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Cheap desert land to "bug out" to?

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posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 09:43 PM
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I am currently trying to relocate myself and a family member with respiratory problems to a warm, dry, desert climate.
I am looking into Arizona and New Mexico, and would prefer New Mexico of the two.

I am curious if anyone might live there and knows of areas with cheap desert plots of land, not too ridiculously far from major cities though, for obvious medical reasons.

I intend to build a "passive house" take full advantage of the two growing seasons, and try to live as cheaply and off the land as possible. I am not totally opposed to building a green house to grow in either, if it turns out to be a high elevation area. Even higher elevation areas there would be better than any elevation where I am coming from in the northeast.

Any information that someone who lives or even has visited the area could provide, would be a huge help. I am planning a road trip to try to find a good location to settle into, any helpful tips provided could potentially save me days of driving, gas money, and grey hair. =)




posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 10:24 PM
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I would agree that New Mexico, Texas, Arizona, and even parts of Nevada are good for a "bug out" desert location, BUT...the main problem is this.

If and when the SHTF and we have complete chaos in this country, MILLIONS will flock to these areas as well. If the power is ever cut and winter is approaching, you and your desert land will be invaded by people looking to survive.

I wish you luck in your search, just make sure you stock up on ammo, water, and most importantly sunblock..



posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 10:55 PM
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Originally posted by ashamedamerican
I am currently trying to relocate myself and a family member with respiratory problems to a warm, dry, desert climate.
I am looking into Arizona and New Mexico, and would prefer New Mexico of the two.

I am curious if anyone might live there and knows of areas with cheap desert plots of land, not too ridiculously far from major cities though, for obvious medical reasons.

I intend to build a "passive house" take full advantage of the two growing seasons, and try to live as cheaply and off the land as possible. I am not totally opposed to building a green house to grow in either, if it turns out to be a high elevation area. Even higher elevation areas there would be better than any elevation where I am coming from in the northeast.

Any information that someone who lives or even has visited the area could provide, would be a huge help. I am planning a road trip to try to find a good location to settle into, any helpful tips provided could potentially save me days of driving, gas money, and grey hair. =)


High elevation areas, even at 3200 feet, make growing things much more difficult. In four years I produced zero good tomatoes at 3200 feet in the high desert in So. Ca. indoors or outside. The soil is basically sand.Water is very expensive or non existent. Its often very windy. Solar radiation is intense.The air is very dry. The nights are cold. Critters will eat everything that is not protected. Its the low deserts ,such as the Coachella valley that are good growing areas.
If you want to grow your own food the high deserts are probably not a good place.



posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 11:17 PM
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I'm not so sure that in a SHTF situation that a lot of people would head for the desert. If you don't know how to survive in that environment you won't last long. And anyone living in a rural desert location should/would have ample home defense against thieves or robbers.

Personally I'm a big fan of Northern Nevada...



Originally posted by rcwj1975
I would agree that New Mexico, Texas, Arizona, and even parts of Nevada are good for a "bug out" desert location, BUT...the main problem is this.

If and when the SHTF and we have complete chaos in this country, MILLIONS will flock to these areas as well. If the power is ever cut and winter is approaching, you and your desert land will be invaded by people looking to survive.




posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 11:29 PM
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reply to post by PhoenixDemon
 


Oh I agree with you IF your thinking like a survivalist. But lets put things into perspective. Much of todays population couldn't survive without the internet, let alone losing AC, HEAT, Electric, Gas, etc....so they turn to what they know. In the minds of those in a cold enviroment the seek heat/warmth. They WILL head south and to the desert/warm climate regions. They will NOT be thinking about what they can grow, kill, and use to survive. They think in simple terms: If the north gets cold, head south..If the south gets to hot, head north.

That all will come after spending days/weeks screaming WHY, WHY isnt everyone helping me, why isn't there aid, why am I not getting handouts...



posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 11:47 PM
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I have never lived in the desert, but have visited frequently . . . it is HOT and DRY. In some regions (Arizona in particular) people don't even have lawns -- too hard to keep the grass alive. Just rocks.

