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Don't be fooled by ATS' professional debunkers

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posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 02:49 AM
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bsbray, don't waste your time with these buffoons.

I showed them a video from NBC News AND transcripts of FDNY Chief of Safety Albert Turley and firefighters talking about bombs and secondary explosives devices planted in the towers.

Their responses were, "the explosions were faked" and "show me a photo of the bomb."



[edit on 4-12-2009 by GoldenFleece]




posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 04:50 AM
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Originally posted by GoldenFleece
bsbray, don't waste your time with these buffoons.


You are the buffoon here, you claimed ""Bombs and "secondary devices" were discovered by FDNY firefighters, including the FDNY Public Safety Chief." "

Then had to back away as there was no proof that they were discovered at all!
So where are the photo's of the bombs? Just another truther lie!



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 04:59 AM
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Originally posted by dereks
But truthers think someone running around like in a James Bond movie, sticking a few egg timers to a wall can bring down a building!


And yet debunkers think that only plane damage + fire brought the buildings down.

So, according to you, it's either no explosives can do the job or it has to be tonnes of explosives.


Why is it always the two extremes with you people and never somewhere in the middle?



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 05:17 AM
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Originally posted by dereks
You are the buffoon here, you claimed ""Bombs and "secondary devices" were discovered by FDNY firefighters, including the FDNY Public Safety Chief." "

Then had to back away as there was no proof that they were discovered at all!

Not backing away from anything. Here it is again, at 2:49 and 4:00 in:


I'll let other ATS members determine who has no proof and who the liar is.



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 05:30 AM
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Originally posted by Nutter

And yet debunkers think that only plane damage + fire brought the buildings down.

So, according to you, it's either no explosives can do the job


Where did I claim that? Stop making things up



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 05:35 AM
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reply to post by GoldenFleece
 


Let's recap.

There's many reports of secondary explosions. Even on NEWS casts of the day.

Yet the government refuses to investigate about any explosives and goes on to lie and say that no one heard explosions?

Things that make you go Hmmmmm.......



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 05:37 AM
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Originally posted by dereks
Where did I claim that? Stop making things up


Well, what are you claiming then? Since this is the official line of what brought the buildings down.

[edit on 4-12-2009 by Nutter]



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 05:43 AM
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Originally posted by dereks

Originally posted by Nutter

And yet debunkers think that only plane damage + fire brought the buildings down.

So, according to you, it's either no explosives can do the job


Where did I claim that? Stop making things up


No wonder people are loosing their faith in these debunkers, government loyalists, or agents. They can't even keep their story straight from one page to the other.


Of course another little fact the truthers ignore is that the seismographs that recorded the event show no sign of a explosion, so not only are the explosives invisible they also leave no physical evidence - care to explain that?


www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 05:43 AM
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reply to post by Lillydale
 


Well, if I was dumb enough to accept everything the MSM and our elected reps told us, then I would agree with you. However, I know that Saddam Hussien trained terrorists that DID launch terrorist attacks against the United States and am fully aware that while the WMDs might not have been in the amounts claimed, a bunch were found, not to mention all the supplies and equipment were found to rapidly produce mass amounts of chemical weapons.

The main problem with the WMD issue, is people like to claim 1. Well, there were only about 500 chem weapons found or 2. They were produced before the Gulf War. Neither of which matters, because by the rules of the cease fire, Saddam was supposed to account for, and destroy all of them, including the items necessary to make them and he did not.


Now, about 9/11. To this DAY, certain intelligence agencies (non-U.S.) claim that Mohammed Atta was meeting with Iraqi intelligence. The truth movement ignores this, and goes with the CIA line that the hijackers never met with Iraqi government officials. The same CIA that the truthers believe planned and carried out the attacks......


In addition, I find it curious that Abu Nidal, who perfected the art of airliner hijackings in the 70s/80s and was teaching at a terrorist training camp in Baghdad.....was executed by Saddam when the US started talking about invading Iraq.

Whether or not history will bear out the above two paragraphs remains to be seen. However, there is more evidence to support those than there is to support the "truth" movement.



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 06:42 AM
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reply to post by GoldenFleece
 


Let's look at Chief Turi's statement shall we

"So we ran back to the car and laying right in
back of my car was a large object which I thought was
probably part of one of the aircraft turbines. It was
laying about ten feet away from the car and it was
still on fire, smoking and fire."

Well, that would explain HIS burned out car at least....

"And I thought to myself that, based on other
high-rise fires that had burned out of control, that we
would probably have some type of localized collapse up
on the upper floors, especially in the core area of the
building, which I mistakenly thought was block
construction. After further investigation, of course,
after the fact, it wasn't block construction. The
elevator cores were encased in sheetrock actually"

So he thought there was going to be at least a localized collapse because of the fire and that there was sturdier construction around the elevator shafts.


