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Avatar, Great Achievement, or a Liberal/Communist Indoctrination Campaign?

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posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 09:40 AM

Originally posted by Wallachian
Wait, what? James Cameron portrayed Capitalism as evil?

He portrayed greed, stealing other people's land and property, killing other people for your personal gain, destroying the environment and other cultures as evil.

Are those things equivalent to Capitalism to you? Are greed and theft and murdering and destruction inherent parts of Capitalism?

Those are inherent to Communism but only in a free capitalistic country can you make those kinds of propaganda attacks.
Cameron and many others like him are too chicken to call the communist what they are, it's far easier to slander Capitalism because Capitalists don't fight back.
Capitalism is like the geek at school that everyone picks on. If capitalism was such an evil power, don’t you think they would stop all this anti Capitalism stuff? Go to any communist country and see how long it takes them to throw you in prison for speaking badly about them.

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 10:24 AM
The fact that you see Liberalism/Communism as something negative, goes to show that you have already been indoctrinated.

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 11:23 AM
reply to post by gdeed

And will it be you that runs it properly?
Communism is a fool’s game. Humans will never treat each other equally and to believe otherwise is naive to say the very least.
Who will create and build things if there is no incentive, no payback? Who will do the dirty and hard work?

OK, great. I've made notation of your opinion, you do not wish to treat others equally or participate in a social structure where everyone has equal governmental power. I've also noted your opinion that you lack understanding of the economic aspect of communism and that you are inherently a greedy person. If there is no incentive for you to work then you'll sit on your lazy butt. I wonder if you'd demand the government take care of you as well when you start getting sick and malnutrition, tossed out on the street. Greedy and possibly lazy. Yet, I'm sure your opinionated views are totally more valid than mine.

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 11:56 AM
Dude.... it's just a movie....

You know what, gather up a few friends and go protest it. You'll probably find James Cameron amongst the very same crowd of protesters lol...

Borrowing from the great Kevin Smith:

"Dude, it's a movie with a rubber poop monster in there... ...."

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 12:40 PM

Originally posted by bignick
The fact that you see Liberalism/Communism as something negative, goes to show that you have already been indoctrinated.

The fact that you see Capitalism as something negative goes to show you have been indoctrinated. There are ten times more socialists and communists than capitalists. Lefties dominate the world, and always have. The world kind of sucks must be something very wrong with the left ideology that rules most of it. Capitalism is certainly on the way out and all hope with it. The sheeple will eventually be caged by their communist masters once capitalism is rubbed out. I’m old, I don’t care. Every generation should have to earn their freedom and prosperity, good luck doing that under communism or socialism.

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 12:42 PM
I know AVATAR is supposed to be so cool, but hey I saw this movie already back when it was called "dances with wolves."

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 12:44 PM

Originally posted by sirnex
reply to post by gdeed

And will it be you that runs it properly?
Communism is a fool’s game. Humans will never treat each other equally and to believe otherwise is naive to say the very least.
Who will create and build things if there is no incentive, no payback? Who will do the dirty and hard work?

OK, great. I've made notation of your opinion, you do not wish to treat others equally or participate in a social structure where everyone has equal governmental power. I've also noted your opinion that you lack understanding of the economic aspect of communism and that you are inherently a greedy person. If there is no incentive for you to work then you'll sit on your lazy butt. I wonder if you'd demand the government take care of you as well when you start getting sick and malnutrition, tossed out on the street. Greedy and possibly lazy. Yet, I'm sure your opinionated views are totally more valid than mine.

Greedy and lazy are what communist are. Capitalist work for a living, lefties live off of what Capitalist create. Go back to school. Oh, you probably learned your leftwing stuff in public school, never mind.

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 01:37 PM

Originally posted by ozzraven

BTW i never understood why North-Americans like to call themselves as "Americans". Its funny because i live in America too, but not in USA. America is so much more than USA.

[edit on 17-12-2009 by ozzraven]

North America is broken up into basically 3 countries, Canada, Mexico, And the United States, which is short for The"United States of America"

Now, people from Canada in general are refered to as "Canadians" people from Mexico are generally refered to as "Mexicans"

Years ago people from the "British North American Colonies" were refered to as "Colonials"

Now they are generally refered to as "Americans" for the simple fact that the "A" in "USA" stands for America, and it is not so much of a mouthful as a "United statesian" or "staesian" or even "US citizen"

Through many years of being refered to as "Americans" the term has basically come to be understood that it refers to someone, or something involving the "United States of America"

I am not saying that it is proper, or not "discriminatory" (to other parts of both North and South America) All I am trying to do is in a simple fashion, explain how and why the United States of America, is often refered to as just "America".

