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Secrecy is Repugnant: An honest request to Masons.

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posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:32 AM
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reply to post by Josephus23
 


Just post the secrets to all the masons powerrrrr!!!!! We want secrets!!!

And I'm bored at work and just took the time to read through this whole thread and all I really see is you saying people are attacking you whenever they respond to you. I don't believe I have seen one single person attacking you at all in here, just people refuting your claims. And you going on and on about releasing "secrets" (ohhhhhhhhh secrets!) but never posting anything.


[edit on 23-12-2009 by jeasahtheseer]




posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:39 AM
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Originally posted by Josephus23

You guys actually believe that through the initiations you will "hopefully" form a stronger bond with your creator (yourself actually, HUMANISM, because God, according to you, was created by MAN, through logic and reason, and any belief is in the construct of one's mind)



could you point me in the direction of this information? I realize I am but a low level porch mason, but if I thought I created God, I think I would know.

I can't wait to see this amazing discovery you seem to have. I am quite sure that the entire truth about masonry has been discussed on this forum multiple times in the past. What makes you think you are "the one" who possess any special knowledge that previous posters have missed?

You have proven in this thread that you have incorrect information on some of the subjects you claim to know. For example, the three great lights in masonry. Since any mason who has made it to the second degree of fellowcraft had to recite the catechism for the first degree, he would know this much like the back of his hand. If you still think you are correct, as any mason present or former to see the truth. I think you had a good premise for this thread here. And if you tried to actually not derail your own thread, you might have had some good discussions about it. I and several others have tried to discuss the OP only to be accused of attacking you. When you get a bit older, you will realize that those weren't attacks, but just rebuttals.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:45 AM
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Originally posted by network dude
So I guess we should start packing our bags now? I guess it would be wise to be ready to vacate the area. After all our greatest secret is about to be revealed. I just wonder if it will be the big one, or the really big one. Oh well, I will just wait and see.


No....

Just be ready for anyone who is reading this to never want to have anything to do with Freemasonry, unless they have no sense of self and then they might coming running to you.

You guys coordinate your responses, you lie and deceive, and anyone who is not in your "special club" is suspect of you guys and if they are not, then they might as well go ahead and join.
The only thing that the information that I will lay out will do is either justify the beliefs of the people who have forever been suspect of you guys, or it will attract the individuals to you who have no secure sense of self and need constant reinforcement that they are OKAY.

11:00 PM EST.

It's coming........



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:47 AM
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reply to post by Josephus23
 


is this really Alex Jones?

He did the same thing. Claimed to have a big earth shattering announcement, then presented a lie.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:52 AM
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reply to post by Josephus23
 


Yes we are all coordinating our responses, we email and call eachother and say "come onto ats, theres a anti mason here, lets get 'em!". Uhh ohhh, you got us!

.... Still waiting for the BIG announcement!....


[edit on 23-12-2009 by jeasahtheseer]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:53 AM
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reply to post by network dude
 


And BTW...

It has everything to do with my OP.

In fact. I will be quoting HEAVILY from Kennedy's speech.

You see...

A rational, responsible adult would have ignored me if what I was saying was incorrect. If you recall, I didn't respond until almost 5 pages into the responses, and if you took the time to surf through ATS then you would see that threads that start with one or two replies go hardly noticed.

But obviously I struck a nerve because my post got over 100 replies before I even stepped back into the foray.
YOU GUYS started the name calling with project 2051, and it is this behavior that made me begin to look in the direction that I was looking to begin with.

THE VERY *IDEA* OF SECRECY IS REPUGNANT IN A FREE AND OPEN GOVERNMENT.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:54 AM
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reply to post by Josephus23
 


This is a message board, its for debate and discussion. Nothing wrong with people responding to you if you post something incorrect.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 09:56 AM
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Originally posted by jeasahtheseer
reply to post by Josephus23
 


Just post the secrets to all the masons powerrrrr!!!!! We want secrets!!!

And I'm bored at work and just took the time to read through this whole thread and all I really see is you saying people are attacking you whenever they respond to you. I don't believe I have seen one single person attacking you at all in here, just people refuting your claims. And you going on and on about releasing "secrets" (ohhhhhhhhh secrets!) but never posting anything.


[edit on 23-12-2009 by jeasahtheseer]


There are no secrets to a Masons power. The answer is SO obvious that I can not believe that more people don't see straight through it.

The answer was in the TITLE to my thread.

Just keep coming back.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:16 AM
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I thought about responding to him out of respect because he showed me great respect, but Norton sealed the deal with his childish response.
Norton is now known as Greyface Josh.
The pope has retracted all of your rights to a Discordian high holy name.

Emperor Norton doesn't want his good name hijacked any longer.



