Amanda Knox (26 years in prison) and Sollecito (25 years) guilty of Meredith Kercher murder

reply to post by Bluebelle


they have the time knox phoned filomena (12:25), filomena says knox told her she had already called the police. Knox/soll infact phoned the police at 12:51 whats the FOA arguement for that? filomenas lying ?

[edit on 12-12-2009 by yeti101]

reply to post by yeti101


For me the most telling evidence can be summed up as thus:

There is no forensic evidence, such as DNA, hair, fibre, blood, skin or fingerprints of Knox, indicating that she had been in the bedroom where Meredith Kercher was murdered.

Knox's defence and supporters claimed that it would have been impossible for Knox to have engaged in an attempted sex orgy and brutally violent killing without Knox leaving some trace of herself in the bedroom.

There is no witness testimony placing Knox in the bedroom at the time of the brutal assault on Meredith Kercher.

It has also been noted that the alleged murder weapon, a 6.5 inch knife, did not match two out of three of the wounds on Kercher's body which were made by a 3 to 3.5 inch knife.

edition.cnn.com...
www.politicsdaily.com...|htmlws-main-n|dl1|link4|http%3A%2F%2Fwww.p oliticsdaily.com%2F2009%2F12%2F06%2Famanda-knox-she-devil-or-victim-of-anti-americanism%2F
business.timesonline.co.uk...
www.friendsofamanda.org...

And then when you factor in:

DNA tests indicate that Guédé had sex with Kercher before her murder, and that faeces found in the toilet were his. DNA tests showed the presence of his DNA on and inside Kercher's body and his palm print in Kercher's blood was found on one of her bed linens. His DNA was found mixed with Kercher's blood at the crime scene.

Plus his ridiculous account of how things happened

Also......


In another development the third convicted murderer of Miss Kercher, Rudy Guede, who was jailed for 30 years in October 2008, insisted Knox and Sollecito were the killers.

In a letter to his lawyer Nicodemo Gentile, Guede wrote: "They were rightly tried for the murder of a wonderful girl. Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito are assassins. During their trial I heard nothing but slander against me... as well as insults, blasphemy and insinuation.

Contradictory to what his statement had said......

(Guede) had seen her being stabbed by an unknown man. Ms Kercher had managed to whisper the initials “AF” to him, which he took to be those of the murderer and which he claimed he had written on the bedroom wall. Police have revealed no such find.

[url=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/italy/6797182/Amanda-Knox-overwhelmed-by-supporters-who-say-she-is-innocent-mother-says.html]Ama nda Knox Overwhelmed by supporters who say she is innocent..." target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow">www.telegraph.co.uk...[/ur l]

In another development the third convicted murderer of Miss Kercher, Rudy Guede, who was jailed for 30 years in October 2008, insisted Knox and Sollecito were the killers.

In a letter to his lawyer Nicodemo Gentile, Guede wrote: "They were rightly tried for the murder of a wonderful girl. Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito are assassins. During their trial I heard nothing but slander against me... as well as insults, blasphemy and insinuation.

Contradictory to what his statement had said......

(Guede) had seen her being stabbed by an unknown man. Ms Kercher had managed to whisper the initials “AF” to him, which he took to be those of the murderer and which he claimed he had written on the bedroom wall. Police have revealed no such find.

[url=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/italy/6797182/Amanda-Knox-overwhelmed-by-supporters-who-say-she-is-innocent-mother-says.html]Ama nda Knox Overwhelmed by supporters who say she is innocent...


[edit on 05/08/2009 by LiveForever8]

reply to post by LiveForever8


theres the footprint on the pillow & solls dna on the bra. Knoxs reading lamp was also found in kerchers room indicating she had been in the room.

bloody footprint matching knoxs found in filomenas room evidence knox had been in the room during or after the murder.

The knife matches one wound out of 3 that suggests more than one knife was in play here. Strangely that particular knife had been cleaned very harshly possibly with bleach. Another coincidence.


You wont have to wait long the jury has to submit their full motivation on why they found them guilty within 90 days. This will be a comprehensive report on how they saw the evidence & why the convicted them.



[edit on 12-12-2009 by yeti101]

reply to post by yeti101


That isnt addressed, which is another reason that its questionable. But it seems odd to claim that not only had a department supervisor logged a different time, but there was a CCTV frame which conflicts with where the police should have been. Just pointing it out because Id not seen it anywhere else and doesnt seem to be a site that plucks random details out from nowhere thats all.

reply to post by Bluebelle

That isnt addressed, which is another reason that its questionable

i assume you mean another reason why the FOA site is questionable?. The reason they dont address it is becuase they cant.. The same as what the defence did in court. They just didnt say anything becuase they dont have an arguement.


[edit on 12-12-2009 by yeti101]

reply to post by yeti101


Not questionable in general. Just that because that part isnt explained so it adds to it. Saying that though, the majority of the sites/blogs/articles that are extremely pro/anti amanda tend to leave details out when addressing various issues within the case. Although the friends of amanda site on the whole seems to present the actual evidence.

