Big Brother giving "We the People" trouble~ No, we ain't gonna take it!, page 3

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reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 06:24 PM by Ladon

I'm sorry, but the Revolution isn't starting yet. The system has changed boys, revolutions don't just spread like the wildfire they used to. The Western powers have made sure that they hold stability by using the biggest trick of all: The Middle Class.

In South American countries, if university tuition is raised, the very next day there are masses of people on the streets, walking out of their jobs, until a settlement is made. There, the people get what they want, they may not have certain freedoms, but they make the government scared.

They can do this because there is little belief held of the Middle Class in these countries. The division is just between the power-holders, and the others.

In the West, too many see their existence as "bad, but at least I'm not like group X." Thus we don't unite against oppression because we continuously think that everything is alright, even though everything could be going to Hell in a hand-basket.

Because we think we're doing better than the lower class, we allow ourselves to fall into the foolish consumerism-based society that's very structure controls us by making us want what we can never have. We blindly move towards our little goals, ignoring cries for unity from others because we don't want to have them drag us behind in the rat-race.

If everyone recognized that TPTB don't regard us as equal with the powerful in society, would they do anything? Or have we already been stuck in the dream where we don't see that we are poorer than we should be, and are continuously losing more and more rights?

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 06:28 PM by boniknik

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

excellent post Jean.

I believe that even if the people fight, and achieved peace, it wouldn't last, because we will be committing the same mistakes again because the cause was never addressed in the first place.

We have so much resources in the world enough to feed every person on this planet, yet a lot of those resources we haven't even touched because, one must have money to access it. Why are we letting the elite control all of the world's resources? Why are we giving so much value on their gold and money? When did they start to own the world? Why did we let it?

Money gets to decide whether I will get health care or not, Money gets to decide whether I will get education, and even if I have money, the quality of education I get still depends on it. Success is always measured by how much money you have instead of how much you contributed to your society.

People say, punishment for your fault cannot be passed on to your kids, yet many kids suffer because they cannot get equal opportunity. People say nothing is impossible when you work hard. Yet the kids from the country where I am from works for $0.25/day under the hot sun in a sugarcane plantation. What did these kids ever do to be punished like this? Yet there is a tree somewhere bearing fruits, kids could not eat, because it was grown in a land he "doesn't own" yet everyday he is the one working on the land making sure it bears fruit, if he wanted to eat it, he will be asked do you have money? Well yo can eat it but it will deducted on your salary.

A 5 yr old kid says "I am very tired", the reporter said, "do you want to rest now?", the kid says, "No, I mean I'm tired of life, everyday all I see is sugarcane." Five years old, and already tired of life.

In all my observation, I saw that the root cause of all wars and suffering is money. Why can't somebody be born with an equal opportunity?

If I want to be a doctor why can I not be? Yet many people embraces the society where money rules, in all their self righteousness they feel they deserve more than others do. They will say, well if I went to school and studied so hard why should I get the same quality of life as everybody else who did not study? It's like saying, "Retarded people, low IQ people, less talented people doesn't deserve a good life, and because I am superior and lucky to afford education I deserve a good life."

Another person will say, well the job of the doctor is more valuable than a janitor, therefore the doctor deserves a better life (more money) than the janitor. Not realizing the doctor could not be a doctor if he also have to sweep the floor.

Only when, we realize that irregardless of aptitude, line of work, race, past and everything, Every person in this planet deserves a good life. If anybody think, this is unfair, look inside yourself, and ask, do I deserve what I have? Look around you, there are many who are working harder than you do, more intelligent and talented than you are, yet they are living below you in the society. You can always find somebody far more superior than you are, far more hard working than you are, and because of this do they deserve a better life and you don't?

Eliminate money, measure success by how much you contribute to the society, payment for your labor should be fame and legacy, make everything in the whole world free for everybody, equal opportunity for every child born. If we can do this, peace and progress will follow.

The evil placed value on gold and a piece of paper to enslaved us. Only giving us enough to live, giving us little rewards when we did a "good job". Nobody owns the world, we all should have equal rights and opportunity.

This should be our goal >>> www.thevenusproject.com...