I hope this helps you to understand the Terminology..

Back on topic.. As far as the movie goes, I have yet to see it, so I do not feel I can comment on it honestly..
That being said, I do understand the point the op is trying to make. But as others have said, It is a movie, possibly it is full of "propaganda", And while this may "influence" some people, and it may "upset" some people, and others will just be simply "entertained" yet still some may never even see or know this film ever existed..

No matter what catagory someone may fall into, I am just very appreciative that, for now, we still have the freedom and opportunity to,

1. make movies, vids,write articles, ETC. that may be "controversial" in one way or another.
2.We also still, for now, have the freedom to debate, critisize, argue,ETC. the above...

[edit on 18-12-2009 by SideWynder]

[edit on 18-12-2009 by SideWynder]

[edit on 18-12-2009 by SideWynder]

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 02:40 PM
Dont worry bro, when this beatiful planet is completely f@cked up, im sure you will have all the time in the world to bash "communism" and "liberalism"...

Seriously, I cannot comprehend this thread, and people who actually think this crap up.

So now being ecological is "liberal communism"?

GO GO SUVs, vroom vroom!

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 03:08 PM
Personally, I believe the original poster is way off base, completely.

I will be seeing "Avatar" soon enough, but knowing the message was not bashing "capitalism", but greed itself, and the act of raping the world for its resources.

If you look at the imagery, methods of comparison, and analogy, James Cameron is re-creating a story almost as old as time itself, good verses evil, George Lucas did this with Star Wars, recreating in essence the Bible wrapped up in the Jedi story of good verses evil, the power of good over evil, the power of the mind over technology, and through technology the enslavement of mankind to our own greed.

Avatar : The Movie : (New Extended HD Trailer)

Quote from : Wikipedia : Avatar (2009 Movie)

Avatar, also known as James Cameron's Avatar, is an American 3-D science fiction epic film written and directed by James Cameron, and was released on December 16, 2009 by 20th Century Fox.

The film is co-produced by Lightstorm Entertainment, and focuses on an epic conflict on Pandora, an inhabited Earth-sized moon of Polyphemus, one of three fictional gas giants orbiting Alpha Centauri A.

On Pandora, human colonists and the sentient humanoid indigenous inhabitants of Pandora, the Na'vi, engage in a war over the planet's resources and the latter's continued existence.

The film's title refers to an avatar, a representation of a real person in a virtual world.

The film was released in 2D and 3D formats, along with an IMAX 3D release in selected theaters.

The film is being touted as a breakthrough in terms of filmmaking technology, for its development of 3D viewing and stereoscopic filmmaking with cameras that were specially designed for the film's production.

Personally, from what I've seen through television commercials, the message I see, hear, and share is that James Cameron is trying to convey the message that man's greed at times, if not more often than not, exceeds our actual need, and through analogy, he is referencing the Native American's that our own ancestors screwed so many times who would have willingly shared the land because they did not see the land as belonging to any one individual, but to all people, to use but always respect, the same as the prisoner's sent to Australia who took the land from the Aborigines.

The white man, has been the bane of existence to almost every indigenous tribe on almost every continent we have explored, yes I am a white man, and I see the white man as the problem as he is the most dangerous predator of all, taking and rarely if ever giving back to the planet, using far more resources than is necessary, thinking only of green technology when our very existence is falsely played out through the "Global Warming" threat through financial predators like Al Gore.

I say falsely played out, not because I do not believe our environment is endangered, but because I believe that this is being hyped through people like Gore, in order to make us feel guilt for destroying something that is not the average citizens fault, but Congress and the politicians in Washington D.C. who print out 1,100 page Bailout Packages per Congressman, or Senator, and lay waste to an entire forest for one bill, and that it is an initiative, albeit a silent one, to make mankind feel guilt, remorse, and culpability for something we do not control the overspending, the over-compensating, and over-indulging, hypocritical politicians in Washington D.C. in a drive to push us into the paperless and cashless society through them utilizing any excuse to get us there, even putting us there through their own ignorance and arrogance.

