THE LORD Jesus Christ vs. the MAYANS! Whose side are you on?

The mayans vs. Jesus, huh???

I think the mayans would hang jesus out to dry...
PUN INTENDED...

Im not about to fully subscribe to either of the predictions put forth by the mayans or jesus. but if i *had* to choose, i would choose to believe the mayans. why? because we KNOW for a fact that they existed. we do NOT know as a real provable fact that jesus existed. and no, the bible is not proof of his existence. sorry.

however, i have a feeling that you're going to disregard any post that does not agree with your point. i've seen some great posts from people in this thread giving you reasons as to why they believe in the mayans more, and you dont even bother to acknowledge those posts. thats not a very effective way to gather information. and not an effective way to come to an educated well thought out conclusion. a person who TRULY wants to know the truth will look at all sources available, do the research, and THEN come to a conclusion. you OT, have failed to do this, as you seem to ONLY take the word of the bible when making your conclusions. you do not have all the necessary information to conclude anything in regards to this topic. so not only do i disagree with you, i think you are grossly misinformed and narrow minded. you clearly do not have a "quest for the truth" you have a "quest for those who agree with you". and whenever someone says they believe the mayans more you want proof as to why...well, i propose a question to you! can you provide evidence that is not taken from the bible or other forms of heresay that jesus is more correct in his prediction? i mean actual hardcore measurable proof that his predictions are more accurate, not bible quotes.

Day after day, time after time the same bovine excrement. NOT for the last time, I'm sure, the Mayans never made any predictions! Why isn't this drivel in the Religions forum? Ridiculous tripe.

Hi OT

I might ramble a little bit so just kick me if I do, okay. As you know I am not a christian, although I do have a solid understanding of the Belief-System and its derivatives.

Given that we know little about the Mayan Calendar other than its end date pointing to the conclusion of a "sun" or age, then we might think it refers to "the end of what we know".

Given too the ways of humanity, and its current state I would think that things would come to a climax in the next few years anyway. So the Mayans may well have predicted this phase, or not.

Now the words of Jesus left to us in the Bible.. any version.. were written down quite a time after his alleged death, with the exception I think of the Book of Thomas.. which was not included in the forging of the Bible at the Council of Nicea in AD300 and something, as you know my friend.

Also, there are over 4,000 mistranslations that give us the modern version of the Bible.... as claimed to me by my mentor, an old woman with around 32 letters after her name who has done a lot of "alternative" research over the years including deciphering the Sumerian Tablets for the British Museum at the same time as Zecharia Sitchin did. Hence I hold a good deal of respect for her work.

And, while christians do believe all the work in translations were guided by God, we must also expect that some of it was done purely for the power and kudos provided to men like Constantine. In other words, God gave us Free Will, yet so many refuse to see we freely used it for personal gain as humans often do.

Even then, I have trouble with some quotes attributed to the man "Jeshua" and do no thtink at all that he Believed himself to be the one and only Son of God.... otherwise why would he have been quoted as saying.....

The Kingdom is inside of you, and it is outside of you. When you come to know yourselves, then you will become known. And you will realize that it is you who are the sons of the living father.

Thomas in "Dialogue of the Saviour", The Nag Hammadi Library

We should be able to understand from that quote that he is speaking about Gnosis. The finding of the way from within, the knowing from our own souls as portions of God.

Now to answer your question in the OP. I tend towards the Mayan thought of the world as we know it coming to a climax/fruition. I see it as a naturally occuring series of events, some earthly and some human made that provides the change. And I think so because of visions I had ten or so years ago about that year all the new-agers are so excited about these days.

Off Topic Here: OT, please do not let the naysayers get under your skin. Thay attack because they have no great understanding or compassion for others who do not think as they do. This my friend is natural, and so I anticipate reading your highest words in the face of their onslaught.

Be well Old Thinker

I tend to think the Mayans were a tad bit creepy. Especially after seeing the movie, "aPoCaLyPtO." Lol

Personally, I'm not into this whole solstice thing. I've read quite a bit about it and from a biblical standpoint, the only thing that peaks my curiousity is the time it occurs - not the day.

My husband swears my brain retains worthless pieces of information, like when we play along with the "Cash Cab" (yeah we're easily entertained) and I smoke him.

Anyways..... what I find interesting about the time the event is to occur (11:11 a.m).. lines up with instances of resurrection.

Revelation 11:11 - "And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them."

Also, John 11:11 - has Jesus going to "wake up Lazarus."

The end? No. Possibility of a spiritual awakening en masse? Maybe.

Is it possible? The Bible teaches that with Yahveh all things are possible. Is it probable? For a fact, a day will come when he pours his Spirit out on all flesh. Until then it's each persons choice to either seek him out or put him off.

But could they be tied together? I'm not feeling it.

