Secrecy is Repugnant: An honest request to Masons.

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by Project2501


The Royal Secret of the 32nd degree, It is the secret of the Universal Equilibrium, Yes it is "Equilibrium." I suggest you re-read A Bridge to Light by Rex R. Hutchens (A study in Masonic Ritual & Philosophy) Which is given to every new comer that joins the Southern Masonic Jurisdiction of the Scottish Rite.

I am very familiar with the 32°. I am also very familiar that you are not...nor with the "Ben Franklin degree", lol.

A "Regular Master Mason" can goto a "conferral," and leave with all of the "secrets" of the 4th through the 32nd degrees of the the scottish rite. While the 33rd is an honorary degree. Although they're degrees which must be crafted. These are, The 4th degree of the "Master Traveler/A long Journey" which is in the Lodge of Perfection, Also the 14th Degree of the "Grand Elect Mason/Perfection" Also in the Lodge of Perfection (This is the most mysterious of all, even if the 30th degree is one of the most mysterious to watch, As the 14th degree contains the beloved Vault of the cube. Is yours already 33 in all directions?! The inner sanctum if you will.)

& the 18th degree of the "Knight of the Rose Croix" this is in the Chapter of the Rose Croix and as such should be noted.

"The 18° ritual approved by the Supreme Council in 1870 reinforced and perpetuated the original Christian emphasis of the degree. This circumstance was not without its critics, however. For one, Albert Pike, Sovereign Grand Commander of the Southern Jurisdiction and a renowned Masonic ritualist in his own right, objected to the 18° ritual of the Northern Masonic Jurisdiction as a “strictly Christian degree.” The rebuttal to Pike was that he was an inno- vator, who had changed the ritual of the 18° to transform what always had been a Christian degree into a universal degree."

Then there is the 30th degree, That of the "Grand Inspector/Practice Justice" which is a Consistory degree

And then the last Mandatory degree of study is the 32nd Degree! of the Sublime Prince of the Royal Secret, Another interesting note here is

The 32° of the Scottish Rite had its origin as the 25th and last degree of the 18th century Rite of Perfection and may be traced back to a French degree that was extant 250 years ago. The Francken Manuscript of 1783 did not record the ritual of the degree, but it did describe a major component, the symbolism of the camp, disclosed the signs and passwords of the degree, and provided the motto, then as now, “Spes Mea in Deo Est.” Also then as now, a person admitted to the degree was styled “Sublime Prince of the Royal Se- cret.”

So yes your right I've not really studied the The Twenty-fifth “Ben Franklin” Degree of which is that of the Master of Achievement to give it its due right! And your point is? lol

Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by Project2501
Which is given to every new comer that joins the Southern Masonic Jurisdiction of the Scottish Rite.

But what do you care about the Southern Jurisdiction when you keep saying Pike is a load of crap and the Northern Jurisdiction is all that matters?

Where have I said exactly that Pike is a load of crap & the Northern Jurisdiction is all that matters?

Originally posted by Project2501

Originally posted by Masonic Light
reply to post by Project2501

 

Trolling is in violation of the ATS T&C. I suggest you re-read them.

The Royal Secret of the 32nd degree, It is the secret of the Universal Equilibrium, Yes it is "Equilibrium." I suggest you re-read A Bridge to Light by Rex R. Hutchens (A study in Masonic Ritual & Philosophy) Which is given to every new comer that joins the Southern Masonic Jurisdiction of the Scottish Rite.

[edit on 17-12-2009 by Project2501]

If you are going to come in here and be a baiter (nay a Master Baiter) you should at least get the names right.

Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite (there is no 'masonic' or 'freemasonry' in the title)

Scottish Rite is an optional appendant body.

I can't comment on their practices because I'm not one.

I *am* however the highest 'level' Mason in Freemasonry. I can state unequivocally that there is NO chamber of reflection in my Grand Lodge's jurisdiction, that NOBODY has ever been killed in my jurisdiction ever for any reason related to Masonry, and nobody is threatened with death.


I get it.

You don't like masons.

That's your right.

Furthermore, I am a Mason and I would go to my grave to defend your right to speak your mind even if I don't agree with you.

I would also rush to your aid as fast as I would fellow Mason because the ultimate lesson of Freemasonry is that ALL of humanity is a brotherhood under the Fatherhood of God.

I don't even know you, but I know that 99.9% of our DNA is identical. That means you are a family member and as a Mason I promised to take care of my family.

Lastly, I love you. Sounds crazy, huh? What if we said that to every person we see in a day?

What if we spent all our time and frustration and effort on ATS to find things we agree on instead of things that divide us?

