International officials knew 9/11 was brewing

reply to post by TrueTruth


Ah.

went back over the thread, and it seems I misunderstood you.

you're not calling me a 'truther' ... o, you know the mistake i made.

i think the offical 9/11 investigation was part cover up.... i think people like sibel edmonds are where the real story is at... i think the multiple advanced warnings are suspicious... but so much of the rest, comes down to plain old speculation. if half the members of the keane commission are telling us the thing was run like a cover up, why aren't we focusing more on what they were trying to cover up, instead of what we imagine might have happened? many a criminal investigation has been successful just by honing in on the inconsistency of a perps story....

**

anyhow.

i got my wires crossed. only slept 3 hours last night. sorry for the confusion.

think i need a nap.

reply to post by TrueTruth


No worries.

I will accept the words of John Farmer that he believes the Commission's Report is accurate.

The problem I have with the Commission, is that it was designed to ensure no real blame was laid upon members of either party for their actions/inactions over the last 30 years.

An example, a lawyer at the Justice Department was asked to give her permission for FBI agents to perform a search on a non investigation related item and share information with another department concerning Zacharias Moussari. In her zeal to uphold her idea of Civil Rights protection, she said NO.

What was her reward? She became a member of the 9-11 Commission, Jamie Gorelick.

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

I will accept the words of John Farmer that he believes the Commission's Report is accurate.

That is untrue.

The 9/11 Commission Rejects Own Report As Based On Government Lies Gordon Duff Salem-News.com

Sep-11-2009 23:46printcomments
The 9/11 Commission Rejects own Report as Based on Government Lies
Gordon Duff Salem-News.com
How long have we watered the Tree of Deceit with the blood of patriots?
The Ground Truth: The Story Behind America’s Defense on 9/11
John Farmer’s book: “The Ground Truth: The Story Behind America’s Defense on 9/11″
(CINCINNATI, Ohio) - In John Farmer’s book: “The Ground Truth: The Story Behind America’s Defense on 9/11″, the author builds the inescapably convincing case that the official version... is almost entirely untrue...

www.911blogger.com...

Make no mistake, Farmer is not saying that 9/11 was an inside job, however, Farmer’s testimony, along with that of his fellow 9/11 Commission members, conclusively demonstrates that, whatever really happened on 9/11, the official story as told to the public on the day and that which remains the authorities’ version of events today, is a lie – according to the very people who were tasked by the government to investigate it. This is a fact that no debunker or government apologist can ever legitimately deny.

www.prisonplanet.com...

9/11 Commission chief admits official report was entirely untrue!

CINCINNATI, Ohio - September 11, 2009 - In John Farmer’s book: “The Ground Truth: The Story Behind America’s Defense on 9/11″, the author builds the inescapably convincing case that the official version... is almost entirely untrue.

The 9/11 Commission now tells us that the official version of 9/11 was based on false testimony and documents and is almost entirely untrue. The details of this massive cover-up are carefully outlined in a book by John Farmer, who was the Senior Counsel for the 9/11 Commission.

freedomradio.us...

Senator Max Cleland – Former member of the 9/11 Commission, resigned in December 2003 "I, as a member of the [9/11] Commission, cannot look any American in the eye... It is a national scandal... this White House wants to cover [9/11] up."

Senator Mark Dayton – Member, Senate Committee on Armed Services and Homeland Security "[NORAD] lied to the American people, they lied to Congress and they lied to your 9/11 Commission...the most gross incompetence and dereliction of responsibility and negligence"
Congressman Ron Paul - Vice Chairman of the Oversight and Investigations subcommittee "the [9/11] investigations that have been done so far as more or less cover-up and no real explanation"

Congressman Curt Weldon - "[9/11 Commission] there's something very sinister going on here... something desperately wrong... This involved what is right now the covering up of information that led to the deaths of 3,000 people"

Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney - Member of the House Armed Services Committee "the [9/11] Commission ran up against obstruction by the administration and non-cooperation from government agencies... the errors and omissions immediately jumped out at us"

Director of the FBI, Louis Freeh – "[9/11 Commission] findings--raises serious challenges to the commission's credibility and, if the facts prove out, might just render the commission historically insignificant itself"

