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Just Say NO to Fed Health Plan

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posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 09:44 AM
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I'm posting this in the Political Madness forum because I'm pretty sure that it's in agreement that the Federal Health Plan coming up for vote is nothing short of madness...But hopefully this post in particular shows us that we do have remedies available to reign in their insanity.

According to polls, the majority of People want nothing to do with the Federal Health Care Plans coming up to vote in the Senate Monday. Well, if they don't listen to the opinions of the people, maybe they'll listen to the law & court-case precedences?

For one thing, the Feds can't force anything like this on the States. For another thing, many States have already been reasserting their Lawful Jurispudance on quite a few Federal shenanigans...36 States rejecting the Real ID & its spinoff, the PassID, for one example. Another example being how quite a few States are also rejecting the anti-gun legislation coming from the Feds too.

I ran across this letter that a woman in Michigan is has sent to her reps up in DC. I think it pretty much says it all...At least it says more than enough to get the point across. I've posted nearly the whole letter as it appeared, picking up right after the initial greeting to her Senators. To avoid any privacy issues, I also left out any reference to the woman's name as well.
---------------------

CONSTRUCTIVE NOTICE OF INSTRUCTION

It is my understanding from the news reports that you are scheduled to vote in this Illegal and Unconstitutional Health Care Reform Act on Monday at 1 am.

I am putting you on CONSTRUCTIVE NOTICE OF INSTRUCTION that you do not have any LEGAL CONSTITUTIONAL authority to vote yes on this issue. Therefore, you must vote no or you will be in VIOLATION of your OATH OF OFFICE and subject to removal.

Congress lacks the constitutional authority to regulate and control the practice of medicine in the jurisdiction of the States.

See Linder v. United States, 268 U.S. 5, 18, 45 S.Ct. 446 (1925) ("Obviously, direct control of medical practice in the states is beyond the power of the federal government");

Lambert v. Yellowly, 272 U.S. 581, 589, 47 S.Ct. 210 (1926) ("It is important also to bear in mind that 'direct control of medical practice in the States is beyond the power of the Federal Government.' Linder v. United States 268 U.S. 5, 18. Congress, therefore, cannot directly restrict the professional judgment of the physician or interfere with its free exercise in the treatment of disease. Whatever power exists in that respect belongs to the states exclusively.")

Oregon v. Ashcroff, 368 F.3d 1118, 1124 (9th Cir. 2004) ("The principle that state governments bear the primary responsibility for evaluating physician assisted suicide follows from our concept of federalism, which requires that state lawmakers, not the federal government, are 'the primary regulators of professional [medical] conduct.' Conant v. Walters, 309 F.3d 629, 639 (9th Cir. 2002);

Barsky v. Bd. of Regents, 347 U.S. 442, 449, 74 S.Ct 650, 98 L.ED. 829 (1954) ('It is elemental that a state has broad power to establish and enforce standards of conduct within its broders relative to the health of everyone there. It is a vital part of a state's police power.') The Attorney General 'may not...regulate [the doctor-patient] relationship to advance federal policy.' Conant, 309 F3d at 647 (Kozinski, J., concurring).")

And certain features of this proposed law will certainly be unconstitutional; see:

United States v. Constantine, 296, U.S. 287, 56 S.Ct. 223 (1935) "We think the suggestion has never been made -- certainly never entertained by this Court -- that the United States may impose cumulative penalties above and beyond those specified by state law for infractions of the state's criminal code by its own citizens. The affirmative of such a proposition would obliterate the distinction between the delegated powers of the federal government and those reserved to the states and to their citizens. The implications from a decision sustaining such an imposition would be startling. The concession of such a power would open the door to unlimited regulation of matters of state concern by federal authority. The regulation of the conduct of its own citizens belongs to the state, not to the United States. The right to impose sanctions for violations of the state's laws inheres in the body of its citizens speaking through their representatives. So far as the reservations of the Tenth Amendment were qualified by the adoption of the Eighteenth, the qualification has been abolished. (emphases added)

THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION

Article. IV.


Section. 3.

Clause 2: The Congress shall have Power to dispose of and make all needful Rules and Regulations respecting the Territory or other Property belonging to the United States; and nothing in this Constitution shall be so construed as to Prejudice any Claims of the United States, or of any particular State.

CONSTITUTION OF MICHIGAN OF 1835

ARTICLE I
BILL OF RIGHTS

Political power.
First. All political power is inherent in the people.

