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The Amazing Lincoln/Kennedy Connections Revisited

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posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 08:49 AM
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Originally posted by Oblivious Man
-Abraham Lincoln was elected to Congress in 1846.
John F. Kennedy was elected to Congress in 1946.
-Abraham Lincoln was elected President in 1860.
John F. Kennedy was elected President in 1960.
-The names Lincoln and Kennedy each contain seven letters.
-Both were particularly concerned with civil rights.
-Both wives lost their children while living in the White House.
-Both Presidents were shot on a Friday.
-Both Presidents were shot in the head.
-Lincoln's secretary was named Kennedy.
Kennedy's secretary was named Lincoln.
-Both were assassinated by Southerners.
-Both were succeeded by Southerners.
-Both successors were named Johnson.
-Andrew Johnson, who succeeded Lincoln, was born in 1808.
Lyndon Johnson, who succeeded Kennedy, was born in 1908.
-John Wilkes Booth, who assassinated Lincoln, was born! ! in 1839.
Lee Harvey Oswald, who assassinated Kennedy, was born in 1939.
-Both assassins were known by their three names.
-Both names are composed of fifteen letters.
-Lincoln was shot at the theater named 'Kennedy.'
Kennedy was shot in a car called 'Lincoln.'
-Booth ran from the theater and was caught in a warehouse.
Oswald ran from a warehouse and was caught in a theater.
-Booth and Oswald were assassinated before their trials.
-And here's the kicker...
A week before Lincoln was shot, he was in Monroe, Maryland.
A week before Kennedy was shot, he was with Marilyn Monroe.



I know this is already somewhat old curiosity, but time to time it seems to pop up (I just received it via the e-mail), so I thought it would be appropriate to give it some more consideration.

On ATS, there has been at least 3 earlier attempts to address this matter:

Case 1 - by Obliv_au.
Case 2 - by Oblivious Man.
Case 3 - by alias101.

And here is one skeptical source claiming:

The coincidences are easily explained as the simple product of mere chance.
snopes.com

Yet, what is the chance for all these coincidences occuring to two distinct persons? I am not proficient in calculating the chances, but I could imagine it would be quite slim.

In above threads, there has been both pro and con opinions. I have absolutely no opinion about what is the cause for the apparent connections between these two ex-presidents of United States. I am not even sure whether there is connections or is it all mere coincidence? It even can be result of distorted historical facts.

But now, let's start with easily checkable facts. The format includes first the amazing claim which considers both Lincoln and Kennedy, then 'facts' with sources, ending on comments in italics. And please note that I will not bother to check all of the claims, but I'll leave some for ATS to work out


 

Abraham Lincoln was elected to Congress in 1846.
John F. Kennedy was elected to Congress in 1946.


Abraham Lincoln was elected to Congress in 1846.
wikipedia.org

Kennedy represented Massachusetts's 11th congressional district in the U.S. House of Representatives from 1947
wikipedia.org
So there is not exactly 100-year period, but 101 years between the entries in congress.
 

Abraham Lincoln was elected President in 1860.
John F. Kennedy was elected President in 1960.


On November 6, 1860, Lincoln was elected as the 16th President of the United States.
wikipedia.org

On Tuesday, November 8 (1960), Kennedy defeated Nixon in one of the closest presidential elections of the twentieth century.
wikipedia.org
No comments, 100 years there.
 

Both Presidents were shot on a Friday.
Both Presidents were shot in the head.


The assassination of Abraham Lincoln, one of the last major events in the American Civil War, took place on Good Friday, April 14, 1865, when President Abraham Lincoln was shot while attending a performance of Our American Cousin at Ford's Theatre with his wife and two guests.
wikipedia.org

Booth raced forward and shot the president in the back of the head.
wikipedia.org


The assassination of John F. Kennedy, the thirty-fifth President of the United States, took place on Friday, November 22, 1963, in Dallas, Texas, at 12:30 p.m. Central Standard Time (18:30 UTC) in Dealey Plaza. Kennedy was fatally shot while riding with his wife Jacqueline in a Presidential motorcade.
wikipedia.org

They each concluded that the final shot entered the rear of President Kennedy's head
wikipedia.org
According to the sources, that was indeed the case.
 