Assistant Secretary of the U.S. Treasury, Paul Craig Roberts, PhD - "Distinguished national and international scientists and scholars present massive evidence that the 9/11 Commission Report is a hoax and that the 9/11 "terrorist attack" has been manipulated to serve a hegemonic agenda in the Middle East... We know that it is strictly impossible for any building, much less steel columned buildings, to "pancake" at free fall speed. Therefore, it is a non-controversial fact that the official explanation of the collapse of the WTC buildings is false"

Assistant Secretary of Housing, Catherine Austin Fitts - "Regarding 9/11 "The official story could not possibly have happened... It’s not possible. It’s not operationally feasible... The Commission was a whitewash. "

U.S. Army Intelligence officer, Federal Prosecutor, Office of Special Investigations, U.S. Department of Justice, John Loftus ~ "The information provided by European intelligence services prior to 9/11 was so extensive that it is no longer possible for either the CIA or FBI to assert a defence of incompetence"

Foreign Service Officer, George Kenney - " I cannot believe, much as I might like to, the standard account of 9/11"

Foreign Service Officer, J. Michael Springman - "Fifteen of the nineteen people who allegedly flew airplanes into buildings in the United States got their visas from the same CIA Consulate at Jeddah"

Deputy Attorney General, State of Pennsylvania, Philip J. Berg, Esquire - "The official story of what actually took place on 9/11 is a lie. "
Major General U.S. Army, Commanding General of U.S. Army Intelligence and Security Command, Albert Stubblebine ~ "I look at the hole in the Pentagon and I look at the size of an airplane that was supposed to have hit the Pentagon. And I said, ‘The plane does not fit in that hole’. So what did hit the Pentagon?"

Col. Ronald D. Ray, U.S. Marine Corps – Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense, Deputy Director of Field Operations for the U.S. Marine Corps Historical Center - "I'm astounded that the conspiracy theory advanced by the administration could in fact be true and the evidence does not seem to suggest that's accurate"

Col. Robert Bowman, U.S. Air Force, Director of Advanced Space Programs, PhD Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering - " the official 9/11 story is impossible .. There is a cover up .. high levels of our government don't want us to know what happened .. highly placed individuals in the administration .. Dick Cheney .. the very kindest thing we can say about George W Bush .. is high treason and conspiracy to commit murder "

Col. George Nelson, U.S. Air Force, aircraft accident investigator ~ "I never witnessed nor even heard of an aircraft loss, where the wreckage was accessible, that prevented investigators from finding enough hard evidence to positively identify the make, model, and specific registration number of the aircraft -- and in most cases the precise cause of the accident... The government alleges that four wide-body airliners crashed on the morning of September 11, 2001, resulting in the deaths of more than 3,000 human beings, yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from view .. with all the evidence readilty available at the pentagon crash site, any unbiased rational investigator could only conclude that a Boeing 757 did not fly into the Pentagon as alleged. Similarly, with all the evidence available at the Pennsylvania crash site, it was most doubtful that a passenger airliner caused the obvious hole in the ground and certainly not the Boeing 757 as alleged .. the most heinous conspiracy in our country's history "
Major Douglas Rokke, PhD, U.S. Army ~ "Regarding the impact at the Pentagon on 9/11/2001 "when you look at the damage, it was obviously a missile."

www.opednews.com...

I think most credible people already disagree with you.

Just so members understand, I posted this item, as it does seem to apply to the trial, and the implications are quite clear.
I don't for a minute believe that Bush was behind 9/11. There is no way such a cover-up would be able to be kept for long.
I DO believe that what happened on 9/11 in response to the attack was a case of the government keystone cops behavior.
Our government agencies are one step away from complete incompetence. If you don't believe that, all you have to do is see how those publicity hounds got into the State Dinner the other night, past Secret Service and White House personnel. They could have EASILY been terrorists, and they could have brought in anthrax or some other biological agent, and virtually everyone in that affair would have been dead. All the government ever does is close the gate AFTER the horses are out. Fire a few agents, and then go on, business as usual.

Total and complete incompetence is what they are guilty of. They live by the motto: "It's good enough for government work."

reply to post by TrueTruth

we don't disagree that elements of our intel community were possibly involved.

but i think edmonds it credible, and hopsicker has done very good research.

maybe bin laden was involved, maybe he wasn't. maybe he's a figure head, maybe he's just a money man, or maybe, just a bogey man, as you suggest. who knows?