Not my choice for a "bug-out" location but I understand how it may help your family member's illness. My mother has Rheumatoid Lung Disease and the cold, dry winters & humid summers here sometimes give her trouble. Keep in mind that hot & dry often means very dusty as well, it may not be as good for him/her as you think. A side affect of my mother's RLD medication is a sun allergy as well, she can get severely sunburned VERY easily, just a thought in case your family member is on a similar medication for his/her condition, definitely not a good idea in the desert. I think the name of the drug is Methotrexate, but I'm not certain.

If you could find some property with a water source nearby (good luck!) that would be ideal. Even a small spring or tiny creek would be very advantageous.

Stock up on water BIGTIME. I mean alot. Especially if you're in a rural area. During SitX, in the summer heat, with no municipal water or electricity to run your well (presuming they even have wellwater out there?) that dry, dry heat will suck the moisture right out of you. Normal procedure is to count on using one gallon per person per day, I would at least double that in a desert environment.

Desert soil is typically very alkaline and hard to get most vegetables to grow in. Cucumber does pretty well in highly alkaline soil. You'll need to add alot of organic matter (compost) and/or heavy fertilizers to the soil to get anything else to grow. It would be alot of work to keep a well-producing vegetable garden in that climate, even with a greenhouse. It would probably be worth spending some time on researching any hybrid forms of fruit trees or berries that could survive in the desert. Strawberries do pretty well in the heat but they still need alot of water to produce well.

Not much to hunt for meat in the desert either, obviously due to the lack of vegetation to support large populations of animals like deer, elk, hogs, etc. Chickens are easy to take care of and could be raised fairly easily in the desert. Stay away from the heavier breeds like Jersey Giants, Brahmas, they cannot handle the hot weather very well. Medium-to-small breeds will do just fine in the heat. Examples are Delawares, Rhode Island Reds, Barred Rocks, etc. Those three are great dual-purpose birds, good egg producers and great for meat too.

My $0.02



posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 11:53 PM
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not sure if it would be the same for you, but some people have a hard time with respitory problems getting worse by moving to hot, dry desert enviroments. To be sure try holidaying in the region for a few weeks and seehow it goes, also if respitory gets worse, a humidifyer might help in those dryer climates. just something to think about.



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 12:09 AM
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reply to post by ashamedamerican

I am curious if anyone might live there and knows of areas with cheap desert plots of land, not too ridiculously far from major cities though, for obvious medical reasons.

I intend to build a "passive house" take full advantage of the two growing seasons, and try to live as cheaply and off the land as possible.


I'm thinking that somebody has been watching way too much PBS. Desert living is expensive and rarely self sufficient. you have to either pay somebody to haul in water or pay $10+ per foot for a well maybe a quarter mile deep. The water table is constantly falling so that well is going to be pushed down regularly and the energy cost of pumping the water up gets more expensive every year.

Growing crops in the desert is way expensive and self indulgent.



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 12:17 AM
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For a dry climate comparable to Arizona with a great growing conditions and a long growing season plus and overpopulation of game, Try northern california. Although we did have a few days last summer where it hit 26% humidity and we were dying. No one knew how to handle that kind of humidity when it wasn't winter, but generally it only like that during the rainy season in winter. Personally I don't think you can beat my bugout area somewhere in the Humbolt/Trinity/Siskyou/Shasta/Lassen area.No lack of natural resources and the only thing you really have to worry about is Mt. Lions and bears, which I see as food and blankets.



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 12:27 AM
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I wish you all of the luck in the world, but I will stay in my beloved southeastern area. Plenty of woodlands to hide in, plus plenty of game...if needed, we can head to a mountainous area.



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 01:21 AM
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Try Northeast California up by the the Oregon/Nevada border.It is pretty dry up there it is a desert and there is a growing season.

I had a friend and his family move up there for jobs and they like it.

