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Why UFOlogy is a joke to the mainstream

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posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 11:06 AM
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If anyone has been to the thread about the alien zapping a cop, you will now know why fake videos about aliens/ufos are so rampant on the net....the gullibilty of people. The OP and the blind believers that discuss whether or not it is fake or not would be laughable, if it wasn't so sad. This site is great..it is those people that ruin it and make it a joke to some people on the net. They are also the reason..UFOlogy will never be taken seriously amongst scientists and the mainstream media.




posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 11:13 AM
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I tend to agree with you.
20 years ago, if you had known virtually everyone would have a phone/camera, and such a thing as youtube would exist, you would probably have thought how good it would be for the UFO community.
Sadly, it has been quite the reverse.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 11:39 AM
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What I've found a lot though is people just say it's fake, or cgi, but then don't say why. Myself I don't know much about making fake videos, if anything, so if someone says such things, and I ask "why do you think it's fake", it's not cause i'm totally convinced it's real, it's just i'm curious of the method.

What makes it fake? is somehow assumed to mean "I think it's real and will not be convinced otherwise".


Most videos on ATS are debunked after a discussion. Gotta be around 95% of them. Some of these discussions take up quite a few pages and can showcase the great analytical abilities of many members, as well as the more "human" aspects like simple curiousity. I get a kick out of such descussions.

"Ask a stupid question you're an idiot for a moment. Don't ask it and you might be an idiot for a lifetime", or something like that, is how the saying goes I think. So just remember the guy who wants proof in a thread might just demand evidence in order for him/her to comfortably accept something as fact, like "its fake". Remember though, that person is now aware of one more way to see how such things are faked.


[edit on 1-12-2009 by heyo]



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 11:55 AM
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I'm in two minds about all of this. I've been a sceptic for quite some time (didn't start out a sceptic), and have observed changing attitudes among fellow sceptics. It used to be that there was a perception among UFO believers that sceptics would write off anything they said without examining it thoroughly. I think, in many cases, that was justified. Sceptics were as disinterested in UFOs as they were with claims of fairies.

In the last few years a middle ground has emerged, sceptics who are interested in UFOs because, regardless of their social connotations, the phenomena touches on all kinds of interesting things. Like meteorology, space, witness psychology, photographic/video technology, and countless other interesting things.

Which tends to mean better engagement with people making claims of having seen a UFO, or experienced something out of the ordinary. Less hostility, less stereotyping (which is backed up by studies of belief in things like UFOs), and that's a better situation.

There also seems to be more 'sceptical believers' (seems like an oxymoron, but true) who believe in the ET hypothesis, but treat claims sceptically.

So, in some ways, and maybe the ATS UFO forum has spoilt me, I think UFOlogy is in a better position than before the emergence of interested sceptics and sceptical believers. If it's a trend it'd go some way toward unlinking UFOlogy with prominent charlatans.

But, if it's not a trend, it's the same as it ever was. Just with the internet
.

Edit: Bad grammar.

[edit on 1-12-2009 by jackphotohobby]



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 12:59 PM
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Why UFOlogy is a joke to the mainstream


Because of the people that believe everything. And the bar for what is a real UFO is set so low, i mean we have people now shooting video of planes and saying they are morphing orbs. It was funny that FOX of all networks decided to shell out a bunch of money to do their alien autopsy show which latter was shown to be a hoax, although im sure there are people here that still believe that it is real. It is a joke to the mainstream because for the most part every major UFO video that comes out turns out to be a hoax. The latest Spain fisherman UFO for example
www.abovetopsecret.com...
on pages 6-8 it was pretty much prooven to be a hoax but what happened? It went on to 32 pages. Anyone reading that thread would laugh because the people who believe everything believe everything no matter how many times they look dumb for not questioning what they are seeing.
Anyone from any news agency researching UFOs on the net would end up at ATS at some point and they would see what people will believe in. So why is it a joke to the mainstream? Because of the open skulled believers!
I find it ironic that in this group of people there are ones that do not have the brain power to spot CGI but somehow can see the mass NWO Illuminati conspiracy.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 01:42 PM
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reply to post by zaiger
 


I'm a three year vetren of the ET/UFO issue and after some 22 books on the subject I am totally convinced that "we are not alone".

