ATS is dying, a cancer grows within.

Originally posted by GrOuNd_ZeRoI am tired that my voice is never heard on this site

Translation: I am tired of my voice being heard and coldly debunked.

So now the conspiracy site has its very own conspiracy. This is awesome.


ATS is NWO!
ATS is NWO!!

reply to post by GrOuNd_ZeRo


Well, you do have to be suspicious whenever any site is well funded and so well organized with even a reward system for contributors. ATS is pretty top notch, and it's very hard for some honest whitleblowers to have the funds and manpower that ATS does.

Some think ATS is psyops. Which, you know, It could be, but this place also has a lot of smart people who are experts in their field. So they can pick and prod the amateurs sometimes.

I wouldn't want this place to be full of amateurs only and no people who like to ask smart questions. It's actually a good thing to have both.

But if my beloved ATS is psyops then hmmm some weird experiences ever since I have been on ATS must have a pattern.

But it's true that my favorite ATS threads have been harrassed to death. They find a way to scare those guys off.

Click here for more information.

Point Of Order

Originally posted by buds84
Honestly you are making your staff and site look really bad by telling lies.

For whatever it may be worth, you should be aware that all the posts you're referring to, as well as pretty much everything else pertaining to your allegations and account status, are available for over sixty staff members to review in our moderator forums.

I just reviewed them, compared them to your claims, and have made my recommendations for resolving this matter. Several other staff members will do likewise, and we will proceed from there.

We don't generally discuss details pertaining to member accounts publicly, but since you have chosen to do so, I will volunteer that the facts don't speak in your favor, and leave it at that.

The motto of this site is "DENY IGNORANCE" is it not? If we kicked out all "de-bunkers" and only allowed people with the "conspiracy" argument to occupy this site, wouldn't we only be talking to ourselves?

What could be more ignorant than that?

Yeah there are people that come on here to be rude and smash people's theories into the dirt and plainly be an a-hole, but just ignore those people.

In other words, don't argue with idiots. they'll drag you down to their mental level and then beat you with experience.

ATS should welcome open minded individuals who have a sound and credible argument to debate a given conspiracy theory. Its the pursuit of the truth that matters, and you will never find the truth without other perspectives and evidence.

Originally posted by ownbestenemy
reply to post by buds84

 

*Mod Edit: Editted to remove Warned reply*

Oh no?
Did internet opinions hurt your feelings? Do feel better about yourself now? Hypocrite.
You don't have to worry about taking a "hit" as long as it's me you're insulting. Thats acceptable.

I post truth and the truth hurts.

[edit on 14-12-2009 by buds84]

[edit on 14-12-2009 by alien]

Originally posted by Majic

We don't generally discuss details pertaining to member accounts publicly, but since you have chosen to do so, I will volunteer that the facts don't speak in your favor, and leave it at that.

Feel free to post here so everyone can see, exactly what I posted breaking ToC rules.

ATS is full of double standards.

Someone cheers the death of 4 cops, he's and evil man, someone cheers the death of 4 Taliban leaders, he's a good American hero.

Banned for opinion, nothing more, nothing less.

reply to post by buds84


If you got banned how are you here? My friend got banned and he can't post and the Mod's or Mr. Bill (oh noooo) would not even consider his argument. In fact, he never even got a reply from the mods of his complaint he logged against Mr. Bill (oh noooo). Sorry, the oh nooo is an inside joke.....you would have had to be in the Detroit area during the early to mid 70's to understand.

reply to post by buds84


From the link you provided.

Dead cops are great news.
We need more of this.

Theres no such thing as a good cop.

You sided with a child rapist and murderer. Praised him in fact. How do you expect people to react to you?

Not being a Psychiatrist, I can't say for sure, but it appears you may be a Sociopath and in fact a dangerous one potentially. It seems a given from your posts.

One can only hope you find help with all of this hate you have before you hurt others, if you have not already done so.

I read your posts on the Gay Genocide thread before they were deleted. They needed to be deleted. Your brand of hate is dangerous.

reply to post by buds84


I am not to get into an online back and forth. Present your information. Give details, give facts, give strong and compelling opinions why but just don't complain about it. It is not that hard.

I have personally blocked the rest of this thread from my mind and my computer so if you wish to discuss and debate anything I have said, I sir, am quite capable and willing to do so. It just wont be here.

Originally posted by buds84

Dead cops are great news.
We need more of this.

Theres no such thing as a good cop.