That, my friends, is the true 'secret'.

My bad.. looks like 'masonic' is in the Northern Jurisdiction title.

Here is a direct quote statement from Scottish Rite saying what it's all about:

* Exalt the dignity of every person, the human side of his daily activities, and the maximum service to humanity.

* Aid mankind's search in God's universe for identity, for development and for destiny, and thereby produce better men in a better world, happier men in a happier world and wiser men in a wiser world.

As far as Freemasonry, here is the first line of freemasonry.org that sums it all up:

Freemasonry is the oldest and largest world wide fraternity dedicated to the Brotherhood of Man under the Fatherhood of a Supreme Being. Although of a religious nature, Freemasonry is not a religion. It urges its members, however, to be faithful and devoted to their own religious beliefs.

Heck, even Wikipedia gets in on the action:

The degrees represent stages of personal development. No Freemason is told that there is only one meaning to the allegories; as a Freemason works through the degrees and studies their lessons, he interprets them for himself, his personal interpretation being bounded only by the Constitution within which he works.

A common symbolic structure and universal archetypes provide a means for each Freemason to come to his own answers to life's important philosophical questions.

Furthermore, the reason Masons object so vehemently to the inaccurate accusations (like yours) that have been leveled at us over the years is because the lead to prejudice and persecution.

Example:

The preserved records of the Reichssicherheitshauptamt (the Reich Security Main Office) show the persecution of Freemasons. RSHA Amt VII (Written Records) was overseen by Professor Franz Six and was responsible for "ideological" tasks, by which was meant the creation of anti-Semitic and anti-Masonic propaganda.

While the number is not accurately known, it is estimated that between 80,000 and 200,000 Freemasons were killed under the Nazi regime. Masonic concentration camp inmates were graded as political prisoners and wore an inverted red triangle.

Are anti-masons so simple-minded and brainwashed that they would use an obscure source written years ago by prejudiced individuals to paint an entire fraternity of 3.5 million men?

Finally, why do you care? Freemasonry does not affect non-masons in any way shape or form. We don't advocate political stances, we don't push religious dogma and we don't recruit.

The only time you will hear a true Mason become passionate in front of a non-mason is when unfounded allegations of wrongdoing are leveled.



[edit on 12/17/09 by emsed1]

reply to post by JoshNorton


Thank you for the honest and straight forward reply Emperor Norton!

All Hail Eris!

I am not anti-Mason; however, I am anti-SECRET when it comes to individuals who serve in public office.

Anyone who serves the public and takes an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States of America should put that oath first.
Above ALL other things.
To say that a Mason works for the public good, so it is possible to honor the oath to country and the oath to Freemasonry simultaneously does not make sense to me.
Maybe if you guys weren't so secretive then it would make more sense.
Then again....

"My" opinion could be because I am "brainwashed"...

But, if we are talking strict mathematical probabilities here, then I would say the possibility that you are "brainwashed" is much more probable.

"Brainwashing", as far as what is known in the field of psychology regarding cult groups, relies heavily on two aspects central to Freemasonry:

1) Ritual

2) Exclusion

reply to post by emsed1

Masonic concentration camp inmates were graded as political prisoners and wore an inverted red triangle.

About that, and please forgive the source. (I was looking for Project2501's source for the claim that Pike dated Vinnie Ream)

Can anyone comment on the following claim: RE: Nazis and the Masons

One of the more twisted myths being propagated by 'Regular' Anglo-American Freemasonry of late is that the Nazi's persecuted 'regular' Freemasonry in Germany during it's reign.
...

One of the groupings had always banned Jews from joining and was fiercely nationalistic and reactionary in it's politics. One of the groupings had always allowed Jews to join and was international and liberal in it's politics.

Guess which Grand Lodge group American and British Freemasonry recognized as being 'regular' Freemasonry and which group it branded as 'irregular' and 'clandestine' Freemasonry?

For the full text, go here and scroll down until you see white text against a red background. It's titled "The Frederick the Great Association".

Did Hitler really endorse one branch of masonry as claim on freemasonrywatch?



[edit on 17/12/09 by ConspiracyNut23]

Here you go ConspiracyNut23,

The Initiated Eye: Secrets, Symbols, Freemasonry and the Architecture of Washington, DC
Artist: Peter Waddell
2005 Grand Lodge of the District of Columbia

*Please note click Number 10 of the collection* for

Equality in Initiation

"Vinnie Ream was the most prominent American female sculptor of the 19th century. She received the coveted job of producing a life-size marble statue of Abraham Lincoln in 1866 that stands in the United States Capitol rotunda and the bronze statue of Admiral Farragut in Farragut Square. Albert Pike was a philosopher, jurist, orator, poet, scholar, soldier, author of many of the rituals of Freemasonry and Grand Commander of the Scottish Rite Masons.