Quote from : Wikipedia : Avatar (2009 Movie) : Plot

In A.D. 2154, the story’s protagonist, Jake Sully (Sam Worthington), is a former U.S. Marine who was wounded and paralyzed from the waist down in combat on Earth.

Jake is selected to participate in the Avatar program to replace his late twin brother, Tony, whose avatar is compatible with him, too.

He travels to Pandora, a lush and sentient-inhabited satellite of Polyphemus, one of three gas giants that orbit Alpha Centauri A, 4.3 light years from Earth.

Pandora is filled with incredible life forms, some beautiful, many terrifying. This world is also home to the Na’vi, a sentient humanoid race, who are considered primitive, yet are more physically capable than humans.

Standing three meters (approximately 10 feet) tall, with tails and sparkling blue skin, the Na’vi live in harmony with their unspoiled world.

As humans encroach deeper into Pandora's forests in search of valuable minerals to remedy a crisis on Earth, the Na’vi unleash their formidable warrior abilities to defend their threatened existence.

Jake has unwittingly been recruited to become part of this encroachment. Since humans are unable to breathe the air on Pandora, they have created genetically-bred human-Na’vi hybrids known as Avatars.

A genetically-compatible human's mind can be linked to their avatar, allowing them to control it and experience what it experiences, while their own body sleeps.

On Pandora, through his Avatar body, Jake feels like he can walk again. Sent deep into Pandora's jungles as a scout for the soldiers that will follow, Jake encounters many of Pandora's beauties and dangers.

There he meets a young Na’vi female, Neytiri (Zoe Saldaña).

Over time, Jake integrates himself into the Na'vi clan, and begins to fall in love with Neytiri.

As a result, Jake finds himself caught between the military-industrial forces of Earth and the Na’vi, forcing him to choose sides in an epic battle that will decide the fate of Pandora.

If you look at the plot, the names, as well as the integrate symbolism, Cameron is re-telling stories like Pandora's Box, Christopher Columbus, and Dances With Wolves.

For you to analyze this movie without having seen it, I have not seen it yet either, and to limit it to "Liberal Propaganda" (your words), without thought to the historical precedences where this has actually happened via the white man, and as well American Government, British Government, and Russian Government, shows the lack of scope, lack of insight, and lack of foresight and limited knowledge you have in the world altogether.

The movie to me, just watching the previews, and the limited reading on what I've done about it, screams of the rise of Hegemony through the bastardization of overstated needs of a society that is so selfish, so self-aggrandized, and so self-centered as to wipe out a race of people without thought of those people, making to me what I see as the equivalent of the American Government's wiping out of nearly all indigenous Native American's as equal to that the crimes of tyrant Adolph Hitler's Nazi Germany wiping out of the Jews at all of the atrocious Concentration Camps.

Quote from : Wikipedia : Hegemony

Hegemony : is the political, economic, ideological or cultural power exerted by a dominant group over other groups, regardless of the explicit consent of the latter.

While initially referring to the political dominance of certain ancient Greek city-states over their neighbours, the term has come to be used in a variety of other contexts, in particular Marxist philosopher Antonio Gramsci's theory of cultural hegemony.

And, before you try that Conservative verses Liberal horse-puckey on me, since my comments within this post are in no way a personal attack, they are instead a critique of your knowledge, I am not Conservative, nor Liberal, neither Republican, nor Democrat, I am a wholly free, single, white male, who is a registered Independent, who respects the Native American culture, more so than the ignorant American Government, who while they may have almost killed off the people who originally owned North America before us, have much more dignity, much more intelligence, and much more right to having this country than we do.

I can see clearly that this movie is supposed to be about the greed of mankind, through an analogy of Pandora's Box, the height of greed in that Pandora had everything, but could not contain her own curiosity, and thereby released her own undoing by greed and vanity of her own, almost felled humanity itself, if not for hope being released with the pestilence.

Quote from : Wikipedia : Pandora's Box

In Greek mythology, Pandora's box is the large jar carried by Pandora that unleashed many terrible things on humanity – ills, toils and sickness – and hope.

Contrary to use in popular culture, Pandora's Box was not actually a box at all, but rather a jar.

Hence, the historically correct use of the phrase would be "Pandora's jar," not "Pandora's box."

Sure sounds more like an analogy of mankind's greed through corporations manufacturing Swine Flu, manufacturing it's antidote, and releasing it as a pandemic, instead of Communism to me.

