Hitler was NOT an occultist

reply to post by queenannie38

As I recall Crowley had some words on the swastika...somewheres...He said it was associated with the number 65, and either 65 or the swastika had the name, The Beginning Of Whirling Motion, which I think he also gave in Hebrew as "Ras_hith Ha Gilgalim" (I don't speak Hebrew, and it's been years, but, see how memory serves, that's probably wrong).
(I had to put in the underline cause the ATS censor thought I swore, hee-hee)

The beginning of whirling motion bit was about how the swastika was at a point above Kether ...sort of the pre-reflective consciousness moment, or like the very first moment of the Big Bang, when there wasn't yet anything but it wasn't the same nothing you always had before...the immanent pregnant kernel, kind of thing ...These are not Crowley's words, just my take on his words, and I read it years ago.

This doesn't show that Hitler's choice was influenced by Crowley, obviously...but had Hitler been aware of this conceptual-stream-or-lump, it would seem like an auspicious symbol choice along those lines ...But Buddhists among everybody have also liked the symbol independently, pick-your-influences kind of thing

Also I vote Hitler was not a Christian...He had to pretend in order to seem more normal/regular/suitable for power...same way as Bill+Hillary+Barack gotta smirk their way through church, for example, I bet they don't believe in that stuff at all...

[edit on 29-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

[edit on 29-12-2009 by nine-eyed-eel]

reply to post by nine-eyed-eel


thank you
i don't remember the swastika in Crowley's writings, so i'll have to dig it out when i get the chance.

Hitler spoke a lot about GOD in his speeches and writings, but he preferred to keep it as general as possible; it seems he believed in "freedom of religion."

he most often spoke of "providence."

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
reply to post by 2000 Yards

 

What is funny about that is that most occultists don't even believe in Satan!!

Or they actually understand the symbolic representation of the concept of Satan, not as a 'person' per se, but as an integral part of man, the 'animal urges', etc..

This is important to 'believe in' in any practice, if you are to conquer it... as in Gnosticism, or Essene Christianity...

or to 'embrace' it.. as in LeVayan Satanism.

in the former path.. it is indeed what it's namesake means...
(hebrew) 'Shaytan"... "the adversary". (within)

and recognition of it is needed to even begin progress within one's being's refinement... along either path.


i choose the path less travelled... in the Gnostic practice.
though I am certainly not immune or guiltless from giving into temptation, I believe there are Billions of unknowing 'satanists' out there ... worshiping the desires of the senses in their most primal forms..

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I had some discussion with another on the subject of Hitler and the occult in 'Shards of the Illuminati'.

It sort of began to get going here at the first reply. KilgoreTrout and I discussed the transformation at Pasewalk, his relationship to Hess, the practical reasons for any vegetarian practice, the use of will, etc. I think it runs through page 89 interspersed within other conversation. It actually would have been a better fit for this thread than the one it is in and well, it's already there so why should I rehash it here?





Moral Orel: Get Those Praying Mantises


[edit on 12/30/2009 by EnlightenUp]

reply to post by EnlightenUp



Well, there have been accusations of Hitler's occult involvement for years, but accusations do not equate into it being fact. People like Chain want to try to equate accusations with fact.

When one examines what Hitler did, like Ashley said, he tried to appeal to "all people." When he learned he wasn't that appealing, he started persecuting them. He was really just a politician, not necessarily a Christian and certainly not an occultist.

In short, the results of miscegenation are always the following: (a) The level of the superior race becomes lowered; (b) physical and mental degeneration sets in, thus leading slowly but steadily towards a progressive drying up of the vital sap. The act which brings about such a development is a sin against the will of the Eternal Creator. And as a sin this act will be avenged.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 11

Source

Now, admittedly, this source seems to be arguing from an atheist perspective, which I am not, it does bring up some interesting quotes from Hitler's book. He doesn't sound occultic at all. Here are somemore quotesfrom the same source:

Anyone who dares to lay hands on the highest image of the Lord commits sacrilege against the benevolent creator of this miracle and contributes to the expulsion from paradise.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf Vol. 2 Chapter 1

This human world of ours would be inconceivable without the practical existence of a religious belief. The great masses of a nation are not composed of philosophers. For the masses of the people, especially faith is absolutely the only basis of a moral outlook on life. The various substitutes that have been offered have not shown any results that might warrant us in thinking that they might usefully replace the existing denominations. ...There may be a few hundreds of thousands of superior men who can live wisely and intelligently without depending on the general standards that prevail in everyday life, but the millions of others cannot do so.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 10

Really?