I do believe what Edmonds had to say and very creditable people do support her accusation that Bin Laden was working for the CIA right up to 911.
I believe that is why there is no evidences against Bin Laden and that is why our government has sat quietly all these years.

It took eight years of water boarding and beating the h… out of someone to make them confess with that they are the new mastermind of 911.

We are the most advance country in the world we know what every county in the world is doing at any given moment. We have spies in every country in the world; we have spies in every government in the world. You must remember the CIA is not accountable they are above the laws all lands. The CIA are sometimes used as our assassins.

If 911 was a real terrorist attack from a foreign Nation, we would have already caught the “real culprits,” killed all of them, and bomb their country to pieces and the war would have been over in a matter of a few months.
No this is something entirely different. It is about taking control of all the worlds energy resources, oil. Let’s look at some of the worlds largest oil deposits, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Kuwait, United Arab Emirates, Mexico, and notice we have our hands deep in manipulating foreign policies and trade agreements.

The one country that the United States has their eyes on is Iran. We will be going to war and we will overthrow the Iranian regime. Then we will have full control of their oil.

What is left of a country when it has sold out everything, when the country industries has move to foreign lands for monetary gains, what is left? Nothing. Most of the greed in our capitalist society has sold itself out from the American people. Now we are in a rush for a power grab of the world’s most demanding resource, oil. When greed and corrupting play hand in hand all good things will come to an end.


[edit on 3-12-2009 by impressme]

reply to post by impressme


I hear you man.

It does get depressing. Sometimes it really gets me down. But try to remember this - there has never been a time in human history when the world hasn't known evil. Always, there have been those among us who desire to rule us. To conquer the world. And eventually, they fall.

I don't believe in a teleological theory of history, that we are evolving towards some kind of end, but I do believe in tapping our potential. I don't know if you read the spirituality threads, but I believe within us, based on what's been shown to me, that there is a potential for greatness that we have barely begun to tap. We have within us the power to overcome our baser nature. There is nothing that anyone can do, ultimately, to stop it, because it is what we are. They can only distract us from knowing it. Only for a time.

There are many manifestations of the evil that seeks to control us. 9/11 was only one of them. If I were searching for an issue to unite as a people, to take on the elite, and interject justice into the machinery of government, I'm not sure that this is the issue I would choose. There is too much uncertainty. But in the larger sense, they are tipping their hand now. We see it especially with regard to economics. Martin Luther King came closer than any other American to uniting us around a common cause. His vision of a united peace and justice movement was enough of a threat to the people who move us like pawns, that the needed to have him killed. This set us back, but it also revealed to us what they are afraid of - the people uniting.

All of us want justice. All of us want truth. All of us want a better future. None of us are happy watching oligarchs assume the world throne. Operatives aside, the 'truthers' and the 'debunkers', I imagine are not divided on this longing. Our natures are the same, and the light that craves expression is universal.

If 9/11 truth is what you feel is your true calling, it is more important that we can all find one thing to agree on, than to try to be right about 10. And the one thing that people can agree on - even people who mock us - is that the government lies. Not since the vietnam war has it ever been clearer. And people are frightened. People can feel the vice grip choking off their throats. People are ready to act, on the instinct for air.

Appeal to their humanity. Recognize their fear. Have compassion for the fact they've been bamboozled. All of us are victims. We've been fed so many contradicting narratives laced with equal parts half truths and lies, that we don't know where to go, and we just keep running into each other. The easiest place to see it is on the macro level with respect to bipartisn politics. Divided, we are conquered, but people are finally figuring it out.

We need to capitalize on this opening. The radical left and the radical right, finally have a common issue, in the threat of globalization. They may come at it from different sides, but finally, there's an unambiguous common ground, and everyone wants justice.

If we can find one common thread, and all of us can agree to pull on it, the entire web they've woven will begin to unravel, one part leading to the next. If we fight for economic justice, tracing the trail will eventually lead us to the truth about 9/11, for as you said above, it all connects to resources and the struggle for control of them.


I'll stop now. I think you'll see my point. I admire your dedication to truth, but I appeal to you to temper it with compassion.