It legitimately scares me that people like you are in our society, or any for that matter. The fact that this website and country are free enough where someone like you can say what you do, is proof of the freedoms we enjoy. How can you not understand why those comments would be removed when they glorify and encourage violence and murder? The fact that it is people like you that are complaining about this site and it being full of 'the wrong people' just shows the absurdity of the OP or those like you.

The Pearl Of Great Price

All that said, I would like to offer a little more of my own perspective, having participated as a member, (admittedly horrid) Councilor and (hopefully slightly better) moderator over the years.

ATS attracts controversy.

We discuss controversial topics in controversial ways. We tend to be controversial people who don't like other people telling us what we should or should not say, do or think.

This naturally leads to conflict, ranging from low-intensity to all-out virtual nuclear war.

Results vary. Oftentimes it's an utter trainwreck that accomplishes nothing other than pissing people off and leaving behind piles of posts scorched beyond recognition by flames.

But sometimes, something wonderful happens. Something emerges that could not possibly have come to light any other way.

Ideally, such epiphanies would come about easily. But on ATS, as in the Real World™, things are rarely so easy.

Among many other things, making the most of ATS requires developing the ability to separate the chaff from the grain.

And though the process can be lengthy, tedious and maddening, I know I'm not the only ATSer who considers those occasional nuggets of truth to be totally worth it.

It's both sides of the field that's unwilling to meet at the fence. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence to even matter, but somebody's story isn't necessarily bunk if they can't back up the claims, and it's your decision to take interest in it or not. The real cancer here are the closed minds. It has nothing to do with what you believe. It's all about what you refuse to believe. It's not that you should believe everything you hear, it's that you should be open to believing everything you hear, and be open to the things you already believe possibly being wrong.

I was one of the original members... before we moved to this server and this style of BBS. If you think the debunkers are "bad" now, you would have never logged onto the old ATS. Skeptic Overlord came by his name honestly... he was one of the prominent hard-core skeptics.

And what a number of frauds we uncovered, from poking all sorts of holes in the John Titor story (I tracked down his home address and got other info on him) to someone who photoshopped some electronics onto a dead bird and claimed it was a robot surveilance droid monitoring his house... and beyond. And you couldn't pass off the bones of a hind leg from a brown bear as the leg bones from a yeti.

If you came here with a story, we were interested - but we double and triple checked facts. One of the very best fact checking (not by me) was the investigation of color anomalies in the Mars Rover photos. That was one of our earliest stories that got a lot of attention and was cited many places. A number of government agencies checked our site often for news because we made sure stuff was verified out the wazoo. I learned a lot from the board in those days, and it was my main source for aggregated news.

Policies changed in response to complaints, and there is a lot less of this going on. If anything, the percentage of skeptics is fewer and they are somewhat less vocal. Many simply walked silently away. I see them on other boards, though.

If you get a chance, browse the oldest messages. You'll see what I mean.

I would just like to point out how many doomsday scenerios and BOT prophecies that I have read on this site that turned out to be nothing more than hogwash when the day of doom finally arrived. The forums on this site attract posts from an extreme panorama of individuals, from amazingly intelligent and circumspect folk to people who clearly need to seek professional help. It is this incredibly broad spectrum that accounts for the sites entertainment value. But, above all, the site NEEDS debunkers, people who think clearly and do not accept a claim like, "I have Pixies living in my garden" as gospel truth. Because the truth is what we are all striving to get at, whatever it might be, and we're all predisposed to have our own little pet theories about this and that. It's important to hear differing arguments concerning things like UFO's, conspiracies and the like. If you're merely looking for a website to be your UFO equivalent of Glenn Beck and simply reinforce your preconceived notions then there are plenty of other sites out there that can fill yuor void. May bongo, the God of Gravity, bless this site and its many debunkers.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

This has been a very interesting read through this thread. You can actually watch the hatred spawn and grow and develop tentacles engulfing everything in its path. Its like an exorcisim within a forum. This is crazy !!!
This is the future of ATS?

Its like every few weeks, a thread like this opens up.

For the love of everything that is holy, use the search function. You will find this topic beaten to death several times over.

LINK

LINK

LINK

LINK

LINK

Those are only some from recent weeks/days. If you go back to the beginning, there are hundreds of these threads. Wasted space.

Also, if you are going to whine about the same old crap, put it in the proper forum. This is NOT a conspiracy.

reply to post by GrOuNd_ZeRo


If money makes the world go round, then surely it can make ATS go round.

The management is more concerned about retrieving more members from other forums rather than keeping the originality of this community intact.

I'm saddened also.

