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How would You change the Uganda Gay Bill?

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posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 07:52 AM
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This Gay Bill Uganda proposes has upset a lot of people for different reasons. Most of them claiming this is a horrible idea. I assert that it is Uganda's right to run their country as they see fit as long as they do not go and kill millions of Gay people just for the hell of it.

If they do not want homosexuality in their country, then it is their right to do what it takes to thwart this belief system and there is nothing wrong with that.

The Question:

Lets say you were a member of the government in Uganda and you were charged with the task of stopping homosexuality in Uganda.

How would you do it?

Edit:
Please people, I don't need a thousand replies like Ulala below. That type of stuff has already been said in many post about this bill on ATS. If you have some ideas that would make this bill better but still accomplish these same goals I would like to hear them.

[edit on 24-12-2009 by JohnPhoenix]




posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 08:11 AM
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You can't stop homosexuality ; it's a natural state of affairs.

It's not a belief system, it's built in from day one. It'd be like "stopping" freckles or dark hair, it's a completely futile exercise.

So I hope I'd stand up in the Ugandan Parliament and denounce the bill in its entirety and condemn those who advocate such backwards legislation.



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 08:19 AM
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reply to post by Ulala
 


That is not answering the question and in my opinion totally off topic. The Topic is How would you change the Bill and still accomplish the same goals.

Many people disagree with you about being born Gay. Though this is a popular belief, there is nothing that proves this is true and nothing says God created people to be gay. However that is not the issue here.

Obviously Uganda wants this and a lot of people feel the bill is too harsh. O.k. then I ask, How do you change the bill and still thwart homosexuality in Uganda?





[edit on 24-12-2009 by JohnPhoenix]



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 08:22 AM
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Lets say you were a member of the government in Uganda and you were charged with the task of stopping homosexuality in Uganda. How would you do it?


I wouldnt do it because it is against human rights IMHO.
But I would replace the word "homosexual" with the word "person", so that the law would apply equally to everyone. Or is heterosexual rape less wrong than homosexual?

But this all is part of a more general problem - when another country has a law that is not fair in the eyes of people of some other country.

If some country for example legalizes murder, would you intervene somehow?



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 08:27 AM
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Originally posted by JohnPhoenix
Though this is a popular belief, there is nothing that proves this is true and nothing says God created people to be gay. However that is not the issue here.


Now we see the true reason for you justifying the bill in the other thread


And it is the issue here, because its Christian missionaries who have financed the Churches and supported this hate bill in Uganda.

The question should be, should we seek to ban organised religion in Uganda. We have evidence to show religion is more a threat than homosexuality.



[edit on 24-12-2009 by infinite]



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 08:36 AM
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Originally posted by Maslo



Lets say you were a member of the government in Uganda and you were charged with the task of stopping homosexuality in Uganda. How would you do it?


I wouldnt do it because it is against human rights IMHO.
But I would replace the word "homosexual" with the word "person", so that the law would apply equally to everyone. Or is heterosexual rape less wrong than homosexual?

But this all is part of a more general problem - when another country has a law that is not fair in the eyes of people of some other country.

If some country for example legalizes murder, would you intervene somehow?


So they happen to be singling out homosexuals because they obviously feel they do not want homosexuals in their country. One of the things the Bill does say is it's not just the aids thing they are doing this for but also because they feel homosexuality is hurting their traditional family values. To answer your question.. that's why. They must feel that homosexuality is not morally proper.

This is a law about Them specifically. I am sure they have laws in place against murder for the general population too.

The eyes of other people in other countries must not concern the government in Uganda until such time as international human rights laws are violated. This is not the case here no matter how you feel about it. If you change the international human rights laws to protect gays from all forms of discrimination then that is another story and you would be right.



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 08:49 AM
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Originally posted by infinite

Originally posted by JohnPhoenix
Though this is a popular belief, there is nothing that proves this is true and nothing says God created people to be gay. However that is not the issue here.


Now we see the true reason for you justifying the bill in the other thread


And it is the issue here, because its Christian missionaries who have financed the Churches and supported this hate bill in Uganda.

The question should be, should we seek to ban organised religion in Uganda. We have evidence to show religion is more a threat than homosexuality.



[edit on 24-12-2009 by infinite]


My feelings have been known this whole time as I have posted it many times. What I said above has nothing to do with the other thread, I was answering Ulala based on what Ulala said.

This is the thread Maslo is talking about.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I applaud religion to be a threat to homosexuality. I believe homosexuality should be wiped off the face of the earth.. much as you for instance may like to see Communism wiped out.