We're all going to sink together if we can't find away to work together.



[edit on 3-12-2009 by TrueTruth]

reply to post by TrueTruth


I am impressed with your post and you certainly have showing me that you are very well informed in what is really going on in the real world. I am glad to have someone to talk to, without all the drama we see in all these 911 threads.

It does get depressing. Sometimes it really gets me down.

Same here, I know exactly what you are talking about. Just the other day I had CNN on I was listening to a story the News team was telling, it was about how we could not capture Bin Laden because George Bush did not deploy enough troops in Tora Bora. Perhaps so, but I remember very well when we had him supposently surrounded in Tora Bora and I remember George Bush giving the orders to pull our troops out of Tora Bora.
I remember that day as if it was today and I was angry as h… I couldn’t understand why the Bush administration would let him get away, we had him right in our grasps.

What really upset me, was CNN did not talk about how we had Bin Laden surrounded in Tora Bora, not one word of it was mention, nothing. All CNN said is we didn’t have enough troops to capture OBL. I walk over and turn my TV set off I realized our media is still trying to do damaged control and feeding the mass population half truth and disinformation, I felt sick.

Then it dawn on me, the information FBI translator Sibel Edmond was telling us is most certainly true and the Bush administration couldn’t risk having their bogyman caught. In fact, if he was captured the war would have to end. That would be the end of all the oil contracts, the end of all the no bid contractors KBR, Halliburton, all the military contracts the list goes on.

Million and millions of dollars at stake if Bin Laden was caught that would be the end of the Bush administration gravy train.

Senate Report: "Tora Bora Revisited: How We Failed To Get Bin Laden And Why It Matters Today"

911blogger.com...

I don't know if you read the spirituality threads, but I believe within us, based on what's been shown to me, that there is a potential for greatness that we have barely begun to tap.

I have not been to many of these threads. However, some of them are quite interesting. I believe in spirituality but not in a religious sense. My belief is, we all have a certain purposes on this wonderful planet each of us has choosing a path in life “we can change our path at any given time with our freedom of our choices.
I believe earth is more like a school for our soul to learn with life’s experiences for the soul to grow. I do believe in reincarnation and I do support the idea the soul comes back to earth perhaps hundreds of times to learn to grow.

Our true goal on earth is to love one another to learn to live in harmony with the entire human race.

Most of man has yet to learn this. In my opinion evil is a choice, a choice, of one to act upon for whatever reason whether it is greed or power it is a choice. However, all of our choices have consequences and they do affect everyone, whether there good or bad.

We all do go through a life review when we die, everything we have done will be revealed, not a single dark hiding secret is left unexposed, nothing. Here is how it works, when we die we will know what every human being and animal was thinking that we had contact with when we were alive, either good or bad. If you did something bad to someone, you will know how he or she felt and you are going to know what they were thinking at that moment even if that person died before you died.

So, can you imagine when Hitler gave the order to kill six million Jews, not only upon his own death he will spend almost eternity feeling the anguish of every human that continues to learn and read about his actions and the anger that we all feel against this man because, of his choices.

Future generation for hundred or even thousands of years from now, will continue to feel hurt, the only way Hitler will get peace is when the world destroys writing history so, there is no written record or stories of this event any longer.

So, I tell myself sometimes when I feel hopeless, especially when it come to 911, I remind myself that when I die the entire truth will be reveled to me. If Dick Cheney and people in the Bush administration or top experts in our military had anything to do with pulling off a false flag, they will pay dearly upon their own death by their own life’s reviews.

They will have to experience all three thousand death first hand in New York, they will experience and know what all of these people were thinking minuets before their deaths, then they will have to experience all the anguish and pain, thoughts, from the surviving families, then they will have to feel all the anguish and thoughts of every human being across the world, who watched on television in horror on the morning of 911 as all the events unfolded that day.

Then they will get to feel the anguish of all the dead soldiers that had to die in both wars including every innocent person killed that was thought to be our enemy, and that will be a few million people. Now we see how a “choice of evil” plotted by a handful of men has affected every soul in the world.

Everything living has a vibration of energy. Good thing always vibrate on a higher vibration and negative things always vibrate on a lower vibrations.