Because while I agree Communism may be a bad thing, it is a virus, just as much as Democracy, being spread through propaganda, dogmatic and ignorant views, and by people spouting out warnings with no real concept of what it is other than what school teaches them through dogmatic re-recital of preplanned agendas. I have to say that anyone who takes either side, the Republican or Democrat, Conservative or Liberal, who falls into the trap of picking one of two sides, is a victim of a false dichotomy.

"Weasel Zippers", is nothing more, than a Conservative slanted blog.

Here’s the video from the original post.

On Today: James Cameron Reveals Liberal Propaganda in Avatar

I hear nothing more than a man who has convictions, standing up for what he believes, if the original poster believes contrary to what James Cameron does, just say so, don’t hide behind the Conservative verses Liberal crap, because that argument is older than most politicians sitting on both sides of the political aisle.

[edit on 18-12-2009 by SpartanKingLeonidas]

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 03:25 PM
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

You have a lot to learn about Communism, Capitalism, and Imperialism. Not to mention the intentions and ages of the people who share this message board with you.

I love being a Capitalist, but to me it does not mean taking over somebody elses country and raping THEIR natural resources for the good of America. It does not mean interfering in the internal affairs of another country so an American businessman can go there and become a billionaire while the locals are used up and spit out like yesterdays fecal matter.

There is nothing wrong with wanting respect and fair play among the nations that interact with each other on this planet. This planet, it's people, and resources do not exist so that AMERICAN BUSINESSES CAN USE IT UP.

WE AMERICANS ARE NOT THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT EXIST ON THE PLANET. If you are a Christian, then you must understand that God loves non-Americans too.

Calling somebody or some country Communist is the first step to trying to eliminate them. The thing is calling somebody a Communist does not make them one. I could call you a KANGAROO, but that would not instantly turn you into one.

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 03:48 PM

I was thinking the same lol.

I won't get into the lib/commie/capitalist debate because they ALL have done this in the past. As already pointed out; this is a old story told many times before in many forms. It is about HUMANITY, not political ideology. GREED and IMPERIALISM are inherit in mankind, regardless of political affiliation or structure.

I have not seen the movie yet, so can't comment if only Americans are portrayed as "the bad guys" or not. Even so, the movie was made in America for Americans. It is much easier to convey an idea or point using the "look in the mirror" effect. If "commies" were used then the point maybe lost to would be...ahhh the bad commies are doing exactly what I would expect of them, rather then "let's look at ourselves and actions"

And yes a true commie is making a movie that will result in multi millions of dollars going in to his bank account. Wouldn't a commie want to distribute their propaganda for free, so that the manifesto reaches as many as possible.

On the flip side, do movies such as Black Hawk Down or other similar pro-American(capitalist) movies bother you?

Do you know James first thought of this story when he was a young teen ager. He must have been some heavy intellectual back then lol.

BTW, I'm sure your aware( being from Cuba) that the reason Communism first took root in Cuba is because of precisely what this movie is about? Greedy and Imperialistic people( Americans at the time) owning almost everything and abusing the local populace and resources. Check your history.

Lotsa small minds around these days

Here...I'll even give you more ammo for your belief...are ya ready.......

James Cameron is a filthy stinkin' pinko Canadian...oh my!!

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 03:54 PM
reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas and Connector

Yes SKL and Connector, didn't you know it's better to slaughter indigenous people and rape the land of resources?
Damn all you posters showing your humanity.

As I said on Page four Ive actually watched this movie, Its kinda weird all these interpretations on something that hasn't been viewed...

Its visually an artisitc masterpiece, and also just a classic heros journey tale, classic scriptwritting, like Star wars etc.

Other Posters go watch it, before you keep making opionated fools of yourselves.
Its like reviewing a book you havent bothered reading, Or all the Christians that went nuts at the Life of Brian without watching it, and indeed now find it funny

Why am I wasting my time on this lame thread.

[edit on 18-12-2009 by zazzafrazz]

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 04:26 PM
After careful consideration, I'll admit it.......your right zazzy
. If they aren't using the resources correctly, why shouldn't we? And if they can;t defend themselves, they must be weak....don't need that DNA in the gene pool

Now that I'm thinking about it....what was James' motive in terminator. Really though, did he need to demonize machines that way? What about the aliens in Aliens? I won't even bring up Titanic....we all know what's wrong with that movie. Hmmm .....I see a commie trend here......

