National White History Month

Originally posted by letheravensoar
reply to post by v3_exceed

 

Affirmative action is a way of acknowledging the fact that white and non-white people have the EXACT same challenges, but non-white people have that one extra thing: racism.

So you don't think white people experience racism?

Originally posted by letheravensoar
And I don't see why you would assume that a European American wouldn't get a government job because of affirmative action. No law requires, encourages, or allows a black man to be hired over a white man. That's a common misconception of Affirmative action that only exists in people's minds who don't know what they're talking about.

I do agree that once we can get rid of affirmative action as a whole, we will then be equal. I also believe that Affirmative action AT THIS POINT is necessary. America has not advanced enough to consider taking that away from the disadvantaged people who it aids.

Affirmative action may play less of a role in being a factor of whether a white gets a job (government or private) than it once did (quotas, etc..) but it still has a lot to do with whites not getting hired due to lack of jobs because employers are hesitant to terminate non-whites who are inefficient/not productive out of fear of discrimination lawsuits.

[edit on 16-12-2009 by slimpickens93]

reply to post by slimpickens93


Why would the employer assume that a person of color would play the race card? Isn't that initial assumption just an admission of the non-white stereotype?
If the employer has the best intentions, there is no reason he shouldn't get his proper justice in a court of law against a disgruntled ex-employee who pulls the race card.

I don't think that single occurrence is a substantial enough reason to get rid of Affirmative action. It's possible that it could happen to an employer, certainly. But to combat that notion, some whites simply can't believe the fact that a non-white competitor might be more qualified.
Not implying anyone in particular, and there's no reason anyone should feel offended by that statement. Yet somehow I'm expecting to get continually flamed for saying that whites are born with privilages that non whites in America are not born with.
Why is such a blatant truth so hard for some people to see? Denial.

And your first comment, I absolutely believe that whites can experience racism. But because whites are born with privilages that a lot of whites themselves don't notice- but every person of color does- they can step outside of the subject of race at any moment and continue about their lives. It has something to do with being the majority. That's changing and it will be interesting to see how the conversation of race changes with it.

Originally posted by slimpickens93

Originally posted by letheravensoar
reply to post by v3_exceed

 

Affirmative action is a way of acknowledging the fact that white and non-white people have the EXACT same challenges, but non-white people have that one extra thing: racism.

So you don't think white people experience racism?

Originally posted by letheravensoar
And I don't see why you would assume that a European American wouldn't get a government job because of affirmative action. No law requires, encourages, or allows a black man to be hired over a white man. That's a common misconception of Affirmative action that only exists in people's minds who don't know what they're talking about.

I do agree that once we can get rid of affirmative action as a whole, we will then be equal. I also believe that Affirmative action AT THIS POINT is necessary. America has not advanced enough to consider taking that away from the disadvantaged people who it aids.

Affirmative action may play less of a role in being a factor of whether a white gets a job (government or private) than it once did (quotas, etc..) but it still has a lot to do with whites not getting hired due to lack of jobs because employers are hesitant to terminate non-whites who are inefficient/not productive out of fear of discrimination lawsuits.

[edit on 16-12-2009 by slimpickens93]

If employers are too lazy to do the paperwork and document the infractions of any employees who are not producing, they deserve to be stuck with the employee, no matter the color. People who slide through their jobs without contributing to the company come in all colors...and there are very good and fair ways to weed them out.
We have class distinctions, privileges and opportunities in American that are far more unjust.
Why didn't you ever consider a fun career as a golfer? A tennis pro? A museum curator.....? Because these are professions not in your class.

reply to post by Roadblockx


personally - i think we should do away with all the racially dividing themes.

NAACP
Boys/Girls only schools
Scholarships for minorities only

We don't live in the 1950s any more. There are no more whites-only water fountains.

Instead there is "everyone BUT whites" water fountains in the form of EVERYTHING on this planet.

Money, Food, Jobs, etc.

1990-2010 is nothing more than 1920-1960 all over again...but the tables have turned.


What makes this unfair, however, is people like myself (born in the 80s) havne't done anything to deserve it.

But...as history shows...what goes around comes around. And that is very true.

