Ireland Bans Blasphemy

I kind of can't help but to laugh at this. I feel like the religious fanatics (i.e. the people who have to be all in your face about it and need your life to be similar to theirs) are going make ireland the model for how america should be.


stand by for comparisons of "the real america" and small irish towns by people like Palin

reply to post by djusdjus


If you read the Irish Times article posted by Jeanvaljean - you will see the following statement by the Irish Justice Minister explaining the decision to introduce such a law - it is infact to repeal earlier laws and to become in line with the constitution - however, the way the law is written should make it unlikely that a prosecution would ever be brought to bear.

The important part to note is that " no innocent conduct will be captured" - full quote below;

" I am repealing the Defamation Act 1961 which purported to provide a punishment for blasphemy. The Supreme Court in Corway pointed out that legislation was necessary to define the offence in relation to blasphemy. In repealing the relevant provisions of the 1961 Act it is necessary for me to provide for such a definition.

In doing so, I have taken the opportunity of ensuring that private prosecutions for blasphemy can no longer be brought by ensuring it is not a summary offence and that all prosecutions have to be brought by the independent prosecutor, the DPP. I have also removed the punishment of imprisonment and instead imposed a fine. The Labour Party in its proposed suggestion in regard to my amendment does not propose deletion of it, but rather to make a proposal as to the penalty involved.

This acknowledges that a provision is required on blasphemy if no referendum to take out the reference to blasphemy in the Constitution is held.

Finally, while the Constitution requires an offence of blasphemy it also, like the position in many other countries, expressly protects freedom of expression. My reform legislation will have to be construed in that context. No innocent conduct will be captured.

The revised provision in regard to blasphemy requires at least three elements to be present: that the material be grossly abusive or insulting in matters held sacred by a religion; that it must actually cause outrage among a substantial number of adherents of that religion; and, crucially, that there be an intent to cause such outrage. Such intent was not previously required"



[edit on 1-1-2010 by count66]

reply to post by the_denv

I can assure you that Northern Ireland is also mostly Catholic

utter twaddle , you are simply making your " facts " up

Originally posted by mamabeth
reply to post by audas

 

I'm part irish,speak with a little more respect please.There is a form
of stupidity in all races,nationalities...So,the irish passed a foolish law,
why brand all the irish for it!

Because its an Irish law passed by the irish -
what more needs to be said. - It paints Ireland into a very, very bad picture - there is no arguing with the fact. What you should be doing is taking this on board as valuable fodder to fight against this Irish Lunacy - for it is Irish is it not !! If you do not like what the Irish have done, then instead of claiming it is not Irish and dont blame the Irish (maybe it was a British or EU conspiracy) - stand up against the asinine development - call it for what it is a fight it. The point of saying that this makes the Irish look stupid is so that they - themselves stand up and fight it - not sook about like a child.

Your post wreaks of - well - its just stupid isn't it.

reply to post by audas


Did you bother to read any of the articles posted as to why this law was passed????

Originally posted by ignorant_ape
reply to post by the_denv

 

I can assure you that Northern Ireland is also mostly Catholic

utter twaddle , you are simply making your " facts " up

Is he - really - and your doing what - sticking to the facts are you...

Religious Affiliations in Northern Ireland 1961–2001
Religions 1961 1991 2001
Roman Catholic 34.9% 38.4% 40.3%
Presbyterian (Protestant) 29.0% 21.4% 20.7%
Church of Ireland (Protestant) 24.2% 17.7% 15.3%
Other Religions (including other Protestant) 9.3% 11.5% 9.9%
Not Stated 2.0% 7.3% 9.0%
None 0.0% 3.8% 5.0%

Yep - the Majority of northern irish are catholics- gosh who would have thought that - and oh the indignity of you being wrong - twaddle yourself.

This law will get tested, and go to the European supreme court.

People always say bad things about the Catholic church, and justifiably so.
Blasphemy to Catholics, but the bitter truth.

Originally posted by count66
reply to post by audas

 

Did you bother to read any of the articles posted as to why this law was passed????

What ?!!

