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To Lie, or Not to Lie? The Santa Claus Dilema

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posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 06:03 PM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


Like I said, drama queens. I guess if your child is a known drama queen who is going to be butt hurt because his/her parents tried to bring a little joy, excitement and mystery into the season, then by all means tell them about the Santa deception at birth. Otherwise, if you have normal children, allow them to see the magic of kindness from a stranger (even if imaginary) and foster their imaginations to see more of the purpose of the holiday than just "give me the toys I am owed because it is December 25th".
/rant




posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 06:20 PM
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reply to post by bagari
 


Oooh - musta hit a nerve.


Hey, I'm all for bringing joy to children, but not if it takes lying to them. That's my view. It's up to each parent, though. If you want to lie to your kids with the justification of "bringing joy", then by all means, have at it.
I just wouldn't do it. I hope that's OK.

A difference of opinion doesn't mean we have to start calling names, though. Does it?



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 06:42 PM
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Take the opportunity to show your children how people mindlessly conform to these behaviors, and how you can't always trust everything your peers and the rest of society tells you, if you know it doesn't make sense.

If and when I have kids, I'll tell mine as soon as they're old enough to be curious, that Santa is a fairy tale invented by businessmen a long time ago (1800s), and they somehow managed to make it a tradition for parents to lie to their children and tell them this man is real and is bringing you presents when really it's just your parents and other family members. It makes no sense to me, I don't know why they're doing it, but you have to realize that society is full of people who just do what they are told for the giggles of it and no better reason. And we have to try out best to be smarter than that and to think for ourselves, because a lot of the things people do are wrong.



There is plenty enough magic in life already for us to be trying to find it in lies. I could start with all the things we still don't know about the immensely huge universe around us, or even the bottoms of our oceans or the other planets in our solar system. And how we don't know much about what's happening at the teeniest levels of existence. Yet we are immersed in all of this, whether we understand it or not, 24 hours a day, 365 (and sometimes 366
) days a year.

[edit on 5-12-2009 by bsbray11]



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 07:22 PM
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Why do so many of the posters here want to share the bleak and terrible outlook on life that you have learned of with young children? I don't mean to tell people how to be parents, but if I was raised being told that I can't trust anyone and that evil businessmen created holidays just because they can sell things, anyway they are just the puppetmasters pulling your strings, I would not grow up happy or functional.

Who would want to grow up a paranoid cynic? More importantly, who would wish that on anyone else?

I think a lot of you are making this a lot more than it really is.



[edit on 5-12-2009 by Traffic]



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 07:44 PM
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reply to post by Jnewell33
 


You don't have to lie at all. Tell them the true story of the real Nicholas of Myra, who later became better known as Saint Nicholas.

The true story of this man's life in the 4th Century is far more inspiring than the make-believe, commercialized modern version that is packaged as "Santa Claus"... Nicholas of Myra was a 4th Century humanitarian and philanthropist who made it his personal mission to help others in need. He eventually became a Bishop in the Catholic Church, and is alleged to have performed a few of the more bizarre miracles in his lifetime.

He was canonized (officially made a Saint) due to his over-the-top generosity, benevolence and his miraculous (if baffling) ability to appear in two places or more simultaneously. The Church remembers Nicholas as the Patron Saint of Children and Seafarers.

Although he's been physically dead for over 16 centuries, Saint Nicholas has continued making miraculous appearances — as recently as WWII, as far as I know. There are a number of documented sightings, and the Church takes those visitations rather seriously.

Nicholas is really interesting as Saints go — apparently he has no problem appearing in full body manifestation, can interact with mortal human beings, can partake of meals, drink, do everything a normal human can do; then he typically bestows a miraculous gift and departs, leaving his hosts utterly baffled but nonetheless thankful.

— Doc Velocity





[edit on 12/5/2009 by Doc Velocity]



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 07:51 PM
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Originally posted by Clearskies
IMO, We don't 'fib' to our children about Santa, I worked too hard to give the credit to some guy coming in our house (can you say stranger danger)? and leaving them stuff I didnt leave.
Why start lying?
You will have problems with in laws and others. My sons told their peers there was no santa.