But history also shows 'treat others the way you wish to be treated'

that tables turns more than once...keep that in mind next time you choose to go cavalier for anti-white propaganda.

[edit on 17-12-2009 by Snarf]

The black history month is just a way for some to feel better about themselves for past behaviors in the U.S. Your segregation genes run deep but not that deep. Would you wish for history to be in revers so you can understand better? Would you prefer Europe was invaded and you were all stolen from your native land? Would you rather go thru being the minority slave as you watch everyone else around you happy with houses, horses and colledge money as you only work in the field or even better become the masters sex slave and someone get you prego. and put your offspring to work in the field asap. Is that what you all seek 1 must know seriously in order to understand the ignorance in your post and flagging. Mabey your wish shall be granted, but I would never wish for such a life. Carefull with your wishes for they may come true. Instead of bikkering and wyning FIGURE OUT A WAY TO WORK AS 1 and prevent such assinine behavior from happining again. Remember the trick was to make SOME believe they were SUPERIOR causing a, I am great form of thinking. And the down side is you feel your genes are better and chose to sexually segregate degenerating your gene code for being stingy. God knows the plan is intergration and if you think you are to good to do so then dont and see what happens in the end. And if you think im lying then why did he make EVERY woman and man on EARTH sexually compatable. He knew that if any race segregated themselves out of ignorance they would SUFFER the most genetically by becomming the new minority. Mindstate conformation> NEONAZI HATE inbreeding so they think the smart thing to do is keep their kind all alone on EARTH rendering themselves as the genetic minor.....Not hard to see GODS WORKS SEPERATE 1z.

Oh and for the evil who ? my race I have brown skin but have -AFRICAN -INDIAN-ITALIAN-GREEK IN MY BLOOD COMPLETE NON RACIST, next level breed good day

reply to post by rusethorcain


When the numbers of minorities (blacks particularly) being disciplined/terminated in the workplace become higher than the correlating numbers of whites, which is very likely without restraint of affirmative action, then we end up right back in the 1960's.

And it's not an issue of a few incidents of sub-standard performance, it's businesses and supervisors everywhere (particularly in the public sector) who are afraid of lawsuits and their own termination due to accusations of racism and prejudice.

Really, affirmative action is no longer relative or necessary, as their are many other equal employment opportunity laws now which make it redundant. The courts do a great job of enforcing the law in these areas.

The only problem is that many of these laws discriminate against whites while few, if any, discriminate against minorities.

The white race is being punished for their success and the sins of their fathers.

The white race has become the fall guys for the rest of the world.
While the world crumbles.

Who really believes that any other race, once having achieved equal footing in the world with whites, will settle for just being equal???

Who will decide the allowed birth rates to ensure the races remain equal?
How will it be accomplished and maintained?

Once the races are equal, how will we equalize the religions, a much more difficult and most likely impossible task?

These ethnic/cultural/racial issues will never fade as long as intelligent humans walk the Earth.

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13


Your understanding of history is ridiculous. White Americans had nothing to do with invading other nations and abducting people for purpose of slave labor.

I believe the number of slaves that had such experiences as you describe are a minority. I shouldn't have to point out that slavery has never been limited to the black race.

I really encourage you to educate yourself and stop contributing to the molestation American history.

reply to post by Muckster


I think your argument is void.

I was going to post all the black people throughout history with who I am familiar, but then I realized the names I knew quickly started numbering in the thousands. I realized I knew about literally thousands of blacks in all areas of history (not just "sports and music").

I may be naive, but I think I know as much as if not more about black history than the average black person.

I think I know as much about black history as I do about white history.

I am white, grew up in a 99% white town, went to a 99% white school in Texas.

The whole "black this and black that" philosophy is just a conspiracy to propagate the myth that minorities are not equally represented in history. They are not only equally but overly represented considering their "minority" status.

Even more so today in sports, film, television, magazines, music and politics. Maybe not so much in science and technical areas.... but how many contemporary scientists are you familiar with, regardless of race???

Yes there are many, many important blacks who do not get deserved exposure in history, but there are also many, many whites as well who are forgotten or ignored.

I think that anyone who buys into the idea that blacks are not fairly represented in history, probably doesn't know much about history in general anyway and therefore isn't qualified to make such a claim.

