Why People are STILL Laughing at Creationists (and ID'ers)

Originally posted by DOADOA
for those of you who think we evolved, think about this.

so if there were no living organism from what did living organisms evolve from?

good question. I don't think we know the answer to that one. The closest possible answer is that chance allowed molecules to come together in a way that led to self replicating molecules, and this is how the process started. No doubt that the vast space of time between the big bang and the time period when the first organisms existed was very very long so it is plausible that such a great space of time would have allowed for it to happen. It does present a problem in testing that theory in the laboratory because one would have to be able to either *shorten* the time required for it to happen artificially or somehow wait for billions of years for an experiment to conclude. That is of course not gonna happen.

With that said, organic molecules have been found in asteroids, which goes to show that some degree of self organization exists in those chemical structures. They spring up from places that did not come from earth.

I suppose computer simulation could also provide a way to test some of those theories in an accelerated time frame, but not with current computers.

But as you point out, we don't know. But that won't stop us from trying to find out by doing tests in the lab, hopefully that way we will find out more. I would hope that not knowing would compel us to keep looking instead of stopping and resorting to the bible for an answer. The bible has already been mistaken about some scientific facts, so maybe it doesn't hurt to check for ourselves by investigation and experimentation, since reality is the ultimate source of knowledge for what reality is.

It is OK to not know all the answers.

-rrr

reply to post by JaxonRoberts


My sincere apologies for not reading the entire thread. If someone has brought this up, my bad.

First off I want to state out front that I fall into the Darwinist camp. I thought the videos in general were clever and entertaining. That said I think most of us have seen clever videos in support of the various camps on the origins of life. My question is does a statement with links to supporting videos or other types of media alone constitute "thread" material?

JR, we can guess where you fall on this issue but tell me what here is unique that you've brought to our attention? Are you the narrator of the second video? What of this is yours?

This appears to be a stab at those who don't believe what you do. You provided some inflammatory material and sat back and waited to counter punch. That's fine, we've all done it. I would be a bit more accepting of your posting under "New videos debunking creationism" or something of that nature but that's just my opinion. We all do "whatever gets you through the night" as John Lennon said. Perhaps a bit more of your own insights into what was to be presented in the videos from the outset would have sat better with me. I thank you for your time and attention and for posting the videos.

Originally posted by autowrench
reply to post by JaxonRoberts

 

Wow! You really said it true, JaxonRoberts, Blind Faith it is, and I think having anything blind is not a good thing. And I also know that instead of just feeling sorry for the Christians/Muslims/Book Followers, some are trying to help them to understand. Even the word "Faith" has no power, nor does "Belief." I have "Ideas," which are based on research and personal experiences, and yes, even books. Those ideas can be readily changed when new information comes forth, the files can merge, as it were. I can also lose ideas, thoughts, theories...when and if new information comes to prove it was wrong. I do not place ultimate faith in any thing, person, tenet, dogma, religious faith, or supernatural being. We were all made, originally, created, that seems to be a fact. but not by who or what we think. We are taught to "Worship" our Gods, and I for one think the original word meant "Work" instead of raising one's hands and falling face down to respect a Being that at the time no doubt was standing right there for them to see. Humans personify their God because there is memory of that God walking among us in a distant past, and these were not Gods at all, but extraterrestrial beings. You have to look from the eyes of the ones who saw these ET Gods, to see what they saw, forgetting all of out modern thought and technology. A bright silver craft comes down from the heavens and sits down before you. A being comes out, all shining with a golden aura, and tells you he is your God, named Xxxxx.
(insert names here) Of course you would believe this to be true, after all, there it is, for anyone to see! And perhaps the being offers to take you to the "heavenly abode" to show you marvellous things.....Well upon returning to home, you would write all of this down, and tell everyone you know about it, and everyone would then know who the God is. This is how mankind fell, people. God is within us all, in each and every one of us, we of humanity are the personification of God. Once we figure this out, Unity will occur, and when that happens, we will be free.
Thanks for listening.

