If You Want to Stop Terrorism, Stop Killing Muslims!

But you should not categorise that all Muslims tried to convert you or asked you to join Islam or any other religion.

15 at the moment, and I'm not saying all - there was just one, but I admit, it is stupid to generalize the faith with just one person.


[edit on 17/12/2009 by BlackPoison94]

reply to post by ugie1028


You know what?

I disagree with your statement 'IF YOU WANT TO STOP TERRORISM, STOP KILLING MUSLIMS'

I say if you want to stop terrorists then you have to stop the extremists from putting guns and missiles into the hands of children.... and stop the extremists from teaching these children that every person who doesn't accept Islam is evil.... that's how you gotta stop it.... which means you have to get into their camps and take the children out and put them into parts of Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq etc etc where the Taliban don't rule and can't get into contact with these children.

The answer isn't to bring them all over to the UK either

[edit on 17-12-2009 by TruthxIsxInxThexMist]

reply to post by js331975


You missed the point, entirely. It is not up to us to decide what his freedom means, it is up to his people in his lands, and all they want is to be left alone. Why does the U.S. feel they have the right to tell others how to live?

When it comes to China, since they are now the owners of the U.S., the president no longer talks to them about human rights, yet we feel we can wage war on another nation, and tell them how to live?

I would love to see all nations join this century, but it's none of our business. All we can try to do.. from afar, is educate about women and womens' rights.

As to the questions about why they kill their own? Anyone who is seen as aiding and abetting the U.S. or any other supporting member nations is fair game.

This is especially clear in Iraq where the Sunni's have been at war with other factions long before we came along. This is why the security forces and government itself is open to attacks, because they are fulfilling the U.S. agenda, hence, they are supporting the U.S. and open to attack.

Again, this is in the Quran. Oppression is a term used rather loosely, and is open to interpretation, but the gist of his speech to the American people is to just get the government to leave them alone, to leave their lands, and to stop interferring.

I would also like to point out that the date of thel etter that I referenced was 2004. A lot has happened since then. It doesn't change what I feel is the importance of the letter, just keep that time reference in mind when asking, "Well why did they..?"

This is in reply to someone asking about his remarks about why not attack, say, Sweden.

Originally posted by pujols5

Originally posted by adifferentbreed
reply to post by pujols5

 

I did say he wasn't mature. I think the difference, as I see it is.....you made a very personal attack on someone rather than a culture. Big difference between all "fill in the blank", and you "fill in the blank". As a Witch (not Wiccan) thank you very much, I see alot of the same thing......however, do I stoop to their level, or ever further below, or do I rise above, maybe even ignore it. There are many solutions to any given problem......I felt you chose the worst one. BB

Once again, i am not arguing with you, as that was the worst way to attack a member. But you have to understand that after seeing atleast one thread bashing muslims every week you get tired of it, and you get really irretated. But why is it that there isn't any other member saying what he did was wrong and to stand up for his actions. I agree my use of words were very insulting, but given the current state of affairs i feel that everyone else should stop bashing muslims, but wait ofcourse that's a big task to actuallt achieve.

I stand behind what I said. The debate started over the statement that Islam is the fastest growing religion. Well first of all, many sources say that Christianity is the fastest growing, but I didn't even throw that out there. I merely wanted to point out the fact that Islam is not growing due to people who are otherwise free to make their own decisions, and choosing to become a muslim. It is growing because the women are having 6-7 babies each. Do you actually think those women want to have that many babies? I'm not going to make a lot of personal comments on that issue, I will just post the facts -- this is due to muslim women being kept pregnant most of the time:

“That is a staggering 24,000 women dying every year, and 87 percent of them [deaths] are preventable,” Ramesh Penumaka told reporters in Kabul on 14 July.

“The key to better maternal health lies with the men, who have to be sensitive to the health problems and the needs of women,” Penumaka said.

Lack of access to obstetric and health services, early marriages and multiple short-term pregnancies are the main reasons why about 60 mothers die every day.