Andrew Johnson, who succeeded Lincoln, was born in 1808.
Lyndon Johnson, who succeeded Kennedy, was born in 1908.


Andrew Johnson (December 29, 1808 – July 31, 1875)
wikipedia.org

Lyndon Baines Johnson (August 27, 1908 – January 22, 1973)
wikipedia.org
Yeah, 100 years there.
 

John Wilkes Booth, who assassinated Lincoln, was born in 1839.
Lee Harvey Oswald, who assassinated Kennedy, was born in 1939.


Lee Harvey Oswald (October 18, 1939 – November 24, 1963)
wikipedia.org

John Wilkes Booth (May 10, 1838 – April 26, 1865)
wikipedia.org
The claim isn't exactly precise according to the sources used here.
 

Booth ran from the theater and was caught in a warehouse.
Oswald ran from a warehouse and was caught in a theater.


Conger tracked down Jett and interrogated him, learning of Booth's location at the Garrett farm. Before dawn on April 26, the soldiers caught up with the fugitives hiding in Garrett's tobacco barn. David Herold surrendered, but Booth refused Conger's demand to surrender, saying "I prefer to come out and fight", and the soldiers then set the barn on fire.[135][136] As Booth moved about inside the blazing barn, Sergeant Boston Corbett shot him.
wikipedia.org

After Oswald walked away, Brewer went outside his shop and saw Oswald slip into the nearby Texas Theater without paying.[99] Brewer alerted the ticket clerk, who had also been listening to radio coverage of the assassination, and she phoned the police.[100] The police quickly arrived en masse and entered the theater as the lights were turned on. Brewer identified Oswald sitting near the rear, and Officer Maurice N. McDonald approached him and ordered him to stand up. Oswald said, "Well, it is all over now" and appeared to raise his hands in surrender
wikipedia.org
According to sources used, the claim seems to hold water.
 

Booth and Oswald were assassinated before their trials.

At 11:21 am Sunday, November 24, 1963, while he was handcuffed to Detective Leavelle and as he was about to be taken to the Dallas County Jail, Oswald was shot and fatally wounded before live television cameras in the basement of Dallas Police Headquarters by Jack Ruby, a Dallas nightclub operator who said that he had been distraught over the Kennedy assassination.
wikipedia.org
While Oswald can be considered to be assasinated, that can hardly be said about Booth, since he was killed in the pursue, and was said to be shot as a self-defense (see above).
 


Well, there are few 'facts' checked in a quick fashion. I apologize that I don't have time to use better wikipedia.org as a source.

So, in the end. Do you think that all those are coincidences? Or do you think that it is proof of history repeating itself? Or perhaps a proof of an old conspiracy? Maybe you have a theory that is completely different of those? Yeah, tell us!

In my opinion, what ever it was, it is an intriguing phenomena.

-v

[edit on 20-12-2009 by v01i0]




posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 09:02 AM
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Originally posted by v01i0
So, in the end. Do you think that all those are coincidences? Or do you think that it is proof of history repeating itself? Or perhaps a proof of an old conspiracy? Maybe you have a theory that is completely different of those? Yeah, tell us!


Pure coincidence? I highly doubt it. But, lets face facts here. I don't think there's one man on the planet that could plan all that information out in two separate centuries. Or the real conspiracy is the group of hidden secret societies are actually planning these things to happen over the course of their history. Which is a more reasonable explanation.

My thoughts? A secret society has planned out these things since the beginning. Assassinations, ruling elites, whatever you want to call the plots.
This would be a great way to link the two...

Unless there ARE time-travelers.


Good thread.
*S&F*



[edit on 20-12-2009 by havok]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 09:17 AM
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reply to post by havok
 



Originally posted by havok

My thoughts? A secret society has planned out these things since the beginning. Assassinations, ruling elites, whatever you want to call the plots.
This would be a great way to link the two...