Middle of nowhere but still a drive to the city.



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 03:10 AM
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I live in the desert and few will survive out here in a sitx.

Hell you can not survive if you drive off road unless you have years of experience in the desert

People die out here in the desert all the time.
www.encyclopedia.com...
www.yelp.com...
www.expatica.com...

In a sitx come out here to the desert please we will need the supplies you bring.

There are large areas of the desert that have water that is unfit for use straight from the ground.

just go to Google earth and scan the desert there is nothing green out here and nothing will grow.

Temperatures can reach over 120 degrees in the dead of summer,



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 04:17 AM
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OP, if you decide to move to the desert, would it be possible to allow a few of us to make provisions to hunker down there if we pay for our own supplies?



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 06:13 PM
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reply to post by calcoastseeker
 


Jobs
While its a perfect place for survival, there aren't any jobs over there. Its mostly uninhabited. Largest town in the county that occupies the Oregon Nevada border has a population less than 3000. The majority of the area is lake and tribal land.



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 06:27 PM
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I don't recall exactly where this was, although it was not more than 100 miles one way or the other of meteor crator......but the sign I was reading while relieving myself "reality sign" was something crazy like $100-250 per acre, depending on amount purchased and area desired.
I thought it sounded good until I started driving again and 3 hours later the landscape had not changed at all.

But....100 acres for 10 k sounds good, I just about went crazy just trying to pass through though, I could not imagine being there and my car/truck break down, esp in a SHTF situation, walk for help....no thank you.

Now if I had a half million to spare and built a place underground and had a plane, a really deep well......nevermind, I'll stick with the forest and the mountains and creeks.

But there your cheap desert land.....$100 an acre



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 09:36 PM
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Originally posted by Happyfeet
OP, if you decide to move to the desert, would it be possible to allow a few of us to make provisions to hunker down there if we pay for our own supplies?

When I do get relocated out there, if someone was serious about wanting to also make the move, even if that person was a stranger to me I would have to at least try to help them.

Please make sure you pay attention to what some of the people in this thread are saying though, because it is a very serious decision to make.
I have been reading online for months now learning how to build and live in the desert and I am still hesitant to move there, especially to a rural or country area like I plan to.
Something as simple as your car breaking down can cost you your life, but then again where I come from the same rules apply only you could freeze to death instead of cooking. For me the MAIN reason why I am moving to the desert is out of concern for a family members health, everything else comes as an afterthought.

I am going to MAKE this work no matter what it takes, because of the fact that everything else is an afterthought to the health of someone I care about. Your choices may be different. However I do honestly believe that it's a very good place to bug out to as well, anyone not prepared to cross desert land will not live long enough to attack you and your family. For the ones who do they will most likely be in a weakened dehydrated state long before they get to you, most likely the only people you would see are your neighbors, and chances are that unless you are both stupid you would work together for survival. Afterall at least in theory you would both want to live, and see your families live, it would be in your best interest.

I was probably a little vague last time I was a little pressed for time.
I plan to build a passive solar earth sheltered home, which built correctly will actually have less dust inside than a house that is not in the desert. I plan to have an air filtration system for obvious medical reasons to make sure the air quality is good. This could also be a total myth (maybe someone here can shed some light on it) but I also read that an underground home creates a negative ionization field which does multiple things to improve health, but I also read that the reasons for this aren't yet fully understood, which makes me cautious.

I intend to make everything as energy efficient as possible, use multiple solar collection methods from photovoltaic panels to thermal mass to solar hot water etc. I have no problem building a small greenhouse and bringing in good soil, building large water collection systems etc. Just the passive solar building techniques I have learned will reduce heating/cooling costs by 60-90% depending on exactly which methods I use, building an earth sheltered home reduces those costs even more. Combined with lots of other things like "earth tubes" just as one example, can all help to reduce heating cooling costs. I don't have the money to do it all at once but it will fall into place over time.

