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Originally posted by GoodOlDave
Would you mind terribly posting a link to a source that says, "they were only led on a bried tour through the debris"? I'm quoting FEMA's own WTC performance study that says steel was specifically set aside by NYC engineers for them to examine. They go into detail in appendix D on how they collected samples, called "coupons" from steel taken from critical areas for analysis. They even included photographs of the samples they examined- Figure D-16 shows right away how badly the fires messed up one of the perimeter columns. They even show the person examining it!
[Astaneh-Asl] I wish I had more time to inspect steel structure and save more pieces before the steel was recycled. However, given the fact that other teams such as NIST, SEAONY and FEMA-BPAT have also done inspection and have collected the perishable data, it seems to me that collectively we may have been able to collect sufficient data. The main impediments to my work were and still are:
1. Not having a copy of the engineering drawings and design and construction documents.
2. Not having copies of the photographs and videotapes that various agencies might have taken during and immediately after the collapse.
...
[Committee] Has the confidential nature of the FEMA's Building Performance Assessment Team investigation made it more difficult to gain access to materials that might be useful, such as private videotapes?
[Astaneh-Asl] I have not been provided with the information made available to the FEMA Building Performance Assessment Team. This includes, videotapes and photographs taken on 9/11and the following days and copies of the engineering drawings. At this time, having the videotapes, photographs and copies of the drawings not only is useful, but also is essential in enabling us to conduct any analysis of the collapse and to formulate conclusions from our effort.
Originally posted by GoodOlDave
Originally posted by mike dangerously
Ok,GoodOlDave are the first responders lying about hearing explosions? also,is Chief Tursi a lair as well?
No, Chief Tursi is not a liar. Anyone who insists that the explosions he heard were actual bombs is a liar, becuase HE never says they were actual bombs.
Chief Turi arrived at the WTC just prior to and witnessed the second airplane impact. He entered the North Tower lobby shortly after the second impact, where a temporary command post was located.
Q: Let me stop you there for a second, chief. When you were in the lobby of 1 World Trade, can you describe the interior and the condition of the lobby?
Chief Turi: Yes. I was surprised that all the glass was mostly out. I wasn't sure how it got out. I didn't think we took it out. I just assumed that it was the vibration of the aircraft hitting it. And I did notice some pieces of marble that looked like it was dislodged from the core area. ... [Editor's note: At this point, Chief Turi was in the lobby of the North Tower, approximately 1,100 feet below the airplane's impact point at floors 93 to 98.]
And as my eyes traveled up the building, and I was looking at the south tower, somewhere about halfway up, my initial reaction was there was a secondary explosion, and the entire floor area, a ring right around the building blew out. I later realized that the building had started to collapse already and this was the air being compressed and that is the floor that let go. And as my eyes traveled further up the building, I realized that this building was collapsing ..."
Originally posted by GoodOlDave
Originally posted by ThichHeaded
That video is after the 1st tower fell, not minutes more like many many many minutes.. Try and get closer to minutes..
Not that it matters, becuase seeing F-15 fighters in the skies of NYC *at**all* is still irrefutable proof that Ventura's "military stand down order" claim is rubbish.
stand down means to not engage.....you can show up for the party, you just can't play
Originally posted by GoodOlDave
Originally posted by Lillydale
I thought the specific statement was "secondary device" and not 'explosion.' Am I wrong?
You are wrong. I am quoting your own link-
"And as my eyes traveled up the building, and I was looking at the south tower, somewhere about halfway up, my initial reaction was there was a secondary explosion, and the entire floor area, a ring right around the building blew out. I later realized that the building had started to collapse already and this was the air being compressed and that is the floor that let go. And as my eyes traveled further up the building, I realized that this building was collapsing ..."
He not only said secondary EXPLOSION, he even identified the secondary explosion as being air compression from the collapse of the building. You are filtering his statements through your own pro-conspiracy bias, here.
Originally posted by GoodOlDave
Originally posted by Finn1916
Hey just so everyone knows, that new conspiracy theory show is doing 911 tonight on tru tv, watching it now.