Right of the people.

2. Government is instituted for the protection, security, and benefit of the people; and they have the right at all times to alter or reform the same, and to abolish one form of government and establish another, whenever the public good requires it.

Right to assemble and petition.

20. The people shall have the right freely to assemble together, to consult for the common good, to instruct their representatives, and to petition the legislature for redress of grievances.

Acts void.

21. All acts of the legislature contrary to this or any other article of this Constitution shall be void.




John 15: 20

"If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you"

Basically, the Feds have the Lawful Authority to enforce this kind of crap on government employees, on federal lands (such as Federal Administration Buildings in most major cities, federal military bases located within State boundaries, as well as Possessions & Territories like Puerto Rico & Guam) but the feds have no lawful jurisdiction within the States!

In a nutshell: I've said it before here on ATS & I'll probably say it again in the future...

It's ineffective to threaten their lives through revolution...Threaten their jobs through the law instead. This way leaves them nothing to stand on for pretending to have the "high ground."


[edit on 20-12-2009 by MidnightDStroyer]




posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 10:25 AM
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reply to post by MidnightDStroyer
 

I have absolutely no doubt that what Congress did VIOLATES the Constitution of the US. Unfortunately, when lately has Congress EVER worried about the Constitution? They violate it every day of the year.

These people are nothing but CROOKS and CRIMINALS that could care less about the Constitution or the PEOPLE that they SUPPOSEDLY serve. They know that since they control the entire ELECTION PROCESS, that they can continue to violate it, and there is nothing we can do, short of all out rebellion, and blood on the streets.

Draw your own conclusion as to where this is ultimately heading.

edited to add:
STARRED AND FLAGGED.
Everyone should FLAG this thread.

[edit on 20-12-2009 by ProfEmeritus]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 11:03 AM
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Just say no to a TAX, Just say no to a microchip, Just say no to ______.
We have been saying NO... they are not listening... and I find it very interesting that Rothchilds financial interests mean so much to Obama... dont you... also those of maurice strong and Al Gore.... boo hoo ... it appears someone is violating his oath. may not even be eligible for office... this is going to be very bad



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 11:03 AM
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dupe

[edit on 20-12-2009 by Anti-Evil]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 11:24 AM
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reply to post by MidnightDStroyer
 


i think the politicians involved including the president should be brought up on treason charges, just like gw should still be. this sickens me, its time for the people to take the power back.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 11:42 AM
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Personally, I think far too many people are implying threats of violence when it comes to talking about their crimes. It's become obvious that people are preparing with Arms & I see nothing wrong with that. IMO, the 2nd Amendment is the final word when it comes to defending all other Rights under the Law. They know this already & this is where the "implication of violence" enters their minds.

They obviously do not respond to these obvious indicators...But I still think they will start responding to threats of their jobs. Most people, when confronted with implications of violence will become angered, fearful & quite likely vindictive...But threaten their jobs under application of the Law & they cannot justify any "higher ground" for their actions. This way, they're given notice that a certain action will result in criminal action against them & they'd be less likely to face handcuffs than to continue initiating aggressive reprisals.

The tide of history has shown that those in Power won't willingly relinquish that power...Usually, in history, that has meant armed insurrection. But threatening their jobs may be the last effective peaceful method to make them capitulate, because they wouldn't want to be fired & led away in handcuffs either.

They seem to be quite conversant in "psychological warfare," so it's only fair to turn the tables, huh?


[edit on 20-12-2009 by MidnightDStroyer]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 11:53 AM
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reply to post by MidnightDStroyer
 


all i have to say is that if a revolution were to happen i would gladly give my life to defend my country from our elected officials raping. they can pry my guns out of my cold dead fingers.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 12:26 PM
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reply to post by MidnightDStroyer
 





The tide of history has shown that those in Power won't willingly relinquish that power...Usually, in history, that has meant armed insurrection. But threatening their jobs may be the last effective peaceful method to make them capitulate, because they wouldn't want to be fired & led away in handcuffs either.


I agree with what you said in principle. HOWEVER, these crooks are the people that put the judges in their seats. Therefore, going through legal means is pointless, because the judges that rule are all bought and paid for, by the crooks. That is why every attempt at legal means to get Obama to produce a legitimate actual birth certificate (not a proof of birth certificate) has been thrown out by EVERY court that it is brought up in.