Edit to add: I also think it's a myth that the only way to success for blacks is in entertainment. I think that's just an effect of their own desires. They want to be in that industry rather than science and technology fields. Either that or it's just another lie propagated by the same conspirators that say minorities are under represented in history.

At the very least I believe that whites generally know a hell of a lot more about black history than blacks generally know about white history.











[edit on 18-12-2009 by slimpickens93]

reply to post by letheravensoar


Very well stated but I fear that your logic is falling on deaf ears. Posts like this are interested in only one thing and that is division. Anyone that does not know that American history as it is presented is "white" history; just sans the adjective either is truly dense or naive.

The sad thing about this is that once again it will attract a bunch of closet bigots and racist, rack up a bunch of high fives for the good old boys and the country slides down that proverbial hill just a bit faster.

reply to post by slimpickens93

I may be naive, but I think I know as much as if not more about black history than the average black person.

Is that because you was taught it in school... or learnt about it yourself later??

Also... i can only talk about my own experience with regards to education... I went to a very mixed school in central London during the 1980's. You may not have! My argument is not void if you look at it from my perspective and that of the kids who went to my school!

In Britain we have Black History month... personally i think it does more harm than good... All it is ever about is Slavery, Civil right 1960's America, Bob Marley (nothing wrong there ) and Hip Hop!

With the exclusion of Bob... nothing positive. If you are a 13 year old boy, and all you are taught about your ancestors is that they were slaves, victims and foul mouthed rappers... your outlook will not be very positive... just my opinion of course

I would like to preface thsi reply with a message to Muckster

I have not taken offense with what you have said because there was nothing to take offense to. You have replied, as always in a decent and friendly manner. It would be simply impossibel to take offense to your post.

Originally posted by Muckster
If you follow the history of music back far enough you will see that "black" music was not considered black music by black people... it was simply music... Music that had its origins in the cotton fields of America.

It would have been referred to back then as Negro music or Nigger music by the white folk who would often distance themselves from this music.

Even during the 1940's, 50's, and 60's this music was labelled by white people who did not want this music going mainstream... Ray Charles, Nat King Cole, Sam Cook... all had to suffer prejudice and segregation while White artist who emulated the "black" style were much more palatable to the wider audience. Although there were still complaints about White kids singing "coloured" music from parts of the white community.

Yes i agree absolutely, however i again note that if an award ceremony were designated as the MOWO (music of white origins) were presented than the organiser would be called racist. The past should not matter in this regard. Either it's all ok or none of it is. If people want a MOBO's then fine as long as you allow a MOWO's. My peronsal view is that netiher should exist and instead a simple music awards, with categories should work.

Originally posted by Muckster
However... this music went on to inspire whole generation of white kids who could often connect with the message in the music and, being young, loved the rhythms!

During the 70's and 80's black music finally started to come into its own... finally excepted by most people with Black artist getting deals that equalled, and sometimes surpassed, that of their White fellow artists.

No longer "Negro" "Niger" or "Coloured"... the music was finally accepted as Black music.

You see this is my problem. Why accept it as black music? It is possible to accept where it came from but to label it black music sort of muscles out white people. So white people can listen to it, use it, even emulate it but it is still labelled as black music and that in itself seems very strange. When we have white musicians putting their own spin on it then it is no longer black music. Just as if a black person took the most base country music, should we call that white music? Or even the dreaded morris dancing, if a black person does it can we still refer to it as white music?

Note out of all the shames of my ancestors i wish morris dancing didn't exist.

Originally posted by Muckster
The MOBO's does not exclude white artists... it merely rewards artist who perform a type of music which originated on the cotton fields of America many many years ago... regardless of if that person is white or black.

I have no problem with the mobos... not really my cup of tea to be honest... but I can see it for what it is.

The only problem i have with the MOBO's is that you could not have a white alternative. There exists music of white origin and yet if you dared to make an award ceremony of it then you would be hounded by the media, charities and various legal support firms. That annoys me more than i can say. It is wrong no matter how you slice it.

Originally posted by Muckster
To address the other issues you raise i would like to go back to my own school days... I was in a very mixed school (central London in the early 80’s) and almost 99% of all history taught to us was regarding white people...