Team Jesus for me.





[edit on 7-12-2009 by Myrtales Instinct]

I'd bet on the Mayans... unlike Jesus, they DID NOT say they would be back to save mankind.

The Mayans left physical proof they compiled over the course of their thousand year civilization... Jesus was a flash in the pan and left nothin but a promise.

Hey OT great thread. Okay I may have a thought for ya. Christ said that back then, did he mean no one would know today? The plan might have been finished and filtered to the angles by now. The news of the Mayans and how it is so widespread would make it quiet probable that it is at least a sign.

I do tend to believe that God would definitely make the signs pretty big so all will not be lost. It might be a heads up. And I say the sooner the better. Only if everyone could be on that first trip. lol. Again nice thread.

reply to post by woodwytch


Thats PRECISELY my thought... it is not ending but repeating! Just going back to step one!

I was thinking about Ragnarok and what if, they were not predicting what well happen but what they SAW... and I think they figured out it will happen every certain time which is why they were so obsessed with watching the stars!!

reply to post by OldThinker


Im on both sides. Jesus Christ spoke about the end of the age, the Mayan calender mathematically pinpoints this date.

the quran has judgement day warnings, one of many is that the sun will rise in the west and set in the east.

[edit on 7-12-2009 by oobcube]

Why isn't "Neither" an option?

You know what is going to happen december 22, 2012?

Nothing. Their calender starts over.

That's it. No drama.

The Long Count detailing the Procession of the earth's "wobble" restarts

reply to post by OldThinker


Oooooh I love a celebrity death-match. This is as realistic as having Barney The Dinosaur versus Obama's mother!

Or maybe He-Man Vs. Skeletor...
Or maybe Sludge Vs. Starscream...
The list could go on.

Old Thinker you're asking us to a pit a lavish fairy tale against against an urban myth. Seriously, get a grip, and go be a fundie somewhere else.

The Para.

Originally posted by FiatLux
reply to post by OldThinker

 

OT, I have a question for you.

You stated earlier that you have no ego. I have to differ with you on that. What causes you to think that you are alway right in this discussion and they are always wrong?

Think about that for a moment.

Edit to add:

As for who I am with in this subject.....I am with the"ONE".



[edit on 6-12-2009 by FiatLux]

I certainly am not always right....

Jesus always is....

Tell NEO I said hi

Originally posted by devilishlyangelic23
Im not about to fully subscribe to either of the predictions put forth by the mayans or jesus. but if i *had* to choose, i would choose to believe the mayans. why? because we KNOW for a fact that they existed. we do NOT know as a real provable fact that jesus existed. and no, the bible is not proof of his existence. sorry.

however, i have a feeling that you're going to disregard any post that does not agree with your point. i've seen some great posts from people in this thread giving you reasons as to why they believe in the mayans more, and you dont even bother to acknowledge those posts. thats not a very effective way to gather information. and not an effective way to come to an educated well thought out conclusion. a person who TRULY wants to know the truth will look at all sources available, do the research, and THEN come to a conclusion. you OT, have failed to do this, as you seem to ONLY take the word of the bible when making your conclusions. you do not have all the necessary information to conclude anything in regards to this topic. so not only do i disagree with you, i think you are grossly misinformed and narrow minded. you clearly do not have a "quest for the truth" you have a "quest for those who agree with you". and whenever someone says they believe the mayans more you want proof as to why...well, i propose a question to you! can you provide evidence that is not taken from the bible or other forms of heresay that jesus is more correct in his prediction? i mean actual hardcore measurable proof that his predictions are more accurate, not bible quotes.

-please tell me you're not holding your breath

OT's threads are all about baiting non christians, that is all.

I like how he used the word discussion in his OP- hilarious

How about some other questions. How about, why do christians always have to see the world in black and white ? Why do they always expect people to take sides either for them or agaist them ? Why do they need other people to enter their own fantasies ? Why can't they understand that most people have no interest in their personal wars on others beliefs ? Why should we have to tag along with you, and choose between the followers of a 2000 year old book, (that was rewritten, re-interpreted, and stolen from the mythology of all the great empires that preceded Christ, Abraham, and the very apparition of the jewish people by thousands of years), or wacky new age con-artists who try to get people to believe that when the digits on the mayan calendar reach 9999, the world has to blow up, instead of the digits just flipping over to 0000 ?

How about, what on earth has this post got to do with conspiracy, and what the hell is it doing on ATS ?

reply to post by OldThinker


"I certainly am not always right....

Jesus always is....

Tell NEO I said hi"

You say your not always right, but your threads give you away. It`s your demeanor towards those who disagree with you that shows your ego.

And your point about Jesus is.......? What does Jesus have to do with your ego?

If I were to say hi to the "ONE", it sure wouldn`t be NEO.