If 911 was a false flag done by people in our government this country is going to pay heavily. Because, of the negative energy and the mass deception that has been ongoing and the billions of dollars being made by greedy corporation, the robbing and pillaging of the American tax payers the steeling of Wall street barons, the banking bailouts, the pharmaceuticals scams, the Global warming scams, all in the hands of the greedy most powerful elite, all wanting to profit from their frauds and never be held accountable.

I never would have imagined that sciences could have a price tag on it, to be abused to mislead the public.

What I do know is this, if we continue to turn our backs on all of this corruption in our government in our banking in our healthcare, and do not end these wars, this great country will destroy it’s self, as we are already seening it now.



[edit on 4-12-2009 by impressme]

reply to post by impressme


You are right, your post is untrue.

Here is an interview Mr Farmer did on a radio show.

911reports.wordpress.com...

John, you were speaking of, before the break about some of the things that you were told and the public was told and the Commission was told that were, quote, “almost entirely and inexplicably ‘untrue’”; you refer to the fact that, uh, the claim that they could have ‘taken out’ Flight 93 if they had wanted to, that they had within their sights, and so on and so forth- why would- why do you suspect some of these stories would have been told, that were so wildly inaccurate, as you describe them?

JF- I think there was an effort to, um, uh, to make the government look ‘better’ than it was that day- to make the national command structure, um, seem, uh, like it was more in control than it was in those critical moments, and I think in doing that, one of the unfortunate byproducts was that they obscured some of the really important lessons from that morning, among which are- you know, how critical decisions are actually made in a crit- in a cataclysmic situation like that, and the essential estrangement of the top levels from the people on the ground who actually had to improvise the national defense- was important, because we saw replicated a few years later in Hurricane Katrina- completely different kind of event, uh, in fact not a surprise at all, something that had been planned for, for years- but when it actually hit, the same kind of dynamic occurred, where people on the ground in New Orleans were waiting for word from the upper levels of government and there was a disconnect in communications and difficulty communicating, they didn’t have the authority to make critical decisions, and I think one of the things that comes out of this study that I think is important, is the imperative that we actually plan to deal with these crises the way they’re actually experienced, as opposed according to some, uh, you know- organization chart.

Then there is this statement...

JF- Well, let me just say that I think the report is, uh, extremely accurate, and- and sets forth the facts of 9/11. And we actually did point out in the report the discrepancies between the accounts that were given and what we actually found. But what’s different is, you know, in this account is, I think, by telling it structurally differently- in other words, in the Commission Report we told it flight by flight, as much for the sake of clarity as anything else, so you could understand with each flight what happened. That’s not the way it was lived, though, by the people who had to respond, and that’s what this book does- it tells the story, uh, almost from their perspective- when everything’s flying at them at once. And I think the value of that is that you can see that, uh, taken as a whole, you can see that the real enemy of preparedness is bureaucracy, and that’s tough nut to crack but I think it’s the one we have to, if we’re gonna be better in the future.

Did you get it this time impressme? The man who WROTE the book and lived through the Commission says the report is accurate. The men who skimmed the book and did not read the whole thing are telling you the report is untrue. Again, who are you going to believe, the man who wrote the book or the men who make a living promoting conspiracies?

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

9/11 Commissioners say "Official Story" a Lie

The co-chairs of the 9/11 Commission (Thomas Keane and Lee Hamilton) said that the CIA (and likely the White House) “obstructed our investigation”.

The co-chairs of the 9/11 Commission also said that the 9/11 Commissioners knew that military officials misrepresented the facts to the Commission, and the Commission considered recommending criminal charges for such false statements, yet didn’t bother to tell the American people (free subscription required).

Indeed, the co-chairs of the Commission now admit that the Commission largely operated based upon political considerations.
9/11 Commission co-chair Lee Hamilton says “I don’t believe for a minute we got everything right”, that the Commission was set up to fail, that people should keep asking questions about 9/11, that the 9/11 debate should continue, and that the 9/11 Commission report was only “the first draft” of history.

9/11 Commissioner Bob Kerrey said that “There are ample reasons to suspect that there may be some alternative to what we outlined in our version . . . We didn’t have access . . . .”