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 07:52 PM
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I think it may actually serve a slight benefit in the childs life when he finally realizes the truth. Then he will be skeptical about for BS claims later in life.



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 07:56 PM
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Originally posted by Traffic
I was raised being told that I can't trust anyone and that evil businessmen created holidays just because they can sell things, anyway they are just the puppetmasters pulling your strings, I would not grow up happy or functional.


If that's all it takes to ruin your good mood/personality then you didn't have much of one to start with.


Who would want to grow up a paranoid cynic? More importantly, who would wish that on anyone else?


Apparently you were raised naive? What do YOU think Santa Claus really came from?



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 08:08 PM
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Lot of coal for the boys and girls this year!!!!Santa is more than a physical being.He represents faith and good will towards others.



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 08:10 PM
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I didn't read through every reply so I apologize if my viewpoint has been covered already.

My parents thought it was perfectly fine to let my sister and I believe in Santa Claus as little kids. I remember one year I happened to be searching through my mother's dresser drawers for something and found a box full of all the letters I'd written to Santa Claus. I was horrified. It was at that point they explained to me he wasn't real. I was crushed.

Parents may think it is a harmless lie but it is a lot more damaging than they realize in the long run. Kids go through the rest of their lives never completely trusting their parents about anything ever again. Santa Claus was the most magical wonderful person in the world and I had placed so much hope and admiration in that man, only to find out his existence was a lie.

Then my parents wondered why I began to question the existence of Jesus when I grew up.

I don't have kids myself and don't plan to, but if I did, I would never lie to them about anything. Always the truth, that is my motto. False hope is far worse than no hope at all IMHO.



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 08:11 PM
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This tradition of feeding the kids lies about "Santa Clause" and then one day breaking the news to them that it was all a lie (that you told them) is a cruel and ignorant tradition.

Rather than perpetuating the myth that Saint Nicholas was never a real person, why not tell them the historical truth? Saint Nicholas was a real person.

— Doc Velocity



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 08:16 PM
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Originally posted by bsbray11
Apparently you were raised naive? What do YOU think Santa Claus really came from?


For myself, I was raised informed. Those who are informed know that Saint Nicholas was a real person with a real history of benevolence and charity.

I mean, if you're not going to tell the the truth about real religious figures, then you shouldn't be observing Christmas or Easter in the first place.

— Doc Velocity



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 08:50 PM
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reply to post by Doc Velocity
 


You're right, we wouldn't be celebrating Christmas anyway. My family still exchanges gifts, but none of us are particularly "religious" about it anyway. I would sooner call it the solstice than anything else, personally.



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 09:35 PM
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My son no longer believes in Santa, I'm actually not sure he ever really did, I never made a big deal of it but rather let him guide me in how he felt about the whole thing.

We did have lots of talks about the spirit of santa claus, and the spirit of giving and the Christmas is about giving to those we love, and those who don't have the priveledges in life that we do.

We have always taken him to get an ornament off the Angel tree to pick out gifts for another child. And every year before christmas we go through his toys and stuff and he picks out things to donate.

But even though he knows Santa isn't real he is still asking about all of our traditions. He still wrote a letter that we mailed to Santa, he still wants to watch the Norad Santa tracking thing on Christmas eve. He still wants to put out cookies and chocolate milk. He even picked out a new mug this year just for the Chocolate milk.

It isn't Santa himself that made those things important in his life, it is the act of creating a family tradition and history that really matters.


Life is complicated these days, even for kids. Simple joys and a little bit of inspiring magic never hurt anyone.



posted on Dec, 5 2009 @ 10:04 PM
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Santa Clause does exist. Santa Clause is who mom and dad become around Christmas. One day when the time is right you let them know mom and dad are Santa and one day when they have kids they will be Santa Clause at Christmas.