I think the last quote is the most telling. Personal spirituality and philosophy is much more important to an occultist than a shared religion is.

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


Thank you for that brilliant work of a facts and not hearsay and conjecture that can be prevalent in a lot of ATS. Starred as one cant argue with the words from the man him self. I also take the understanding from his words that he was not in to any organised religion as any Mystic and Occultist wouldn't be. Though ironically a religious type structure was the end result of his understandings as he ultimately followed the dark way of his own ego.

perhaps it is Hitler, himself, who is the hidden factor in this issue. a mystery, still, to this day.

"Hitler will emerge from the hatred that surrounds him now as one of the most significant figures who ever lived... he had a mystery about him in the way that he lived and in the manner of his death that will live and grow after him. He had in him the stuff of which legends are made."
- John F. Kennedy, President of the United States of America

no matter what one's opinion of Hitler may be, it is undeniable that he continues to be an interesting enigma to many people, myself included.

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


I decided I would read that infernal book instead of letting others' snippets decide my opinion.

Now I know what dark unity is, that is, unification in the shadow realm. The light realm is of perfect unification of polarity, resolution of paradox, wheras the dark realm chops every continuum into atom sized bits that never fully dissolve into one another. It's perfect madness and chaos. Mein Kampf is a window into absolute darkness, which can be quite enlightening. It hasn't anything directly to do with the content or ideas (which are themselves reprehensible enough) but rather with the finely sliced inherent contradiction in the book, arranged in maximum competing tension.

If he wasn't an occultist in a deliberate sense I can see why those that are on a dark path liked that guy. He's utterly void. What got accomplished is nearly the polar opposite of the stated goals-- but that's just how that works.

reply to post by Epsillion70


Thank you for the compliment. People,in my opinion, need to take a good look at what is really happening in this world. All anyone who may have insight can do is shed light on it.

reply to post by queenannie38


Well, it's a mystery as to how this "madman" came to power. Now, he was in many ways brilliant, as most "madmen" tend to be, but he went from pauper to fuhrer....

Nazi star wars: How Britain recruited a German to second guess Hitler's astrologers

In the battle against Hitler, he was one of the more unlikely figures - a German astrologer who claimed he could predict the Fuhrer's war plans.

Astonishingly, Louis de Wohl was hired by British intelligence after convincing spymasters that Hitler was obsessed with horoscopes and had tried to recruit him to provide readings.

and then

In fact, some historians now believe that de Wohl's claims were a spectacular ruse and that Hitler had no interest in astrology.

But the papers reveal that de Wohl had also influenced "high-placed British intelligence officers" for whom he also began to write horoscopes.

reply to post by queenannie38


Well, yeah. The accusations that Hitler was involved or even interested in anything occult or esoteric is just that, accusations. I have yet to come across anything that convinced me that he even had an interest.

Originally posted by queenannie38
and, interestingly enough, if the swastika, either right- or left-facing, is animated to spin 360 degrees in either direction, repeatedly, the single-frame swastika becomes a sun.
i created just such an animation, several years ago; if and when i remember where it is, i'll post it.

here it is:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/5d3d58f4b46b.gif[/atsimg]

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Well, yeah. The accusations that Hitler was involved or even interested in anything occult or esoteric is just that, accusations. I have yet to come across anything that convinced me that he even had an interest.

well, i'm with you
probably the only one, too!

i just don't find anything convincing, either.

reply to post by queenannie38


Well, you know, it's one of two things. There are claims that he was a jew, occultist, homosexual, et cetera. Yet, he persecuted all of them.

1. He was either so ingrained with self-hatred that he tried to rid the world of anything that remotely resembled him, which is possible.

or

2. He never was any of those things.