Who knows, maybe if it were proved that the only inconsistancy in the police arrival story was amanda's call to filomena then it wouldnt hold much weight for the prosecution.

Found an interesting timeline of events from some insanely large blog though...

Filomena recalls: "While we were trying to park the car, I received a call from Amanda who told me that she had slept at Raffaele's house and that when she had gone back to our house she had found the door open and blood in her bathroom. She told me that she'd had a shower, that she was scared and that she was going to call Raffaele Sollecito. It seemed really strange to me and I asked her to check that the house was in order and to call the police." (Note: Filomena remembers, incorrectly, receiving this call at 12:35.)

*12:34 p.m. Filomena calls Amanda. In her witness statement, Filomena says, "We spoke to each other for the third time and she told me that the window in my room was broken and that my room was in a mess. At this point I asked her to call the police and she told me that she already had." (Note: Filomena remembers this call, incorrectly, as coming in at 12:45).

What stands out here is that she remembered the call times incorrectly. If she couldnt get that right then who's to say other details didnt get confused.

reply to post by Bluebelle


her times were pretty good considering evrything. In court the defence chose not to address it which says it all really.

Knox also phoned the victims phone but told police it "rang & rang". In reality it rang 3 times. Only giving your missing housemate 3 rings to answer? thats not too generous is it.


[edit on 12-12-2009 by yeti101]

Just what would convince some of you that she is at least an accomplice? Everything you all keep asking for has already been provided. The only thing lacking is YOUR willingness to accept it. End O' Story.

[edit on 12-12-2009 by SpeakerofTruth]

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


It's not about trying to convince us of anything, we're fully aware of all the evidence for and against and we have demonstrated that. I don't think I have stated my own personal opinion at all yet, I have merely pointed out some of the more questionable evidence and testimonies. Most probably because she has already been found guilty and I feel the need to root for the underdog.

I always had my doubts and I didn't like the way that the press and authorities were handling the case, which made me somewhat sympathetic towards her.

All said and done, I would find it hard to come to a guilty verdict. At least for murder anyway.

[edit on 05/08/2009 by LiveForever8]

reply to post by LiveForever8



Well, honestly, I assume there is the possibility could exist that she's not guilty. However, 95 percent of what I have heard and read would indicate that she is.

Now, as anyone knows, anything you hear on the mainstream media should be taken with a grain of salt.However, when you get changing testimonies from the alleged suspects and DNA samples all over the place, it's an uphill climb to say "They are innocent."

reply to post by yeti101


The point is though that she made an error. Well, two errors. And the first phone call she mistook for being one that was nearly a full half hour later.
There could be a number of reasons the defence didnt mention it. But if assumptions are going to be made as to why particular points arent addressed, then why werent these reciepts of sollecito purchasing bleach ever produced? The police claimed to have them, yet when it came to the case they were never brought in.

The phone conversations between amanda & filomena are quite confusing. Some articles have quoted filomina saying that amanda says that she was going to call sollecito, and in others its quoted that she said she was on her way to pick him up.
As for the first phone call to meredith's UK phone, there's no information on how long that call lasted. I dont see that it means anything that she let the phone ring for 3, and then 4 seconds. How is that even worth presenting in court? Maybe since she had alerted filomena she felt it was more important to see if there were any other signs as to what happened... and possibly expected filomena to try and contact meredith. Which there is no info on.
And if its plausible that filomena could be so innacurate remembering the times of the calls, then why cant amanda have been innacurate with how long the phone had rung for?

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


I havent stated that I believe she is completely innocent. But there's no evidence that she was even in the bedroom, that she stabbed meredith, or even had any reason to do so in the first place. And not only that, she's been painted as the instigator of the attack.. again with no evidence to support that claim.

Have you come across any info stating what meredith's shoe size actually was? All it seems to say everywhere is that it was incompatible.

No, it was on CNN international, it stated that they put a ruler on it and the size did match, only that there was no pattern.

And as with most other details in the case, there's conflicting reports...

Like what for example?

Just read somewhere that the defence argued it could have been a crease in a blood stain, and when they requested an independent analysis of the print it was refused.

Darkness is the absence of light, otherwise it does not exist.
Who would take a look at it, her lawyer?, the prosecuter
did not conclude this on his own, an opinion was already formed by experts, the prosecuter just stated out the results that came in, sometimes the judge has to make such decisions. You make it sound like
the party involved in giving out the results were part of the prosecution team.






[edit on 12-12-2009 by pepsi78]

All said and done, I would find it hard to come to a guilty verdict. At least for murder anyway.

[edit on 05/08/2009 by LiveForever8]

Then why buy bleach at 7:45 in the morning when you are supose to be sleeping late at your boyfriend, why lie to the police saying we were looking at a movie at my boifriends computer when she was in the shop buying cleaning products. It checks out the computer has not been used, people place her there. The knife with dna on the blade and on the handle was found in her boyfriend's apartment, it had Amanda's DNA on the handdle and victim's dna on the blade. What more do you want.

reply to post by pepsi78


Erm you only have to read about 3 different websites to see that from source to source the details change. Its not difficult to find that out so Im not going to point out particular examples.