"Then Steve Mosiello, Chief Ganci's executive
assistant, came over to the command post and he said
we're getting reports from OEM that the buildings are
not structurally sound, and of course that got our
attention really quick"

Hmm, seems like there was a concern about structure issues from the start.

"He just nodded in agreement. We were looking
at two large bodies of fires that neither of us in our
33-year careers had ever seen anything that enormous."

So much for these being little bitty fires as claimed by some of the truth movement.

"The next thing I heard was Pete say what the
# is this? And as my eyes traveled up the building,
and I was looking at the south tower, somewhere about
halfway up, my initial reaction was there was a
secondary explosion, and the entire floor area, a ring
right around the building blew out."

This statement is used quite a bit by truthers, however, here is the very next line of his statement.....

"I later realized
that the building had started to collapse already and
this was the air being compressed and that is the floor
that let go."

This event, is noticable from footage taken by the news helicopters that day. From above, it is easy to see that its the building starting to collapse, those on the ground would not see that.

"How long do you think the debris was coming
down for, guesstimating?

A. I'm going to guesstimate like a minute."

So much for the building totally collapsing in nine seconds.

"And I started walking south on West Street to
find out where Chief Ganci went when I heard this
enormous roar. It was the same roar I heard when the
south tower collapsed and I knew that this was
collapsing."

Amazingly enough, Chief Turi, does not mention bombs or secondary devices anywhere in his official statement. It only comes up, in a video made by the media in the heat of a moment on a day they made tons of mistakes.

graphics8.nytimes.com...



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 06:45 AM
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reply to post by mike dangerously
 


Sure I did. Reread it.



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 06:54 AM
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reply to post by bsbray11
 





It's called "radio waves" or even "remote control."


Great, now explain the lack of receivers and the associated descrambling gear you would need to ensure your charges did not go off from a stray signal in the RF hell of Manhatten.

Or did you not realize that short of a thermonuclear device, bombs leave evidence of their detonators and associated gear.



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 07:33 AM
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reply to post by Swampfox46_1999
 



However, I know that Saddam Hussien trained terrorists that DID launch terrorist attacks against the United States and am fully aware that while the WMDs might not have been in the amounts claimed, a bunch were found, not to mention all the supplies and equipment were found to rapidly produce mass amounts of chemical weapons.




Iraq and weapons of mass destruction

By March 2003, Hans Blix had found no stockpiles of WMD and had made significant progress toward resolving open issues of disarmament noting "proactive" but not always the "immediate" Iraqi cooperation as called for by UN Security Council Resolution 1441. He concluded that it would take “but months” to resolve the key remaining disarmament tasks.[4] The United States asserted this was a breach of Resolution 1441 but failed to convince the UN Security Council to pass a new resolution authorizing the use of force due to lack of evidence.


en.wikipedia.org...

There was no weapon of mass destruction found period. You are still peddling your disinformation to anyone that pays you any attention.

Anyone can take a minuet like me, and Google any information, do you really think everyone is that ignorant or do you really hope to rope in the naïve reader hoping they are going to take your word. Come on you can do better than that, cant you.




[edit on 4-12-2009 by impressme]



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 07:40 AM
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Originally posted by impressme
reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

There was no weapon of mass destruction found period. You are still peddling your disinformation to anyone that pays you any attention.


you are the one peddling crap once again

www.defenselink.mil...

"
Munitions Found in Iraq Meet WMD Criteria, Official Says

By Samantha L. Quigley
American Forces Press Service
WASHINGTON, June 29, 2006 – The 500 munitions discovered throughout Iraq since 2003 and discussed in a National Ground Intelligence Center report meet the criteria of weapons of mass destruction, the center's commander said here today.

"These are chemical weapons as defined under the Chemical Weapons Convention, and yes ... they do constitute weapons of mass destruction," Army Col. John Chu told the House Armed Services Committee.

The munitions found contain sarin and mustard gases, Army Lt. Gen. Michael D. Maples, director of the Defense Intelligence Agency, "



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 08:15 AM
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reply to post by impressme
 


You quote a report made in early 2003, Derek posts information from 2006.....Gee I wonder which is more correct.....



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 09:00 AM
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reply to post by Swampfox46_1999
 


My deepest apology. Well I have been sadly misinformed and I should have known not to use Wikipedia .org for information. I guess It is all a lie I thought years ago when I watch all to Press release and the live News reports of Hans Blix stating very clearly his team couldn’t find any WMD it was all over the News. I didn’t know he was lying, well the joke is on me!