When we were taught about world war 2 (A part of history i find fascinating) we learnt about the air raids on London, Dunkirk, El Alamein etc...

but they NEVER mentioned the fact that India joined Britain in declaring war on Germany in 1942!! Or that they dedicated over 2.5 million troops to combat... or their role in the battle for Italy!!
They never mention that over 1 million people of Black African origin fought with the allies... nor did we hear of the Tuskegee Airmen... or the Native American code breakers... i could go on but you get the point...

What we did learn was that the Allies consisted of Britain, America, Russia, Canada, New Zealand, Australia, South Africa (white South Africans)

Later on the school did a week of “black History” and the whole week was spent on slavery!!

One of my Black friends was actually quite upset by this... i remember him say “s**t... is this all black people have done in the world?”
All i could do was shrug... i didn’t know anything else... it was only later on in life that i discovered the truth...

I had to quote you fully there because i thought that cutting you short would be dishonest and i hate quote mining. I myself grew up in a society that had very few kids that were not white. In fact in my secondary school there were only 3, that is three, kids who were not white in a school of around a thousand kids, (note that number is an estimate). Yet we were taught about all of the allise within WW2, from the gurkas to the indians. It is all about your local authority. However i agree completely that generally peopel don't know enough. I have experienced 50 year old men who were shocked that indians, black people and others were involved. Actually they tend to be espousing racist thoughts when i point all this stuff out. I love doing that i admit

Originally posted by Muckster
It is sad that i didn’t know then what i know now. I would have loved to have stood up in class and told everyone about the Tuskegee Airmen and the Indian Army, to show my class that it was truly a World War were people of all races stood shoulder to shoulder...

You see, in my opinion, until they finally do address the imbalance in the way history is taught then older Black people, and some White people, will be standing up and saying... We want Black History.

If we want to get rid of Black History then they have to include it into human history!!

The problem is that it no longer is seen that way. There are many black people in america for example that believe that black peopel should not pay taxes because of how their ancestors were treated. What is interesting is that a certain black professor disagrees. I'll find his name out if i can remember it but i know i read his views a while back before he appeared on Penn and Tellers show. The good point that Penn and Teller made is that no white person could hold the views he had, they would be called racist but coming from a black man it's fine. That seems horribly hypocritical.

Originally posted by Muckster
Well thats my opinion anyway... hope i haven’t offended you my friend

Oh... and for anyone who may be thinking that maginaryReality1984 is racist... DONT EVEN GO THERE!!!... i know for a fact that the guy is not!!!

I am grateful for this, i did fear i would be seen that way and after all our talks i am grateful you could take my post as it was meant. I hate hypocrisy, not people based on skin colour!

reply to post by slimpickens93

The whole "black this and black that" philosophy is just a conspiracy to propagate the myth that minorities are not equally represented in history. They are not only equally but overly represented considering their "minority" status.

Wow, what rock have you been hiding under. I want to see these text books in which you think minorities are over represented. If anything, i'm arguing over the opposite...that minorities that those not of European decent are excluded too much from history. And i am saying this after picking up a book by National Geographic that had a history of the world.

I may be naive, but I think I know as much as if not more about black history than the average black person.

Your point being? I've ran into foreigners that know American history and politics than Americans, of all colors.

Yes there are many, many important blacks who do not get deserved exposure in history, but there are also many, many whites as well who are forgotten or ignored.

True but you have to realize that history is purely subjective rather than objective. It's dictated...it's what they want put into the history books rather than the truth. It's one of the reasons why i don't like the History Channel. Everyone else's history (non European) is treated as speculation but European history is treated as factual. I actually got tired of it.

I think that anyone who buys into the idea that blacks are not fairly represented in history, probably doesn't know much about history in general anyway and therefore isn't qualified to make such a claim.

I not only buy into the fact but know it. And i know quite a bit about history, and i don't think your qualified to make that claim. Your going to write off someone because there opinion isn't the same as yours? You belong in politics.

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984

I would like to preface thsi reply with a message to Muckster

I have not taken offense with what you have said because there was nothing to take offense to. You have replied, as always in a decent and friendly manner. It would be simply impossibel to take offense to your post.