Up to 50 percent of Afghan girls get married before they are 15; some are married at the age of eight, UNFPA has found.

8 years old!!! If I had one wish could be granted, I would hire a huge fleet of ships and offer to take as many muslim girls and women as wanted to, to another land.

Now, let's have your response and try not to fantasize this time about

hookers who wears shorts that don't cover her private parts

www.irinnews.org...




[edit on 17-12-2009 by Bombeni]

Afghan girls burn themselves to escape marriage

"She is here only to wash, to clean, to give baby … and nothing more," said Marie-Jose Brunel, a French volunteer nurse at the burns unit who was full of Gallic warmth and purposeful seriousness. "If they have no freedom, no possibility to study, to be considered like nothing, it’s very, very difficult."

worldblog.msnbc.msn.com...

Originally posted by Bombeni

Originally posted by pujols5

Originally posted by adifferentbreed
reply to post by pujols5

 

I did say he wasn't mature. I think the difference, as I see it is.....you made a very personal attack on someone rather than a culture. Big difference between all "fill in the blank", and you "fill in the blank". As a Witch (not Wiccan) thank you very much, I see alot of the same thing......however, do I stoop to their level, or ever further below, or do I rise above, maybe even ignore it. There are many solutions to any given problem......I felt you chose the worst one. BB

Once again, i am not arguing with you, as that was the worst way to attack a member. But you have to understand that after seeing atleast one thread bashing muslims every week you get tired of it, and you get really irretated. But why is it that there isn't any other member saying what he did was wrong and to stand up for his actions. I agree my use of words were very insulting, but given the current state of affairs i feel that everyone else should stop bashing muslims, but wait ofcourse that's a big task to actuallt achieve.

I stand behind what I said. The debate started over the statement that Islam is the fastest growing religion. Well first of all, many sources say that Christianity is the fastest growing, but I didn't even throw that out there. I merely wanted to point out the fact that Islam is not growing due to people who are otherwise free to make their own decisions, and choosing to become a muslim. It is growing because the women are having 6-7 babies each. Do you actually think those women want to have that many babies? I'm not going to make a lot of personal comments on that issue, I will just post the facts -- this is due to muslim women being kept pregnant most of the time:

“That is a staggering 24,000 women dying every year, and 87 percent of them [deaths] are preventable,” Ramesh Penumaka told reporters in Kabul on 14 July.

“The key to better maternal health lies with the men, who have to be sensitive to the health problems and the needs of women,” Penumaka said.

Lack of access to obstetric and health services, early marriages and multiple short-term pregnancies are the main reasons why about 60 mothers die every day.

Up to 50 percent of Afghan girls get married before they are 15; some are married at the age of eight, UNFPA has found.

8 years old!!! If I had one wish could be granted, I would hire a huge fleet of ships and offer to take as many muslim girls and women as wanted to, to another land.

Now, let's have your response and try not to fantasize this time about

hookers who wears shorts that don't cover her private parts

www.irinnews.org...




[edit on 17-12-2009 by Bombeni]

Listen,my argument is not whether islam or christianity is the fastest growing religion, since you already agreed as for the reason islam is on such a rise is becuase the large families. The way you described the situation was very barbaric of you, go back to your post and read the part about muslim women in bed, when you're done ask yourself if jesus would have said that, ya didn't think so. I also said what i said was wrong, but at least i took responsibility for my actions. Going forward, you still haven't provided me with the rules of war in christianity, if there is any. You will see islamic rules of war are very generous towards anyone not fighting them ,and don't kill inncent lives just to go to heaven. if you can provide mw with one verse in the quran (anybody for that fact) just one verse where it says go and kill everyone (women,childre, and the elderly) you will not find it. Most people like to take out few verses, so where is your proof?

Good thing I have never killed a Muslim. Or any other person. This post is a waste of Internet bytes.