Our legal system is CORRUPT beyond repair.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 12:30 PM
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reply to post by ProfEmeritus
 


i agree...i believe if we the people are truly going to ever get our country and our power back, using the corrupted legal system will not be an option. instead, taking these treasonous traitors out in the streets one by one and giving them an old fashioned hanging like used to be done for treason would send all the right messages.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 12:33 PM
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reply to post by chrisd250
 





i agree...i believe if we the people are truly going to ever get our country and our power back, using the corrupted legal system will not be an option. instead, taking these treasonous traitors out in the streets one by one and giving them an old fashioned hanging like used to be done for treason would send all the right messages.

We don't have to go that far. We can just transport them to the Arctic and let them live there. After all, according to them, the Arctic is becoming a tropical paradise. We can leave them there with some palm trees, bathing suits, and some margaritas, but no winter clothes. After all, they won't need them, right?


[edit on 20-12-2009 by ProfEmeritus]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 12:53 PM
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Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
Our legal system is CORRUPT beyond repair.

Granted, that is true...But all Political Power originates from the People; The Declaration of Independence says it & the Constitution says it, from the Preamble all the way to the last Amendment of the Bill of Rights.

If you live in one of the States, look up your State Constitution...There's probably a specific clause about that too. Do you think that lawful court systems can't be re-made from scratch? The Constitution was! It's just a matter mostly of trying to keep calm enough heads to make sure that Rule by Law is maintained when the compost connects with the rotary oscillator.



Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
We can just transport them to the Arctic and let them live there. After all, according to them, the Arctic is becoming a tropical paradise. We can leave them there with some palm trees, bathing suits, and some margaritas, but no winter clothes. After all, they won't need them, right?

Tempting proposal...But, lawfully speaking, we couldn't because that constitutes "cruel & unusual punishment."


[edit on 20-12-2009 by MidnightDStroyer]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 02:19 PM
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reply to post by MidnightDStroyer
 


This qualifies as breaking news? I don't get it. Yes the health care bill is a travesty and a big win for the major insurance/drug company monopolies running our unhealthy-care system. But get used to it, because it is going to be a reality soon. I expect around Christmas.

I think it is a crime too but less of a crime than they were getting away with up to this point. We are taking baby steps when there is a marathon to run. Be that as it may...
God forbid we should heavily promote and make available proper dietary guidelines along with an abundance of natural fruits and vegetables.

We don't do this because we make a bundle off our fatso's and our malnourished skinny people. This is the crime in America.

Hiding the facts of nutrition and foods that promote wellness and can even be beneficial toward reversing specific conditions.

Do you ever hear about that or do you only hear about the drug that will cure you? Are you told that sugar and chemical laden cereal will actually help you become more fit? Lies.

This is why we are in such an unhealthy condition to begin with. we can't even pass a tax on junk food. Somebody is making a lot of money off keeping the populace sick and driven to pills or procedures.

They don't want you well and even lobby vigorously so you have very little hope of becoming so.
(unless you self educate, learn to cook healthy foods so they are palatable and as desirable as "junk" , AND you can afford to shop at a Whole Foods Supermarket -that's if you even have one in your area)
Poor neighborhoods typically have only convenience stores, which if you live out of them you are sure to die a slow and painful death.

Sure, everyone makes a personal choice AFTER they are mentally manipulated and deceived by television and clever psychologically researched and induced advertisements.

Almost everything can be controlled by proper diet.
3/4 of the supermarket is filled with stuff that will kill you. Is it any wonder 3/4 of the country is sick from something?

This new plan reigns in and makes it a little harder for these same insurance and drug monopolies and the politician/puppets they employ (bribe is such an ugly word) to make the inconceivable windfalls they have made in the past by exploiting the sick.







[edit on 20-12-2009 by rusethorcain]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 02:30 PM
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Huh? When did I talk about the poor state of health & food? You did address your reply to me, but went way off in left field & I don't see a connection there. In fact, after perusing through the rest of this thread from the beginning, I don't think anybody specified the "food & health" angle at all, other than to tell our "representatives in government" to leave it alone...It's an issue that comes under States & People Powers.

This thread is not about the Health Bill specifically...It's about the criminality of the Federal Government & how to still have a hope of peacefully bringing them down. It's a strategy for handling the criminals when they're breaking the law rather than specifically limiting the idea to the Health Reform.