Name calling? Great. Gobble, Gobble, Gobble, Gobble, Gobble.



If you were to read the Principia Discordia rather than illuminatus!(however this is still a great read), then you would get the just of this inside joke.

One that requires no initiation, secret meeting nor handshake, but just the purchase of a book.

Like I said, your true colors shown like a fluorescent light in a criminals face.

I had high hopes for you.



[edit on 23-12-2009 by Josephus23]

[edit on 23-12-2009 by Josephus23]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:18 AM
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reply to post by Josephus23
 



The very word "secrecy" is repugnant in a free and open society; and we are as a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths and to secret proceedings. We decided long ago that the dangers of excessive and unwarranted concealment of pertinent facts far outweighed the dangers which are cited to justify it. Even today, there is little value in opposing the threat of a closed society by imitating its arbitrary restrictions. Even today, there is little value in insuring the survival of our nation if our traditions do not survive with it. And there is very grave danger that an announced need for increased security will be seized upon by those anxious to expand its meaning to the very limits of official censorship and concealment. That I do not intend to permit to the extent that it is in my control. And no official of my Administration, whether his rank is high or low, civilian or military, should interpret my words here tonight as an excuse to censor the news, to stifle dissent, to cover up our mistakes or to withhold from the press and the public the facts they deserve to know. But I do ask every publisher, every editor, and every newsman in the nation to reexamine his own standards, and to recognize the nature of our country's peril. In time of war, the government and the press have customarily joined in an effort based largely on self-discipline, to prevent unauthorized disclosures to the enemy. In time of "clear and present danger," the courts have held that even the privileged rights of the First Amendment must yield to the public's need for national security. Today no war has been declared--and however fierce the struggle may be, it may never be declared in the traditional fashion. Our way of life is under attack. Those who make themselves our enemy are advancing around the globe. The survival of our friends is in danger. And yet no war has been declared, no borders have been crossed by marching troops, no missiles have been fired. If the press is awaiting a declaration of war before it imposes the self-discipline of combat conditions, then I can only say that no war ever posed a greater threat to our security. If you are awaiting a finding of "clear and present danger," then I can only say that the danger has never been more clear and its presence has never been more imminent. It requires a change in outlook, a change in tactics, a change in missions--by the government, by the people, by every businessman or labor leader, and by every newspaper. For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy that relies primarily on covert means for expanding its sphere of influence--on infiltration instead of invasion, on subversion instead of elections, on intimidation instead of free choice, on guerrillas by night instead of armies by day. It is a system which has conscripted vast human and material resources into the building of a tightly knit, highly efficient machine that combines military, diplomatic, intelligence, economic, scientific and political operations. Its preparations are concealed, not published. Its mistakes are buried, not headlined. Its dissenters are silenced, not praised. No expenditure is questioned, no rumor is printed, no secret is revealed. It conducts the Cold War, in short, with a war-time discipline no democracy would ever hope or wish to match.

link to source


If you read this portion of his speech, You know, the one you started this thread about, you will notice he was speaking to the press about policing their news reports to not give away national secrets.
Kennedy was a member of a secret society. Knights of Columbus. In case you didn't know about them, they are a Catholic group formed to give catholics something like masonry.

Now, on with the enlightenment.

BTW, you're late. 11:00am EST came and went.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by network dude]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:28 AM
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reply to post by Josephus23
 


Kennedy said that that he doesn't want ANYONE in the press to interpret this as a reason to censor ANYTHING.
HE WAS CALLING FOR COMPLETE OPENNESS IN GOVERNMENT.


You're completely right. Thanks for pointing that out.


It is clear that Kennedy insn't asking for "censorship or any new types of security classifications". He is simply asking them [the press] to use good jugement in their reporting. (Of course, the same words spoken by Bush would surely be interpreted very differently.)

I'm seeing that your thread will now take a somewhat religious turn, and I'll probably not be able to add to it much, as I'm sure you don't want this to turn into a theist vs atheist debate. (that one is sure to derail the thread BIG TIME, and if I were a disinformation agent, I'd surely jump at the opportunity.
)

PS- Unlike some posters, I am a conspiracy theorist, and proud of it! I would think that in a conspiracy forum, the term wouldn't be used in a deragotory fashion.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:45 AM
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Now, on with the enlightenment.

BTW, you're late. 11:00am EST came and went.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by network dude]


I just woke up....

Thank you for pointing out my mistake.

I meant 11:00 PM EST. TONIGHT.

Just keep coming back.

And I am glad that people are finally noticing what my OP was referencing.

Stars for you CN23.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 10:52 AM
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Originally posted by ConspiracyNut23
reply to post by Josephus23
 


Kennedy said that that he doesn't want ANYONE in the press to interpret this as a reason to censor ANYTHING.
HE WAS CALLING FOR COMPLETE OPENNESS IN GOVERNMENT.


