The Steorn magnetic motor replication by JL Naudin

Originally posted by downisreallyup

Originally posted by die_another_day
First of all, this isn't about free energy, it's about efficiency of motors.



He's using a "pulsating direct current" which basically turns the dc on and off (or changes the amount of current) at high frequencies. He has it at around 100hz.


It creates the same result as an alternating current induced rotation.

AC has some back emf.

Pulsating DC still has some in my opinion. I'm not sure what he's doing that makes cemf 0.

Assuming that cemf is 0, the maximum RPM is causing by the DC induced force and the counter friction force from the bearings. If anything is connected to harness the energy the motor, the motor will decelerate, forcing increased power into the motor to maintain the RPM.


BASICALLY:

Cemf is like friction, if you can reduce it, you get greater efficiency.



[edit on 12/29/2009 by die_another_day]

No, it IS about free energy. It is the back EMF that contains that extra burst of energy that Tesla and Bedini talked a great deal about. This is not just about the gains realized by removing the back EMF, but also about the additional energy that is realized in the circuit when the back EMF triggers more energy to be pulled out of the cosmic vacuum.

It would be interesting for you to study the work of Bedini, Bearden, and of course Tesla, as it is quite apparent that this is all part of what the Steorn motor is taping into. These guys at Steorn may not even be aware of all these others people that have tapped into the same thing.

What on earth is a cosmic vacuum?

I have yet to see the conservation of energy fail in these "free energy generators."

Originally posted by die_another_day
First of all, this isn't about free energy, it's about efficiency of motors.

Wrong. Just follow the charlatan's web link:
pesn.com...

And you find:

JLN Labs replicates Steorn's free energy motor

Reading comprehension is an essential skill. So that you know.

Originally posted by Did you see them
It would be intereting to see how this develops if coupled with the "programable magnets" or "frictionless magnetic gears" idea anounced last month ( see www.popularmechanics.com... )

[edit on 29-12-2009 by Did you see them]

Interesting. Should we forward that info to Steorn or do you think they are already aware of those magnets? I always assume that scientists are aware of what every other scientist is doing.

Also, is anyone here willing to give this experiment a run?

Originally posted by die_another_day

What on earth is a cosmic vacuum?

Think about it this way. "Vacuum" or empty space isn't really empty, it's a raging sea of virtual particles. In other words the whole Universe is one gigantic field of energy of virtually unlimited potential.

So these "free energy" systems aren't creating energy from nothing, they're drawing on energy that's already there in the fabric of spacetime.

Whenever you have a dipole (magnet), there's a ridiculous amount of Negative Energy or Radiant energy coming in, which you can siphon off to a battery and convert to standard current. But most electrical engineers don't even know that the Negative energy exists so they don't design their systems to make use of it.

That's Bedini and Bearden's explanation anyway.

Originally posted by MajorDisaster
Whenever you have a dipole (magnet), there's a ridiculous amount of Negative Energy or Radiant energy coming in

Yeah, this looks like a silly speculation at the very best. Do you know how magnets work anyway? Nothing to do with "cosmic vacuum" or acoustic energy of Steorn's flatulence.

reply to post by buddhasystem


To clarify. I'm not a physicist or engineer or inventor, I don't have a background in electronics. Like many on here, I'm just an amateur researcher with broad interest in all the different subject matter covered at ATS.

I'm just giving you Bedini and Bearden's explanation of how "free energy" works.

We know that the "Radiant" or Negative energy exists because in some cases you can actually see it as a bright green flash. As the story goes, when they first turned on the Westinghouse generator built by Nicola Tesla, there was a brilliant flash of bright green light in the air outside the generator, and that was the moment when Tesla first discovered "Radiant" energy.

Originally posted by MajorDisaster
We know that the "Radiant" or Negative energy exists because in some cases you can actually see it as a bright green flash.

Sorry but I think this is again, a speculation. I've spent a lot of time working with electronics and high voltage gear. You can see a corona discharge or some other kind of plasma, but it doesn't mean you opened a portal to "negative energy" or other such nonsense.

reply to post by buddhasystem


Okay, fine, don't believe it then.

*shrug*

It reminds me of Ed L.'s rotor. I've been trying to replicate it in a miniature version on and off now, based on the ideas in his manuscripts. I wonder, does this version have a lead going to ground, and a lead going to an elevated antenna?

reply to post by buddhasystem


you do know your body is an over unity device?

.........

some people are so clueless..

well done OP S+F

and for the peopl who think over unity is fake.. i suggest you PICK UP a few bricks after eating a salad..

that is OVER UNITY

reply to post by 13579


no it is not ............

FFS , if you think it is YOU are clueless

hint , how do you think dieting works ??????????????

reply to post by ignorant_ape


Who says dieting works?

Mmmm, pizza........

reply to post by MajorDisaster


bobby sands ?

reply to post by ignorant_ape


Yeah, there's a little "die" in "dieting" alright......

reply to post by jimmyx


It's not a Free Energy device in the sense that it requires no energy input, but in the way that its energy output is greater than the energy input.

Perhaps it would be better to refer to it as an Over Unity device.

Originally posted by buddhasystem


Wrong. Just follow the charlatan's web link:
pesn.com...

And you find:

JLN Labs replicates Steorn's free energy motor

Reading comprehension is an essential skill. So that you know.