However talking to friends, they immediately cry "BS".

So to counteract this I started buying DVD' on the issue, in fact I just about have all of them. Then I started passing them around to the same people who said there was nothing to it.

Well, what a change in opinions, all of them started to ask me more questions and then began to really consider the subject as being real.

Also most of them asked me which books to buy.

So a picture tells a thousand words.

So if you are serious about this subject and want to spread the word, get some DVD' such as "Out of the Blue", any of the "Disclosure Project", Jim Marrs presentations etc etc.

The one issue which keeps coming up is the fact that we are being lied to, AND THATS THE THING THAT P***ES ME OFF.

Dont forget what Stephen Bassett says.

"Its not about the lights in the sky, its about the lies on the ground.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 01:47 PM
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Why is UFOlogy a joke to the mainstream media? It comes down to this...if anything, many of us are too openminded. Nearly everything is an alien from space... Unable, or unwilling, to believe, oddly enough, that something can be completely mundane.

Really, that's the only fault that prevents UFOlogy from being taken more seriously...



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 01:57 PM
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The media are to blame aswell for actually giving some airtime to the nuts of the ufo scene. Equating ufos' with aliens, showing crappy hoax pics/videos as genuine and talking about well known cases that don't have much evidence to back them up...Roswell being a prime example of a case that is overblown when imo it is inferior in regards to evidence compared to alot of little known ones.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 01:59 PM
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I think it's important to distinguish between ufology - the study of unidentified flying objects - and a forum discussing UFOs & Aliens. Arguing that "ufology is a joke" because of gullible people on a forum would be like arguing that "astronomy is a joke" because of the 2012 forums.

The percentage of people in here actually studying, researching and evaluating the data and evidence is very very small. So, first of all, most of what is addressed in this forum can't even be classified as 'ufology' per se.

Secondly, if one takes the time to think, historically, about ufology and the way it's seen by the general public and the media, one obviously comes to the conclusion that ATS, or any other forum, doesn't have anything to do with it.

The media and the public in general have never, since the topic became mainstream, long before there was even an internet, taken it seriously.

We could of course debate, until we're blue in the face, whether there is some more sinister reason why the media, which directly influences a lot of people's perceptions and opinions, treats the subject of UFOs like it does; but the point remains quite apparent, in my opinion, that forums or what goes on the internet doesn't have anything to do with it.

Saying that it's because "there's a lot of gullible people" doesn't cut it either, because if it was truly because of that, the media wouldn't take religions and religious people seriously either.

In my opinion, it comes down to the social conditioning of people to think that UFOs are nothing but the imagination of crazy people. Society in general doesn't take UFOs seriously, so of course the internet and other mediums are going to reflect those social trends.


[edit on 1-12-2009 by converge]



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 02:03 PM
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Originally posted by seagull
Why is UFOlogy a joke to the mainstream media? It comes down to this...if anything, many of us are too openminded. Nearly everything is an alien from space... Unable, or unwilling, to believe, oddly enough, that something can be completely mundane.

Really, that's the only fault that prevents UFOlogy from being taken more seriously...


That's one of the things hitting the nail right on the head right there. Myself being me don't give them the credit of being too open minded insomuch as I would say gullible. But, granddad always had a saying, be open minded, just not so much that your brains fall out.

I'll give those ufo crazies credit on having such an imagination tho, it must be great at times to be spooked so easily and gain such wonder at the most mundane of things, even if they are wrong 99.9999999% of the time.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 02:10 PM
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reply to post by kerazeesicko
 


Ufology (in the sense of the possibility of alien life and such) isn't a "thing" from the modern days. It has been around since the 30's, and if you consider other accounts, it may also go back to pre-historic times.

The way people see it is the factor that changed. Now people call some strange stuff in the sky "UFO", because, it is that... a U.F.O. .

But centuries ago, they would call them "demons", "angels", "signs from gods". Only with the technological progress, people started to look at them like machines, from Earth or beyond.

Because of religious reasons, ufology was always a joke, since day one. Blaming the Internet all the "jokers" for it isn't correct.

Before internet there was photo manipulation, before that there were legends and stories...