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 07:25 PM by Walkswithfish

This government will take it.

They will take away freedom and liberty and replace it with dependence.

In time poverty and hunger will drive even the most diehard rebels into acceptance and compliance... When the government controls everything they will eventually control you.

You may not think so, but you already are forced to turn to this government in many ways.

Like candy for kids or cash for clunkers, health care from the government will be their greatest achievement, when they have control over heath care they will control all... Where else will you turn when sick or need care?

Unemployed?

Cant find a job?

Where can you get assistance?

Think of the things that the government controls now, and then what they are seeking to control through pending legislation.

No matter how much you would like to believe in revolution, it will not happen... Too many are already too dependent on government.

independence has been replaced with dependence.

In time, even YOU will turn to this government... and that is exactly what they want.

Economic failure a designed opportunity this government has not wasted.

You ain't seen nothing yet.

Stay tuned!

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 07:26 PM by Subjective Truth

Thank whatever god you hold dear in your heart for the DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE. For without that simple piece of paper drafted so very long ago I fear all would be lost. Let me explain, we will only sleep for so long while it is desigrated. It seems that alot of the people will never wake up but I beleive they already have the truth is self evident at this point.

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 07:56 PM by jitombe

reply to post by lapi7

"BUNK & BULL!!! Over the past decade I’ve seen perhaps millions of “Revolution, Militia, Patriot, Liberty, “We the People” TALKERS!!! You TALK & TALK & TALK & RANT & RANT & RANT on blog boards about “rising up” and “overcoming” and “revolution” and “taking down the elite” & “We the people will not be stopped” and "I'm with you...count me in" and "Yeah, RIGHT ON MAN!! We're locked and loaded and ready to bring down those corporate elite bastards!!!" …etc. BULL#, BULL# and more BULL#!!!"

Thank you Lapi7 for your reply to this thread, loved it! It's nice for people to think they can take over the current govt, good luck with that dream folks. Does anyone remember what happened last time this country had a civil war? Another civil war will not happen here. No one can agree on how to run the country as it is. Just take a look at the people we vote for in congress. I've babbled on this topic on other related threads...all the power to the states(move to a different state that is more in line with your way of thinking/lifestyle)....get rid of congress & the supreme court, keep it a national army just in case some other country is dumb enough to really tick us off. One other thing, no more military bases in other countries.

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 08:00 PM by IceDash

I with ya, I cannot take sexual abuse on freedom of american from Obama and the government

However, just a nice advise for you, check your computer, you could be "bug" by a concern secret agents to keep an eye on you.

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 08:03 PM by Walkswithfish

Originally posted by David9176
For as much as we want things to change, it's not going to happen until a very large portion of the country is really hurting...and that could be when we finally have to face our debts and deficits...and that day will come.

And that is the whole point.. see my previous post in this thread?

That "hurting" is their opportunity to be your saviors.

By the time "enough is really hurting" it will already be far too late.

In time... even you will stand in line somewhere for a government ration of social generosity... Perhaps you already have?

The "change" has already happened, and many fail to see what it really is.

There isn't going to be any going back now... Through regulatory controls, nationalized industries and financial institutions/banks, reforms/legislation, massive spending, deficit and debt that is assured.

Failure is their greatest success!

Wake up America, so you can be put to sleep!

Put your guns away and get in line now.

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 08:29 PM by Jean Paul Zodeaux

reply to post by boniknik

Thank you for the kind words in regards to my post, boniknik;

However, we will have to disagree on your belief that people are not born with equal opportunity, and that money is the root of all evil. First, let me address this notion that people aren't born with equal opportunity. It is true that some are born into wealth and many others are born into poverty andthis is an inherent inequality that exists on more levels than wealth, as health is also a factor of inequality and some are born healthier than others, some are born stronger than others and some are born smarter than others and this sort of natural inequality can not be regulated, it is the way things are.