I believe homosexuality is a very horrible thing. This is Not a hate Bill.. Christians Do Not Hate the people.. We only hate the Actions of the people. Christians do not go around killing gays for the hell of it. This is a measure to get an unwanted ideal out of this country of Uganda. Yes they may jail them. but no one is advocating hate.

[edit on 24-12-2009 by JohnPhoenix]



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 09:08 AM
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Originally posted by JohnPhoenix
Lets say you were a member of the government in Uganda and you were charged with the task of stopping homosexuality in Uganda.

How would you do it?



Outlawing it does not stop it, it only creates more of it because special focus is put there, naturally causing rebellion.

Why do homophobes never understand that?

[edit on 24-12-2009 by Skyfloating]



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 09:20 AM
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Can i suggest this thread is closed - its not doing anything worthwhile but will quickly become a homophobic/personal attack thread.

While the OP may have had a valid question, he has instantly dismissed every sane persons reply of "i wouldnt do it" Personally I would just resign from any regime that forced through such an ugly anti-humanitarian bill.

mod please close before this gets out of hand.



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 09:27 AM
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reply to post by JohnPhoenix
 


Homosexuality, unlike communism is encoded in the genome. People dont choose to be homosexuals, so they cannot be persecuted for it.



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 09:45 AM
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Originally posted by freakyclown
Can i suggest this thread is closed - its not doing anything worthwhile but will quickly become a homophobic/personal attack thread.

While the OP may have had a valid question, he has instantly dismissed every sane persons reply of "i wouldnt do it" Personally I would just resign from any regime that forced through such an ugly anti-humanitarian bill.

mod please close before this gets out of hand.


Of course I dismissed every persons reply of " I wouldn't do it" because that does not answer the question asked and the point of this thread. I am still waiting for someone to actually answer the question as intended. I believe it will happen sometime today.

I do not appreciate people using my thread for their own agenda. Let them start their own thread if that is the case. that is exactly why I made this new thread because the postings in a previous thread prompted this question to be asked and I did not want to hijack the other persons thread. It's called Respect.

If people cannot reply directly to the topic at hand then don't post in this thread!

This thread has only been alive for an hour. Your claims that this thread should be closed and it will promote personal homophobic attacks are unfounded.

[edit on 24-12-2009 by JohnPhoenix]



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 09:50 AM
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The way i look at it, is at least uganda is up front about this.

I wonder how many males are in the west that are in prison, or had there life destroyed for being gay and there is no word about it. The west is not free for these people either, so i would not say to people in uganda how to live there lifes, as the west is full of homohobes too.



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 09:52 AM
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reply to post by Maslo
 


Again that is a matter of opinion. Science is proven wrong time an again. Even when the observations support the theories that is not proof as other observations will often times support different theories. I do not believe science understands genes enough to really say exactly what the case really is. If they told you tomorrow they found a gene that makes people murderers and you had it would you believe it?



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 10:05 AM
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Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by JohnPhoenix
Lets say you were a member of the government in Uganda and you were charged with the task of stopping homosexuality in Uganda.

How would you do it?



Outlawing it does not stop it, it only creates more of it because special focus is put there, naturally causing rebellion.

Why do homophobes like you never understand that?

[edit on 24-12-2009 by Skyfloating]


"homophobes like you" - ? is that a personal attack? Your supposed to be a moderator. What kind of moderator goes around personally attacking people? I do have gay friends. They know I do not agree with their lifestyle. But we do not hate each other because we disagree with each other. Your name calling is rude and untrue.

And for the record.. I just asked The Question - I didn't write the Bill. It is the Bill that's in question here, not my personal beliefs.

[edit on 24-12-2009 by JohnPhoenix]



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 10:10 AM
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Surely, a policy of educathion would be far more effective at stopping the spread of AIDS, lets also remember the Pope's comments about condom use, probably havn't helped the situation. But you will find proper education is the key to this, like many of the worlds problems



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 10:22 AM
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reply to post by JohnPhoenix
 


Sorry if it strayed off topic.

To answer your question then, a totally ridiculous one at that, but I'll try.

Firstly, if homosexuality has to be eradicated then the bill cannot simply be confined to those caught committing sexual offences. It'd have to clearly define who a homosexual is.

Easiest way to do that would be to define a homosexual as someone who has had sexual contact with another of the same sex ? Can we agree on that ?