Thanks ImaginaryReality1984... and once again you have given an excellent post... a star for a great response

Yes i agree absolutely, however i again note that if an award ceremony were designated as the MOWO (music of white origins) were presented than the organiser would be called racist. The past should not matter in this regard. Either it's all ok or none of it is. If people want a MOBO's then fine as long as you allow a MOWO's. My peronsal view is that netiher should exist and instead a simple music awards, with categories should work.

I think that the reason for this is because It would seem almost retaliatory to have a MOWO's... almost like "well you can have your club we can have ours na na nana naaa"

When the fact is it’s not meant to be like that... There is nothing to retaliate to.

You see this is my problem. Why accept it as black music? It is possible to accept where it came from but to label it black music sort of muscles out white people. So white people can listen to it, use it, even emulate it but it is still labelled as black music and that in itself seems very strange. When we have white musicians putting their own spin on it then it is no longer black music. Just as if a black person took the most base country music, should we call that white music? Or even the dreaded morris dancing, if a black person does it can we still refer to it as white music?

Note out of all the shames of my ancestors i wish morris dancing didn't exist.

I see it like this... White people labelled it Negro/Niger/Black/coloured music for derogatory reasons... Black people took the least offensive label and kept it... now that "Black music" is mainstream, successful and loved by all people, white people suddenly want the label removed! This is a Music that was born from the oppression of millions. I feel they have the right to call it whatever they want. Maybe it should be Music of slave Origin... that would be true because that’s where it comes from! But that would just be rubbing everyone’s noses in slavery all the time, which i don’t think is healthy.

The only problem i have with the MOBO's is that you could not have a white alternative. There exists music of white origin and yet if you dared to make an award ceremony of it then you would be hounded by the media, charities and various legal support firms. That annoys me more than i can say. It is wrong no matter how you slice it.

Don’t get me wrong.. I do understand what you are saying and you DO have a very strong and valid point. From this generations point of view the term Black Music seems divisive and almost racist. I personally don’t see it like that... I see it in its historical sense... as a music that was born from pain and suffering. Born from a people who was torn from their homeland and had their culture ripped away and replaced with something foreign, Born as a way of remembering their culture in the least dangerous way.

Well that the way I see it anyway

I had to quote you fully there because i thought that cutting you short would be dishonest and i hate quote mining. I myself grew up in a society that had very few kids that were not white. In fact in my secondary school there were only 3, that is three, kids who were not white in a school of around a thousand kids, (note that number is an estimate). Yet we were taught about all of the allise within WW2, from the gurkas to the indians. It is all about your local authority. However i agree completely that generally peopel don't know enough. I have experienced 50 year old men who were shocked that indians, black people and others were involved. Actually they tend to be espousing racist thoughts when i point all this stuff out. I love doing that i admit

You see... that’s what I love about talking with you, and this paragraph is a prime example... At the risk of sounding like an a!!e kisser... you are a completely honest, open minded stand up guy... Nice one

The problem is that it no longer is seen that way. There are many black people in america for example that believe that black peopel should not pay taxes because of how their ancestors were treated. What is interesting is that a certain black professor disagrees. I'll find his name out if i can remember it but i know i read his views a while back before he appeared on Penn and Tellers show. The good point that Penn and Teller made is that no white person could hold the views he had, they would be called racist but coming from a black man it's fine. That seems horribly hypocritical.

Yeah i hear what you are saying... Anyone who thinks that Black people shouldn’t pay taxes in America is misguided in my opinion!! And there are examples of people twisting anti racism into anti white!! I have experienced this first hand and as far as I am concerned Racism is a human disease not a white disease... something that people need to remember!!!

I am grateful for this, i did fear i would be seen that way and after all our talks i am grateful you could take my post as it was meant. I hate hypocrisy, not people based on skin colour!

Always my friend I know that we are both sensible enough to have slightly different views and still respect each other...I do understand the points you have raised and i do agree with what you are saying! I guess I’m just coming from a slightly different angle.

Thanks again for a great response and once again it’s always a privilege to talk with you.