However, that five year old kid you mentioned who is tired of life because of hard work spent in a sugar cane, her life is not set and she can as she grows up make decisions to change her fate, and rise up and be more than the she has found it possible to be while laboring away in a sugar cane field. The United States is filled with immigrants, and children of immigrants and grandchildren of immigrants and great grandchildren of immigrants who all left their unacceptable situations in order to pursue a life of prosperity in the U.S. They came to the U.S. because there were no laws preventing them from rising up towards wealth. That is the equality under law that all people should have and have every right to fight for, even if it means a call to arms.

Now, let me address your claims that money is the root of all evil. This is a mistake of fact, and misunderstands what money is. Money is symbolic and only represents the effort you make. While working in a sugar cane field, I have no doubt, is hard work, it pays too little and thus it is a bad investment of effort and any lack of wealth is reflective of that bad investment. Rise up! Walk away from such serfdom and pursue a better life! Live long and prosper! It is not a sin to prosper it is an imperative if one truly wants to survive. There was a time in the U.S. when anyone could rise to wealth no questions asked, today, however, there are dubious licensing schemes after dubious licensing schemes followed by dubious taxation schemes that accomplish nothing more than suppressing wealth and keeping the vast majority of people from obtaining wealth.

Again, I say, rise up! In my original post I was not making an argument to not fight, I was arguing that before we begin shooting each other there are peaceful and diplomatic ways to convince our enemies to surrender and get the hell out of the way! Rise up! Be free and do so peacefully until all avenues of peace have been exhausted and then, and only then, if peace can not obtain freedom, then kill those who are suppressing you and necessarily remove them as obstacles to your longevity and prosperity!

Every single one of us have the right to pursue happiness, we have the right to life and liberty and we have the right to own property and the best and surest way to ensure that right is by acting as free people do, that is to say, unencumbered by slave owners. Do not agree to serfdom or slavery, walk away peacefully if you can and if you can't then fight to ensure your freedom but always make sure that if you must fight for your freedom, that you are prepared to be victorious, otherwise your fight is merely sacrifice for the freedom of others and while that may have meaning to a very few, for the vast majority of complacent individuals it will mean nothing at all. If you must fight for your freedom, fight to win and fight to ensure your own freedom and those you love, and do so to enjoy that freedom and avoid loosing at all costs except for freedom.

The long and continuing battle for freedom requires more than just brute force it requires sound strategies that can affect victory. If free people can not devise strategies that would ensure victory, what makes them so sure they can deal with freedom? This is all I was trying to say in my last post, and I do not at all advocate any collectivist philosophy that would impose laws forcing a monetary equity at the expense of freedom.

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 08:58 PM by randyvs

I just watched what Ventura did concerning 911 on tru .t.v. last tue. night
at 10. (we should all be there on tue. nights in support). The first two have been great, I digress for the sake of a plug.
My point? Pretty much just an "on the other hand".

Walkswithafish your words are wise. We should talk about this some more.

I know it has been said, "the time for talk is over" but war requires much
consideration. Especially in the light of immediate obliteration.
That is all I have to say.

[edit on 12-12-2009 by randyvs]

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 11:06 PM by ADVISOR

People need to organize, we have to come together in community and state based groups.

Just as our founding fathers acted as the voice and leaders of the creation of this nation, so too must we find our roles.

I know that if enough people see others standing up and doing some thing, others will follow.

Organizing the people and ensuring we speak with one voice is foremost I feel.

If we focus on what the majority agrees on, then we can set aside our differences and work together.

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 11:13 PM by ADVISOR

It is necessary "to dissolve the political bands", this is the problem. Too many people are still caught up in the "bs", playing right into the hands who seek to cause the division.

Divide and conquer, allowing we the people to be turned against each other.

With out the control over the masses, they have nothing.

We are ATS, and we are stronger than the sheep.

That, is our community. That is why we are here, and that is why I will continue to the message I have been for all these years.

[edit on 12-12-2009 by ADVISOR]

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 11:32 PM by Walkswithfish

Originally posted by randyvs
Walkswithafish your words are wise. We should talk about this some more.

My words are not wise, just the simpleminded common sense truth from an American who has seen first hand the best and the worst of this nation we have lived together and lost divided in.

It is we who have collectively allowed corruption in government to grow for far too long to turn it back now.