And look how much power do you give the word "theory"? Here I am, someone with no faith in any religion getting frustrated by phuck heads like you that can not take 2 seconds to think outside the square they were asked to draw on the first day of school. The way you talk about the need to "help them to understand" sounds like a religion of your own based on theories if you ask me. If you actually take the time to ready the material and links posted in this thread you will soon see the problem is not as simple as you make out and this is why it is the most debated topic - It's not science trying to convince the arrogant religions to open their minds its all parties being too arrogant to accept their "theory" may be wrong. At least the religious groups have the balls to say they act on faith where science simply acts on theories they treat as face until prooven wrong and then they rewrite the books (After a masive pollitical showdown).

Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by JaxonRoberts

 

I'm not an atheist

Ah another self made self serving religion then. Same thing.

Why are we here

With out God you cannot ever know the answer.

[edit on 30-12-2009 by randyvs]

You "HAVE" god? can god be "had"?

-rrr

God does not Govern Us

Originally posted by GorehoundLarry
reply to post by Solofront

 

We as a species has evolved and so has our planet. In fact, evolution overpowers the theory of creationism, but we all know that.

Oh do go on, just incase we dont "all know that". Could you please provide some sources or information that shows "evolution overpowers the theory of creationism"

ANYBODY?

it doesnt,

we create dont we?
so then why cant be have been created?

reply to post by MattMulder



You bring up an intresting point regarding religion, yet state to use logic become a darwenian.

I will give credit where credit is due, but please explain Darwins views on how matter or energy came to be. We can go back to the big bang theory. Which states that in a super heated enviroment that energy in the form photons came together to create matter and anti mater etc etc. The question is where did this energy come from? To date, no one can answer that.

As humans we like to consider ourselves "intelligent" and we create, or design all the time. Its ins our nature to attemt on improving the quality of life. As I stated earlier we can look at everything around us and accept that it was intelligently designed. Everything serves a purpose whether its the keyboard I am typing this on or the pen sitting on my desk.

Everything points to a design. Everything has a function. The odds that life on earth alone happened by chance are astronomical. Let alone the unknown life through out the universe.

Now regarding my first question Thermo dynamice states that matter/energy cannot be created or destroyed, only changed. We know this to be true so that points, once again to a superior being beyond human comprehension as the grand designer.

www.physicalgeography.net...

Also, scientists have proven Spontaneous Generation to be false.

www.talkorigins.org...
biology.clc.uc.edu...

I will await your response.

I got to the point I don't even care any more or let the ridicule get to me. I'm not a 'The earth is only 6,000 years old and the dinosaur bones were put into the strata by Satan to deceive us' type of creationist. I also try to approach criticism of aspects of evolution on an intellectual and scientific approach. Most of what I bring to the table are facts, realistic questions, and inconsistencies with the theory, only to be scoffed at by the evolutionists who resort to ad hominem fallacies, ridicule, or assume I don't understand evolution.

I came to believe they are actually the ignorant ones because they cannot scientifically refute some very basic and damning arguments against aspects of evolution (keep in mind I actually DO accept certain levels of evolution). It's like those skeptical of the science behind climate change, all the falsified evidence, the arrogant scientists, etc., being equated with flat earthers and brushed aside with scoffing.

The Bible said near the end, mankind would deny the existence of a creation event and that those who still hold to that view would be the victims of scoffers. So be it. What can you really do? Until they're ready to engage in an actual debate without acting like someone insulted their mother when evolution is questioned, I really have no further interest in debating the topic and really don't care what anyone thinks about my views.

I'm not trying to get creationism taught in school. I don't run around telling anyone they're going to go to hell. Nor do I repeat faulty science I know isn't true to support creationism. But even trying to approach the topic fairly gets you laughed at. Eventually you really stop caring what those types think of you.