Have you mate - seriously have you bothered to look at it or have you just skimmed over the glossy spin and concluded its a win win. Dont start questioning me with your multiple question marks !!! When you CLEARLY dont know what you are talking about yourself -

The fact of the matter is the Ireland has passed legislation with fines of £25K for blasphemy - the idea that this is good because people no longer have to go to jail, or that it needs a special prosecutor can only come from the mind of someone with remedial intellect and no concept of freedom from oppression - seriously twisted.

Here is some reading for YOU from Ireland on why this is a STUPID< STUPID STUPID thing and why people are opposed to it -

blasphemy.ie...

Thanks for your question marks - hope this helps you out.

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


This law was enacted to repeal earlier and more harsh laws.

The Irish constitution was written at a time when religion was an important part of Irish culture and as such reflected that fact.

This law has now reduced the punishment for blasphemy from imprisonment to a fine and has made it almost impossible for somebody to be prosecuted unless 3 distinct criteria have been met which I have already posted thanks to the link provided by jeanvaljean.

Living in Ireland under the old harsher laws - I still managed to see the Danish cartoons of Muhammed in the national newspapers - so this fuss about this law is a nonsense.

It was enacted to prevent an unnecessary constitutional referendum.

reply to post by audas


Really? and what great state of freedom do you live in?

I suppose in a country which either doesn't have a constitution or one where states have the death penalty, homsexuality criminalised, alcohol dry counties, blasphemy laws that are stricter than those imposed by the Irish constitution etc.

Why don't you tell us where you live so we can point out the stupidity of your race or would that be too close to the bone!!!

Originally posted by count66
reply to post by Blue_Jay33

 

This law was enacted to repeal earlier and more harsh laws.

The Irish constitution was written at a time when religion was an important part of Irish culture and as such reflected that fact.

This law has now reduced the punishment for blasphemy from imprisonment to a fine and has made it almost impossible for somebody to be prosecuted unless 3 distinct criteria have been met which I have already posted thanks to the link provided by jeanvaljean.

Living in Ireland under the old harsher laws - I still managed to see the Danish cartoons of Muhammed in the national newspapers - so this fuss about this law is a nonsense.

It was enacted to prevent an unnecessary constitutional referendum.

NO - no it is not - it is ridiculous. Your claim is ridiculous and your position is untenable unless of course you wholesale condone backward religious laws dominating modern progressive society - I think you do.

This type of law would not stand a chance in most progressive societies - it is utterly abhorrent.

The fact that Ireland had a chance to remove this type of crap entirely from its system - but instead chose to reinforce it by continuiing it in another form is the worst possible outcome.

Time to look at it for what it is - rather than only looking at the margin of change. For example : - rape is not as bad as murder - does that make rape good ? No - it is still bad - so is this law.

Originally posted by count66
reply to post by audas

 

Really? and what great state of freedom do you live in?

I suppose in a country which either doesn't have a constitution or one where states have the death penalty, homsexuality criminalised, alcohol dry counties, blasphemy laws that are stricter than those imposed by the Irish constitution etc.

Why don't you tell us where you live so we can point out the stupidity of your race or would that be too close to the bone!!!

Australia mate - any questions !!!!

Didn't think so - your supposition that I was American has just made you look like a tool - that said - if there any laws in Australia which are anachronistic and ridiculous I would only too gladly accept that and challenge them for the moronic stupidity that they are - not defend them out of petty parochial nationalistic fervor as you are doing - parochialism has to be the lowest form of pride.

EDIT TO ADD:

I see you have switched topics - when it became clear that I had indeed read - and that you clearly have not........best of luck goign forward champ - you sure as hell are going to need it - ooops!!!

e25K

[edit on 1-1-2010 by audas]

Originally posted by mamabeth
reply to post by audas

 

I'm part irish,speak with a little more respect please.There is a form
of stupidity in all races,nationalities...So,the irish passed a foolish law,
why brand all the irish for it!

Lots of people are part Irish - Im part Irish - this is a stupid thing the Irish have done. Its stupid and its Irish.

Who you say?

Idiot politicians trying to justify their worthless existence.