But see, and I'm playing devils advocate here, but a surprisingly large number of otherwise straight men have had sexual contact with another man, in adolescence perhaps or during a menage a trois ... so you'd really be looking at eradicating a surprisingly large percentage of the male population ... at least 50% I think, if we're all being honest.

But even if we left the percentage at merely 10% you'd have to establish facilities to house these men before their trial and you'd have to construct a very large number of execution facilities. Death camps perhaps ? And you'd need to expand the police force, judiciary to cope with the numbers coming through the system. Perhaps you could give the bill powers to allow the police to monitor internet useage, to monitor those who visit gay porn sites, chatrooms, social networking sites etc. We could engage police officers as agent provcateur, to pose as gay men in clubs, cafes etc and in those areas where "nocturnal activity" is likely to happen.

There'd be huge social consequences, of course. You'd have to get the straights to work longer hours to make up the fall in production. You'd probably have rioting too unless you vigorously suppressed all opposition. You could create a police state where those suspected of homosexuality are reported by neighbours etc. You'd have to do that, I think.

The international reaction might not be too advantageous though. You'd have your country suspended from the British Commonwealth, the EU & its constituent nations would break off economic & diplomatic ties, USA too I reckon, you'd have your economy on its knees, people going hungry etc, much like Zimbabwe I think.

But at least you'd have eradicated the gays. The current ones, obviously. You'd still have to deal with "Gays : The Next Generation" being born, perhaps you could provide the bill with powers to raise funds to provide universities with the ability to find the gay gene, then at least you could abort all gay babies without the need for death camps etc.

Does that answer your question in a fashion you find acceptable ? Getting off on it yet ?

It's all a bit Nazi though, nicht wahr ?



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 10:33 AM
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Originally posted by JohnPhoenix

Lets say you were a member of the government in Uganda and you were charged with the task of stopping homosexuality in Uganda.

How would you do it?
[edit on 24-12-2009 by JohnPhoenix]


You will not like my response but I am going to say it anyway because this is a public forum and I am entitled to my opinion.

I have no right to tell my neighbour to be heterosexual any more than the Ugandan government has any right to tell the gay members of it citizenry to be heterosexual.

If I was a member of the Ugandan government and I had been tasked with stopping homosexuality in Uganda. Firstly I would tell the tasker to stick the task where the sun does not shine and secondly I would go into self exile because I would not wish to live in a country that thought that discriminating against one group of people for their sexual preferences is a civilised and decent way to go.

For me it is no wonder Africa is in such a mess and its people suffer proportionately much more than many others humans in the world demographically when its governments prove their idiocy time after time. This moronic policy against homosexuality is a perfect example of idiocy based on ignorance that sets in motion the African elite to make policy based upon quasi-religious bias and flies in the face of respectful tolerance for each other.

I am heterosexual (before I am accused of being gay and thus biased in my opinion) and I have no problems whatsoever with another’s sexual preference because it is their life not mine and I have no rights to influence another with my preference.

It is time to raise our heads above the nonsense and the things that divide us, and start looking at things that really matter like reasons/lies for war and the real truths that motivate our governments to do such unspeakable things to our people all over this earth in our name.

Heterosexuality/homosexuality is a personal thing that no person has a right to legislate against and only divides us further at a time when we really should be standing together no matter what our sexual (or religious) preferences.

Divide and conquer was never so easy for the elite it seems, just mention religion and sexuality and we will conquer ourselves ripe to a turn.

It would seem many of us that buy the line fed from up top deserve everything that may be coming.



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 10:35 AM
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Making unenforceable laws will do what? It won't make people "see the light" as it were.

Just out of curiosity, how do you enforce this silly law? What's the punishment?

I wonder how many homosexuals will die in this pogrom? ...and will the world care? I suspect lots...and no.



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by JohnPhoenix
 


And God is proven to be right again and again yeh? Science is a much greater help to people than religion will ever be. Jog on son, your boring!



posted on Dec, 24 2009 @ 11:08 AM
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I have to agree with the bill. There are too many people witht his dreaded disease that are "gift givers." They care nothing about society and because they have the disease they figure others must have it to.

They condem people to death when they decide to have sex when they are infected and they know it and this is what this bill is really about.

Homosexuals here have decided to attack the OP for asking the question and have actually once again asked that the thread be closed because they don't like the content of the thread.

I would not stop the bill. I would encourage the bill and I would encourage it here in America. There are homosexuals here in America that do the same thing. The gift givers must be stopped before this disease mutates into something that is unmanageable.

So, as I can't agree with being against the bill I am for the bill but I surley wouldn't ask that a gay pride thread be closed just because I disagree with the content...



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