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ATS is dying, a cancer grows within.

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posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 08:58 AM
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Just to add my own opinion into the mix, there is a difference between providing counter-information to a discussion, analyzing another's opinion, disagreeing with various opinions, and entering a thread and posting inflammatory, derogatory information before even reading the thread or links.

I won't mention names, since it is certainly not limited to only a couple of members, but lately I've noticed in several threads that within the first seconds of a thread going live, people have posted "this is photoshopped" (when it wasn't), this is not right because of -- then this poster went on to list stats and information that had nothing to do with the video and/or documents in the thread -- but that person wouldn't know because they didn't even bother to read the links and enclosures and admitted as much. What was this member's answer? I don't have to read the documents -- I already know what they'll say. Nonetheless, it killed the entire first two pages of the thread as the rest of us that actually wanted to discuss said topic were inundated with nay-sayers talking about a completely different thing -- because they couldn't be bothered reading what the OP had linked. Were any of these posts removed? Nope.

Again, there is a difference between participating and reading a thread versus automatically posting irrelevant garbage for the sole purpose of ending the thread. This can also be found of late in all Obama threads.

No longer can one have any discussion about a particular policy of this administration without reading through several posts about Obama's general stats and things completely unrelated to the specific topic. In fact, the same exact post can be found in several of the Obama threads despite the fact that each thread covered a completely different topic.

Should people believe everything posted on this site? Not unless you have a room reserved on the fifth floor of a hospital and have been fitted for a nice, white coat.

However, I think asking people to actually read a thread -- including links and video -- prior to simply attacking the OP on premise alone -- claiming to already know where the discussion is going -- is a little ridiculous. Further, I think we need to focus on removing off-topic posts.

Just my opinion.




posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:10 AM
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reply to post by GrOuNd_ZeRo
 


I have been here for quite a while, I have seen ATS change in my time and was changing way before I got here.

While I agree that once in while some may come with some agendas in specific times of the year and years, usually they go away to comeback on the next round.

Doesn't bother me as many really are actually harmless to a point.

Now as for the staff of ATS, I have know many for a while as a member they could be graded from very fair to mildly annoying, but It was a time that used to be worst that what the OP is trying to imply, I am glad that those are gone now.

We may agree with some members reaching moderator status and we may disagree, but that is usual in a more personal manner depending how the interaction of the member has been with that particular ATS staff before.

I have my own opinions but I kept them to myself when it comes to ATS staff after all I have not been bothered or find anything they have done to be personal so far at least toward me.



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:15 AM
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Just to add a little. In my opinion, the skeptics are a good thing. While I agree with some of the OP's comments about attacking and not allowing for a "live and let live" policy with some. The argument with a bunch of people here is this is a conspiracy site. But everything evolves and I believe that is what is happening to ATS. I get my news from here alot of the time because our members break stories right and left before anyone gets a sniff. ATS has merit and legitimacy now more so than ever. I like and respect what ATS has evolved into. We need the skeptics just as much as we need those that are considered "out there". It adds a wonderful balance.



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:18 AM
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For the last year or so, there has been a major awakening of the masses to some degree. Those that are not conspiracy theorists are starting to look for answers, some how they have ended up here after a year of watching Youtube videos that have completely swooped them from their feet and will attack (due to disbelief) anything that upsets their commercialized lifestyle.

ATS, just like The X-Files, needs believers and skeptics. Having skeptics within the crowd not only makes things interesting, but it makes the believers/researchers dig for more information - Skeptics motivate true believers. Counterintelligence agents/users are the ones who are wasting the time, they are the cancer.

I do agree on the fact that there is a cancer in here:
1) Counterintelligence.
2) Crack pots (Delusional people half awakened).
3) Teenagers and Idiots (Who annoy people for fun)
4) Complete amateur researchers (leads to misinformation).


4 Types of cancer.

Four problems need four solutions. Ironically its four (to all those Zodiac researchers).



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:27 AM
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No Offence ATS mods but i think skeptics dont have a right here, they got there own forums somewhere on the forum, i am not allowed to post it though it might create a forum war.



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:33 AM
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I am in the camp of thinking that skeptics are a critical aspect of this board...falsificationism is at the very least, the best mode of investigation for the plethora conspiracys here...the faster you can rip down easily debunked conspiracys, the faster you can focus on the ones that cannot be ripped down so easily.