Quite possible. The chance for coinsidence is a slim one - and hardly historical events repeat themselves every 100 years or so with a little mutation, even thought it might be possible (what is reality? But that's not the topic of this thread, so no going there).

If we consider that both of the culprits, Booth and Harvey were murdered before trial, before they had change to prove their innocence or tell their story, or whatever, it seems like somebody wanted to make it that way.

Who knows? I don't



Originally posted by havok
Good thread.
*S&F*


Thanks for those. I'm just glad somebody find it intriguing.

-v

[edit on 20-12-2009 by v01i0]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 09:55 AM
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Originally posted by v01i0
If we consider that both of the culprits, Booth and Harvey were murdered before trial, before they had change to prove their innocence or tell their story, or whatever, it seems like somebody wanted to make it that way.


Exactly, we take in consideration the multiple dates corresponding to both people, not just in murder before trial, but also all the above listed...
It seems it was a plot on both sides.

Lets just say that (fill in the blank) was a group of people who had both presidents assassinated and then put the blame on these two guys. Based on facts alone, both presidents were historically against secret societies and hidden governmental operations. So, maybe that's what puts these two people together. The gov't (or secret group) might have actually killed them both and then pointed the finger elsewhere.

For all we know, the gov't could of set these two guys up. It just so happens that all the evidence is extremely similar. Almost like someone from the past wanted a certain future individual to figure it out...

That's the conspiracy!


I don't believe in coincidence. Everything happens for a reason.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 09:59 AM
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One thing they both did seems to be forgotten. Both issued interest free money, in opposition to elite bankers.

Abraham Lincoln and John F. Kennedy

One more thing on JFK. He was determined to release to the public what little information the government had on ETs and UFOs. He had to go. Kennedy was the last president who was briefed on this, to the best of my knowledge.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 10:17 AM
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reply to post by havok
 


Possibly the power of language and karmic ebb and flow intertwined. This world is under some sort of matrix in which there is no coincidence, merely incidence. Something and its opposite occur to balance each other out. This could be merely related to the perceptual nature of our binary chord, but these perceptions play out in the world as well. Art imitates life, and life imitates art. The butterfly effect, the monarch effect could certainly have played a role in the kennedy assassination. It takes no century-spanning conspirators, although those with great power are highly aware of cyles, consequences, reactions, integration, and other relational dynamics. Plus, it can all affect people on a subconscious level.



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 10:19 AM
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Originally posted by autowrench
One thing they both did seems to be forgotten. Both issued interest free money, in opposition to elite bankers.

Abraham Lincoln and John F. Kennedy

One more thing on JFK. He was determined to release to the public what little information the government had on ETs and UFOs. He had to go. Kennedy was the last president who was briefed on this, to the best of my knowledge.


Hey autowrench. Good to see ya. Long time, no hear...(um...read I mean).

This is exactly my point.
I think they were the only two presidents that threatened the secrecy of alot of hidden agendas. When you look at all the facts. It all adds up.
TPTB weren't haven't that. So, they off'd them both.

That write-up from your post is awesome.

You should start a thread with just that post!

TAKE A MINUTE....EVERYONE SHOULD READ IT!

That solves the mystery that is Lincoln/Kennedy Assassination.
Plain and simple. Nice!

[edit on 20-12-2009 by havok]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 11:59 AM
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Great thread, I remember reading all this back in the 90s. I brought all the documents into my brothers work and was able to print them all off. It looks like a book now, too many connections here, too much proof.

If I was a cop on the homicide department, and if it where possible for a human to live a few hundred years, then I would say that these two cases are the either the patterns of a serial killer, or a copy-cat. Either way, both following the original assassination patterns.

The elites have a "script", they use it as a guide book.
"How to Rule the World - For Dummies"


[edit on 20/12/2009 by the_denv]



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 01:10 PM
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reply to post by autowrench
 


Your post in general provides something to think about


-v



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 01:12 PM
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reply to post by the_denv
 



Originally posted by the_denv
Great thread, I remember reading all this back in the 90s. I brought all the documents into my brothers work and was able to print them all off. It looks like a book now, too many connections here, too much proof.