They met around 1868 when Pike settled in Washington. Both were ambitious and charismatic. Interestingly, Pike generated a series of freemasonic rituals intended for women and initiated Ream into the Masonic fraternity."

Here's a glimpse of what it might of been like for her today! "Initiation Ceremony of the Order of the Eastern Star"

Bit different from the other male freemasonic rituals I might add.

[edit on 18-12-2009 by Project2501]

Originally posted by Josephus23
To say that a Mason works for the public good, so it is possible to honor the oath to country and the oath to Freemasonry simultaneously does not make sense to me.

Of what of the fact that our Masonic obligations explicity state adherence to the laws of the country in which you live?

double post sorry.

[edit on 18-12-2009 by jeasahtheseer]

reply to post by Project2501


Why are you calling everyone who disagrees with you a fake mason? Its quite rediculous you are on here spouting the most rediculous random stuff about masons and you are sitting here calling people who are actually masons themselves fakes. And what would anyone have to gain from sitting on a message board pretending to be a freemason? lol thats the stupidest thing I ever heard.

Some of you trolls on this board are really loony and obnoxious.

[edit on 18-12-2009 by jeasahtheseer]

Originally posted by Project2501
Where have I said exactly that Pike is a load of crap & the Northern Jurisdiction is all that matters?

Um, how about here?

Originally posted by Project2501
Also everyone doesn't subscribe to the butchered Albert pike system of the Scottish Rite that was reworked from the Francken Manuscripts.

and here

Originally posted by Project2501
The Northern Masonic Jurisdiction is where the most important players in the history of America are. The Southern Jurisdiction is where we send the washed up talent.

???

And going off about a Ben Franklin degree in the Northern Jurisdiction, but then listing Southern Jurisdiction Scottish Rite degree distributions and recommending A Bridge to Light, which is all about the Southern rituals. Pick a system a stick with it, because by confusing the two, you're only showing how much you don't know.

So if you're hooked on going on about Ben Franklin degrees in the Northern Jurisdiction, you'd know that the Northern Jurisdiction bodies are divided as follows:
4° through 14°: Lodge of Perfection
15° and 16°: Council, Princes of Jerusalem
17° and 18°: Chapter of Rose Croix
19° through 32°: Consistory

Whereas if you're going to go on about Pike & A Bridge to Light, you'd know that the Southern Jurisdiction bodies are divided as follows:
4° through 14°: Lodge of Perfection
15° through 18°: Chapter of Rose Croix
19° through 30°: Council of Kadosh
31° and 32°: Consistory

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Our "country" does not have laws that govern us.
We live under statutory code. Our rights are contracted to the federal government through the 14th amendment.

If you really want to get into a conversation about the Federal Government then I would love to hear what input a Mason might have.

Emperor Norton did post a link relating to this topic and I am guessing that he is a Mason. (although I do not understand how someone can be a Mason and Discordian at the same time. Unless, of course, he says that nothing can be more Discordian that becoming a Mason)

We do not live in a country, but we are employees of a corporation.

The citizens of the USA have all fallen prey to the bait and switch, and the umbrella for the codes under which we live was created by FDR (another Freemason).

Tell me...
What happened to Masonry between the founding of our country and the great government coup of 1933 (the emergency banking act)?

The only thing that I can think of is Albert Pike.

reply to post by Josephus23

I'm not sure if what you posted is real.

But if it is, it just isn't safe.

Identity Theft And Your Social Security Number
www.ssa.gov...

I alerted the staff. Hopefully, they get to it before Google caches it.

EDIT: Wow, that was quick. ATS staff simply amazes me at times.


[edit on 18/12/09 by ConspiracyNut23]

reply to post by JoshNorton

Originally posted by Project2501
Where have I said exactly that Pike is a load of crap & the Northern Jurisdiction is all that matters?

Originally posted by JoshNorton
Um, how about here?

Originally posted by Project2501
Also everyone doesn't subscribe to the butchered Albert pike system of the Scottish Rite that was reworked from the Francken Manuscripts.

Even the Southern Jurisdiction of the Scottish Rite has to rework Albert Pikes "butchered" mistakes. example in the 25th degree which today is a revised ritual, Because Pikes version of the degree did not consider that the Sufi rather than the Druze represented the mystical tradition of islam.

Btw the keyword "Butchered" that I used was in reference to #7 of its meaning which is that "to bungle; botch: to butcher a job."