Maybe my reading comprehension isn't up to par, but it seems to me that your link and headline come from a website that is reporting on the matter, not JLN labs themselves. When you click on the link JLN's actual site, the "free enegry" terminology is not used to describe the motor.



[edit on 29-12-2009 by Deny Arrogance]

I just spent a few hours going over all the info I could find on this thing.

What Steorn has done is to intercede two magnetic fields in a helix configuration. The toroidal coils do indeed have an exterior magnetic field, but it is a closed field (as opposed to an open field which has an area that is easily interacted with by other objects, like a horseshoe magnet). When the toroids approach the pairs of magnets mounted on the wheel, they are switched on. This allows the toroidal magnetic field to interact with the NIB magnets on the wheel, giving a tug of attraction and spinning the motor.

Since the toroidal field is closed and the NIB magnets are set (apparently) in opposing directions, the attraction exists regardless of the direction of the toroid field. The only difference in the magnetic forces would be a torque trying to twist the toroids around, which is countered by the mounting. Reversing the polarity of the applied current only reverses this torque, not the attraction.

The motor direction is set by the optical encoder used for timing the pulses. Adjust that and the motor will change its direction.

As to back EMF: Back EMF is created by a collapsing magnetic field perpendicular to the wires. The arrangement of the toroids means that there is no collapsing field at right angles tot he conductors, thus no back EMF. In that regard, this is an ingenuous design. The closed field of the toroids as well as their orientation relative to the wheel keeps any change in magnetic field away from the loops of wire.

That was Steorn's rig; as to the JNL rig:

In this case the toroids are turned with respect to the wheel, with their centerlines facing the wheel instead of parallel to the axis. Also, single NIB magnets are used instead of pairs. Thus, this is not an exact duplication of the Steorn design, but rather an adaptation. Still, the fact that it works so well indicates the flexibility of using toroidal coil design.

The lack of back EMF is for the same reason as in the Steorn design. In both cases, the toroidal field and positioning insulates the wire loops forming the coils from perpendicular interaction with the NIB magnets.

Also, JNL uses a Hall effect sensor instead of an optical encoder. there is really no difference in the final operation of the two different approaches; both simply turn the toroids on and off at the appropriate time. The optical encoder is much simpler and easier to build, but the optical switches can be pricey. I would assume that cost is the reason JNL went the Hall effect route. If anyone tries to use a Hall effect sensor, remember that the position of the sensor is critical and will need to be adjusted to get the best efficiency out of the motor. Notice JNL uses tape to secure the sensors... there is a reason for this.

The electronics used to control the coil current is very simple, and yes, it can be built at home if anyone wants to try it. A quick tip on working with MOSFETs: the gate terminal is very sensitive to electrostatic fields! Make sure you are grounded when working with any type of CMOS or MOSFET devices! A discharge too small to see or feel will blow the MOSFET in a microsecond. I have installed strictly only incandescent lights in my shop (florescents give off electrostatic fields) and I am touching a grounded piece of metal every few seconds to make sure any static build-up in my body is dissipated. Also avoid working in carpeted areas, as carpet tends to create electrostatic fields as well. And lastly, make sure your soldering iron has a grounded tip. If it only has two prongs where it plugs in, the tip is not grounded.

If anyone has ever built computers from boards,it is the same principle why you continually touch the case while assembling, just more sensitive since the components are not pre-mounted on boards.

I'll put in a shameless plug for the place where I get my magnets: KJ Magnetics. They have been very reliable and have a good selection of smaller NIB magnets as well as decent prices.

Now, as to whether or not this is over-unity... no, it is not. At least, no more so than any electric motor. It is simply efficient, probably due to the lack of back EMF. The power is being supplied by an external source, not by the device itself. I do believe that there is an inherent property in permanent magnets that appears to defy the laws Conservation of Energy, but to date no one has been able to develop this in a useful form. The same goes for gravity. In both cases, the problem is that we are not able to switch either ferro-magnetism or gravity on and off to create usable energy.

And neither has Steorn or JNL at this time, in my 'expert' opinion.

Oh,and there is a financial consideration here as well: the Steorn Knowledge Database (SKDB) charges a fee of €419.00 (about $600 at present exchange rates) annually. The License Agreement can be found here for those interested. I personally would not waste my resources at this time.

I will not degrade Steorn for offering this license at this price. Should I have technology that appeared to be a good investment for others, I would probably do the same. However, I would personally want more information (such as what is shown on JNL's site) before investing,and would certainly not invest merely on the basis of YouTube videos.

It's a very interesting and very efficient electric motor, and would make for an excellent science project or learning tool. But it is still just an electric motor. Nikola Tesla would be proud.

TheRedneck

reply to post by TheRedneck


Okay... but are the coils connected to and charging up a battery, like in a Bedini motor? If not.... then what's the point?

Originally posted by jimmyx
how does having a battery attached in the schematics upper right hand corner make this a free energy device?

There's no problem having a source of power as a trigger (car battery for example!) its when that battery is the source of all the energy in the system.

So Steorn need to generate more energy than they are consuming from the battery. This is exceptionally difficult to prove with meters and even if genuine the skeptics will claim its a con anyway. So it will be interesting to see how Steorn attempts to prove energy out > energy in.

reply to post by MajorDisaster

No, the coils do not charge the battery; the battery runs the coils. What you are looking at is a motor that runs efficiently off of a battery, nothing more.

TheRedneck