Cops Taze Unarmed Naked Man to Death for "Walking Toward Them'

Originally posted by Gargamel
The use of a taser is an alternative to using a firearm. At least that was what it's original purpose was. To those who are asking what should the officer have done to subdue the naked guy, I ask you this: 20 years ago when officers only had a pistol to use what would they have done to subdue a man in this situation? Would they have shot him? I don't think so. They would have gotten thier hands dirty and physically have subdued the man. They would have had training to do just that. I'm pretty sure that training still exists and would hope that the LEO's are still taking it. To me the taser has made these officers very lazy and unfortunatly people are dying due to said laziness.

Ahh but that was then, now we live in a world full of remote control nancy boys, who need to use toys to feel like men.

But at least one thing should be noted from this, and other cases like this - If you have a loved one in danger from themselves, DO NOT CALL THE POLICE.

Call friends, or relatives. People who will not try and kill the ones you love and wite it off as a casualty and justify it because "What else should we do?" is a justified excuse today.

God damned xbox cops.

it used to be a cop had to be over sixfoot at one time,
maybe it was me but they all was big back 20 years ago, im 6.2.
now if they had stuck to the size height thing they could of restrained him.
id sooner have a broken rib than be dead . but i guess in the U.S you woulda get a load of lawyers involved to get moneyfor the injurys, so tazers are a natural progression .if they are sanctioned by gov then you are covered . society caused all the grief steming with lawsuits back in the 60s an 70s . Greedy lawyers are to blame for a lot of the worlds ills

Originally posted by Conspiracy Theorist
Why should they risk injury to themselves attempting to subdue and restrain someone who has already shown themselves to be unable or unwilling to follow instructions.

Because this is the United States of America and the man was not an evident threat to the officers or an immediate threat to himself or anyone else. He was naked and sick. There is a reason we do not cut hands off or execute people on whims here either.

Oh please.

the man was not an evident threat to the officers or an immediate threat to himself or anyone else

Naked on the side of a road during a psychotic episode is not an evident threat. Easily could have stepped into traffic and hurt himself or others trying to avoid hitting him.

He was naked and sick. There is a reason we do not cut hands off or execute people on whims here either.

Again why call police then? Seems to me that a man as you describe needs a doctor. Try requesting an ambulance.


People. The officers where onscene for LESS THAN A MINUTE when a man, described by his own wife as being in the midst of a psychotic episode, began advancing towards them unarmed. After repeatedly ignoring the officers command to stop and get on the ground, the officer drew his taser and fired on the subject. Causing him to fall to the ground. Instead of staying on the ground the subject tried to get up resulting in the officer providing him with another jolt.

I really do not see a problem with the above situation.

CT

Originally posted by Conspiracy Theorist
Oh please.

Naked on the side of a road during a psychotic episode is not an evident threat. Easily could have stepped into traffic and hurt himself or others trying to avoid hitting him.

He could have been and done lots of things. He was not and did not.

Again why call police then? Seems to me that a man as you describe needs a doctor. Try requesting an ambulance.

Yeah, his stupid wife. Apparently she wanted him arrested instead of helped?
I am not sure what planet you read this story on.

He could have been and done lots of things

Tragic result aside:

You are right. He could have been and done lots of things, but thanks to the intervention of the officers, he wasnt and didnt.

It is tragic that this man died. But the end result doesnt make the officers actions wrong.

20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Yeah, his stupid wife. Apparently she wanted him arrested instead of helped?
I am not sure what planet you read this story on.

You are the one harping on about the poor "sick" man. I merely made the observation that sick people are better off being cared for by medical professionals.

CT

reply to post by Demoncreeper

Guy, I used to think that, I used to give the LEOs the benefit of the doubt. But then I had multiple encounters with them, and now I can honestly say, that I have had a lot of experience with cops, and I have NEVER met an honest one. A good person. Much like lawyers and politicians. I know, I know, there is an exception to every rule, but I have never met them. I wish it were different. But now I consider it idiotic to call cop. I may buy a .45 and start to Open Carry, just out of selfpreservation. If this Copenhagen Treaty gets signed, along with Piglosis' Small Arms already signed, I'd have to just hide it somewhere. I may not. We'll see. But you prove my contention that the good people are either run out, or leave on their own. Just like the Chosen are exiting the churches now. The environment, the social atmosphere in the police forces is now corrupt. Good people do not fit in. Like Andie Griffith doesn't fit with a drug cartel. Same for the church; Christians no longer belong there. And it all fits in together; the restraining influence of the Holy Spirit is gone from the Earth, IMHO. Evangelicals have always assumed that meant a rapture. I guess it does not.