BTW, I completely agree with your last sentence.....

[edit on 18-12-2009 by Connector]

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 05:17 PM
reply to post by zazzafrazz

zazza, I have to say I have much more respect for the indigenous tribes of any culture, than for those who would take the land without thought of those currently inhabiting it.

It saddens to me to be related to that race that would do that, and I refuse to be a part of the uncivilized behavior, hidden behind corporate greed, utilizing the lie of progress as a shield to hide their lies of meaningless and rampant spreading to an area they neither need, nor have the right to.

More often than not this is done for the greed of land, but as well it leads to the discovery of gold, silver, and other precious metals, and the symbology of alchemy is brought about not through wizards creating gold out of lead, but through lead bullets leading to the corruption of society itself and making the proverbial "gold" through illicit means of killing off the indigenous populace.

Wealthy Exploit and Silence Native Americans, Indigenous Cultures, Women, Children and Nature

Hegemonic greed is nothing more than a virus itself, spreading through lies, not of the Conservative, nor the Liberal, but through the indoctrination that we as a society actually benefit because of these false labels, and that people believe falsely that they are on one side or another, but instead they are being used by both sides, the false dichotomy.

zazzafraz, I can see the original poster is trying, but I see that loyalty to a party line rules, and not a belief through freedom, nor the ability to see both sides.

The Men Who Stare At Goats : Secret Missions, Movies, and Propaganda

If the original poster saw both sides, he would not claim "Communism" of James Cameron, but claim instead that a balance is being shifted via both sides, propaganda of both Democracy and Communism.

Are You "Right-Wing Fringe", or "Left-Wing Fringe" and How Will They Push You

The Beginning of the End of US Hegemony - Class War & the G20 London Summit

This is where I see both sides of the conflict as wrong, as both sides are being played for fools, by those power elite, who utilize Divde and Conquer.

Hegelian Dialectic- Problem, Reaction, Solution explained 1/3

Hegelian Dialectic- Problem, Reaction, Solution explained 2/3

Hegelian Dialectic- Problem, Reaction, Solution explained 3/3

Right and Left : A Control Mechanism of the Skull and Bones Society, the Order of Chaos

Again, nothing more than the bastard, Hegemony, killing off an indigenous populace.

Quote from : Wikipedia : Dialectic : Hegelian Dialectic

Hegelian dialectic, usually presented in a three-fold manner, was stated by Heinrich Moritz Chalybäus as comprising three dialectical stages of development: a thesis, giving rise to its reaction, an antithesis, which contradicts or negates the thesis, and the tension between the two being resolved by means of a synthesis.

Although this model is often named after Hegel, he himself never used that specific formulation.

Hegel ascribed that terminology to Kant.

Carrying on Kant's work, Fichte greatly elaborated on the synthesis model, and popularized it.

On the other hand, Hegel did use a three-valued logical model that is very similar to the antithesis model, but Hegel's most usual terms were: Abstract-Negative-Concrete.

Sometimes Hegel would use the terms, Immediate-Mediated-Concrete.

Hegel used these terms hundreds of times throughout his works.

The formula, Thesis-Antithesis-Synthesis, does not explain why the Thesis requires an Antithesis.

However, the formula, Abstract-Negative-Concrete, suggests a flaw in any initial thesis—it is too abstract and lacks the negative of trial, error and experience.

The same applies to the formula, Immediate-Mediated-Concrete.

For Hegel, the Concrete, the Synthesis, the Absolute, must always pass through the phase of the Negative, that is, Mediation.

This is the actual essence of what is popularly called Hegelian Dialectics.

To describe the activity of overcoming the negative, Hegel also often used the term Aufhebung, variously translated into English as "sublation" or "overcoming," to conceive of the working of the dialectic.

Roughly, the term indicates preserving the useful portion of an idea, thing, society, etc., while moving beyond its limitations.

(Jacques Derrida's preferred French translation of the term was relever).

In the Logic, for instance, Hegel describes a dialectic of existence: first, existence must be posited as pure Being (Sein); but pure Being, upon examination, is found to be indistinguishable from Nothing (Nichts).

When it is realized that what is coming into being is, at the same time, also returning to nothing (in life, for example, one's living is also a dying), both Being and Nothing are united as Becoming.

As in the Socratic dialectic, Hegel claimed to proceed by making implicit contradictions explicit: each stage of the process is the product of contradictions inherent or implicit in the preceding stage.