Originally posted by bigyin
Completely stupid waste of time. Who makes this rubbish up.

Dunno how the Celtic supporters are gonna get round this when they are screaming abuse at the Rangers ... and vice versa.

Would it even cover that, the difference between Catholic and Protestant, both are Christian faiths ?

Or is inter faith abuse acceptable ?

reply to post by audas


My point being that you live in a country without a constitution - which was the first part of my sentence - so unless you can't read I believe that someone else is the tool.

So as an Australian when you get a constitution and are ready to be free from colonialism as Ireland mostly is - then you can criticise our repealing of an archaic law to be replaced by another nonsensical law that will never be enforced!

'The new law defines blasphemy as publishing or uttering matter that is grossly abusive or insulting in relation to matters held sacred by any religion, thereby intentionally causing outrage among a substantial number of adherents of that religion, with some defences permitted.'

Note the 'grossly abusive or insulting'. Basically they are just going after radical atheists and other rabble rousers who love to mock religious figures while using disgusting over the top language etc etc. For those in Ireland who do not like the law, they can just leave? It's about time more nations shifted toward a theocracy.

reply to post by FirstRonin


Interesting story. Its not quite as stupid as hate speech laws however, since most people do actually hate others and it should therefore be legal to express that hate. Whereas the blasphemy law is directed at intentionally angering someone, hate speech is directed at informing someone of a truth they find uncomfortable. I know the legal definition of hate speech has less to do with hate as much as selective punishment of speech specific politician can't stand but still I have to figure the best definition of hate speech is speech related to feelings of hatred.

As a fundie surely this law would never effect you as you should not Blaspheme. unless your thinking it would stop you from attacking other religions.
Why you brought the Muslims into the debate, when it's about Ireland a catholic country,.

And how are they defining Blaspheme? It is one thing to speak bad about G-d, it is quite another to speak bad about the creator of the moon god religion fraud. History blasphems Islam, do you now squelch all history about that? Sure, this is about a predominately Catholic nation, but it spews its vile corruption to the One World Government, now forming on the framework developed in Copenhagen. I do not say UN, that is now the way of the League of Nations. And if your 'religious slant' is offended by, say, your recital of the history of Saturnalia, or Ashtarte, or the Sabbath moved to Sunday, is that blashpeme? It is, according to the US Constitution, none of the governments' business. People are always offended by something. Get over it.

Originally posted by count66
reply to post by audas

 

My point being that you live in a country without a constitution - which was the first part of my sentence - so unless you can't read I believe that someone else is the tool.

So as an Australian when you get a constitution and are ready to be free from colonialism as Ireland mostly is - then you can criticise our repealing of an archaic law to be replaced by another nonsensical law that will never be enforced!

Unlike Ireland which is still divided by the conquering English into Ireland and northern Ireland - or simply because the souther Irish deserted their brethren as the English enacted a pogrom of enforced conversions and saturated the country with immigration, land seizures and enforced subjugation - the fact that you simply allowed Ireland to be divided and conquered means that what happens in the north is no consequence to the south because you have washed your hands of it ?

Is that the Irish way is it - turn your back on your mates and walk out on them ?

Ireland is the colony here mate - and a backwards one at that dominated by laws evolved around superstitious clap trap.

Way to make yourself look like a tool - Australia has something called the Australian Constitution - it came about with federation - may I suggest that you do NOT try an tell people about their own countries - so far I have owned you on every point - your not doing well are you.

Federation ended our colonialism in 1901 -

www.australianpolitics.com...

[edit on 1-1-2010 by audas]

[
The fact that Ireland had a chance to remove this type of crap entirely from its system - but instead chose to reinforce it by continuiing it in another form is the worst possible outcome.

It occurs to me that noone would enforce the earlier law, but now they have a motive to enforce the new law; MONEY! In the same vein as traffic laws that are totally arbitrarily enforced, whenever the gang in power needs to raise extortion money. They do not demand money personally, like they do in many other nations, but extortion money for the government, to pay the 'law enforcement' salarys and benefits. This supposedly makes us more civilized. Actually, more devious, and evil.