I once believed in democracy and justice, but have learned that both are simply the tools of pacification used to lull us all into believing that "we the people" actually matter.

Fact is, we never have, nor ever will.

We can all stand gloriously in our defiance now, do everything in our power to stop this and take back our country... But you all already know that isn't going to happen and even if it did it would change nothing except to redden small areas with the blood of those who tried.

We can go to the polls in future elections and fire them all.... and those who replace them will meet and ultimately conform to the corrupt system that has ruled far longer than any of those elected before them.

Change will only come in names and faces.

Good night... Good luck... God bless America.

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 11:33 PM by Walkswithfish

Oops, double post.

Sorry.

[edit on 12-12-2009 by Walkswithfish]

reply posted on 12-12-2009 @ 11:44 PM by ADVISOR

Well walks, I don't see any wisdom in your comment.

What I see is one who has become cynical, perhaps from seeing to much of the same old bs from the same old damn politicians.

Well, the reason I see the same things that have been going on still going, is because the same damn idiots who were in charge then, are still in the circle of power today.

A nation which has forgotten the quality of courage which in the past has been brought to public life is not as likely to insist upon or regard that quality in its chosen leaders today - and in fact we have forgotten.
JFK

People have forgotten, because they have not been reminded.

I am here as I have been for years, as a reminder.

Not every one has forgotten, if you are not here to support, then;

If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquillity of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.
-- Samuel Adams

reply posted on 13-12-2009 @ 12:00 AM by Walkswithfish

reply to post by ADVISOR

Cynical? perhaps... But I am also a realist.

ADVISOR, I respect what you are doing here more than you know... I also respect and deeply appreciate your sacrifice and service to this nation... You are one who knows first hand the cost in defending freedom.

I am simply offering you and others a strong dose of realism.

Until the cancer of corruption is removed from all branches of our government we are doomed to repeat this insanity in one form or another between every election cycle.

Eventually it will destroy this nation... in fact it already has in many ways.

My apologies for my opinion.

I wish you all the best in this cause... Better to do something than to have future history judge us for never trying.

The true enemy to our freedom and liberty is not partisan politics, nor politicians.

reply posted on 13-12-2009 @ 12:09 AM by Oaktree

Originally posted by Asktheanimals
I'm with you mind and heart but I have one problem. WHO IS THE NWO?
Who the heck is destroying America? It would be so much easier if they all wore red coats but they don't.
I'm old, my body is spent and quite frankly I'd love to see this country turned around since I do have grandchildren.
The country I grew up in is not the same one they are growing up in and that really gets me pissed.
If this country totally goes to sh*t then you can find at least some of the bad guys down in Paraguay.

STAND UP PEOPLE! THIS IS YOUR COUNTRY!!

I spent fifteen years as a chef in some of the finest restaurants in Chicago.
Three of those years I was the chef of a very exclusive club that catered to the power brokes of the CBOT.
I can tell you from my experience that these people are not hiding out.
They come and go, wives or mistresses on their arm, walking down streets, valeting their cars and hailing cabs like many other people.
To approach one and speak your mind would take very little effort.
They are right there, among the rest of the common folk.
You just have to know where to look.

reply posted on 13-12-2009 @ 12:28 AM by ADVISOR

Very true.

The people who are "in power", who have all the money are not sneaking around. Even as Oaktree says, mistress on arm, no shame or moral qualms.

Many of the people in what is considered the NWO, are top shelf A list, international committee attending, silver spoon fed rich elites. Or people who are trying to garner their influence.

When the entire worlds currency is printed and controlled by an international cabal of bankers, banker owners and "nation builders", I have no issue seeing who the NWO are.

It is not one person, or even one single group.
The "Omega Agency" as it has been called is the same. Not one static core of individuals, but one that changes. Not constantly, many of these control figures are in the seat of power because they were born into it, inherited if you will. For cases of the Euro nobility.

As for others not of that caste, then itis by appointment. No, not that they had a scheduled one, as going to the doctor. But they were chosen and emplaced in said position. Most never fully know what they are getting into, as is the case with the majority of American presidents.

These National representatives, come and go, presidents are a dime a dozen tothe people telling them what to do.