9/11 Commissioner Timothy Roemer said “We were extremely frustrated with the false statements we were getting”
Former 9/11 Commissioner Max Cleland resigned from the Commission, stating: “It is a national scandal”; “This investigation is now compromised”; and “One of these days we will have to get the full story because the 9-11 issue is so important to America. But this White House wants to cover it up”.

9/11 Commissioner John Lehman said that “We purposely put together a staff that had - in a way - conflicts of interest“.

The Senior Counsel to the 9/11 Commission (John Farmer) who led the 9/11 staff’s inquiry, said “I was shocked at how different the truth was from the way it was described …. The tapes told a radically different story from what had been told to us and the public for two years…. This is not spin. This is not true.”

www.beyondleftright.com...

These are the facts, care to disprove them?

Seven CIA Veterans Challenge 9/11 Commission Report!

socioecohistory.wordpress.com...

I have to tell you swampy, there are people more powerful than you, who disagree with you.
As far as your book… Let’s say it was to make money just like Alex Jones does,and to a little damaged control however, it didn’t work.
The 911 commissioners admitted they lied and you cannot disputed it.

Try again.

reply to post by impressme



I find it funny you use this quote..

9/11 Commissioner John Lehman said that “We purposely put together a staff that had - in a way - conflicts of interest“.

Its funny, because I said the same thing on this thread.

And again, you use John Farmer, a man who said the report was accurate, to support your claims the report wasnt accurate.

Your disconnect is that you believe when the Commission members state they did not believe what they were being told it means that George Bush and Dick Cheney were running the whole attack. And in that, you are wrong. As Mr Farmer points out in his book, the stories being told were being told to make it look like that chain of command wasnt the confused mess it turned into during the attacks.

And with this quote, I agree

"“I don’t believe for a minute we got everything right”, that the Commission was set up to fail, that people should keep asking questions about 9/11, that the 9/11 debate should continue, and that the 9/11 Commission report was only “the first draft” of history."

People SHOULD still be asking questions. Not about who planned and carried out the attacks, that we already know, but how we allowed our elected officials to damage our national security as badly as they did from 1975 to 2001.

That's the questions that our elected officials wanted to gloss over. In the end, the blame would start with Richard Nixon, through George Bush and with every congresscritter/senator from 1975 till 2001.

[edit on 4-12-2009 by Swampfox46_1999]

[edit on 4-12-2009 by Swampfox46_1999]

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

9/11 Commissioners say "Official Story" a Lie

The co-chairs of the 9/11 Commission (Thomas Keane and Lee Hamilton) said that the CIA (and likely the White House) “obstructed our investigation”.

The co-chairs of the 9/11 Commission also said that the 9/11 Commissioners knew that military officials misrepresented the facts to the Commission, and the Commission considered recommending criminal charges for such false statements, yet didn’t bother to tell the American people (free subscription required).

Indeed, the co-chairs of the Commission now admit that the Commission largely operated based upon political considerations.
9/11 Commission co-chair Lee Hamilton says “I don’t believe for a minute we got everything right”, that the Commission was set up to fail, that people should keep asking questions about 9/11, that the 9/11 debate should continue, and that the 9/11 Commission report was only “the first draft” of history.

9/11 Commissioner Bob Kerrey said that “There are ample reasons to suspect that there may be some alternative to what we outlined in our version . . . We didn’t have access . . . .”

9/11 Commissioner Timothy Roemer said “We were extremely frustrated with the false statements we were getting”
Former 9/11 Commissioner Max Cleland resigned from the Commission, stating: “It is a national scandal”; “This investigation is now compromised”; and “One of these days we will have to get the full story because the 9-11 issue is so important to America. But this White House wants to cover it up”.

9/11 Commissioner John Lehman said that “We purposely put together a staff that had - in a way - conflicts of interest“.

The Senior Counsel to the 9/11 Commission (John Farmer) who led the 9/11 staff’s inquiry, said “I was shocked at how different the truth was from the way it was described …. The tapes told a radically different story from what had been told to us and the public for two years…. This is not spin. This is not true.”

www.beyondleftright.com...

These are the facts, care to disprove them?

Swampfox46_1999, are these statements true? Have I told a lie? Are my statements lies?
You have totally “ignored” my above post.

reply to post by impressme


I already explained to you that your interpretation of what the commission members said is faulty.