You are not alone

oz

reply to post by GrOuNd_ZeRo

Disclaimer, this author can not proof any of the claims since he doesn't have any evidence to support his claims, this is merely his perception based on personal experience. No claims will be made that this is the truth, but the author strongly believes it is the truth and is not deliberately trying to deceive ATS

Wow, was this disclaimer put on by the author or was this forced on by the mods?

Some may view the OP as paranoid and ill-informed, but as an "old time" member I can agree with most of what the OP is saying. Is this a paranoid/ignorant view or is perception gained through thoughtful observation?

I know discussions about such topics is bad publicity for ATS, but this is a matter ATS staff has tried to sweep under the rug for far too long.

As a long time member I'm able to see and compare the difference between ATS today and what it was when I first joined. I'm not out to ruin ATS, rather I criticize constructively.

* Members censorship is up 10 fold, this can be argued that we have more members therefore the staff must censor or moderate more posts. But the perception can be viewed as over top, especially to some who have been around a while.

* Any constructive criticism is frowned upon generally as an annoyance. Many in fact are speaking out because of the love they have for this site. A good public image is essential for growth. I understand the marketing concept but for a site that sales it self as denying ignorance, we need to live up those standards.

* Many critics on this site apparently are given a free pass to lay waste to threads when it is obvious it affecting the flow of the discussion. I agree with the allegation that we have a trend where some very insightful post/threads are ignored or trolled excessively. Is this because many happen to not be on the same page or is it an organized effort to minimize some important information? It's obvious that certain topics have a higher troll count than others. A trend can be observed by the casual member when it comes to a thread cycle pertaining to certain subject matter.

* Little or no explanation is given to a OP or a thread contributor to why censorship was used. I will not elaborate further because it pertains to personal experience that may violate terms of use agreements.

* Petitioning of staff is either ignored, delayed, or responses are vague. Again I will not elaborate because I value my membership here.

With that said I still find ATS as a useful resource for learning. I hope that either my perception is wrong or these apparent problems can be addressed. This is said because I love ATS and what it's supposed to stand for.


[edit on 14-12-2009 by oconnection]

Wow, I posted this thread last night and it ballooned quite a bit.

First of, Ozweatherman, I greatly appriciate your contributions but rather than to be skeptic you like to debunk threads routinely, it's one thing to be skeptic but to make it your goal here on ATS to debunk...let's just say it makes me wonder what makes you post here, do you just laugh at every body thinking that bright dot in the sky could actually be inteligently controlled?

I am NOT against skeptisism, I am a skeptic my self! I don't believe the first joe coming with the "I am an alien from Tau Ceti" threads however I do treat him SERIOUSLY first before slamming him, what if he IS an alien? it's unlikely but it is possible, even if it's only 0.0000001% possible, but what in the off chance it IS.

If they fail to produce us any satisfactory proof of who they are we can lable it a hoax sure but I think ATS just might be a bit too quick to determine it is a hoax but that's just my opinion.

Scenario: ATS member photographs UFO.
"I snapped this picture of this UFO, I saw it with my own eyes and then took these pictures! can any members explain to me if this is a UFO or something else?"

Believer: "wow that's amazing! the GFL will save us all! you definitly captured a pleiadan beam ship!"
Skeptic: "You may just be seeing an aircraft from a distance and the way the sun hits it make it look like it's shining brightly, however it may very well be a UFO but it's hard to tell from the pic."
Pseudo-skeptic: "That's CGI! you used photoshop to make this hoax! I can reproduce this in photoshop easilly!"
Debunker: "You obviously captured nothing but lense-flare, I don't think you ever saw anything before you took the picture, the only person seeing a UFO is you."

as you may see this is a typical way a thread is being handled, I usually don't even post anymore in such threads due to these debunkers and pseudo-skeptics.

I try to be skeptical but I also try to be polite to the poster! many on here don't and slam the poster and ASSUME it's another hoaxer! stop crying wolf people! I know seperating the chaff from the wheat is sometimes a tedious task but don't get lazy.

ATS lost it's ballance, no longer are the pros and cons being weighed, no longer are we discussing things in a neutral fashion and in this way we become hostile towards each other and resort to infighting.

We should not fight each other, we should fight our enemy! our enemy is false-truths, half-truths and people obscurring the truth.

Skeptics are essential for a site like ATS but so is politeness and neutrality!

I challenge all members to be neutral and polite to each other from now on and try to not post with emotion but with inteligent discussion.

I see too much emotional responses here on ATS, fear and anger being the most prevalent.

Don't read something already having your mind made up on what is being posted on, read it and weight the probability that this person and/or entity is telling the truth, but open the thread with an open mind no matter how outlandish the thread may sound.

Ignorance is close mindedness.