From an ethnobotanical standpoint, if you deem meditative techniques to be the only legid way of inducing these states of awareness (or unawareness
even!), what are all the Shamans in the Amazonas doing? They sure must be fooling and deceiving themselves...
Somebody on this forum said that shrooms were the "crashcourse" of what meditation is supposed to prepare for...I think, if you do these
substances, maybe you'll know what to look for, when you're meditating..How do you know you're not doing it wrong?
And anyway, such substances have all kinds of different characteristics...Every substance is in some way uniquely affecting the neurochemistry,
however meditation probably leads to one realization, probably rendering it "ultimate". In that sense, it's kinda weak that we look for shortcuts.
However, there is genuinely shaman use of psychedelics and if you concider states induced by them to be artificial, they still offer some variation in
exploring the different mindscapes because of their vast differences. There's a user on this board, I think his name was an alliteration, something
about unity. He spends much time putting the word out about nutrition and its effects on the mind. He has expirienced states of profound revelation
himself but questions them to the core because he doubts his sanity because of his diagnosed nutritional disorder.
So in some way or other he had expirienced them- but only questions them because he doubts he induced them himself
So I think you're ultimately demanding that people induce it by the power of their own mind so they will be certain that they're real...Well how
does that tell you you're right on everything? Something induces it and since it's with you all the time (your mind) you won't question it. The
problem with psychedelics is that you probably will actually question the legidity of the expirience because of it's duration for example. It's just
when they come down that they start wondering about it. But given you're in your mind, this point of induction is constantly present and you won't
see another expirience from which you may question the prevalence of your intial realizations...I don't know...
I'm just thinking, if you have the right intention, it may do something for you. I think the whole deal of shamanism is finally about sacrificing
something to prove yourself worthy...Well, not everybody goes through the expirience unscathed! Some are deeply unsettled by it because it's so
overwhelming and they weren't prepared for it. So maybe I may draw a line here to being worthy of being submitted to the expirience.
It shouldn't be recreational because recreation implies only a gain intended to last a short time. Meditation of course requires constant attention,
but if someone doesn't take the time to prepare for these "plant-teachers", their expirience will be as unsettling and unrewarding as it can get.
It's still up to them what to make of it after all.