Originally posted by oliveoil
reply to post by LeoVirgo
Hi Leo Virgo
Sense you accept that God's 'story' is all left in the Bible, as is....you wouldn't be able to see anything outside of that
No I cant see anything outside of that.However I do see God in all things,And the Bible bares witness to these things which I see.
God created Thee's story before man ever even walked the Earth. All things were made with life in ways that we could find Thee and know
True but without reading and studying the Scriptures one can not know him, unless he is righteous and never heard.
What is happening now, today, is very similar to what happened when Jesus spoke against many others back then. There is wisdom in the books, in
all of the books, but to know the nature of God one has to seek a personal relation.
Anyone can have a personal relationship with God in there own mindset. However, The knowledge you seek of him can only be found in the Bible.
Man is not supposed to take another man's word for it....we are to seek Thee, we are to knock. The path of understanding takes a lifetime,
maybe many lifetimes.
The Bible is not just another mans word.Its 100% grade a Gods word. /If An average mans life span is not enough time to find him, how much more time
do you need?.
For God to leave his nature all in a book, laid out all black and white, would defeat the purpose that we were made for, which is a true
humbled personal path with Thee.
Please expand on this for me.
I dont doubt that many religious fold can find wisdom's, but there is knowledge that will blind the true nature of what God is, such as blood
sacrifices and the idea that God wanted man to kill other men.
Expand on this too
If one is discerning what is a Earthly nature between Spiritual nature, then one can see that these actions in the OT was of a Earthly mind,
therefor, ways of men.
I said this before,
Man is of spirit and of flesh. He has a soul and a body.And the OT was indeed of a spiritual nature.
We have to be in tune with our deepest self first
Correction, The only way man can truly understand himself is by FIRST understanding God.- Try it you'll be amazed how much you though you knew.
Why did they seek Jesus's death?
Jesus saw they would want him dead for the things he taught,
Sorry for the delayed reply, I must do my jogging.
Im going to be lazy and just quote this entire discussion, its late but I do wish to respond for I have enjoyed our convo.
I just have to disagree due to experience, one can know God without a book. Before there was writing, I believe that man did have intuition of a
'higher self'. Most likely through the invisible forces of energy and nature, man saw that the blue print of the world was full of mysteries, and
had a foundation of a 'force' that tied all things together. This was the beginning of man seeking God.
Today, there are people that dont have the Bible, but yet, their inner being shines brighter then the sun. God is so great that all the tools we
needed to seek Thee were here before man walked here. I already made this my claim earlier, but stating it again.
If we are to not clinge to man made materials, why would God depend on man needed a book, a material that could be destroyed? The reason that we can
find some of the nature of God within the Bible is because some of the stories do display a 'holy nature', such as men that did love their
neighbors, did try to walk a rightous path, did try to love others as themselves. But most are fooled, for they think that the entire Bible displays a
Holy nature, it simply does not. It is a shame on what is 'divine'.
There is a difference in a spiritual man and a carnal man. They have two different natures. Both are capable of both natures, but the choice and
growth of one man over the other is more spiritual, due to that mans understandings. This is just one reason that God doesnt leave us all the answers
in our lap, would you give your gems to someone that would throw them away finding them worthless? It would be like God given his treasures to foolish
men that did not know its worth. This is why the scriptures are called the milk, for the food is 'life', a true living word within us that the Holy
Spirit brings us....leading to understandings about Gods true nature. This is why Jesus spoke in parables. This is why I must be cautious with what I
share with others, for I dont want to throw a treasure at someone that would turn it and twist it to be something it is not. What is precious should
be carefully kept and used wisely. We are talking about the mysteries of heaven and God...this isnt something to 'give' away. God made sure the
'way' involves a must for a personal path with Thee...not a broad path that many can follow that would twist and turn the worth of the knowledge.
This is why spirituality is of God, religion is of the Earth.
The OT is full of reactions from 'God' that are very carnal reactions, as man would react. This needs discernment. God is consistent. One must
compare the nature of Jesus to the nature of the OT God and stop making excuses for the two to fit together, the dont fit. Its like water and oil. To
make excuses for this is limiting God's true nature greatly. It blinds people from seeing what sits right below their nose. If they are not seeking,
they wont discern, they will only accept. You can pull any excuse out of the hat for the actions of God in the OT...and I will tell you, this is not
the nature of God. God does not expect men to kill other men nor had God used anger or wrath to keep man on the right track. Man often used God for
explaining many actions and behaviors back then, even thunderstorms and droughts were excuses to use 'God is mad' or 'Man has sinned'. One must be
careful and dig deep into why man did what they did, is there any greed there to be seen, any pride there to be seen....if there is, God was not
The idea that bloodshed saves us from sins is the biggest thing today that is holding man kind back from his spiritual nature. By believing killing
free's us and that this is Gods path he made for our salvation....leads one away from God....not closer to Thee.
When I saw there was a spiritual nature in the OT, I am not talking about its entirety. The understanding of an 'eye for an eye' is a karmic law.
This is what bounds the spiritual self to the physical world. If you kill or harm another in this life, you will and must experience the other side of
the scenario in another life (or later on in that life even if lucky). This understanding of this spiritual cause and effect was known by certain
cultures but became misused by many also. Man began to make 'scapegoats' through animal sacrifices....representing and eye for an eye physically. Do
wrong in your life, a life must be given then, to the Lord, through a killing of a life. The spiritual law should of not been represented that way
through physical practices. All of those people that killed animals for sins....have faced their fate of knowing in the after life that this was
wrong...and they will or already have, relearned, and will reap what they sow or already by now have reaped what they sown. They actually increased
must karma in the OT.
They sought to kill Jesus because he wasnt what they expected. I believe that he was very much against them killing for their sins and was teaching
them that reaping what you sow will be and wont go away, hence, he tells us, pick up your cross and follow me (in my ways). We have turned Jesus into
a idol of God. God is nameless, exceeds all boundaries of Earthly ways, even our words and language.
Jesus came and taught against their ways, more or less told them....you are wrong. If one is not open minded, they too today are gong to tell many
that bring wisdom to them....they are wrong. It not an easy road to stand against the masses, knowing it could mean the loss of your life of flesh.
But when your life of flesh means nothing, except being a tool to show others the love and nature of God...then that person could do such works.
Imagine a man coming to tell the Jews that their blood sacrifices and Earthly practices were not Spiritual. Imagine the rejection and anger they had
for him trying to take away what has comforted them for years and years.
I tell you though, it will happen again, man is not ready for they are still very much attached to Earthly ways.
This is why only few find the way, the answers are not in plain site for the simple carnal man to find and ruin with their foolishness.
I tell you truly, if you were born again onto this sphere, after all things of man were washed away...and only life remained in its form of
nature....you could find God. Just ask Thee....where would I find you if I didnt have this book....you will get an answer....God thought way ahead on
this one...the tools for finding Thee has always been here.
Cut a tree...I am there....lift a rock...you will find me.
Discernment of Earthly nature and Spiritual nature is a must. Do you really think God would make a logical reasoning man and be counting on that man
to depend on a book passed down between many many hands? And then blame the ones that didnt except it as 'Gods word'? That would be like shoving
mans logical and reasoning's in his own face. Its just not so.
Gods word is in life, the things that cant rust nor be destroyed. It can never be tainted, distorted, or twisted. Why do you think so many parables
use a form of 'life' in them. Life shows us patterns, cycles, repetitiveness, and process. Our souls journey works much the same way, under these
same 'laws'. There is a science, believe it or not, to the way God works and makes our path.
[edit on 12-12-2009 by LeoVirgo]