Nice, the matter then must be somewhat familiar to you.

Since you have such compelling document available about the matter, can you find anything interesting from it? Something that may provide valuable insights in the matter?

In the case you do, thanks


-v



posted on Dec, 20 2009 @ 05:45 PM
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reply to post by orwellianunenlightenment
 


There is really nothing more to say, that is, for those of us who know about the hidden hands behind every government since at least the French Revolution...I mean, these guys were basically instrumental in many things, from the French thing, the American Revolution, the War Between the States, WW1, and 2, Korea, Viet Nam, and now the wars we are in. Add in the economy. See, what you (the Bank) do is start a war between two factions, and loan money to both to make a war happen. When the war is over, you haven't lost anything, and..you make billions in interest on the loans. If a Nation refuses to pay off the loans, you send in the military. (Saddam refused to pay his loans)
It is called making money from debt. You get everyone deep in debt, and collect the money back in payments, plus interest. Face it people, we are slaves to the Federal Reserve Bank, and until we take it over and seize it's assets and give them to the United States Treasury, the only legal entity that has the right to coin money, according to the Constitution. We can all see this, what are we waiting for? We can demand new, interest free money, and put some iron in our words. The FED only has power for as long as we let them have power.



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 02:56 AM
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reply to post by autowrench
 


You are absolutely right that there are people in power trying to manipulate things behind the scenes in an effort to achieve a desired outcome. They have done it for thousands of years, and they are continuing to do so. I tend to agree with Monty Python, in that man must develop a soul. I also think many have not developed such a thing, and as such, many are reactive animals. This makes history and the flow of society the easiest thing to predict. It is what makes human karma a reality. Until people develop their own minds outside of the current of endless imitation, then this type of manipulation behind the scenes continues. We can talk about ignoring TPTB or rebellion till we are blue in the face (not saying you are), but we must simply not be so predictable. We must exhibit the behaviors that stem from those with a mind.



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 03:36 AM
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reply to post by havok
 



Originally posted by havok
I don't believe in coincidence. Everything happens for a reason.


I hear you! That is my observation as well. Every effect has a cause, and every effect becomes a new cause; it spawns the complexity what we often interpret as a chance.

-v



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 03:44 AM
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reply to post by orwellianunenlightenment
 



Originally posted by orwellianunenlightenment
reply to post by autowrench
 


I tend to agree with Monty Python, in that man must develop a soul. I also think many have not developed such a thing, and as such, many are reactive animals. This makes history and the flow of society the easiest thing to predict. It is what makes human karma a reality. Until people develop their own minds outside of the current of endless imitation, then this type of manipulation behind the scenes continues.


QFT. I am glad that you brought up such philosophically creditable source as Monty Python


Seriously, MP masks many philosophical facts in comedy; those who can intuitively see past the comedy side of their shows, can learn a lot. Indeed what you said about the soul (which I regard to be a concept meaning the individual thought) resonates with reality as I observe it.

It is unfortunate that many human beings are nothing but homo sapiens, another animal species, members of the family of primates. I dare to claim, that the basics of the human psychology have remained pretty much same for thousands of years and the critical step on it's evolution would be the development of something, which you call soul.

-v

[edit on 21-12-2009 by v01i0]



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 04:05 AM
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reply to post by v01i0
 


Monty Python is quite brilliant, as you are undoubtedly aware due to the nature of your post. I would posit that some have developed what I call a soul, but it is a vast minority. Monty Python sublimated the absurd, shining a light on man's folly. After all, one key aspect of our learning is learning what we are not. We all have a final solution which begets the development of this somewhat foggy concept of a soul. The soul holds a truth which is so powerful that the world cannot contradict it. The soul is not afraid of outside questioning, as it has already run the course of questioning. What I said was partially meant in jest, but it was primarily quite serious.