Deny ignorance is not just meant to deny offical storys...its also to deny myths, imaginations, rambling insanity, etc...the ultimate goal from both parties is for the truth to come to light...the ultimate objective reality truth verses a subjective perspective.

Unless of course its a post made strictly in matters of faith (like "Satan is actually God disguised" or something that starts out without need for facts or reason but simply a philosophical discussion from the get-go.,..alternatively, skepticism is needed in posts like: "Bill Clinton is a 3rd level demon from the abyss plane of hell"...then ya...proof is required, both of demons and once thats proven, then proof Clinton is indeed the horndog of hell)

So, in reality OPs...your complaining about opposing thoughts that are making it difficult to buy into any story told...but that is exactly why ATS exists...to voice opposing thinking.

There is a conspiracy that conspiracy theories are created to sell books to gullible people...and so a skeptic whom smashes down many tall tales is actually quite needed.



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:34 AM
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I would have assumed that this site is used by people who are searching for truth. Peole who are looking for answers. I know I am.

The problem is, the are so many members who have never once posted a positive response to anything. They are not here to search for truth, they are here to debunk it.

Can anyone tell me what the purpose is in coming to a site day after day only to teach and never to learn? These people (and there are no shortage of them in this thread) seem to have a monopoly on reality and are VERY rude to anyone who starts a thread without an airtight case and enough proof to satisfy their insatiable appatite.

Bottom line is 'proof' is evidence which compells one to believe. If you have made up your mind and you are flat out NOT going to believe no matter what then there is no such thing as proof.

What pisses me off is that there are alot of people who have alot of very interesting stories to tell which defy proof or evidence but are true none the less.People who 'know' things' that others need t know. People who have seen and heard things that humanity needs to be aware of. These people are discouraged from coming forward with what they know because of these 'de-bonkers'. I should know, I'm one of them.

and don't you know that was the whole plan all along? We are not afforded any more respect or credability here than we would be in the MSM and that's just the way they want it.

ATS will always be somewhere I turn to to learn but I'll god damned if I ever share what I know with these A-holes.



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:35 AM
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Sceptical analysis is good
Sceptical viewpoints are good
Being sceptical and applying logic to a problem is wonderful, and absolutely the right thing to do.

Being rude, derisive, supercilious, dismissive, condescending, and attacking and ridiculing posters for having views and opinions (however wrong-.ed and illogical you might think those views and opinions are), and then having the cheek to turn around and call that 'required' scepticism is WRONG!

I think that's where the OP, and all the recent threads on this topic are trying to point out.

Be a sceptic, but also be polite and respectful. It costs nothing, and if anything strengthens your argument by not arguing from any sentiment, but from pure analysis and logic.... and if the other person will not accept your viewpoint/argument, accept it and move on. Just agree to disagree.




posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:42 AM
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reply to post by Dagar
 


Very well said. star for you.
Love your signature too.



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:43 AM
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reply to post by GrOuNd_ZeRo
 


Since im not gonna trawl through pages of people ranting about how bad ATS has become, I don't know if this has been said. The cancer that you moan about but ironically don't realise that your contributing towards, is threads like THESE. "Oh what has ATS become, posters are so mean lately" Talk about snorezville.

You've obviously been here a while, so surely by now you have your own filter for ATS. It's incredibly simple, if you don't like the thread/post, don't read it.

If we all had your attitude by wanting everyone to be nice to each other or posting threads were only proof is allowed to back up a claim, ATS would be plain boring.

I love the fact that you can read "im an alien" threads right next to political arguments that sit right next to swine flu conspiracies that sit right next to..... The diversity here is amazing. Embrace it instead of moaning about it.



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:43 AM
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for all those that agree skeptical have a right in this board, I have to say is true what kind of member board will survive if everybody agree on the same topics?.

Is all about debate and discussion, research and finding the truth.

So sorry to say this to those that are against debunker, but they are a necessary and critical part of any discussion board.



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:47 AM
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Maybe the skeptics should just stop posting for a day or two? Lets do a No skeptics day?

That would be an interesting experiment.

Btw, who's doing the tomorrow's Burn teh skeptics!!!11oneoneleven thread?

[edit on 14/12/2009 by DGFenrir]



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:48 AM
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reply to post by thesneakiod
 




[edit on 14-12-2009 by The Lord and Savior]



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 09:56 AM
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Originally posted by DGFenrir
Maybe the skeptics should just stop posting for a day or two? Lets do a No skeptics day?

That would be an interesting experiment.