For Hegel, the whole of history is one tremendous dialectic, major stages of which chart a progression from self-alienation as slavery to self-unification and realization as the rational, constitutional state of free and equal citizens.

The Hegelian dialectic cannot be mechanically applied for any chosen thesis.

Critics argue that the selection of any antithesis, other than the logical negation of the thesis, is subjective.

Then, if the logical negation is used as the antithesis, there is no rigorous way to derive a synthesis.

In practice, when an antithesis is selected to suit the user's subjective purpose, the resulting "contradictions" are rhetorical, not logical, and the resulting synthesis is not rigorously defensible against a multitude of other possible syntheses.

The problem with the Fichtean "Thesis-Antithesis-Synthesis" model is that it implies that contradictions or negations come from outside of things.

Hegel's point is that they are inherent in and internal to things.

This conception of dialectics derives ultimately from Heraclitus.

Hegel has outlined that the purpose of dialectics is "to study things in their own being and movement and thus to demonstrate the finitude of the partial categories of understanding"

One important dialectical principle for Hegel is the transition from quantity to quality, which he terms the Measure.

The measure is the qualitative quantum, the quantum is the existence of quantity.

"The identity between quantity and quality, which is found in Measure, is at first only implicit, and not yet explicitly realised. In other words, these two categories, which unite in Measure, each claim an independent authority.

On the one hand, the quantitative features of existence may be altered, without affecting its quality. On the other hand, this increase and diminution, immaterial though it be, has its limit, by exceeding which the quality suffers change. [...] But if the quantity present in measure exceeds a certain limit, the quality corresponding to it is also put in abeyance.

This however is not a negation of quality altogether, but only of this definite quality, the place of which is at once occupied by another.

This process of measure, which appears alternately as a mere change in quantity, and then as a sudden revulsion of quantity into quality, may be envisaged under the figure of a nodal (knotted) line".

As an example, Hegel mentions the states of aggregation of water:

"Thus the temperature of water is, in the first place, a point of no consequence in respect of its liquidity: still with the increase or diminution of the temperature of the liquid water, there comes a point where this state of cohesion suffers a qualitative change, and the water is converted into steam or ice".

As other examples Hegel mentions the reaching of a point where a single additional grain makes a heap of wheat; or where the bald-tail is produced, if we continue plucking out single hairs.

Another important principle for Hegel is the negation of the negation, which he also terms Aufhebung (sublation): Something is only what it is in its relation to another, but by the negation of the negation this something incorporates the other into itself.

The dialectical movement involves two moments that negate each other, a somewhat and an another.

As a result of the negation of the negation, "something becomes an other; this other is itself somewhat; therefore it likewise becomes an other, and so on ad infinitum".

Something in its passage into other only joins with itself, it is self-related.

In becoming there are two moments:coming-to-be and ceasing-to-be: by sublation, i.e. negation of the negation, being passes over into nothing, it ceases to be, but something new shows up, is coming to be. What is sublated (aufgehoben) on the one hand ceases to be and is put to an end, but on the other hand it is preserved and maintained.

In dialectics, a totality transform itself, it is self-related.

The abstract, being a "savage Indian", the negative being that those "savages" refuse to move off of OUR LAND, a false premise, and the concrete being the eradication and or removal to a Reservation.

James Cameron's Avatar Movie Story Behind The Scenes Featurette HD

[edit on 18-12-2009 by SpartanKingLeonidas]

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 07:50 PM
I think people need to decide what the movie means to them, if they choose to let it mean anything at all other than a fantastic science fiction movie.

YouTube : Avatar Channel

AVATAR - Official Launch Trailer (HD)

I see the movie as complex, a Marine, living with a disability, seeking out a way to feel as if he is a whole physical being again, finding the solution offered through the the promise of the Avatar Body, similar to prosthetics.

Quote from : Wikipedia : Prosthesis

In medicine, a prosthesis (plural prostheses; from the Greek πρόσθεσις "addition") is an artificial extension that replaces a missing body part.

It is part of the field of biomechatronics, the science of using mechanical devices with human muscle, skeleton, and nervous systems to assist or enhance motor control lost by trauma, disease, or defect.

Prostheses are typically used to replace parts lost by injury (traumatic) or missing from birth (congenital) or to supplement defective body parts.

Inside the body, artificial heart valves are in common use with artificial hearts and lungs seeing less common use but under active technology development.

