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Ohio Executes Inmate Using Single Drug Method

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posted on Dec, 10 2009 @ 11:36 AM
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reply to post by blueorder
 

Cut out the rest of your ridiculous attempts at smart arsery- read above, he specifically called the execution of a murderer, murder- so "per se", it is the act of execution in his eyes
Ah yes, "smart arsery" - I'm not suprised to see a debater of your calibre resort to attempting to deride intellectual arguments which form an inescapable chain of logic refuting you: its a pattern I'm seeing in your posts all over.
You may well attempt to fall back on the position that your posts in this thread, quoting text from this thread, were actually inspired by stuff written elsewhere, which you did not quote until the fallacy of your position was pointed out, however, everyone else reading this knows that you are busted. For what? For the exact opposite of that which you accused me of, ie dumb arsery.




posted on Dec, 10 2009 @ 11:52 AM
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killing a killer to prove your point that killing is wrong is wrong ?

what ever happened to forced labor , forced organ donation or medical experiments ?


got to be a better way to process these "blackholes of tax money spent wrong"



posted on Dec, 10 2009 @ 11:58 AM
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Why not just use the single bullet method?

I'm sure you could find plenty of willing and capable guys.



posted on Dec, 10 2009 @ 12:03 PM
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reply to post by Miraj
 


i get your pun

but do you mean that the punishment is the fire ing of a single bullet and after that punishment is over ?

what happens if the weapon missfires, only wounds or better all together completly missed , ? then what ?

is she/he free to go ?



posted on Dec, 10 2009 @ 02:50 PM
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reply to post by zerbot565
 


these questions are irrelevant, there's no divine justice through coincidence clause in the law, none that i know of, at least.

so, shoot the guy with a dozen bullets (.30cal) delivered through firing squad, or if you must, 'terminators'. you could still use the guillotine, y'know but you'd have to rename it into 'freedom blade' or somesuch newspeak, because, well, it's originally French... anyways, if he's still alive, repeat the process until the desired result is achieved. won't happen, though, unless the firing squad conspires and only maims him which in itself would be illegal. another point for beheading i guess.

this injection method is imho highly problematic because essentially medical tools and procedures are used to destroy life. not good, no matter how humane or painless it actually is. guns and blades otoh are designed to kill, so these are the tools of choice.



posted on Dec, 10 2009 @ 03:36 PM
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Well if you want the most cruel punishment...

Force them to read all the closet sadists on ATS write about their own favorite fantasies of killing someone violently and cruelly because 'that's ok when the person is a bad person!'

By the time they finish reading about how all these 'good' and 'decent' law abiding citizens want to do everything under the sun one could imagine to indulge their own blood lust the condemned will kill himself...

Not out of fear of any or all that stuff will be done, but out of a genuine and deep desire to get off of a planet filled with the worst and most mundane hypocrites imagined.

As usual in most of these posts I fail to see the destinction between the mentality of the condemned and those condemning.

Same sick twisted love of violence, the only difference is seeking permission and an 'official' victim for it.



posted on Dec, 10 2009 @ 04:29 PM
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I don't really think the method of execution is that important. You know, I don't believe in torture, so I think that hanging, firing squad, lethal injection, gas chamber, electric chair, are all humane ways of execution.

A single dose of lethal drug is ok, as long as it doesn't cause pain before instant death. There are drugs that cause incredible pain. There is a drug that makes the victim feel like they are on fire. I wouldn't want to see a lethal injection where the prisoner was injected with some terrible pain inducing drug that caused him to die by screaming to death for 8 hours.

Then the family of the victims would have on their conscience that they watched a man get tortured to death. Which honestly would probably leave a stain on their souls.



posted on Dec, 10 2009 @ 07:12 PM
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reply to post by above
 


Way to go. You just made a whole bunch of baseless assumptions. Not everyone who is against the death penalty is a godloving hippie who cares about a murdering criminal. I'm an agnostic, conservative business executive who believes murderers deserve to die. I am also against the death penalty. Nice try with the assumptions though.

One thing none of you pro death penalty people will address is the fact that innocent people have been and will always be occasionally found guilty and put to death by the state. That is murder. There is no way around this fact. No matter how good our justice system is there will always be mistakes made. For this reason I could never be for the death penalty until the day when all human beings are infallible.

By supporting the death penalty you are supporting the occasional murder of an innocent person by the state. Again, there is no way around that. It happens and will continue to happen as long as there is a death penalty. How can you possibly justify that?



posted on Dec, 10 2009 @ 09:42 PM
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Originally posted by above

Damn you godloving hippies.