I have been following this case, a little.

And I'm afraid to say I believe they came to the right conclusion.

Not only do you have the forensic evidence to go on, you have the psychological evidence as reported by those who dealt with Knox after the event.
Her behavior certainly suggests that she wasn't in shock, if anything, she was enjoying the scenario while believing she would completely get away with it.

She is not retarded in any way, so the suggestion that she simply didn't understand the severity of the situation after the event is null and void. In my opinion, she knew exactly what was happening, and her behavior was that of an arrogant, upper-class girl who though she'd be let-off.
She probably thought America would come to the rescue and demand her release.

I don't think we've seen the end of this case by any means. It'll be interesting to see exactly how the jury came to their conclusion.

reply to post by pepsi78


www1.voanews.com...

Nick Pisa is a British tabloid journalist who has been covering the story since Kercher's dead body was found. "In general I think people were expecting this verdict. It was certainly one that has been anticipated by both the Italian media and the Italian public. I think the only people who were surprised were perhaps the Anglo-Saxon press because in the face of the evidence that was presented in court it's very, very unlikely that this case would have been found guilty in another court," he says.

Nick Pisa agrees that the appeal could make the difference for Knox. "It does appear that the evidence that convicted her was very, very flimsy and I think once they examine this DNA evidence again - let's remember there was the request for an independent review that was ruled out by the judge. And I think that's probably one of the first things that a new judge will ask for when he comes to review this case," he says.

It seems to be a shared view.

By early March the court will provide a written document outlining the reasons behind the verdict.

That will be an interesting read.

reply to post by LiveForever8

It's funny how you guys only quote on some things but leave out the stuff you can't say anything about. It's just like the defence team, when they had no answers they did not say anything.

When people placed her there the defence did no say anything, when they stated out that they lied over and over and offered evidence that Amanda lied over and over the defence did not say anything.

When Amanda went to buy cleaning products early in the morning with a corpse in her home the defence did not say anything


When Amanda lied about the knife and stated that the victim by acccident
touched the knife and poked her self she lied and it was proved that this did not happen, the defence did not say anything.

When Amanda lied and tierd to blame it on the black man and it was proven that it was not true the defence did not say anything.
With such a smile in the cortroom looking like "I don't care"
with her tring to blame it on someone else it shows how this person is.

No sign of forced entry also, then cops find the knife at her boyfriends with her dna on the knife.

Give me a break, this monster is guilty.

reply to post by pepsi78

When people placed her there the defence did no say anything, when they stated out that they lied over and over and offered evidence that Amanda lied over and over the defence did not say anything.

When Amanda lied and tierd to blame it on the black man and it was proven that it was not true the defence did not say anything.

She had already said she was present at the scene, that wasn't in question. What she did wrong was originally state she wasn't there but that she was instead at Sollecito's home.

She puts this down to a combination of exhaustion, after being questioned for hours, and police interrogation tactics.

When Amanda went to buy cleaning products early in the morning with a corpse in her home the defence did not say anything

That is circumstantial evidence and should not be put forward as the basis of a strong case. Which it wasn't.

When Amanda lied about the knife and stated that the victim by acccident touched the knife and poked her self she lied and it was proved that this did not happen, the defence did not say anything.

The knife has Knox's DNA on the handle and what some forensic scientists say is Kercher's DNA on the tip. A bloody print on the bed linens conveys the shape of the actual murder weapon and the the knife in question "doesn't match an outline of the knife on the bed." Additionally, expert testimony has already indicated that at least two of the wounds on Kercher's neck couldn't have been made by that particular blade.

That aside, it's not surprising that Knox's DNA would be on its handle; she prepared dinner with Sollecito in his apartment. As to whether the DNA on the tip belongs to Kercher, experts disagree. Patrizia Stefanoni, a police forensics expert who testified in the pretrial hearing in May, suggested that it was Kercher's DNA on the tip of the knife — and that the way the genetic material was positioned indicated the knife had probably been used to puncture the skin. But other experts who have analyzed the DNA evidence for the defense suggest that poor sample quality and possible contamination undermine the accuracy of these results.

I really do think you have fallen victim to the media hype that surrounded this case. Remaining objective is imperative.

The evidence really isn't as strong as some would suggest.

Also, the Italian authorities made a mess of the investigation. Contaminating the crime scene and not finding 'key' evidence until thirty-forty days after the investigation began.

For example, on one of the videos from the crime scene investigation, after placing rulers on the sides of a bloody shoeprint, a blue-rubber-gloved hand reaches down with a piece of white cloth and scrubs the bloody mark off the tile floor before putting the cloth into an evidence tube. This happens three times for three separate footprints. In film footage taken at least a day later, another team of investigators attempts, using photographs, to place where the footprints had been. They should have lifted the tile.

Also, when a female investigator reaches down with tweezers to pluck a hair sample off the blood-stained duvet, her own long hair dangles down beside her.

Very amateurish if you ask me.

reply to post by pepsi78


Im sure Ive already quoted this article in this thread before... but it brings up serious issues regarding the DNA found on the knife.

www.newscientist.com...