Other medical devices and aids that can be considered prosthetics include artificial eyes, palatal obturator, gastric bands, and dentures.

After finding his ability to walk again, he falls in love, and like Vietnam, "goes native".

Looking at the meaning of "avatar" though we can see its original meaning.

Quote from : Wikipedia : Avatar

In Hinduism, Avatar or Avatara (Devanagari अवतार, IAST avatāra, Sanskrit for "descent" viz., from heaven to earth, from the verbal root tṝ "to cross over") refers to a deliberate descent of a deity from heaven to earth, and is mostly translated into English as "incarnation", but more accurately as "appearance" or "manifestation", as it corresponds more closely to the view of Docetism in Christian theology, as distinct from the idea of incarnation in mainstream Christology and its implication of God 'in the flesh'.

The term is most often associated with Vishnu, though it has also come to be associated with other deities.

Varying lists of avatars of Vishnu appear in Hindu scriptures, including the ten (daśāvatāra) of the Garuda Purana and the twenty-two avatars in the Bhagavata Purana, though the latter adds that the incarnations of Vishnu are innumerable.

The avatars of Vishnu are a primary component of Vaishnavism. While Vishnu is typically spoken of as the source of the avatars, in Vaishnavism, Narayana, Vasudeva, and Krishna are also described as the source.

While Shiva and Ganesha are also described as descending in the form of avatars, with the Ganesha Purana and the Mudgala Purana detailing Ganesha's avatars specifically, the avatars of Vishnu carry a greater theological prominence than those of Shiva or Ganesha and upon examination relevant passages are directly imitative are imitative of the earlier Vishnu avatar lists.

One of the earliest references to avatar is in the Bhagavad Gita (c. 3138 BC), which describes the typical role of an avatar of Vishnu—to bring dharma, or righteousness, back to the social and cosmic order:

Whenever righteousness wanes and unrighteousness increases I send myself forth.

In order to protect the good and punish the wicked,

In order to make a firm foundation for righteousness,

I come into being age after age. (4.7–8)

Symbologically, this is an adaption of the xenophobic humans, against aliens.

Quote from : Wikipedia : Xenophobia

Xenophobia is a dislike and/or fear of that which is unknown or different from oneself.

It comes from the Greek words ξένος (xenos), meaning "stranger," "foreigner" and φόβος (phobos), meaning "fear."

The term is typically used to describe a fear or dislike of foreigners or of people significantly different from oneself, usually in the context of visibly differentiated minorities.

Rise of Xenophobia in Europe

Xenophobic Violence Erupts in South Africa

Xenophobia in Russia 'Out of Control'

So, if anything, James Cameron is speaking out against racism, against the needless rape of the environment, the ecology of the world, and war all at once.

[edit on 18-12-2009 by SpartanKingLeonidas]

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 08:25 PM
There is nothing good about Communism. It has been tried by many countries and so called equality seekers.

[edit on 18-12-2009 by gdeed]

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 08:31 PM
Imperialism is a problem for the nation engaging in it as much as it is for those on the receiving end of the Empire's might. America is indeed an
empire, you can call it our "Sphere of influence" but it is just a superlative for the same thing.

Secondly I think
Mr. Cameron, like most liberals, are confused as to what capitalism actually is. Any time you have a centralization of power and wealth it is not capitalism, as we have it here in the US with the FED and the Federal Gorvernment's incurrsion into the market. That called fascism(corporatism) and it is an old worn out idea as much as socialism and communism. Freedom and decentralization is a NEW concept to the world. Something NOT EVEN conservatives have caught onto.

That said, that leaves us Constitutionalists and Free Market advocates like me and some of the membership of ATS, the citizenry of the US and one or two Congressmen and Senators. Communism is stealthy just as fascism, but fascism would be more subtle in a society like ours, as the foundations are already there in our leaderships' imperialistic desires and irreconcilable inclinations toward corruption that we the people have failed to identify and hold to account.

Indeed, we have a problem here in America. It's called ignorance. Ignorance of the Constitution, ignorance of ones own rights, ignorance of ones own responsibility, and ignorance of history. Out of that ignorance we've built the most pervasive empire known to man. I'm going to go see this movie because I love alien movies. That's it. Bur Mr. Cameron and others have a right to say what they will and believe what they wish, and in the Free Market of ideas, his and anyones ideas ignoring the free human-and the powers of a free people will find themselves fading into obscurity, or, if that fails, on the wrong end of a freemans revolution.