Oh... and as a final note (which will probably put a nail in the coffin of my own argument) I told my wife, who’s black, about your post and asked for her opinion.... She agrees with you She thinks that music should just be music, if you want to truly unite people, and that the Mobo’s should be called something like the RnB awards or something similar. Oh well... I can’t win em all

we got da whole world fella, we don't need no stinkin month. months are for pulling the wolve's eyes over the minortiy's eyes. it;s just toi pacify them

Originally posted by givememyslaveback
we got da whole world fella, we don't need no stinkin month. months are for pulling the wolve's eyes over the minortiy's eyes. it;s just toi pacify them

Judging by your grammar and backward attitude I would argue that you need a hell of a lot more than a month!!

I guess that when you done your Google search you spelt KKK wrong and came up with ATS... please go away.. trolls are not allowed here!

[edit on 21-12-2009 by Muckster]

Originally posted by Muckster

Originally posted by givememyslaveback
we got da whole world fella, we don't need no stinkin month. months are for pulling the wolve's eyes over the minortiy's eyes. it;s just toi pacify them

Judging by your grammar and backward attitude I would argue that you need a hell of a lot more than a month!!

I guess that when you done your Google search you spelt KKK wrong and came up with ATS... please go away.. trolls are not allowed here!

[edit on 21-12-2009 by Muckster]

lol. i was making fun of people who think we need a white history month. is there anything you really disagree with in my post? we brutalized people of color for how long? and what'd we give them? a month. wow. isn't that thoughtful? makes em feel special. i guess you could say i was wrong about white people controlling the world. an argument could be made that it's really the chinese but i can't say for sure. (alas, i am not a reptilian so i am not privy to who really runs the show!)

as for my grammar, i was listening to a 40Hz binaural beat while being blasted by a dreamachine at the time of my post. and i am flattered by you saying i need more than a month. i really hope people write some excellent book reports on me.

/SEACREST OUT.

[edit on 21-12-2009 by givememyslaveback]

Originally posted by Muckster
I think that the reason for this is because It would seem almost retaliatory to have a MOWO's... almost like "well you can have your club we can have ours na na nana naaa"

When the fact is it’s not meant to be like that... There is nothing to retaliate to.

Actually i see it like that now, the fact we cannot have a MOWO's is like "naa na na na naa". It is a double standard and that to me creates tension. Either both are ok or neither is. To me the MOBO's don't come out of a musical past but out of the shame of society over the past. The past should be put behind us, not forgotten but it should not illicit emotions that guilt a society.

Originally posted by Muckster
I see it like this... White people labelled it Negro/Niger/Black/coloured music for derogatory reasons... Black people took the least offensive label and kept it... now that "Black music" is mainstream, successful and loved by all people, white people suddenly want the label removed! This is a Music that was born from the oppression of millions. I feel they have the right to call it whatever they want. Maybe it should be Music of slave Origin... that would be true because that’s where it comes from! But that would just be rubbing everyone’s noses in slavery all the time, which i don’t think is healthy.

I want all labels removed or all labels applied. Either is fine with me as long as one option is picked. I hate how we allow some things but not others, i hate hypocrisy.

Originally posted by Muckster
Don’t get me wrong.. I do understand what you are saying and you DO have a very strong and valid point. From this generations point of view the term Black Music seems divisive and almost racist. I personally don’t see it like that... I see it in its historical sense... as a music that was born from pain and suffering. Born from a people who was torn from their homeland and had their culture ripped away and replaced with something foreign, Born as a way of remembering their culture in the least dangerous way.

Well that the way I see it anyway

And i respect that you have your opinion i just happen to see things in a really, horribly fair sense and to me this isn't fair. Slightly childish maybe but i'm all for being fair to everyone, completely even.

Originally posted by Muckster
You see... that’s what I love about talking with you, and this paragraph is a prime example... At the risk of sounding like an a!!e kisser... you are a completely honest, open minded stand up guy... Nice one

Ok seriously we have to stop complimenting each other, if we don't people will suspect something

Originally posted by Muckster
Yeah i hear what you are saying... Anyone who thinks that Black people shouldn’t pay taxes in America is misguided in my opinion!! And there are examples of people twisting anti racism into anti white!! I have experienced this first hand and as far as I am concerned Racism is a human disease not a white disease... something that people need to remember!!!