Humanity, not knowing what it is or to what purpose it must aspire, tends to let others create the spirals for them. Those creating the spirals can often create a situation in which it is an upward spiral for the creators and a downward spiral for the manipulated. Eventually, this causes civilization to implode, and the process begins anew. If we do not want to begin anew, but rather change perspective, then we must be aware of the mind and soul, for lack of better words, in addition to the body. I hold firm that many men think with their penises, and many women think with their vaginas. This does not create the best societal dialogue. The third thing this duality creates is something not unlike a devil, the author of the human cyclical drama. This androgynous goat is the worst of combinations, both a bitch and a dick.



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 04:16 AM
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reply to post by v01i0
 


Let me also add that I think many more than people realize are capable of individual thought. It is obvious to me that the system itself stifles such an individual. Being a yes man or woman is a much easier way to get to the top of the hierarchical pyramid, albeit the method of a whore. The methods of a whore (both men and women) are no longer sustainable, as too many have developed individual thought, or they have at least gained the desire to develop individual thought. Moreover, the desire to say yes to idiocy for personal gain has led to the system eating itself, as these people had no foresight beyond their immediate rewards. These people, even if they weren't idiots to begin with, became such in the process. We live in a period of intellectual, spiritual chaos in which those who can think for themselves must get their ideas out. The world we are going to live in depends upon it.

Edit: BTW, your avatar is too cool. Do you like mine? I did have my reasons, and I don't think they are all that dissimilar to yours.

[edit on 21-12-2009 by orwellianunenlightenment]

[edit on 21-12-2009 by orwellianunenlightenment]



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 04:24 AM
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reply to post by orwellianunenlightenment
 




I must admit, you have some insight. I can approve lot of what you said in your two above posts, and not by a faith, but because of my own experiences.

Indeed, as the current nations and societies are nothing but glorified tribalism, so is our (well not everyone's) social behaviour glorified sexuality.

-v



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 04:31 AM
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Originally posted by orwellianunenlightenment
reply to post by v01i0
 

Edit: BTW, your avatar is too cool. Do you like mine? I did have my reasons, and I don't think they are all that dissimilar to yours.


You left it blank intentionally? I thought the vanity of the avatars when I was making mine.

-v

(edit to add)
PS. Now that I noticed it (I have missed it before), I will be reading your only thread. I might even respond it, but it might take time, as the thread text itself is long and obscure. But from the beginning, I find it interesting. Indeed, one needs to interlegere.

[edit on 21-12-2009 by v01i0]



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 04:44 AM
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reply to post by v01i0
 


I appreciate that, but I must warn you that I think I went too far in dismantling the ego. I think that the ego is necessary, but that it is also a trickster. Kind of a hard thing to reconcile. I was not as diplomatic as I could be in that thread. I am not always on my "A" game.

Edit: Yes, I left it blank intentionally. Vainglory coupled with desire for personal peace with disregard to the external fallout is an element which I think creates the most damning things in the human drama. Sort of, "I will create a heaven for myself, but I care not if that creates a hell for you." This eventually creates a hell for everybody. Many want to win "the game," but they do not realize that there are other players just as capable, with views just as profound. I long for a world which is good for both sheep and goats, or rather one in which neither are necessary. I realize it is quite an undertaking, but I do think it is possible.

[edit on 21-12-2009 by orwellianunenlightenment]



posted on Dec, 21 2009 @ 05:27 AM
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reply to post by orwellianunenlightenment
 



Originally posted by orwellianunenlightenment
reply to post by v01i0
 

Yes, I left it blank intentionally.


In that respect - which I thought to be the case - I like it



Originally posted by orwellianunenlightenment
I think that the ego is necessary, but that it is also a trickster. Kind of a hard thing to reconcile.


I agree. Ego seems to be fundamental part of our psyche and hence it cannot be dismantled totally. Yet, the unnecessary parts of it can be, and should be, disintegrated. It tends to distort our perception of reality and therefore one is objected of perceiving the objective reality as it is.


Originally posted by orwellianunenlightenment
I was not as diplomatic as I could be in that thread. I am not always on my "A" game.


Oh well, that happens to almost everybody. Individually, I find myself sometimes too offensive about other's infant beliefs, yet I have no absolute certainty that my own beliefs and concepts are any better.

-v



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