I had to chuckle a little. I find it funny that you picked my thread to respond to first thing. Now why would that be?




[edit on 7-12-2009 by FiatLux]

Originally posted by OldThinker
"No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. Matthew 24:36

NO one…not even JESUS!

Not you, not me, not even the smartest founder or posters on ATS…

BUT........................

BUT?

The Mayans say 2012?

How could they know? JC said NO ONE would know, was JC wrong? Pls enlighten OT, ok?

Are they right? the Mayans, that is?

CAVEAT! This thread is not for “trolls”…move along, move along…ok?

This discussion is for those researchers that have data/backup/info…alright?

OT simply asks, “who is right?” and/or "are you ready for the inevitable??"

Tell us where exactly you were told that the Mayans said exactly when something would happen.

Why on earth would one need to choose between Christ and the Mayans?
It is a silly premise.
Let me run Occam's Lawn Mower over this, ok?
First let me inform you that I am an interfaith minister (I accept no donations, but good will is always nice).
Now, the Mayan calendar records the Grand Procession of the local corner of the universe, it's quite impressive.
It is also remarkably accurate.
The universe isn't going to implode at 12/22/12 at 2:20 pm.
Aliens will not torpedo us on that day and time, and the feathered serpent lower case god isn't going to demand nubile virgins be sacrificed to show our devotion to his; sacred to somebody I'm sure memory.
The long count calendar is a truly impressive feat of ancient man, many astronomical observations were made in ancient times, they didn't have cable or the internet, so they had a lot of time to look towards the heavens and wonder what in creation all those sparkling little dots were.
Elder priests had undoubtedly observed the planetary alignments for generations, as they had a very large population by all estimates, and they needed to know when to plant the maize and such.
Not knowing what is going on in the heavenlies is a sure recipe for failure to plant at the proper time, or even to gauge how much food to put back to get through the non-productive months.
Now Jesus did indeed say that the time of his coming was not known even to the highest chorus of the angels, and he would return when no man watched for him.
However, he did tell his pals (ok disciples) that some would not die before his return, which sort of makes me think there are some very old recluses somewhere, or we missed the bus, cloud of glory, or the arms of the angels(I love that song), because that statement seems to indicate that the Christ returned for his faithful more than 1,800 years ago.
We are also taught that only a couple of humans have so far entered the Kingdom of Heaven, that being Enoch and Elija, the dead sleep and know no passage of time, but they have not according to current interpetations of scripture gained passage to The Place of Many Mansions, which I always thought was a little unfair to poor old Ezekiel, I mean everybody probably started calling him "Crazy Zeke" after seeing his wonderful wheel works.
Luckily he didn't get the anal probe, or he'd probably have gotten stoned (and not in a good way), but then Whitley Streiber hadn't began writing his series of books detailing his encounters with Extraterrestrial perverts.
By the way, I've found Whitley's fiction to be far more interesting than his accounts of E.T. with the booty fixation, and since he is a very talented writer, I tend to believe his reports, if he was making it up, it would be spellbinding like his other fictional works.
I'll tell you about a "vision" I had at Machu Pichu...got chummy with some locals and wound up getting the REAL dosage of ayahuasca.
Anyway, I wasn't afraid because I had the undivided attention of four old guys who had been sheparding seekers through their psychadelicatesin for forty years or so and had only lost a few...I passed the Electric Kool-aid Acid Test (I'm dating myself aren't I?) and it wasn't that earth shattering to me...lots of strange geometry and good music, plenty of waves of color washed brain tangle, but not at heavy as doing peyote with some crazy indian kids I grew up with.
We'd set four buttons out, one was for the mother, and they'd whittle on em to get the poison out (I always thought the poison was the good part, but no) and then I'd dip a button in some fermented honey, which was a buzz all by itself, and try to swallow it, but they advised me it'd help my trip to chew a little, so I did.
I've drank from a Saguro, so I never expected a cactus to do a nasty in my mouth, but you have to really want the experience to chomp on some peyote buttons, cause a little while after you swallow them ya puke, and eat some more.
Ayahuasca 5 days gone.
catch my next post

reply to post by OldThinker


The Mayan's did not predict the end of the world.

11:11 pm on 21-DEC-2009 is the end of the Mayan 26,000 year calendar. The end of that 26,000 year cycle is the beginning of the next 26,000 year cycle, not the end of creation.

11:11 pm on 21-DEC-2009 is the point when there are certain celestial alignments in relation to the plane of the ecliptic.

No destruction implied.

Actually it was to be a time of celebration, akin to Easter celebrations, as it was seen as a rebirth.

reply to post by hlesterjerome


Don`t you mean 2012, and not 2009? I see where others even say it`s 2010. I may be wrong on this, but isn`t it at 11:11 AM?