My main point there was that a white person could not possibly voice that opinion because if they did then they would be labelled a racist, their points rubbished and their ideas forgotten. As Penn and Teller said "We're so happy to find Professor (i forgot his name), we're just to, well.......white to say this stuff".

Now that i find absolutely annoying, white people can't voice their views because they can simply be labelled a racist and ignored.

Originally posted by Muckster
Oh... and as a final note (which will probably put a nail in the coffin of my own argument) I told my wife, who’s black, about your post and asked for her opinion.... She agrees with you

She thinks that music should just be music, if you want to truly unite people, and that the Mobo’s should be called something like the RnB awards or something similar. Oh well... I can’t win em all

Muckster please invite your wife to read this reply of mine. She is obviously a smart, logical, fair and practical minded woman. You should also remember a simple fact, a fact every married man knows........................your wife is always right

reply to post by Byrd


Again, Byrd, may I extend an offer of marriage? Or barring that, a footrub?

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984


Okay.

Tell me about the very distinct culture of white America. Please, go on, tell me how white americans are not only terribly underrepresented in our history, but also provide an interesting and informingly divergent-from-mainstream culture.

And then tell me about that mainstream culture for a little compare-and-contrast.

See, that's the problem with these people puttering around and bemoaning the lack of a "white history month." For starters, every month is "white history month", at least in the United States. This leads us to the second point that African-American culture and history follows a different path and is identifiably different from, though connected to, mainstream (white) history. The same can apply to any other of the country's non-dominant groups.

Every time I see these arguments, what becomes clear isn't that anyone really WANTS a "white history month" - they're just petulant that blacks actually get a month where their historical and cultural achievements are treated equally to those of whites.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
Okay.

Tell me about the very distinct culture of white America. Please, go on, tell me how white americans are not only terribly underrepresented in our history, but also provide an interesting and informingly divergent-from-mainstream culture.

I wasn't on about america actually as i'm English but hey i'm interested in how you turned this into a debate about being under-represented. The simple fact is that now everyone has the vote and if they wish to be represented they can vote. You are supporting a regeim that allows discrimination. I want equal rights for all, not certain sectors of society to have special legal and moral powers to represent their rights above others and to use the guilt of society to win battles that they should not.

I am for equal rights, you are for unequal representation.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
And then tell me about that mainstream culture for a little compare-and-contrast.

I don't much care what you perceive as mainstream because you are in the USa i am in the UK and it seems we are arguing across difference between our countries.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
See, that's the problem with these people puttering around and bemoaning the lack of a "white history month." For starters, every month is "white history month", at least in the United States. This leads us to the second point that African-American culture and history follows a different path and is identifiably different from, though connected to, mainstream (white) history. The same can apply to any other of the country's non-dominant groups.

firstly history is history. In the UK we are very multicultural, in the middle of Birmingham every year we havea graet carnival where every race parties out, i have done it, it's fun. We don't concentrate on race despite it being a religious festival, it's just a damn good time. "Every month is white history month" what utter nonsense and the sooner people like yourself stop seeing it in those terms the better. You are encouraging segregation and yet you don't see it. I want none of this crap, none of this seperation i want complete and utter even and none race talk.

Yes people are black, yes people are white, yes people are all sots of shades but we need to move beyond such stupid labels in normal social terms. Oh you can refer to someone as black, or white or chinese etc but to donate a day or month to a race is stupid. Either you allow a white month along with the black month or you say none of it is allowed. I'm for none.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
Every time I see these arguments, what becomes clear isn't that anyone really WANTS a "white history month" - they're just petulant that blacks actually get a month where their historical and cultural achievements are treated equally to those of whites.

It isn't petulant to see a double standard and realise it causes a seperation within society. To see that it causes a problem where there is one set of rules for one race and another set for another race. I will say again, either we can both have it or we both can't. I don't raelly care which way it goes i just want it to be equal. That is what i'm about, complete and utter equality between races, sexes and sexualities.

If you don't like that then fine, but i want things to be equal, in every respect and to represent one race and not another is wrong.