[edit on 20-12-2009 by MidnightDStroyer]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 02:40 PM
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reply to post by MidnightDStroyer
 


You didn't but I think it is all connected.
A conspiratorial effort to maintain a status quo of sick people. This is reprehensible. I support any measures including this new health care plan that takes a little more power from insurance companies and shines a light on where the big money is going.

I wanted a public option and I think those fighting tooth and nail against that choice are like people who will cut off their nose to spite their face.

A comprehensive attack was needed to reverse damage already done by incentives for being sick rather than the reverse. It would have meant a healthier stronger nation, mentally alert and able to innovate, invent and produce verses the bunch of pathetically ill we have begging for help and in no position to help anyone least of all themselves.

Welcome to America...home of the sick.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 02:51 PM
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s+f, especially for the unique angle.

As much as I can't stand the do-nothing-goods in DC, I can't see how we're going to stop this one. If we got off our collective rumps a bit earlier, perhaps we would have had a chance.

Unfortunately we're confounded by the people who are too busy watching sports as well as those who think this is a GOOD idea.

It already hurts like hell... and it's only gonna get worse.


Whatever the question, government isn't the answer.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 05:17 PM
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Sadly I think it's way to late for the American people your already in to deap there's nothing to be done.

You won't change anything through voting or leagal means because they own the leagal system.

You won't beat them though armed rebellion either that would be like lambs to the slaughter, in fact I think an all out armed rebellion is what they want, that way they can realy drop the hammer on the people.

Dammed if you do and dammed if you don't.

I belive the time for fighting these guys was 50 years ago.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 05:28 PM
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I disagree .. i will say YES to the plan ..

.. I like it (i have read it) .. it has a few flaws .. but i think just passing the bill will allow time for corrections ..

Is the bill a bit socialist-like .. Yeah, of course it is ..

Do i care .. not really .. because i am not a brainwashed fool that believes SOCIALISM is the EVIL of all Evils...



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 05:44 PM
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Yeah sure OP! Just say NO to the only entity that you have ANY representation in (the government) and YES to the greedy, corporate health bastards that WILL screw you every way to Sunday when you loose your coverage (and even if you don't) and in which you have NO say so. If you have been in my shoes YOU WOULD GET THIS (but you obviously work for Aetna or likewise). The only reason that most Americans don't get this is because they haven't gotten their pink slip yet - and still have good coverage. It's just a matter of time though.


Oh by the way, since you right wing wackos are against government of any kind, I guess we better do away with the FDA, Dept of Agriculture, US postal service, Centers of disease control, NASA, NOAA, US geological service, etc., etc, - and even with your social security and medicare. Hypocrites! Why weren't you railing against these things before Obama??


[edit on 20-12-2009 by whatsup]

[edit on 20-12-2009 by whatsup]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 05:46 PM
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I don't know much about the states gov't, or it's systems, therefore the question I'm about to ask might sounds stupid. That being said, please have mercy on me by not flaunting my ignorance.
What is stopping the gov't at the state level, which seems to wield more power, from abolishing the fed. income tax, upping state taxes, and cutting themselves off from dependance on central government?



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 06:04 PM
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Originally posted by whatsup
If you have been in my shoes YOU WOULD GET THIS (but you obviously work for Aetna or likewise).

This one comment, for a start is completely way out of line...You know nothing about me & throwing all kinds of accusations. You get off your high horse & try to think rationally instead of with your glands.

Your kind of hostility is actually a bannable offense at ATS...I suggest you read this thread & review the T&C.


Originally posted by whatsup
Why weren't you railing against these things before Obama??

BTW, I have been...At ATS for more than 7 years...
...This post is the one & only crumb I feed to those who act like trolls.


Originally posted by heyo
What is stopping the gov't at the state level, which seems to wield more power, from abolishing the fed. income tax, upping state taxes, and cutting themselves off from dependance on central government?

States are getting a better grip on the Powers delegated to them much more readily than they did even 5-6 years ago. For example, 36 States have rejected the RealID & its spinoff, the PassID. Also, States are more often rejecting Fed regulations about gun ownership. The list of examples is already much longer than this & still growing.

It's all about the 9th & 10th Amendments. Of course, with most of the MSM wrapped up the way it is, you just don't get this kind of news from the major networks or publications.

[edit on 20-12-2009 by MidnightDStroyer]



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