Listen,my argument is not whether islam or christianity is the fastest growing religion, since you already agreed as for the reason islam is on such a rise is becuase the large families. The way you described the situation was very barbaric of you, go back to your post and read the part about muslim women in bed, when you're done ask yourself if jesus would have said that, ya didn't think so. I also said what i said was wrong, but at least i took responsibility for my actions. Going forward, you still haven't provided me with the rules of war in christianity, if there is any. You will see islamic rules of war are very generous towards anyone not fighting them ,and don't kill inncent lives just to go to heaven. if you can provide mw with one verse in the quran (anybody for that fact) just one verse where it says go and kill everyone (women,childre, and the elderly) you will not find it. Most people like to take out few verses, so where is your proof?
===================================================================
You were being awfully pushy about the rate growth thing. I don't want to rehash all of it, and I could have put it in different words, but what I said about muslim women being covered and having no say over their sexuality, for the majority at least, is still true. A large number of muslim baby girls have their external sex organ cut off when they are toddlers. The parents want to get the girl married off to the highest bidder, like selling an 8 year old little girl to a 49 year old man. That stinks. Then many of them have babies when they are just beginning puberty.

And I don't know why you brought up the koran to me. I have no intention of debating the Bible and the Koran with a muslim. I don't know what the koran SAYS. I only know what muslims are doing. If what you say is true, then this Imam in the video is not teaching the koran, right?

So far you and the other muslim supporter here have refused to comment on this video, this is what is being taught to muslims. And I know there are verses in the koran that tell them to kill infidels, and convert nonbelievers. I know as much as I want to about the koran, ok? I would appreciate your opinion on this muslim sermon. I don't notice anyone protesting or getting up to leave.






[edit on 17-12-2009 by Bombeni]

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


it was the title of the video.

copy/paste job.

third line

[edit on 12/17/2009 by ugie1028]

reply to post by polychronopolis


For Example - over here in the UK, one might think that the founding fathers of the USA were Terrorists but Americans think of them as 'freedom' fighters.

Also, many Americans think of the IRA and it's associated offshoot Groups (PIRA etc.) as 'freedom' fighters (and indeed funded them directly from American Banks) whereas UK Citizens think of them as Terrorists.

Originally posted by Bombeni

Listen,my argument is not whether islam or christianity is the fastest growing religion, since you already agreed as for the reason islam is on such a rise is becuase the large families. The way you described the situation was very barbaric of you, go back to your post and read the part about muslim women in bed, when you're done ask yourself if jesus would have said that, ya didn't think so. I also said what i said was wrong, but at least i took responsibility for my actions. Going forward, you still haven't provided me with the rules of war in christianity, if there is any. You will see islamic rules of war are very generous towards anyone not fighting them ,and don't kill inncent lives just to go to heaven. if you can provide mw with one verse in the quran (anybody for that fact) just one verse where it says go and kill everyone (women,childre, and the elderly) you will not find it. Most people like to take out few verses, so where is your proof?
===================================================================
You were being awfully pushy about the rate growth thing. I don't want to rehash all of it, and I could have put it in different words, but what I said about muslim women being covered and having no say over their sexuality, for the majority at least, is still true. A large number of muslim baby girls have their external sex organ cut off when they are toddlers. The parents want to get the girl married off to the highest bidder, like selling an 8 year old little girl to a 49 year old man. That stinks. Then many of them have babies when they are just beginning puberty.

And I don't know why you brought up the koran to me. I have no intention of debating the Bible and the Koran with a muslim. I don't know what the koran SAYS. I only know what muslims are doing. If what you say is true, then this Imam in the video is not teaching the koran, right?

So far you and the other muslim supporter here have refused to comment on this video, this is what is being taught to muslims. And I know there are verses in the koran that tell them to kill infidels, and convert nonbelievers. I know as much as I want to about the koran, ok? I would appreciate your opinion on this muslim sermon. I don't notice anyone protesting or getting up to leave.