WASHINGTON, June 29, 2006 – The 500 munitions discovered throughout Iraq since 2003 and discussed in a National Ground Intelligence Center report meet the criteria of weapons of mass destruction, the center's commander said here today.
"These are chemical weapons as defined under the Chemical Weapons Convention, and yes ... they do constitute weapons of mass destruction," Army Col. John Chu told the House Armed Services Committee.
The Chemical Weapons Convention is an arms control agreement which outlaws the production, stockpiling and use of chemical weapons. It was signed in 1993 and entered into force in 1997.
The munitions found contain sarin and mustard gases, Army Lt. Gen. Michael D. Maples, director of the Defense Intelligence Agency, said. Sarin attacks the neurological system and is potentially lethal.


www.defenselink.mil...

If the government said it is so, I will have to believe them, because I know they would never lie don’t you agree? I will gladly bow out of this thread with my head down now that I know that Saddam was going to blow up America with muster gas.





[edit on 4-12-2009 by impressme]



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 10:13 AM
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reply to post by impressme
 


I should have known, you think the entire US military was in on it...........




I will gladly bow out of this thread with my head down now that I know that Saddam was going to blow up America with muster gas.


Umm, no, but then we werent going to take the chance that Saddam might start selling his WMDs to terrorists after 9/11 either.



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 11:02 AM
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Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
reply to post by impressme
 


You quote a report made in early 2003, Derek posts information from 2006.....Gee I wonder which is more correct.....


Since later dates somehow mean anything, now let's jump to April 22, 2007: www.cia.gov...

While a small number of OLD, ABANDONED (emphasis mine) chemical munitions have been discovered, ISG judges that Iraq unilaterally destroyed its undeclared chemical weapons stockpile in 1991. There are no credible indications that Baghdad resumed production of chemical munitions thereafter, a policy ISG attributes to Baghdad's desire to see sanctions lifted, or rendered ineffectual, or its fear of force against it should WMD be discovered.

Page 13 of 19.



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 11:20 AM
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And just more information if the "Coalition of the Willing" is still hanging around and may be bored with nothing to do:

www.thefreelibrary.com...:+abandoned+chemical+weapons+pose+continual+threat-a0167430175

"Under the CWC, all member nations have agreed to dispose of their stockpile, recovered chemical agents and to destroy former production facilities. These tasks were supposed to be completed by April 2007, but the United States and several other countries have fallen behind the goals set by the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons, the international office that implements the treaty.

Delays, work stoppages and environmental issues prompted the United States to request an extension. The OPCW granted a five-year extension to 2012. Yet, it appears unlikely that the United States will meet the 100 percent disposal goal by that date.

"At this time, we do not expect to be able to meet the April 29, 2012 deadline for destruction of the U.S. declared chemical warfare stockpile," the Department of State announced.

Although the United States is farthest along in the international program, having destroyed 45 percent of its stockpile, troubles meeting the CWC dates point to the difficulty of eliminating even highly regulated and controlled chemicals.

Bennett believes the 2012 goal was unreasonable from the start. "It's not realistic to say that countries can meet this goal," he said.

The Unites (sic) States has requested a new deadline of 2023 from the OPCW, but it has not yet been approved, he said.

So far, the 182 CWC member nations have destroyed only 25 percent, or 18,000 tons, of declared weapons. A total of 71,000 tons have been declared."

Edited: Couldn't fix the above link so this one to the same article may work:

findarticles.com...



[edit on 4-12-2009 by NIcon]



posted on Dec, 4 2009 @ 11:59 AM
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I agree 1000% esp with obama new powers to shut down the internet have you read about the new Global treaty????

Stealth Treaty Seeks Strict Controls Over Internet…A sweeping international treaty to regulate how knowledge and creativity may flow on the Internet is now being negotiated… Too much truth I guess…

A sweeping international treaty to regulate how knowledge and creativity may flow on the Internet is now being negotiated. Haven’t heard of it? Funny thing, that’s exactly what the backers of the treaty want. The film, music, publishing and information industries don’t want a public debate about the issues or an open debate in Congress. So they have been working hand-in-glove with the U.S. Trade Representative to move U.S. policymaking offshore and throw a dark cloak of secrecy around everything. The next stop: draconian penalties for anyone who is accused of violating copyright law.

the whole story is here...ctpatriot1970.wordpress.com... /stealth-treaty-seeks-strict-controls-over-internet-a-sweeping-international-treaty-to-regulate-how-knowledge-and-creativity-may-flow-on-the-internet- is-now-being-negotiated-too-much-truth-i-guess/



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