Btw, who's doing the tomorrow's Burn teh skeptics!!!11oneoneleven thread?

[edit on 14/12/2009 by DGFenrir]


I can't say I remember anyone saying anything about sceptics. It's the de-bonkers that have got to go. Healthy scepticism is dearly needed. The difference is that unbeknwnst to them, de-bonkers DO NOT and WILL NOT believe PERIOD!!!!! You can spend countless hours providing mounds upon mounds of endless evidence from solid respected professionals in their feild and it will ALL fall on deaf ears EVERYTIME!!!!

They are either afraid to know or are trying to keep us from knowing. Either way they are standing in the way of learning and that is never good.

Again,

Sceptic= Good
De-bonker= Bad

[edit on 14-12-2009 by The Lord and Savior]



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 10:01 AM
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reply to post by The Lord and Savior
 


Most consider health skepticism as debunking too. Answering their questions'n's.. shoe.
Doing research to explain a natural phenomena is a wasted time on ATS. Most simply ignore your explanations just because they don't support the Flying-Spaghettimonster theory..
I'm a leetle puzzled cuz I don't know how those most respected skeptics on ATS put up with this.


Edit:

Why exactly is a denunker bad? I haven't seen any really.. I only see silly people supporting silly theories without even understanding the basic physics.. let alone any other scientific field.

[edit on 14/12/2009 by DGFenrir]



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 10:02 AM
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In reply to the original post that started this thread ! I have not been here long and posted in very few topics but what i have already noticed is how quick the debunkers are to jump on you if by god you use the wrong phrase or insert the wrong word and just generally nit-pick ! Then when the discussion isn't going they're way they will attack a contributer personally ! They can only and always fall back on that one argument they have 'show me proof' ! Thats they're mantra they are'nt about to open they're mind's to any other possibilty it's they're way or no way ! They are'nt skeptics a true skeptic has an open mind ! When something occur's a true skeptic will say 'I dont know what that is so i will reserve judgement until i have seen and heard all the evidence, ' but no, these 'skeptics' will say 'it IS this and until anyone proves different thats WHAT it IS' ! They are not skeptics, in the true sense ! They are debunkers and misinformation agents ! Does anyone know where all the true skeptics went ? Perhaps there's some conspiracy and i should start a thread to uncover where they've gone ?

[edit on 14-12-2009 by ProRipp]



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 10:06 AM
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reply to post by ProRipp
 


You're confused. Skeptics aren't there to support theories without proof or at least a logical explanation.
Judging from your post you want us all to believe the Flying-Spaghettimonster just because you want us to.. but I hope I'm wrong.



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 10:07 AM
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hey ppl, iv been reading here for a long while and only recently joined so i guess im a newbie of sorts but i can see why the administrators would want to be skeptical, they have the RESPONSIBILITY to be skeptical as alot of what is put up here people base their lives upon, so i think its only fair to be skeptical, like not everything you read in a newspaper is true and likewise on this site not everything is true aswell so i think skeptics can have their positives too as they act as a barrier for people who can be a bit naive believing everything, lets be honest! some posts can be very silly! and i think its only professional to ask for "evidence" "data" or "info" on what you are posting.

i consider myself very open minded and i like reading the posts that are up on this site by likewise open minded people, and its great to hear different peoples opinions but its not great when people post and yet they cant back up what they are saying. and also the main thing i am against is people who create fear on ats. unnessecary fear. with stupid video clips from old films! like c'mon (robocop clips) for souless cyborgs walkn the earth!!!!! lmao!

i also see where the old members are coming from, this was and still is a great site for people to come and discuss matters generally not discussed in society but i think the old members should realise that the new members joining etc is a good sign for them as like minded people are growing in numbers! and id like to see patience on the old members behalf and maybe less ignorance on the newcomers behalf

everyone is entitled to their own opinion on everything, maybe their will be arguments along the way but that doesnt meen everyone is wrong, both could have a tiny bit of the truth of a massive puzzle



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 10:09 AM
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reply to post by DGFenrir
 


like you?

Posting News Source as proof isn't helpfully.

[edit on 14-12-2009 by Agent_USA_Supporter]



posted on Dec, 14 2009 @ 10:09 AM
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Why exactly is a denunker bad? I haven't seen any really.. I only see silly people supporting silly theories without even understanding the basic physics.. let alone any other scientific field.

[edit on 14/12/2009 by DGFenrir]



If you honestly don't know and you don't recognise one when you see one then you may be in danger of being one.



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