You do not have to tell them the Santa in the Mall is the "Real Santa" but maybe Santa's helper. You only need tell them Santa is real. One day let em know the "Real Santa" is their mom and dad.

Most of the planet believes in God because know one let em off the hook when they grew up.

It would be bad if you forgot to tell your kids that Santa is Mom and dad before they get to High School!



posted on Dec, 6 2009 @ 08:35 AM
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Originally posted by Traffic
Why do so many of the posters here want to share the bleak and terrible outlook on life that you have learned of with young children?


It's quite an assumption that since people don't want to lie to their children that they must want to share some bleak and terrible outlook on life!


There is a middle ground, you know. I would tell my children the story of Santa, but they would know that it was a story, a fairy tale, just like The Cat in the Hat, The Three Pigs and Cinderella.

Like Eladria, it was shortly after I discovered my parents' lies about Santa that I started asking questions about the existence of Jesus. Today, I don't believe in either. Yes, I know the people actually existed, but we're talking about the story of Santa being alive today and delivering presents door to door on Christmas Eve.
THAT is the lie.

We don't celebrate Christmas (except maybe as an excuse to have a big meal) but if we had kids, I'm sure we could find a way to tell them the truth and still have joy and wonder around the holidays without resorting to stories that are bleak and terrible!
Santa isn't all there is to Christmas.
There are presents, decorating, trees, generosity to those in need, love, singing, family, cookies and sleighrides! Not too bleak.



posted on Dec, 6 2009 @ 09:41 AM
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I think on the list of things which are going to deeply disturb you for the rest of your life, finding out santa claus isnt real is definately not at the top. And if that experience has damaged you in any way, then chances are your probably quite a fragile person anyway!

Seriously dont see anything wrong with letting kids believe in santa claus. Think the only harm that it causes is lack of sleep xmas eve due to the excitement of it all.



posted on Dec, 6 2009 @ 07:55 PM
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Originally posted by Bluebelle
I think on the list of things which are going to deeply disturb you for the rest of your life, finding out santa claus isnt real is definately not at the top.


Right! I mean, your children are going to become disillusioned enough in their lives as they discover that our educational system isn't about education at all, it's about social engineering, behavior modification and political indoctrination; they'll become deeply distraught as they mature and realize that their earnest political allegiances are based on propaganda and the lies of shallow, corrupt, power-seeking charlatans; and they'll lose faith in humanity altogether when they realize that their "global village" has no respect whatsoever for its most valuable resource, its population of senior citizens.

There's enough heartbreak and disappointment in life for everyone without depriving kids of a few years of joy believing in something that our mean-spirited society despises.

Tell society to kiss your ass, and let the kids have fun while they can.

— Doc Velocity



posted on Dec, 6 2009 @ 08:58 PM
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I knew someone once who was actually angry later cause she didn't get to experience Santa. Her father was a preacher and made it all bout Jesus and totally left Santa out of it.

If you ban Santa you might as well ban all fictitious writings, cartoons and movies. You know If your going to set every thing strait where do you draw the line? People do go through a lot of trouble to keep that lie alive though, a lot of trouble. Santa will always be real as long as you believe. I still tell my girls that today.



posted on Dec, 7 2009 @ 09:12 AM
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Originally posted by Bluebelle
I think on the list of things which are going to deeply disturb you for the rest of your life, finding out santa claus isnt real is definately not at the top.


It's not finding out that Santa wasn't real that bothered me. It was finding out that my parents, whom I trusted 100% had been telling me this totally fabricated story, KNOWING it wasn't true - that bothered me... And it wasn't a moment of disillusionment. It lasted for years afterward, making me unsure of everything they told me.

I don't blame my parents or hold it against them. I just know I wouldn't want that for my child. I would want my child to know that if they wanted the truth about anything in life, they could (and should) come to ME. When I wanted to know about sex, I didn't ask my parents because I knew they would probably lie, so I went elsewhere. I never completely trusted my parents again. I wouldn't want that for my own child.



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