HAHAHAHA thanks for the good chuckle mate. A very quick peruse of my profile would confirm that I, in fact, can't STAND religion.


I would like to see how your opinion changes after someone like the man discussed in the op decides to pay a friendly visit to your sister or mother?


It wouldn't for two reasons: 1. I am absolutely against the death penalty and 2. Australia abolished the death penalty decades ago so I wouldn't have to worry anyway



I have empathy, i FEEL for the victim, i FEEL for his family. You feel sorry for the criminal.


Wrong, wrong, wrong. Put your money where your mouth is and quote where I said that AT ALL. I guarantee you cannot because you are now officially MAKING THINGS UP.

How revolting of you to suggest I don't have sympathy for the family or that I feel bad for the criminal. He deserves punishment, just not by method of execution - nobody does.


As they say, people have trouble understanding something until it something literally demonstrates what he means by shoving it unmercifully where the sun does not shine.


Please explain how executing a criminal actually proves anything to them or teaches them anything? I've got news for you THEY ARE DEAD, kaput, gone - they can't learn the lesson because they are DEAD. Have you ever tried teaching a DEAD PERSON anything? I would bet you didn't get too much of a response eh.....


An eye for an eye when someone acts on purpose is the only just way to handle things. Killing someone in an accident by eg. driving over is a totally other business, severe, yes because you have taken a life but grounds for execution or life in prison? no.


Please explain how accidentally killing someone by driving over them has ANY relevence to the topic at hand. IT DOES NOT.

 



Originally posted by blueorder

Cut out the rest of your ridiculous attempts at smart arsery- read above, he specifically called the execution of a murderer, murder- so "per se", it is the act of execution in his eyes


It's a pity you had to search my profile and quote those from another thread altogether eh. Hypocrite.

[edit on 10/12/2009 by Kryties]



posted on Dec, 11 2009 @ 05:46 AM
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reply to post by Kryties
 


You are witnessing the US gradually entering unfortunate part of its history . Apart of this is the savagery I already mentioned along with support for the use of torture all of which including preventive detention will be eventually used on the local population . Such savagely is tragic because New Zealand needs to adopt the US system of degrees of murder or what ever the official name is . But alas that is another topic .



posted on Dec, 11 2009 @ 07:36 AM
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Originally posted by Bunken DrumAh yes, "smart arsery" - I'm not suprised to see a debater of your calibre resort to attempting to deride intellectual arguments which form an inescapable chain of logic refuting you: its a pattern I'm seeing in your posts all over.
You may well attempt to fall back on the position that your posts in this thread, quoting text from this thread, were actually inspired by stuff written elsewhere, which you did not quote until the fallacy of your position was pointed out, however, everyone else reading this knows that you are busted. For what? For the exact opposite of that which you accused me of, ie dumb arsery.


just to highlight again, your point was wrong, his point was specifically about execution "per se", and once again, refer his "murdering the murderer" comment- I mean really, you can stick your head in the forum sand and try to waffle, but I called you on your point and proved it was wrong

Like I say, that consultation was free



posted on Dec, 11 2009 @ 10:16 AM
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reply to post by blueorder
 
You are delusional or lying. You have proved nothing. What has been shown is that you ignored what was written to put your own slant on it so that you could argue against that slant, ie a strawman argument. Having been caught out, you then proceeded to make up an excuse as to what you were really arguing against, ie something unquoted, written elsewhere. Personally I think that was a lie also, but at best it was OT to this thread & poor debating.
I fully realise you cannot concede a point gracefully &, having observed your style elsewhere, realise that you will continue to repeat yourself ad nauseam, in the puerile belief that he who has the last word wins. By all means, have it. You cannot erase what has gone before.
As for the charges for a lesson in rhetoric, I'll extract it in kind from your metaphorical hide anon...



posted on Dec, 11 2009 @ 10:18 AM
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I accept your compliment in the manner I intend it



posted on Dec, 12 2009 @ 06:42 AM
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Originally posted by Kryties
...
Please explain how executing a criminal actually proves anything to them or teaches them anything? I've got news for you THEY ARE DEAD...


you are probably over-emphasizing that point and that's imho where the accusations of being more concerned with the perpetrator than anyone else come from.

a conviction is not necessarily a moral statement. if someone is dangerous enough to warrant permanent removal from society, then what do you think is more humane? locking them up until they die or killing them? i have a hunch that much if not most of the opposition against the death penalty isn't at all related to anxieties over the fate of convicted criminals, but rather a desire to avoid the topic altogether.

cases of innocently convicted people should be viewed as a reason to keep the system in check and don't have much to do with punishment itself. after all, locking an innocent person up for life can't be ruled out, either.