[edit on 17-12-2009 by Bombeni]

Where are you getting this information from? really you have no insight or knowledge of islam or the quran. And i quote you" I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE QURAN SAYS" if you have no clue what the quran says then do us a favor and be quiet. Islam says YOU CAN NOT INHERIT WOMEN AGAINST THEIR WILL, in other words you can not force a women to marry someone she doesn't want to. So whetever you were referring to about giving their daughter to the highest bidder, THAT IS NOT ISLAM. get your facts straight man. LIKE YOU SAID YOU HAVE NO CLUE WHAT THE QURAN SAYS, i find that funny but yet you insist on saying islam is a barbaric religion but have no proof.

THE QURAN:
"O ye who believe! Ye are forbidden to inherit women against their will. Nor should ye treat them with harshness, that ye may Take away part of the dower ye have given them,-except where they have been guilty of open lewdness; on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and Allah brings about through it a great deal of good. (4:19) "

HADITH:
Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas: "A virgin came to the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) and mentioned that her father had married her against her will, so the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) allowed her to exercise her choice. (Translation of Sunan Abu-Dawud, Marriage (Kitab Al-Nikah), Book 11, Number 2091)"

THE BIBLE:
the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man........Now kill all the boys [innocent kids]. And kill every woman who has slept with a man,

reply to post by pujols5


And I am not arguing about what the koran says. It may say a lot of great things, I have no clue but I will take your word for it. But tell me, is the imam, in the video, preaching from the koran? I have seen countless videos of imams saying this same stuff to the audience. I have never seen ONE video that shows an imam preaching LOVE your neighbor. If you know of one, lay it on me.

And if the koran says to treat women that way, why are muslim women so incredibly ill-treated?

You still haven't said anything about the message in the video? Do you deny that this is what is being taught?



[edit on 17-12-2009 by Bombeni]

reply to post by Bombeni


Good point. You won't hear Islam supporters say that beating women is wrong, killing infidels is wrong, or anything else against Islam. They just accept the behavior and expect non-muslims to also.

reply to post by Bombeni


Again i showed you evidence that islam says YOU CAN NOT INHERIT WOMEN AGAINST THEIR WILL, so since you said you have no clue what the quran says, well not atleast you know that part. Moving on, i refuse to watch that video and have no intention of watching it because it's probably a clip taking a sentence or verse and not letting the man finish what he wants to say.how about the videos that december-rain posted and you have yet to respond to that .You said that there are verses in the quran that says to go and kill infidels, once again SINCE YOU YOURSELF SAID YOU HAVE NO CLUE WHAT THE QURAN SAYS, you have no right to say anything about it. I will however tell you that these verses were sent down at a time of war. Every verse in the quran was sent down suring a specific time, and has it's meaning and interpretation behind it. LIKE I SAID THE VERSES TALKING ABOUT KILLING INFIDLES WERE SENT DOWN AT A TIME OF WAR, these though are the rules of war for muslims

THE QURAN:
"Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for God loveth not transgressors. (The Noble Quran, 2:190)"

"But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in God: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things). (The Noble Quran, 8:61)"

THE HADITH:
"Stop, O people, that I may give you ten rules for your guidance in the battlefield. Do not commit treachery or deviate from the right path. You must not mutilate dead bodies. Neither kill a child, nor a woman, nor an aged man. Bring no harm to the trees, nor burn them with fire, especially those which are fruitful. Slay not any of the enemy's flock, save for your food. You are likely to pass by people who have devoted their lives to monastic services; leave them alone."