When the NWO wants to see the office of the US President, or even the British Prime Minister and many other foreign puppet regimes. The NWO looks down, to see these "players" whom they are in control of.

World resources, for these people are invested commodities.
There are global summits where the worlds richest and most influencial government representatives get together and discuss business.

Each of those "clickes", they are the manipulators of the arena.

We the People, are also a part of the world, and the world has lost faith in what America was known to stand for.

It is a shameful burden I feel upon my soul, because, being an American who remembers when America was that place, the world knew was what it represented...

As I have done so, for many years here at ATS, and as I will.

"The issue today is the same as it has been throughout all history, whether man shall be allowed to govern himself or be ruled by a small elite." -- Thomas Jefferson

Freedom Keys
[edit to add link for quote source]

[edit on 13-12-2009 by ADVISOR]

reply posted on 13-12-2009 @ 08:31 AM by kenochs

reply to post by ADVISOR

Hey man, I'd love to help and all but it's football day and there are some games I want to watch.
Plus, I gotta do some christmas shopping, and get to the grocery store.
And after that there's an "office" marathon...
So hey, can we hold off on this 'revolution' stuff till after the holidays.
.
.
.
But seriously. I'm sorry and I usually really try and be respectful but this kind of talk is all cowardly baloney. Some guy sitting behind a computer urging sedition.

Give me a break.

You want to change things? Do it within the law. Get involved in local politics, join your school board, run for local office. But no, you can't be bothered to really work hard. You just want to run out in the streets calling for revolution.

Your duty is to defend the constitution, that means working within its structures to maintain governmental integrity, not urge revolution when the nation elects a democrat. Your speech reminds me of John Belushi from Animal House, all bluster, no muster.

Duty is heavier than a mountain buddy. You wanna fix things, do it the right way, which is the hard way. Don't sit behind your computer like a modern day Madame Defarge urging us all to send the royalty to the guillotine. I hate to say it, but I know cowardly when I see it. And I have seen the real enemy, and it's people like you.

reply posted on 13-12-2009 @ 08:37 AM by kenochs

reply to post by Oaktree

You know who the NWO is? It's a myth that exists in the minds of snake oil salesman who are running a good business based on books, videos, posts suggesting they know the 'truth' behind the NWO. They don't, really but for 14.95 they'll send you a book filled with half-truths and false coincidences that suggest causality. But in the end, they get rich, you feel more powerless, and everyone wins but you. Who's the NWO? It's nothing. But guess who's selling it, all the big names in the conspiracy business, and they're making a good living.

reply posted on 13-12-2009 @ 08:58 AM by thewind

reply to post by lapi7

I agree with ya 1000% here lapi7! I am 47 years old and have heard the same things for over 30 years now, and I ain't seen nuthin yet from the so-called militias! I do hear them all the time though at the pubs talkin their smack at how they're gonna do this and that, and how they aren't going to stand for the gov't doing this and that!

Over the last 30 years, we have continued to lose freedoms, and where have all those brave militia men been? Out playing GI Joe at their little club houses, flexing their steroid-filled biceps as they chug down their beers while popping off a few hundred rounds of ammo, making themselves feel like they're the testosterone kings of the jungle!

I doubt if any of them even know how to read a compass, know what a "pace-man" is, know what a "click" is, or even have the least idea of what and how to navigate a long range navigation on a topo map! To them, being "jungle" qualified is when they have just finished watching the latest "Rambo" movie!

And let's not even get into tactical assault with small arms fire and doing recons. I mean, they'd make gomer pyle look like schwartzenneger in commando! I have already been kicked out of numerous so-called Patriot" websites because I was said to have been out of my mind or a radical when it came to fixing this nation!

I guess you so-called "Patriots", and I use this term extremely loose when addressing you, think that our forefathers won our independence by defeating the british in a game of checkers? I have tried to get people to stand up, and they won't! So I say because of the cowards, we're all gonna get what we deserve! You that won't stand for your family and neighbors will live to be old and on your knees begging the tyrannical gov't for a crumb of bread while I will have died trying to defend mine!

I'd rather die standing than spend the rest of my life on my knees!