Originally posted by JoshNorton
and here

Originally posted by Project2501
The Northern Masonic Jurisdiction is where the most important players in the history of America are. The Southern Jurisdiction is where we send the washed up talent.

Originally posted by JoshNorton
???

Yes?

Originally posted by JoshNorton
And going off about a Ben Franklin degree in the Northern Jurisdiction, but then listing Southern Jurisdiction Scottish Rite degree distributions and recommending A Bridge to Light, which is all about the Southern rituals. Pick a system a stick with it, because by confusing the two, you're only showing how much you don't know.

So if you're hooked on going on about Ben Franklin degrees in the Northern Jurisdiction, you'd know that the Northern Jurisdiction bodies are divided as follows:
4° through 14°: Lodge of Perfection
15° and 16°: Council, Princes of Jerusalem
17° and 18°: Chapter of Rose Croix
19° through 32°: Consistory

Whereas if you're going to go on about Pike & A Bridge to Light, you'd know that the Southern Jurisdiction bodies are divided as follows:
4° through 14°: Lodge of Perfection
15° through 18°: Chapter of Rose Croix
19° through 30°: Council of Kadosh
31° and 32°: Consistory

Why should I pick a system & stick with it? I'm I not free to pick & choose as I please? And I'm not confusing the 2 in anyway shape or form. What are you trying to do, Chisel away at my character like the "Mithraic Mysteries" A man from rough ashlar, The self made man? Also I stated the Northern Masonic Jurisdiction of the Scottish Rite bodies of the Surpreme Council perfectly in one of my previous post. I'm not following your logic? Could you or, Can you please reinforce it?

"The seething energies of Lucifer are in his hands and before he may step onward and upward, he must prove his ability to properly apply energy." p.51 The Lost Keys of Freemasonry

reply to post by Josephus23


You are arguing symantics at this point. Adherence to the law is part of the obligation.

Originally posted by Project2501


Even the Southern Jurisdiction of the Scottish Rite has to rework Albert Pikes "butchered" mistakes. example in the 25th degree which today is a revised ritual, Because Pikes version of the degree did not consider that the Sufi rather than the Druze represented the mystical tradition of islam.

The idea that Pike's ritual was somehow deformed comes from Waite, who mistakenly thought that the ritual published in Blanchard's "Scotch Rite Masonry Illustrated" was Pike's.

In reality, Pike's ritual is the most dramatic, poetic, and concise, of the various Scottish Rite ritual.

Also, Pike never said that he considered the Druzes "the mystical tradition of Islam". Pike was aware of the Sufi tradition, but preferred the Druzes because they incorporated Gnostic and Kabalistic elements. DeHoyos and Hutchens have preferred the the Sufis for one of the modern revisions, but the Pike original remains superior.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


Semantics IS LAW.

If you don't believe me, then ask a judge if his court is based on statutory law or constitutional law.
There is a HUGE difference that exists between the two.

I suppose that if it is just semantics that we argue concerning law then this aspect of the Bush v. Gore ruling doesn't apply.

"The individual citizen has no federal constitutional right to vote for electors for the President of the United States"

link to the ruling

You gotta come with something better than that Mr. Masonicus.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

You are arguing symantics at this point. Adherence to the law is part of the obligation.

I am shocked to hear a Freemason, who's goal is to understand the bifurcated goal of the lodge, argue a point based on semantics.
Unless, of course, you are willing this argument based on your own logic and your own reasoning.

The answers to my questions are becoming clearer and clearer with each reply I receive to this thread.

Project 2051 seems to know your "religion" better than you guys.



[edit on 18-12-2009 by Josephus23]

i want to chime in;

i think "masonry" as it is now is illegal, it completely goes against any republic that is ancient in order.to attempt to recreate any ancient republic through the use of knowing of such republic through initiation is illegal.to be of a world but to attempt to create from a world one is not from is why america is a failure.to attempt to initiate into a republic one is a foreigner to is why there are no true builders within the fabrication of america today.to attempt to make what is not secret to those who are initiated a secret to those who have not come into contact with the priest who initially initiates makes knowledge power, this act is illegal to the rights granted to each being as stated rights within the fabrication of america.to anyone that finds themselves a member of a society ,that is not the product of ones works or greater works through generation, you found yourself in the wrong place.

[edit on 18-12-2009 by Ausar]

reply to post by Ausar


Here is a link to the 1st installment of Bill Cooper's Mystery Babylon Series.

This series explains in great detail exactly why Freemasonry should be banned in this country.

Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon #1

[edit on 18-12-2009 by Josephus23]