Edit: Grammar, spelling.

[edit on 18-12-2009 by projectvxn]

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 10:03 PM

Originally posted by bignick
The fact that you see Liberalism/Communism as something negative, goes to show that you have already been indoctrinated.

Not really, I didn't just "read it or was indoctrinated by some Liberal/Socialist/Communist professor" meanwhile living in a Capitalist country, and having the FREEDOMS that are denied under a Socialist/Communist dictatorship.... I actually lived, and experienced Communism, and I, like millions of others, am talking from experience.

The people who ahve been indoctrinated are those like you, you don't even try to say Liberalism and Communism are different, which that in itself shows your ideas are to the far left of the political spectrum.

To those who keep claiming James Cameron is not embracing the Communist ideals, and he is not a Communist, let's see who else talks like this about how "Capitalism, and U.S. imperialism is what has caused all the problems in the world"....

"I promise I won't talk more than others have talked this afternoon," he said at the start of a rambling, 25-minute diatribe that outshot other speakers by a full 20 minutes. In the wide-ranging speech, he called capitalism the "road to hell" responsible for poverty, murder, AIDS — and even unfair climate agreements, the Toronto Star

And look what else does this self professed Socialist/Communist, and yes he has stated 'so I am a Communist, so what?"....

Let's see what else he says..

Calling on spiritual leaders as varied as Jesus, Muhammad and Karl Marx, Chavez bellowed that climate discussions were going on behind closed doors and draft agreements remained "top secret."

"The text presented is not democratic or inclusive," said Chavez, who has made it a practice in his native Venezuela to close opposition newspapers, radio stations and TV networks, and jails dissident politicians on spurious charges.

"It's not democratic, it's not inclusive. Well, ladies and gentlemen, isn't that the reality of the world? Are we really in a democratic world?"

First of all Karl Marx was not an "spiritual leader"... His ideas seeked for the destruction of all individualism, and spiritualism, but since most south Americans are religious he had to use religion also as part of his tactics to lure the poor to him.

Karl Marx was a CRITIC of ALL religions, and in essense was an atheist all of his life....

Marx was an atheist from his childhood and remained such for the whole of the rest of his life.

His atheism was not only practical but also theoretical. His theoretical atheism is due primarily to philosophical reasons and only secondarily to historical, social and political reasons.

Already in his thesis for the doctorate Marx proclaims in no uncertain terms that "in the country of reason" the existence of God cannot have any meaning.

BTW, you want to be an atheist, that is fine, but it is not your right, nor your "destiny" like some atheists seem to think to "rid the world of all religions, and spirituality"....

It should be the CHOICE of every individual to believe what he, or she WANTS TO BELIEVE...

Anyway, then Chavez also states "this is not Democratic" do you know why Socialists/Communists talk about Democracy? Because it is the easiest way for true Socialism/Communism to slowly be embraced by a nation, and to control everyone by making them believe the "mayority agrees with me"...

In the past, EVERY TIME true Socialists/Communists have infiltrated countries through "Democratic Parties", and "environmental parties."

BTW, I am not saying "let's destroy the environment".... With freedom also comes responsibility, but this doesn't mean to give up our individual rights, and to give up technology because of the flawed ideas of some.

posted on Dec, 18 2009 @ 10:31 PM
Hello everyone,

I just got back from the movie myself ( I am a severe graphics junkie ) and to be honest I think the OP blew it out of proportion. The only thing the movie attacks is greed and corruption. I think the OP is subconciously linking those with capitalism or trying to fuel the debate to get the liberal / conservative - or communism / captialism thing going.

For the record I like the idea of capitalism. I don't like, however, the way the current system has been tainted by the very thing the movie attacks... corperate greed for the sake of 'shareholders' and corruption. Those things are whats causing the people now adays to believe that handing all control to the government to keep people from 'excelling too much' because they have seen so much of the taint by the greedy and corrupt that they have in thier minds that all successful hardworking people got there by behaving that way.
If you want to preserve capitalism make sure you make those points instead of getting into a bullfight with the supposed 'opposition'.
Everything can be and is a division tactic.

Thanks for reading!
(forgive my attrocious spelling in advance!)
[editing spelling problems as I see them]

[edit on 18-12-2009 by EminenceofAeon]

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