Tasers were never intended to be used by police as an alternative to lethal force. They are a tool used as an alternative to other forms of non-lethal force such as pepper spray, nights sticks, flap-jacks, and other tools that law enforcement has used over the years for non-lethal applications.
No police officer is going to reach for his taser when faced with a life threatening situation. That's what the .40 S&W is for. There is a new tool called an LED incapacitator that will offer police a safer alternative to the taser.

Originally posted by Tayesin
I see some people have forgotten something very important. What is that thing?

Police are trained in hand to hand combat, in how to take down another human. It only takes one officer to do the job right, two if the person is hard to bring down.

Remember this: They are capable due to their training. What we see today is police being AFRAID and opting immediately for the Tazer. Gutless people.

So then why do so many of you think it is okay, perfectly good for the police to Tazer anyone? You wold say the opposite if it was you or your loved one being Tazed.

Whoa there, dude.
Why preach the hate. These guys have big ones for even wearing the uniform as they are instantly hated/resented by 1/3 of the population.

I was tazed. I was shot in the upper body, one diode or watever went in below my left collarbone, and one at the base of my sternum.

It rendered me useless. Trust me when I say, cops' "hand to hand" is extremely limited to a small amount of effective and brutal techniques. I'd much rather be tazed. I'm way more thankfull that I wasn't shot. I didn't have any bruising, broken bones or anything. The next day I felt like I ran a marathon, but was no worse for the wear. They could have easily used the "lethel" option instead.

It was sad the dude died. No doubt. But if he hadn't died, we wouldn't even be on this thread. We wouldn't even know. The cops didn't kill him, the tazer did.

Originally posted by Gregarious
reply to post by Demoncreeper

 

Guy, I used to think that, I used to give the LEOs the benefit of the doubt. But then I had multiple encounters with them, and now I can honestly say, that I have had a lot of experience with cops, and I have NEVER met an honest one. A good person. Much like lawyers and politicians. I know, I know, there is an exception to every rule, but I have never met them. I wish it were different. But now I consider it idiotic to call cop. I may buy a .45 and start to Open Carry, just out of selfpreservation. If this Copenhagen Treaty gets signed, along with Piglosis' Small Arms already signed, I'd have to just hide it somewhere. I may not. We'll see. But you prove my contention that the good people are either run out, or leave on their own. Just like the Chosen are exiting the churches now. The environment, the social atmosphere in the police forces is now corrupt. Good people do not fit in. Like Andie Griffith doesn't fit with a drug cartel. Same for the church; Christians no longer belong there. And it all fits in together; the restraining influence of the Holy Spirit is gone from the Earth, IMHO. Evangelicals have always assumed that meant a rapture. I guess it does not.

Dude, you've obviously NOT had much experience with them, or you are a criminal. OR you live in the United States.

I've spent a lot of time with cops. In trouble and not. Hell (because I can't use the "eff word) dude, there are a lot of good ones.

[edit on 7-12-2009 by bad man incorporated]

reply to post by bad man incorporated


OR, this was a classic example of:

cop1: Theres a naked guy walking toward me!

cop2: TASE that mother##!!

Yeah people don't kill people, guns do, right?

[edit on 7-12-2009 by Wookiep]

Originally posted by Wookiep
reply to post by bad man incorporated

 

OR, this was a classic example of:

cop1: Theres a naked guy walking toward me!

cop2: TASE that mother##!!

Yeah people don't kill people, guns do, right?

[edit on 7-12-2009 by Wookiep]

This wasn't a gun, dude.
Whoa, you were there?
Doubt it.

I should have been shot for my behaviour. I would not contest the shot, if I was and lived. I deserved it. I injured 2 cops, before they finally decided to taze me. Even then, it seemed like a big decision. But it worked, they did everything to NOT kill me. I accept that the tazer can be deadly, but is used so to not kill.

So yeah, in this case the taser killed him.



[edit on 7-12-2009 by bad man incorporated]

reply to post by bad man incorporated


I wasn't there, I confess, were you? I did however, read the article in the OP. It's pretty clear to me. Oh I guess the cops had a good reason to taser him twice in the chest, afterall he COULD have had a gun or another TASER in his BUTT! Otherwise, perhaps they should have exersised their "training", took the guy down and cuffed him.