I have a good start at figuring most of this out, fully understand the hardships related to living in the desert and am willing to do all of this if it means a better quality of life for my family member.
I also have heard that in the northern parts of Arizona and New Mexico there is actually some good hunting, it's a different type of deer than we have here in the north, slightly smaller but rather abundant from what I have read.

I'm just hoping to find an ATS member who knows the area around New Mexico and may know for example that in "city a" there are almost always lots of jobs because it's a retirement community and/or family area with lots of shopping etc.
Or another example would be if someone happened to know that there was an area with lots of cheap land an hour or two drive from a good sized city etc.
Another good example: stay away from the nuclear waste dump in "city b"


Just hoping that anyone with knowledge of the area would hopefully share that information.
Like the advice about having a hard time growing tomatoes at higher altitudes, is worth it's weight in gold, thank you for telling me that.
Just a question though is it because of frost at night at higher altitudes that's giving you a hard time? If not, do you know why? Have you tried bringing in outside soil?


Originally posted by Doc Holiday
I don't recall exactly where this was, although it was not more than 100 miles one way or the other of meteor crator......but the sign I was reading while relieving myself "reality sign" was something crazy like $100-250 per acre, depending on amount purchased and area desired.

Information like that is priceless to me at a time like this, thank you very much and please guys keep it coming. Posting some information may not seem like a major thing but it is a HUGE help to me in my situation. If I can find a place like that only an hour or two from a good sized city I'm in business, and you just helped to improve the quality of life for someone.



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 10:14 PM
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reply to post by ashamedamerican
 


I live in New Mexico and anywhere with available water is relatively expensive as our population is growing with lots of retirees, trustfunders,
cybernetworking yuppies, illegal aliens, witness protection people and federal employees working for the labs, bases, who knows what else black ops projects, California escapees, Rich Mexicans and gambling addicted Texans.

However there are still land bargains to be found. I have bought lots of land for back taxes and repos. All desert and all dry but very beautiful. Eventually developers from China will buy my land, sink a deep deep well and build tract homes for the middle class. Currently I live in a small, very upscale village and the Chinese are buying up all the very expensive property as well.

Personally I wouldn't worry about hunkering down. Come on down to the Land of Enchantment and relax with a great laidback lifestyle, wonderful mix of cultures and just kickback, open a Corona and enjoy the most breathtaking sunsets imaginable.

Great skiing, worldclass trout fishing, Beautiful golf courses, art and culture that makes NY jealous and an entrepreneurial spirit second to none.


[edit on 19-12-2009 by whaaa]



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 10:41 PM
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Desert (1,500 ft) - Tonopah, AZ

High desert (2,000 ft) Black Canyon City, AZ

High plains - Foothills (5,000 ft) - Prescott, AZ

[edit on 19-12-2009 by In nothing we trust]



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 10:59 PM
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A bugout location makes no sense unless it is difficult to access by the general zombie population. A good bugout location would be some place that is just not worth the effort trying to get at you. This would be, for example, some location where you might have to have a plane you can land on a lake in the middle of some remote forest to access. Or, some place that would take days to hike and climb to get at you. If all I need is an ATV to get at you, you're doomed.

This is why investing money in a bugout place is not the best solution. Your survival may depend upon you remaining mobile and flexible. It's better to flee trouble and find a new bugout location than to stay and try to defend the one you've sunk all your money into. What happens when survival requires you to move where the jobs or food or water and other services are? Your investment could become worthless and abandoned if things get really bad.

Invest your emergency preparation and survival dollars wisely, and avoid putting all your eggs into one basket. A bugout bag and tent might be your best survival investment than some fixed location on a map, ha.



posted on Dec, 19 2009 @ 11:17 PM
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There is always an abundance of food in the desert year-round and plow-free: tumbleweed, cholla, prickly pear, mesquite, agave, amaranth, wild lettuce, mustard, the list goes on and on. You could probably supplement with a few houseplants of herbs and a small garden but there is no need at all for a farm. Drill a deep well and drink the water.



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