BIBLE:
1 Samuel 15:2,3

2 This is what the LORD Almighty says: 'I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt.3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy [a] everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.' "

Numbers 31:17,18

17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man,18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

Deuteronomy 20:16

16 However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.


SEE ISLAM HAS RULES UNLIKE CHRISTIANITY , IAM STILL WAITING FOR YOU TO POST ME VERSES THAT SAYS THE KILLING OF INNOCENT PEOPLE WILL LEAD YOU TO HEAVEN. I AM WAITING. we just saw right there that the bible ordrs the killing OF EVRYTHING WHICH BREATHES. I'll be waiting for those verses. Till next time, actually read and see what the quran says, as i gave you a piece already. Do all of us a favor and actually post like you sound as if you have the basic knowledge of islam and the quran.

reply to post by Bombeni


Again i showed you evidence that islam says YOU CAN NOT INHERIT WOMEN AGAINST THEIR WILL, so since you said you have no clue what the quran says, well not atleast you know that part. Moving on, i refuse to watch that video and have no intention of watching it because it's probably a clip taking a sentence or verse and not letting the man finish what he wants to say.how about the videos that december-rain posted and you have yet to respond to that .You said that there are verses in the quran that says to go and kill infidels, once again SINCE YOU YOURSELF SAID YOU HAVE NO CLUE WHAT THE QURAN SAYS, you have no right to say anything about it. I will however tell you that these verses were sent down at a time of war. Every verse in the quran was sent down suring a specific time, and has it's meaning and interpretation behind it. LIKE I SAID THE VERSES TALKING ABOUT KILLING INFIDLES WERE SENT DOWN AT A TIME OF WAR, these though are the rules of war for muslims

THE QURAN:
"Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for God loveth not transgressors. (The Noble Quran, 2:190)"

"But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in God: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things). (The Noble Quran, 8:61)"

THE HADITH:
"Stop, O people, that I may give you ten rules for your guidance in the battlefield. Do not commit treachery or deviate from the right path. You must not mutilate dead bodies. Neither kill a child, nor a woman, nor an aged man. Bring no harm to the trees, nor burn them with fire, especially those which are fruitful. Slay not any of the enemy's flock, save for your food. You are likely to pass by people who have devoted their lives to monastic services; leave them alone."

BIBLE:
1 Samuel 15:2,3

2 This is what the LORD Almighty says: 'I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt.3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy [a] everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.' "

Numbers 31:17,18

17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man,18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

Deuteronomy 20:16

16 However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.


SEE ISLAM HAS RULES UNLIKE CHRISTIANITY , IAM STILL WAITING FOR YOU TO POST ME VERSES THAT SAYS THE KILLING OF INNOCENT PEOPLE WILL LEAD YOU TO HEAVEN. I AM WAITING. we just saw right there that the bible ordrs the killing OF EVRYTHING WHICH BREATHES. I'll be waiting for those verses. Till next time, actually read and see what the quran says, as i gave you a piece already. Do all of us a favor and actually post like you sound as if you have the basic knowledge of islam and the quran.

Originally posted by JJay55
reply to post by Bombeni

 

Good point. You won't hear Islam supporters say that beating women is wrong, killing infidels is wrong, or anything else against Islam. They just accept the behavior and expect non-muslims to also.

Since we are talking about muslims, then bring me a verse that says killing innocent people is allowed, or to trat your women harshly, or to do wrong. Bring your proof, until then you have no credibility.

reply to post by pujols5


Man you are really thick headed. The video is an uninterrupted sermon, no cuts, and if you won't watch it then what are we talking about? Geez.

As I said, I don't know the koran, and don't want to either. I am not arguing anything with you about what the koran says ---------- can you get that through your head???? I am talking about the REALITY of what is actually being taught to muslims by these so-called religious leaders. I don't know if they get their sermon from the koran or from a telephone book, and don't care. They obviously don't follow what the koran says, if what you quote is in the koran. It is too frustrating dealing with you because you refuse to stay focused, you keep using smoke and mirrors to avoid the subject. So, what about those statistics, all those young girls and women being impregnated time after time, no medical care, 8 year olds being married off to 50 year olds, 10 year olds having babies and tearing up their insides??? This is the reality of muslim FEMALES. Maybe you don't give a damn about muslim females. Maybe that is why you don't get the crux of what I am saying. I think it just goes right over your head, so, your excused.