[edit on 7-12-2009 by Wookiep]

To everyone suggesting going hand to hand, please remember that officer has a loaded firearm strapped to his waist.

Going hand to hand while armed with a firearm is the absolute last resort. Its too easy for the subject to get hold of it.

CT

[edit on 7/12/2009 by Conspiracy Theorist]

reply to post by bad man incorporated

It was sad the dude died. No doubt. But if he hadn't died, we wouldn't even be on this thread. We wouldn't even know. The cops didn't kill him, the tazer did.

LoL, tasers dont kill people, people kill people
I just had to use that old cliche, with a little twist of course but it is the truth.
Sure, the chances of dying by a taser jolt are very, very low and there's no doubt that the cops had no idea it would kill him, I dont think anyone is arguing that, at least im not.
However, one has to look at the NY cops that tased the man on the 2 foot wide ledge, 10 feet off the ground.
Where in the hell did they think he was going to fall after being hit?
Did they not think a 10 foot fall on to concrete would hurt this man?
Sure they knew it and they damn well should be arrested for at least manslaughter.

Anyway im saying that I dont believe all of them necessary, there were two cops there with the guy on the highway, they couldve taken the time to try and come up with some way to take him down or give him a bit more time for the meds to take effect.
My point is that cops seem to be taking on a "shoot first, ask questions later" mentality and it isnt isolated events either, its all across the Nation (and beyond)
I hate to keep harping on the same examples over and over but jeez come on, 10 year old kids, 80 year old women (for refusing to sign a citation)
Not signing a ticket means nothing, its not against the law and youre still obligated to show up for court and cops know this.

Whats happening is that these cops are so arrogant, so full of themselves that they just cant handle someone defiying their orders, at least in the old womans example anyway.
Hes thinking, how DARE you defy my ultimate authority, ill show you "ZZZZZZZZZZZT" take that you wrinkled old bitch.

What, you wont take a shower? your mom lacks parenting skills?
Well, youre pretty big for 10 years old, you actually come up to my chest and you may bruise my shin if you kicked it... ZZZZZZZZZZZZZT, take that you rebellious little brat.

Originally posted by Conspiracy Theorist
To everyone suggesting going hand to hand, please remember that officer has a loaded firearm strapped to his waist.

Going hand to while armed with a firearm is the absolute last resort. Its too easy for the subject to get hold of it.

CT

That is true, but if an officer doesn't have sufficient training to protect his/her weapon then they don't belong in the business. Again, it's a dangerous business, but they *know* that going into it.

reply to post by bad man incorporated


Sure beats having your bones all busted up by protracting steel bars, eh?

Originally posted by Wookiep
That is true, but if an officer doesn't have sufficient training to protect his/her weapon then they don't belong in the business. Again, it's a dangerous business, but they *know* that going into it.

So if you agree that going hand to hand is a last resort due to the firearm where is the argument?

The officer used the resources available to him at the time so it didnt have to escalate to a physical takedown.

Again I reiterate, it is an absolute tragedy that the man died as a result of being tased, but that doesnt make the officers actions wrong. He should be accountable for his actions, but as the situation appeared to him at the time.

CT

Originally posted by Wookiep
reply to post by bad man incorporated

 

I wasn't there, I confess, were you? I did however, read the article in the OP. It's pretty clear to me. Oh I guess the cops had a good reason to taser him twice in the chest, afterall he COULD have had a gun or another TASER in his BUTT! Otherwise, perhaps they should have exersised their "training", took the guy down and cuffed him.

[edit on 7-12-2009 by Wookiep]

I was in my own tazing situation, but apparently your reading is a bit limited.
I'm sure with a gun strapped to your waist, you would have opted to go hand to hand with a lunatic in fit? What should I protect? My gun or my head? Can't do both. .. ..

Without knowing what the dude is capable of, knowing he was a lunatic and I can stop him from comin at me without killing him, I would have tazed his ass too. Especially if I was told the tazer wasn't deadly. Oh yeah. It isn't for most people.

[edit on 7-12-2009 by bad man incorporated]

Originally posted by 2compelled
reply to post by bad man incorporated

 

Sure beats having your bones all busted up by protracting steel bars, eh?

Indeed it does. Though, unfortuneatly not for this guy.