You're completely right. Thanks for pointing that out.


It is clear that Kennedy insn't asking for "censorship or any new types of security classifications". He is simply asking them [the press] to use good jugement in their reporting. (Of course, the same words spoken by Bush would surely be interpreted very differently.)

I'm seeing that your thread will now take a somewhat religious turn, and I'll probably not be able to add to it much, as I'm sure you don't want this to turn into a theist vs atheist debate. (that one is sure to derail the thread BIG TIME, and if I were a disinformation agent, I'd surely jump at the opportunity.
)

PS- Unlike some posters, I am a conspiracy theorist, and proud of it! I would think that in a conspiracy forum, the term wouldn't be used in a deragotory fashion.


I have to run CN23, but I wan to tell you that my next post will have a religious tone, but that is because Masonry is a religion. No matter how much they try and deny it.

Masonry offers SALVATION.
Mason's offer salvation through discovery of self.
Whereas the true Abrahamic faiths offer salvation through that which is freely given by God.

As for the Knights of Columbus.
Kennedy took an oath to office when he became president and I feel confident that he realized exactly what that meant, and he renounced ALL other "higher" oaths and allegiances.
Thus, he got his brains splattered. So So So So sad.

Adding you as a friend CN23.
You have enlightened me and I greatly appreciate it.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by Josephus23]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 11:01 AM
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It be interesting to look up what kind of bills Kennedy's Administration was trying to push through at the time he gave his speech.

We know that Kennedy voted for "The first Patriot Act" (ISA), so maybe he was trying to enforce his words through legislation.

The CIA had already heavily infiltrated the media via Operation Mockingbird. But after Kennedy fired Dulles, who knows if he ever fully regained control of the CIA.

The leaks Kennedy mentions in the speech could have been deliberate manipulations by CIA assets. (this is pure speculation on my part - maybe I'll give it more though, and perhaps ask Mr. Marrs if it's worth pursuing)


[edit on 23/12/09 by ConspiracyNut23]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 11:09 AM
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Originally posted by Josephus23
Masonry is a religion. No matter how much they try and deny it.

Masonry offers SALVATION.
Whether salvation through discovery of self or through that which is freely given by God.


I am confused. I thought my salvation came from My belief in Jesus Christ and God the father. Never in any part of masonry has ANY promise of eternal life been given. We all say we hope to be welcomed into the gates of heaven, but that is a far cry from the guarantee of everlasting life. I think you might be spreading a bit of fertilizer here.



As for the Knights of Columbus.
Kennedy took an oath to office when he became president and I feel confident that he realized exactly what that meant, and he renounced ALL other "higher" oaths and allegiances.
Thus, he got his brains splattered. So So So So sad.

could you point to the proof of this "fact", cuz if you can't then it's a fantasy/lie/bs opinion/whatever.



edit to add: Sorry about missing the PM thing. My mistake.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by network dude]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 11:20 AM
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Originally posted by network dude

Originally posted by Josephus23
Masonry is a religion. No matter how much they try and deny it.

Masonry offers SALVATION.
Whether salvation through discovery of self or through that which is freely given by God.


I am confused. I thought my salvation came from My belief in Jesus Christ and God the father. Never in any part of masonry has ANY promise of eternal life been given. We all say we hope to be welcomed into the gates of heaven, but that is a far cry from the guarantee of everlasting life. I think you might be spreading a bit of fertilizer here.



As for the Knights of Columbus.
Kennedy took an oath to office when he became president and I feel confident that he realized exactly what that meant, and he renounced ALL other "higher" oaths and allegiances.
Thus, he got his brains splattered. So So So So sad.

could you point to the proof of this "fact", cuz if you can't then it's a fantasy/lie/bs opinion/whatever.



edit to add: Sorry about missing the PM thing. My mistake.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by network dude]

11:00 PM Kind Sir.

You can tell me that you believe in salvation through Jesus Christ, but that does not matter in the TRUE FAITH of the ABRAHAMIC RELIGIONS.
The only thing that brings the TRUE FAITH of salvation is simply the belief and reverence of the ONE God.
A God completely unknown from my perception of anything and nothing that I can do will bring me closer to or further away from God. THAT is ALL.
The rest is a learning experience and we are to use the God given powers of logic and reason to determine our course.

You guys have PERVERTED the TRUE FAITH.

Plenty of information found on the Net shows how the mystery schools have infiltrated religions (Christianity, Judaism, Islam etc..) to make them mimic their belief and ritual.

11:00 PM EST. Later.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 11:26 AM
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Originally posted by ConspiracyNut23
It be interesting to look up what kind of bills Kennedy's Administration was trying to push through at the time he gave his speech.