And the opposite process also occurs. Medicine was seen as a joke when it appeared, and it took a long time for people to start leaving spiritual "help" and going for medicine.



I'm not saying that these things are positive, its the opposite. I'm just saying that this wars of blame don't help at all. Any second wasted with this people, is one second we all waste, instead of searching for the real truth.

If people stop giving this people attention (like everyone does with David Wilcock for instance...) the problem will eventually go away.

When something pops up, you either dismiss it, or support it (WITH GOOD REASON). Most of those stupid discussions hurt ufology.

[edit on 1/12/09 by Tifozi]



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 02:11 PM
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reply to post by Solomons
 


Agreed. Those are the folks that make good press. You know that old saw, about dog biting man isn't news, man biting dog, that's news...that's exactly how the big media looks at it when doing any programming concerning UFOlogy.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 02:18 PM
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reply to post by CoffinFeeder
 



I'll give those ufo crazies credit on having such an imagination tho, it must be great at times to be spooked so easily and gain such wonder at the most mundane of things, even if they are wrong 99.9999999% of the time.


It's imagination that leads to answers in other fields, so imagination can't be considered a wrong. People want so badly to believe that there is something out there that they grab onto anything that remotely answers those needs...again, nothing really "wrong" there.

Gullible? Maybe. That's better, IMHO, than being too close minded to think outside the box.

That's the trick, though... To be open-minded enough to think outside the box, without falling into an abyss of silliness...



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 04:11 PM
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Nonsense, 99.5% of the worlds population probably will never visit conspiracy site, let alone this one. Threads here have no bearing on the mainstream opinion of UFOlogy. Things like movies and television programs have a much greater impact. Media has a big role to play. They also are not influenced by sites like this.

Most people in fact, I've found if not interested, don't really care one way or the other. If they were offered very solid facts in either direction, they'd probably latch onto that. Most folks I talk to about the subject have very little real knowledge of UFOS at all. They have usually heard of Roswell, but don't know wany facts, have heard of Area 51, but don't know what to think about it. The media, who I think has been a tool of the government for a long time as disinformation, have made UFOs a bit of a mockery. However, public attitude has changed I think, due to movies and television shows.

But I highly doubt even the nuttiest threads here will ever have even a minor impact on a smidgen of the population of the world. I love the site, but honestly, if people aren't interested in this sort of thing, they don't visit these sites. And unlike some other types of sites, this sort of thing you don't often stumble upon, unless you are actively looking for it. Most people don't google "cop car ray gun burned to crisp" for example.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 05:24 PM
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reply to post by converge
 


Who are you, and how did you get so insightful and wise?

Very good post.

Applause from me anyway..........



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 05:49 PM
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Originally posted by Solomons
The media are to blame aswell for actually giving some airtime to the nuts of the ufo scene. Equating ufos' with aliens, showing crappy hoax pics/videos as genuine and talking about well known cases that don't have much evidence to back them up...


Well said Solomons - don't forget the newsreader 'rolling their eyes' whilst accompanied by the kooky music.


Don't know if you've seen it before but Terry Hansen makes some very good points in this video about the treatment the UFO subject receives in the corporate media:



Google Video Link



"A mesmerizing account of his investigation into whether some of America's most influential news organizations, many having maintained close ties to the U.S. intelligence community, have willingly suppressed full and accurate news coverage of extraterrestrial related phenomena for a variety of "national-security" reasons. Hansen reveals the remarkable and persistent difference in UFO-related news coverage exhibited by local and national news organizations and reviews the history of censorship and propaganda during the twentieth century and the evidence for media-government collusion over the course of the half-century-long UFO controversy. Terry Hansen is an independent journalist with an interest in scientific controversies and the politics of mass media. He is author of The Missing Times: News Media Complicity in the UFO Cover-up. He has organized and moderated two symposiums about the science and politics of UFO research for the Science Museum of Minnesota. Hansen holds a bachelor’s degree in biology and a master’s degree in science journalism, both from the University of Minnesota. He was a founding partner of KFH Publications, Inc., a Seattle computer-magazine publishing company. This presentation covers some of the more recent and important stories that have been suppressed by the media cartels and powers-that-be. "


Cheers.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 06:01 PM
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reply to post by CoffinFeeder
 


I'd just say its 'wilfull ignorance' -plain and simple.

