how did you come by all the truth?

Just curious.



posted on Jan, 17 2010 @ 03:13 PM
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reply to post by Jwest06
 

So much truth everywhere! But hey, hey people play nice, this is not a political thread on all sides.
It would be interesting however if the political could be linked to the supernatural in a racist way. But outside horror movies that's probably not much experienced?
Several of my recieved notions have been challenged, which I think is great.
From my time as a reborn fundamentalist Christian I remember that all human souls were either in heaven or hell, or they were frozen somewhere until Judgement Day.
Therefore all other things supernatural were regarded as "demons".
I've seen this view repeated many times on other threads, but now I see it is not as strong or prevalent as I once presumed.
Thanks to all.


[edit on 17-1-2010 by halfoldman]



posted on Jan, 17 2010 @ 03:17 PM
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Because Christians aren't CHRISTians, and also some people are just darn ignorant, Like what is the HOLY SPIRIT..... No rudeness intended.

[edit on 17-1-2010 by SpiritHipHop]



posted on Jan, 17 2010 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by halfoldman
In the accepted Old Testament Saul encounters the dead via the "Witch of Endor". Some verses are more specific: Job 4:15, "Then a spirit passed my face; and the hair of my flesh stood up".
How, why or where does anyone get the message in the Bible that all spirits are "demons"?
Somebody please explain why significant amounts of people believe in aliens and spirits, but only as "demons"?

[edit on 3-1-2010 by halfoldman]


Hope you don't mind if I address this question? I really do not know what Christian call everything not Jesus looking a "demeon." (Greek: Inner Self) They do. for one who has had the curse of seeing dead people all of my life, this alone drove me far away from anything Christian. Now follow me here, if a good Christian "sees" Jesus, complete with fair hair and beard, and nicely tanned skin, not that is REAL. Any, and I do mean ANY other thing, spirit,or whatever, is automatically a demon from Hell, or one of the Devil's minions come to lie you.

I will tell you all a little story here, a true story, believe it or not.

As a small child, about 12-14, we had a large woods to play in, some odd 40 acres. Nice big trees. I had encountered some men out there in the woods, I though they lived in there. We fought war al the time, they had guns, and ragged clothing, and I too had a gun made of wood, a branch that looked like a rifle. We would fight all day sometimes, fighting "Yankees." I thought nothing of this, it was like real to me.

One day my mother, herself a Fundamentalist Christian from the word go, called me and I failed to answer, I came in over two hours late for supper, basically a crime to Mom. She began to question me on what I had been doing, so I just told her. told her the whole story, about the men, the war we were fighting, all of it. Mom became convinced that I was possessed my demons. A call to the preacher brought him and one other man, and two women to our house for three days in July. they tried their best, I have to give them that much, to pray out the demons in me, truth be known, there were none to find.

After I left the church, many years went by and those men were, and are still with me. In time of danger, I see them. If something big is happening, they are there. Others have seen them, all of my family, and more than a few friends. I believe they actually saved my life on two occasions, once in a car wreck, and once when a car fell from the lift to the floor in a flash, hands came out of nowhere to pull me to safety. These men served with me in the Civil War, there is not one doubt in my mind of this.

I often see the dead, at hospitals, nursing homes, which I avoid like the plague, and places where the old life and work. They are not demons, they are dead people.

Now on to the rest of my story. I became a Wiccan a long time ago. when i cast my first magick circle, and began to chant, I called out to the Goddess to join me, and a beautiful Feminine figure appeared in my circle, all in white she was, and this was no demon either. she practically bled love out to me, and I never felt so loved before. Would a demon exert love?

I have also see ET beings too, several times. Christians tell me there are demons too.

IMHO, everything Spirit is anything but a demon. I think, operative word, think that people who are really evil, really angry, really hateful, upon death they may stay here in this plane, and this is a demon. Satan, Devil, are made up by whoever made up the bible stories of them. If you want a People to FEAR, you have to have an Enemy for them to fear. There is nothing to fear from the dead, or from ET, or from any loving Spirit. Just show it love, and if it stays, it is good, if it runs away, it is not good. It's that simple, folks.



posted on Jan, 17 2010 @ 05:00 PM
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reply to post by halfoldman
 


I don't know if spirits exists ... but lets assume that it is so, and that good and bad entities exists ... then it seems like just plain good advice.

Let me explain :

1000's of year old spirits with abilities the see and remember perfectly (iq=5000,photografic memory), would at any time be able to decieve you to achieve their own goals (or the boss's goals)

if evil they would be totally unscrupulous, and ready/able to immitate your dead mothers voice and habits perfectly, you would never know and you would be completely defenseless, prone to believing what ever they would say ...

if good they would know how easily misguided you could be, and realise that the best way, to avoid you picking up interest in that stuff, would be to completely shut up, and never reveal their existence ..... to keep you doing what you were supposed to do here ...


You are like a cute little dog going to congress to change animal laws, congress is populateted by old experienced congress people having other agendas, maybe even dog trainers, or of chineese decent with a brother having a restaurant.

They can distract you in a second by throwing a bone to the little doggie .... or have you served on a dinner plate ....

It is just plain good advice for curious little humans





[edit on 17-1-2010 by pilot70] various spelling issues


[edit on 17-1-2010 by pilot70]



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