We know that Kennedy voted for "The first Patriot Act" (ISA), so maybe he was trying to enforce his words through legislation.

The CIA had already heavily infiltrated the media via Operation Mockingbird. But after Kennedy fired Dulles, who knows if he ever fully regained control of the CIA.

The leaks Kennedy mentions in the speech could have been deliberate manipulations by CIA assets. (this is pure speculation on my part - maybe I'll give it more though, and perhaps ask Mr. Marrs if it's worth pursuing)


[edit on 23/12/09 by ConspiracyNut23]


Kennedy's administration was an enigma, but the one thing for sure that can be said is that his behavior when he first became president and his behavior for the previous 9 to 10 months before his execution was like night and day.

He figured out something and knew that something was up and he wanted to tell EVERYBODY.

Because the VERY IDEA OF SECRECY IS REPUGNANT IN A FREE AND OPEN NATION.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 11:43 AM
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reply to post by Josephus23
 


A 'free and open society' essentially means no privacy, no personal gain and no sense of self. These are all positive things, and have motivated people to accomplish great things, and will motivate even greater accomplishments to come. I have no problem with a 'secret' society, as it is every human's right to confer information (in whatever form, be it 'knowledge', experiences, etc.) to whom they see fit or to whom they are comfortable with. I believe that so many detractors of Freemasonry and other 'secret' societies are either bearing a grudge from a personal slight, or basically just feeling left out. We always want what we can't have and want even more what someone else does have or has had.
As far as groups such as the Masons and whomever else perpetrating nefarious deeds to bring subjugation to an otherwise obese, lazy, willfully ignorant populace, well...that remains to be seen.
I am an ardent believer, however, that in order to do a lot of good, sometimes you need to do a little evil.



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 12:14 PM
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Originally posted by Josephus23

Originally posted by network dude

Originally posted by Josephus23
Masonry is a religion. No matter how much they try and deny it.

Masonry offers SALVATION.
Whether salvation through discovery of self or through that which is freely given by God.


I am confused. I thought my salvation came from My belief in Jesus Christ and God the father. Never in any part of masonry has ANY promise of eternal life been given. We all say we hope to be welcomed into the gates of heaven, but that is a far cry from the guarantee of everlasting life. I think you might be spreading a bit of fertilizer here.



As for the Knights of Columbus.
Kennedy took an oath to office when he became president and I feel confident that he realized exactly what that meant, and he renounced ALL other "higher" oaths and allegiances.
Thus, he got his brains splattered. So So So So sad.

could you point to the proof of this "fact", cuz if you can't then it's a fantasy/lie/bs opinion/whatever.



edit to add: Sorry about missing the PM thing. My mistake.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by network dude]


11:00 PM Kind Sir.

You can tell me that you believe in salvation through Jesus Christ, but that does not matter in the TRUE FAITH of the ABRAHAMIC RELIGIONS.
The only thing that brings the TRUE FAITH of salvation is simply the belief and reverence of the ONE God.
A God completely unknown from my perception of anything and nothing that I can do will bring me closer to or further away from God. THAT is ALL.
The rest is a learning experience and we are to use the God given powers of logic and reason to determine our course.

You guys have PERVERTED the TRUE FAITH.

Plenty of information found on the Net shows how the mystery schools have infiltrated religions (Christianity, Judaism, Islam etc..) to make them mimic their belief and ritual.

11:00 PM EST. Later.

I guess I worded my question wrong. I will type it slow for you so you don't miss it this time. k. Question: Where is the proof of your statement about what President Kennedy renounced? My faith and belief is mine and mine alone. Yours, or lack there of, is personal to you. Whatever your choice. My point is that just because you say that masonry is a religion and offers salvation does not make it true. Salvation is the guarantee that one will transcend the earthly world and in death be reborn into the realm of the father. Or whatever your personal belief may be. (since I haven't croaked yet, I am just kind of guessing on that) My salvation was guaranteed by my baptism (in my belief ) For the record, I am not a disinfo agent and I am not trying to derail this thread. I would very much like to discuss the topic of the OP, but my repeated attempts have failed. Enjoy your earth-shattering revelation. I am sure your followers will be worshiping you later tonight. BTW, do you offer any salvation to them?

[edit on 23-12-2009 by network dude]



posted on Dec, 23 2009 @ 12:21 PM
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Re: Knights of Columbus Oath

Has anyone found a decent link to the Knights of Columbus rituals? (or a book suggestion)

I'd love to read what kind of oaths Kennedy took as a member.

The ones I've found online appear to be faked. (they claim it parallels some sort of Jesuit satanic oath, which I doubt. lol)

[edit on 23/12/09 by ConspiracyNut23]



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