[edit on 2009.12.12 by Long Lance]



posted on Dec, 12 2009 @ 09:43 AM
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While this case is especially horrible, I still do not support the death penalty. It is just revenge, plain and simple. We should focus on forgiveness and not revenge.

I know I'm not in large company here though.



posted on Dec, 12 2009 @ 09:46 AM
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Originally posted by Bosko


One thing none of you pro death penalty people will address is the fact that innocent people have been and will always be occasionally found guilty and put to death by the state. That is murder.


And THAT is why the death penalty is NOT about the victims. it's about having a socially safe outlet for bloodlust.



posted on Dec, 12 2009 @ 09:56 AM
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Death is death. Im from Australia and the death sentence is a foreign and quite weird concept to me, however killing someone after the crime is still quite silly, considering that it all depends on the money, lawyers, evidence and etc... If this guy had better lawyers, money and better talk to the judge he could of been free, minor sentence or etc..

To me it seems the Death sentence is used to silence an individual... Maybe he could of wrote some books, or shed some light about it? While there are huge factors such as the above, and also the fact that despite he obviously was guilty, but he could of benefited someone by research into the reasons he killed the poor girl. Killing him is to me, wiping clean the evidence, or information.

Also what if this guy was framed? (Which I do not even think he was, but what if?). I know this is a hard subject to converse about, but what ifs, and if so's abound my mind.



posted on Dec, 12 2009 @ 11:51 AM
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Originally posted by Aoxoa
Death is death. Im from Australia and the death sentence is a foreign and quite weird concept to me, however killing someone after the crime is still quite silly, considering that it all depends on the money, lawyers, evidence and etc... If this guy had better lawyers, money and better talk to the judge he could of been free, minor sentence or etc..

To me it seems the Death sentence is used to silence an individual... Maybe he could of wrote some books, or shed some light about it? While there are huge factors such as the above, and also the fact that despite he obviously was guilty, but he could of benefited someone by research into the reasons he killed the poor girl. Killing him is to me, wiping clean the evidence, or information.

Also what if this guy was framed? (Which I do not even think he was, but what if?). I know this is a hard subject to converse about, but what ifs, and if so's abound my mind.


Who cares WHY the evil man killed her? He is evil, and men like that will kill again. Motives into why someone kills someone for thrills is not important research. Getting rid of that someone to keep him from hunting down more law abiding citizens is the most important goal.



posted on Dec, 12 2009 @ 06:14 PM
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Originally posted by Bosko
By supporting the death penalty you are supporting the occasional murder of an innocent person by the state. Again, there is no way around that. It happens and will continue to happen as long as there is a death penalty. How can you possibly justify that?


I don't think anyone can argue that point. For the most part high profile criminals also wear a target within the prison system itself. So what happens when joe innocent is picked off by the other inmates ? No matter what system of justice is imposed there will be innocent casualties.

What do you then propose we do? Do we continue to stuff more prisoners into a system that is already bulging at the seams and underfunded? I honestly believe that the majority of death penalty cases are scrutinized more than non death penalty cases. I cannot prove this but the appeals process seems to offer some perspective here. No its not infallible but the options list is short. I am certainly not in favor of rehabilitating repeat offenders, by their repeated actions alone they deserve death in cases of murder.

brill



posted on Dec, 12 2009 @ 07:20 PM
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A little late to the party but......

Its intereting to see his lawyer complain about the fact that it took 8 attempts to start an IV. In a sick dehydrated child we sometimes take more than that to establish vascular access and we do not hear any complaints that thats cruel :shk:

The one drug method did and should work assuming a good IV AND a massive overdose that gets the job done. With this you get respiatory standstill AND massive hypo tension (decreased BP) and that will do the job nicely.

Ive seen that the big issue has been getting the drugs in to the perp.

I have a simple solution that is almost fool proof. An Inter-osseous cathter. AN IO is a huge needed that is punched into a bone (Tibia etc) and into the bone marrow. Almost anything can be infused there. In pediatrics its a last resort way of getting vascular access (Im pretty good at it but there are some kids that a regular IV becomes impossible)

We use the EZ IO which is a drill. www.vidacare.com... There is a cool video on how it works.

That would ensure we can kill these animals in a timely fashion




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