Originally posted by pujols5

Originally posted by JJay55
reply to post by Bombeni

 

Good point. You won't hear Islam supporters say that beating women is wrong, killing infidels is wrong, or anything else against Islam. They just accept the behavior and expect non-muslims to also.

Since we are talking about muslims, then bring me a verse that says killing innocent people is allowed, or to trat your women harshly, or to do wrong. Bring your proof, until then you have no credibility.

Don't threaten me. That's just rude. If you know nothing about Islam it isn't anyone's job to teach you. It is your job to learn.
"The Koran is above all a book of war a call to butcher non-Muslims (2:191, 3:141, 4:91, 5:3), to roast them (4:56, 69:30-69:32), and to cause bloodbaths amongst them (47:4). Jews are compared to monkeys and pigs (2:65, 5:60, 7:166), while people who believe in Jesus Christ as the Son of God must according to the Koran be fought (9:30)."

reply to post by Bombeni


Ok, I watched your film, and I will honestly tell you what I see.

I see an Imam giving what amounts to nothing more than a war pep rally. The thing about the Quran is this: They feel justified because they are being attacked on their own soil. This is their truth.

I am not a "muslim supporter". You may have not meant that in a bad way, but it came across that way. Apologies if you didn't intend for it to. Explaining why what is happenening is happening is a lot different from supporting extremism.

The Quran is taken out of context a *lot*. People love to quote one liners from it, while leaving out the explanations either before or after the one liners. I found this out because I felt a lot like others in this thread until I took the time to read it, and realized a lot of poeple lie about what it says to further their hate and agenda.

That does not take away from the fact that there are extremists, and I believe the extremists pose the greatest dangers to us.

I loathe terrorism and all that it stands for. However, to defeat an enemy, one must understand them. This means you have to put emotions aside, and take the time to legitimately understand.

If you seriously do not want to know anything more about the Quran, then you are really limiting yourself in the types of replies that can be taken seriously from you. You are implying you know all you want to know, your mind is made up, and that's that.

The video says nothing that is not true, to the muslims. I only watched it about halfway through, because it was about all I could tolerate, but if you stand back a moment, and put yourself in their position, you would see they are feeling oppressed and overtaken by America and Israel.

I do not blame them one bit, because we would be feeling and saying the
blame thing to our troops if we were invaded in the US.

I do not see anything, in the first half of that video, that I would consider wrong or bad, considering they are a people at war, and their retalliation is justified.

Originally posted by Bombeni
reply to post by pujols5

 

Man you are really thick headed. The video is an uninterrupted sermon, no cuts, and if you won't watch it then what are we talking about? Geez.

As I said, I don't know the koran, and don't want to either. I am not arguing anything with you about what the koran says ---------- can you get that through your head???? I am talking about the REALITY of what is actually being taught to muslims by these so-called religious leaders. I don't know if they get their sermon from the koran or from a telephone book, and don't care. They obviously don't follow what the koran says, if what you quote is in the koran. It is too frustrating dealing with you because you refuse to stay focused, you keep using smoke and mirrors to avoid the subject. So, what about those statistics, all those young girls and women being impregnated time after time, no medical care, 8 year olds being married off to 50 year olds, 10 year olds having babies and tearing up their insides??? This is the reality of muslim FEMALES. Maybe you don't give a damn about muslim females. Maybe that is why you don't get the crux of what I am saying. I think it just goes right over your head, so, your excused.

I laugh at you hahahahhaha, i brought you proof, now bring me the peoof of marrting girls to 50 year olds with force. WHERE IS THE PROOF hahahahaha, i seriousely am laughing at you, you continue to change the topic to this video, DECEMBER-RAIN POSTED YOU OVER 7 VIDEOS THAT YOU HAVE YET TO COMMMENT ON, you are a joke and I WILL NO LONGER RESPOND TO JUST AS DECEMBER-RAIN STOPPED BECAUSE OF YOUR IGNORANT COMMENTS THAT HAVE NO BASIS OR JUDGEMENT OR PROOF. HAHAHAHAH GOOD DAY TO YA