[edit on 12/30/2009 by AshleyD]

ashley you bring very good points to the table, sorry this thread isnt worth your holyness anymore

reply to post by AshleyD


Well done, someone with some intelligence that follows their own heart and mind when coming to a conclusion. Whilst our views are no doubt a lot different I respect where you are coming from - I cant believe how pig headed some of the answers I have seen in this thread are. Good on you for looking at both sides of the coin before making your choice

i just, think its funny that just like politics this debate is useless, it doesnt solve anything, nobody comes out victorius, but it still is very enjoyable to see what everyones views are on the matter

reply to post by AshleyD


I agree with you completely. Its appaling that scientists supporting creationism or intelligent designed or forced out of the public forum, and ridiculed as religious fanatics.

Its almost as if the evolutionists knows how many flaws there theory holds and would rather suppress information then actually weigh out all the facts.

Originally posted by habfan1968

Originally posted by john124
reply to post by JaxonRoberts

 

Without creation there is no science and science has yet to explain creation.

This is very true! I believe science and spirituality will one day merge and I believe in both, creationism and evolution. All is continually evolving, but is the original blueprint still there? Is there an intellignet consciousness? Most Christians choose to believe in some entity waving his magic wand, but that's not realistic. If it was, where is he? Why did he disappear and leave us alone to evolve? I guess we're evolving technologically! But what about spiritually? I don't see evolvment within organized religion. We know the earth is 4.5 billion years old and not 6000.

Science still can't explain the human soul, but aren't they working on it? Some believe there is a god particle that unifies everything and moves through all and the Genesis story seems to have skipped some parts. We went from male/female(before the split) to male and female made he in his image? So, in the beginning, male and female energies were merged. This is most certainly a dualistic world.

Is there something else besides brain impulses that make us move and feel? Where did our DNA come from? Scientists claim it didn't come from earth. Almost every culture has a creation story and it usually begins with water. What is water? It's very unique and Genesis begins with "Gods spirit moved over the face of the water." The Enuma Elish is another creation story with two kinds of water.

I don't believe there is some old man sitting on a throne, but I do believe we are connected and a part of an intelligent consciousness and there is much more to us than we know. If consciousness is comparable to water or ether(I'll throw that in there), our connections to this consciousness stretch much further than we can imagine.

I've always thought everything is energy and everything vibrates. We vibrate at a certain frequency too. If we raise our frequency to a higher level by letting go of fear and holding to compassion, we discover much more than we can see...presently. What if we were their since the beginning and are the creators co-creating and working our way back to the source? You'd be surprised what I've experienced, but it really doesn't matter. Nothing ever dies. We'll all know soon enough.

Originally posted by habfan1968 people who don't know the boiling point of water, so what's up?

212°F...GOD is good

reply to post by JaxonRoberts

Yes, thank you, I agree that some are still laughing after all these years. I conclude some people are just born laughing and die laughing. At least you have a reliable humor-haven that helps you cope with the weighty matters of your existence.

Originally posted by Solofront

Originally posted by moocowman
Because we're sick and tired of deluded people assaulting our childrens minds and attempting to control how we live with idiotic unproven supernatural mythology.

So instead, we should live with "idiotic unproven natural mythology?"

you do realize that the "idiotic unproven natural mythology" you're referring has evidence to back it up?

Originally posted by JaxonRoberts

Originally posted by Snarf
Most people who believe in God, don't believe the planet was created 7000 years ago, don't believe man walked with T-Rex....among many other things.

I'm assuming that you were talking to me, and if you had bothered to read the thread before your oh-so-nice reply, you would have realized that the above describes me...

Ketchup goes great with Crow, btw...

I actually did read your posts. Good thing to because had I responded to your OP as this innocent person did, I would have thought as they did.

Crow is a dish often shared. What you posted later on down the page should have been in your OP.

The Earth was Created 6,000 years ago, it took god 7 days to create the earth
not 7 literal days of course

but carbon dating doesnt work
and you all should be christians to save yourselves from the impending doom

Originally posted by trueperspective

Originally posted by moocowman
reply to post by trueperspective

 

The actions of men can not be used to describe the character of God.

Of course they can if it is true that they are made in its' image.

That is one of the biggest mis-statements I have ever heard. Try not to speak about that which you do not understand.

So why do you have greater understanding than I ?