Yeah, I'm watching it now, too. Good GOD this thing is chock full of steaming heaps of horse [censored].
-They kept saying over and over they found traces of explosives in the dust. THERMITE IS NOT AN EXPLOSIVE! It burns really hot...and what they found wasn't even thermite! They found aluminum and iron particles, which Alex Jones is insisting are signs of explosives on his own.
-They put some of this goop on a small I beam to show what it does. THE WTC WASN'T BUILT OUT OF I BEAMS! They had massive four foot by five foot square box columns. Oh, and guess what: the thermite didn't explode. It just went HISS.
-THEN they say, someone could have painted the buoldings without knowing what it was. THEY WOULD NEVER PAINT THE STEEL! The steel was coated with fire retardant foam, and would never be painted. The only thing that would be painted was the dry wall.
-They kept saying how all the steel was immediately shipped overseas and destroyed. WRONG. Eevry girder, every piece of junk, every smashed car they recovered, was all shipped to a field in New Jersey for analysis.
-He just repeated the claim that our air defense was in stand down mode. WRONG. 100,000 New Yorkers saw fighter jets arriving over the skies of Manhattan only minutes after the strikes, and even the news cameras picked them up.
-NOW, he's hyping up Northwoods, claiming that the plan was to attack US cities as a false flag operation to frame Cuba- WRONG. It was set up *not* to cause any casualties. The plan was to keep people alive to make them witnesses to the supposed Cuban aggression.
-Then there's the thing that pisses me off the most- Ventura says the gov't "gave us all this garbage about how the WTC fell", while flashing the cover of the 9/11 Commission report. THE REPORT NEVER DISCUSSED HOW THE TOWERS FELL. It was to document who was behind the attack and how it was carried out, not the physical progression of the collapse.
There's only one thing this show is going to do, in the end- NOTHING. The people who are so madly in love with these conspiracy stories will point at it and say PROOF OF CONSPIRACY, while people who know these conspiracy mongers are lying through their teeth will point at it and say PROOF THAT THE CONSPIRACY MONGERS ARE LYING THROUGH THEIR TEETH, so either way, everyone is exactly where they were before. The only one who wins in the end is Jesse Ventura, who probably picked up at least fifty grand for this episode, and all he did is recite the crap these damned fool conspiracy web sites are pushing out almost word for word. I guess P.T. Barnum was right after all.
I just saw the previews for next week's show. They're claiming global warming is a hoax meant to "take over the world". Huh?!?
Originally posted by Lillydale
NO. That is not what I asked. You are at least the second person to claim that there were NO REPORTS OF SECONDARY DEVICES. I was asking if you are going to stick to that or if you at least admit that secondary device(s) were reported?
Originally posted by Finn1916
Hey just so everyone knows, that new conspiracy theory show is doing 911 tonight on tru tv, watching it now.
Originally posted by Dark Passenger
Wtf? Thank you Jesse Ventura for turning what happened on 9/11 into an episode of "Destination Truth". What was he thinking.
Originally posted by bsbray11
I was mistaken that the FEMA team itself complained about a lack of evidence; it was a public investigator sent to work with the BPAT and collect as much information as he could for the NSF and UC-Berkeley. He spent a month in NY looking through the landfill site.
He was summoned to report before the House Committee on Science as to what he had learned:
[Astaneh-Asl]I wish I had more time to inspect steel structure and save more pieces before the steel was recycled. However, given the fact that other teams such as NIST, SEAONY and FEMA-BPAT have also done inspection and have collected the perishable data, it seems to me that collectively we may have been able to collect sufficient data. The main impediments to my work were and still are:
1. Not having a copy of the engineering drawings and design and construction documents.
2. Not having copies of the photographs and videotapes that various agencies might have taken during and immediately after the collapse.
I don't know what happened with SEAONY, but FEMA and NIST both came out with totally BS reports on the towers that makes their investigations at least negligent, more likely compromised in terms of being able to legitimately investigate the collapses.
And they are keeping thousands of photos and videos, and more importantly the complete structural information to themselves to this day, preventing anyone else from the public of reviewing their work.