Regarding your post about prosaic explanations and percentages - its actualy about 30 per cent of cases which remain unexplained..



"The opposite conclusion could have been drawn from The Condon Report's content, namely, that a phenomenon with such a high ratio of unexplained cases (about 30 percent) should arouse sufficient scientific curiosity to continue its study."
"From a scientific and engineering standpoint, it is unacceptable to simply ignore substantial numbers of unexplained observations... the only promising approach is a continuing moderate-level effort with emphasis on improved data collection by objective means... involving available remote sensing capabilities and certain software changes."
Ronald D Story - American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics UFO Subcommittee -New York: Doubleday, 1980



"Probably the most striking discrepancy in the Condon report, however, was between its contents and conclusions. Condon had concluded that science could gain nothing from studying UFOs. Yet, the report ended up with a near 30 percent unexplained rate, and a core of cases that came within a hair's breadth of being conclusive evidence for the reality of alien technology – cases which, under the most rigorous analysis, appeared to be the result of extraordinary craft in the skies."
Richard Dolan PHD



"There are unidentified flying objects. That is, there are a hard core of cases - perhaps 20 to 30 percent in different studies - for which there is no explanation... We can only imagine what purpose lies behind the activities of these quiet, harmlessly cruising objects that time and again approach the earth. The most likely explanation, it seems to me, is that they are simply watching what we are up to." (Redbook, vol. 143)
Dr. Margaret Mead, world-renowned Anthropologist



..and if you want to talk about the word gullible then try just mindlessly beleiving these USAF UFO explanations without ever looking into them for yourself.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 06:35 PM
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Reporting and analysis of UFO sightings are important.
I don't think we get them often enough and complete enough.
Things like saying they investigated a crash site after the MIB
came by within 15 minuets after the crash and took out three little
people disguised as aliens.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 07:00 PM
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reply to post by fleabit
 


I was curious if anybody was going to point that out, fleabit!

I've noticed a weird trend on internet forums, especially forums that have a defined focus (be it UFOs, bigfoot, fixing cars, what-have-you), and there's a kind of false importance that crops up. The forums discuss amongst themselves for so long that they start forgetting that there's an outside world that is discussing the very same thing (and without their input! For shame!). ATS is just a website, among literally millions of websites, that has a focus on these subjects (I will say it's so far my favorite, though).

UFOlogy is getting worked over by scam artists and "entrepreneurs" that are hoping to exploit it for their own gain. And they are doing very well on that front.

Penn and Teller's BS isn't exactly a "scientific" show, but I think their alien abduction show was a wonderful example of why normal people look at UFOlogy as a joke:




Have a laugh, and then take a good hard look at yourself, and ask whether or not you belong in that video. That's a good first step.



posted on Dec, 1 2009 @ 07:52 PM
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reply to post by EsSeeEye
 


LMAO...this is exactly how I view the abduction phenomenon. Complete BS! I pity those people that actually believe this is happening to them or is happening to other people. Alien abduction is media driven and the abductions differ from era to era....now we are more technoligically advance so of course the aliens have to be more advanced than us....before the alien had tech similiar to ours because it was the 50', 60's and so on. Stories should not count as evidence, nor should the supposed inplants that look remarkably like rocks, pieces of glass or pieces of metal in places you would find them if you had taken a fall and had not realized something got embedded in you. I am what you would call "want to believe" guy, but so far nothing that points to outright evidence just possibilties. I have witnessed UFO's and believe it ot be black op stuff but I am willing to accept that they are alien once the evidence can back it up.

They are some interesting encounters out there..but nothing that outright screams alien. I was wondering about one incident about the guy who said he witnessed a mile or five mile wide ufo in texas somewhere....sure there was radar to help his story...but my thought is this...if somethuing that big came that close to the ground and you were on a farm, why was there no other witnesses to back his story up...I am sure he lived near a road or highway. Something that big would not be that hard to see for miles....but he was the only one to see it...hmmmm.

[edit on 1-12-2009 by kerazeesicko]



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